awesome video

[Robinho]

not sure how out of the loop i am on this one, but on the off chance you haven't seen this before check out the video below (apologies if i'm breaking any rules, its kinda got some advertising in it) but its really all about this US Rally driver Ken Block doing amazing things in an Impreza - well worth clicking the HD option and going full screen if your connection allows.

http://video.google.co.uk/videosearch?q=ken+block+gymkhana&hl=en&emb=0&aq=1&oq=ken+block#q=ken+block&hl=en&emb=0

[MrJan]

Ooooohhh are you for some trouble now :p : Thou shalt not call Ken Block a rally driver orst thou shalt be struck down by Daniel :D

I think that the video is class but (as the thread in the WRC section confirms) some people aren't so happy to watch it

[Daniel]

Ooooohhh are you for some trouble now :p : Thou shalt not call Ken Block a rally driver orst thou shalt be struck down by Daniel :D

I think that the video is class but (as the thread in the WRC section confirms) some people aren't so happy to watch it
:p

[Robinho]

i must admit i've never heard of the guy, but it looks lie he competes in Rallying in the states, although they do have a different take on it soemthimes.

granted this video isn't rallying, it seems to be something along the lines of what we call Auto-testing over here, apparently thats Gymkhana in the states? although on a grander scale and much faster (autotesting tends to be small cars and specials in very tight enclosed routes.

back to the video, its more dance than anything, great exhibition of show and car control

[WRCfan]

Ken is the owner and starter of DC shoes, he competes in the American rally series with his team mate Travis Pastrana (crazy double backflip king). Sponsored by Subaru America and Monster Energy he now enjoys life spending loads of money and making videos for publicity (DC, Subaru, Crawford, Monster).

[N.O.T]

nice show....

[MrJan]

granted this video isn't rallying, it seems to be something along the lines of what we call Auto-testing over here, apparently thats Gymkhana in the states? although on a grander scale and much faster (autotesting tends to be small cars and specials in very tight enclosed routes.

back to the video, its more dance than anything, great exhibition of show and car control

I think that the yanks call it Autocross (which we do on grass), over here there is still autotesting and gymkhana, although gymkhana is a bit more fiddly rather than flicking the car about :)

I agree that it's a great exhibition and think that this sort of things should be encouraged, I guess that the people who are against it are probably also against drifting. While I wouldn't class either as motorsport I'm happy to appreciate the skill and beauty involved in both :)

[raybak]

Watch this space for the NSW Bearings Rally Show, coming in the latter half of this year.

Ray

[RAS007]

Ken Block was once accused of being a rally driver, but was found not guilty.

[pino]

As N.O.T said, nice show...but nothing to do with rallying. Worst thing is that stupid Codemasters have chosen him to promote/adverts their new Rallygame DiRT2, which was supposed to be a tribute to the great and leggendary Colin McRae :crazy:

[leopard]

nice show

[RAS007]

As N.O.T said, nice show...but nothing to do with rallying. Worst thing is that stupid Codemasters have chosen him to promote/adverts their new Rallygame DiRT2, which was supposed to be a tribute to the great and leggendary Colin McRae :crazy:

Codemasters have chosen to go down the X-Games, extreme sports route with the Dirt series, and I think it sucks. Like you said, it has nothing to do with rallying. Why the f*** can't they make a straightforward rally game?

[A.F.F.]

Codemasters have chosen to go down the X-Games, extreme sports route with the Dirt series, and I think it sucks. Like you said, it has nothing to do with rallying. Why the f*** can't they make a straightforward rally game?


I hated Dirt and I couldn't agree more RAS007. There are hundreds of arcade titles out there already. Why not a one decent and pure rallying game ???

[MrJan]

I hated Dirt and I couldn't agree more RAS007. There are hundreds of arcade titles out there already. Why not a one decent and pure rallying game ???

Rallying games won't sell, pointless spending vast amounts of money just to please some rally fans when you can send out an arcadey title which the rally fans still buy as well as Joe Public.

[Daniel]

Rallying games won't sell, pointless spending vast amounts of money just to please some rally fans when you can send out an arcadey title which the rally fans still buy as well as Joe Public.
Yeah, Colin McRae 1 and 2 didn't sell well at all ;)

[A.F.F.]

Rallying games won't sell, pointless spending vast amounts of money just to please some rally fans when you can send out an arcadey title which the rally fans still buy as well as Joe Public.

I disagree simply because...

Firstly, see Daniel's reply below.

Secondly, I'm for instance a rally fan and don't buy those arcade games and I know severel other rally fans who only laugh at those games.

I honestly think that if they would make a proper rally game for example PS3 platform, it would be a hit.

[MrJan]

Firstly, CMR1 & 2 came at a time when there weren't that many quality driving games on the market, it was pretty much GT and.....well ummmmmmm ;)

Secondly, yes some rally fans don't buy those games but I have DIRT and I'm sure a large number of people on this forum do, but so do a huge amount of people who I wouldn't expect to own it. SImply put there are more non-rally fans who would buy DIRT than rally fans who wouldn't :)

RBR is probably the most realistic rallying game but won't really appeal beyond the hardcore because it's f***ing difficult, DIRT on the other hand is very easy. Just my 2p :)

[A.F.F.]

The sad thing is that you're mostly right Mr Jan Yeo. With sad thing I mean that that is the direction, not only rallying games but in other genres too. All of them has gone more and more arcade.

Then again, I may not be in the age segment the game developers plan the games ;)

[J4MIE]

Agreed about the sales thing which is why RBR was a flop with people complaining it was too hard etc. Still the only game I have played over the past 5 years or so :D Whilst I haven't even seen CM Dirt never mind even considered buying it.

I did see Ken Block in an Escort last October at the McRae Stages and thought he was going really well, though pino tells me he spun a bit further down the road, or was it that other American chap :p :

But I agree, do like that video :up:

[Josti]

Rallying games won't sell, pointless spending vast amounts of money just to please some rally fans when you can send out an arcadey title which the rally fans still buy as well as Joe Public.

Well the WRC series got up to five editions, so I guess rallying games do sell, bearing in mind that the last edition was less populair than the others. V-Rally also did pretty well and that was pretty much a "real" rallying game too.

[lcd]

Great video - from a director's point of view - and great performance by Ken...
I just personally never liked any kind of stunts, exept those achieved during a real rally race! ;)

[WRCfan]

The new video is indeed entertaining, lots of sideways although nothing like how a rally driver drives. Seemed like the car was sledging sideways with mad amounts of wheelspin. Like Ken has said it's good exposure for DC, Monster Energy, and Crawford performance.

Regarding rally games. If there was a accurate rallying game put out it would be good. With the same rules as a real rally, being able to roll 5 times and still finish the rally is a bit sad. Something as accurate as possible would come across a big hit with real rally fans in my opinion.

[SubaruNorway]

Just to put some more wood to the fire ;)

A spoof of Ken Block's Gymkhana video by another american rally driver, Kyle Sarasin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=channel_page&v=kh6HzUZuvPs

[Daniel]

Just to put some more wood to the fire ;)

A spoof of Ken Block's Gymkhana video by another american rally driver, Kyle Sarasin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=channel_page&v=kh6HzUZuvPs
ROTFLMAO that's hilarious :D

I think although the guy is clearly nuts he's got better car control skills. Faaaar harder to do that in something that underpowered than in Ken's car.

[SubaruNorway]

I can confirme that one. I got the same engine in my 99 2 door 2.5RS :p

[gloomyDAY]

Just to put some more wood to the fire ;)

A spoof of Ken Block's Gymkhana video by another american rally driver, Kyle Sarasin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=channel_page&v=kh6HzUZuvPsLOL! I love when they start shooting off the Roman candles.

[janvanvurpa]

I did see Ken Block in an Escort last October at the McRae Stages and thought he was going really well, though pino tells me he spun a bit further down the road, or was it that other American chap :p :

But I agree, do like that video :up:

Considering that Block and Pastrana's publicity machine calls them "Rally Gods" and even listed Pastrana as "2007 World Rally Champion", and considering that they do tend to win a huge amount of the so called "National Championship" events (albeit with bore/stroked crazy expensive engines and fresh ones swapped in overnight) and considering that they were in absolutely first class machinery, if one checks the stage times then I personally would be loathe to classify 55th-65th Stage times as "going really well".
Now granted throwing away massive amounts of money just to embarrass oneself doesn't seem to bother either of them as they have plenty of money, limitless it seems and if one looks at their few WRC outings, well lets just say thank goodness for Super-rally for those wishing to see them on SS2 or maybe SS3 at the latest.
All reports are that Block is a outwrdly friendly person and I don't doubt that, but the extravagance of the Publicity machine for truly mediocre driving puts a odd taste in most peoples mouth.

It would be like if Ruatenbach bought out M-sport and showed up at your British single venue events with a couple Semi trailer rigs, 20-30 people, crashed about 45% of the time, one a few, and then paid to produce these made for You Tube "look at me" made up things and allowed the armies of 12 and 14 y.o. boys all flood every forum in the world with praise such as "Block is right up there at the top" "He's a Pro!" and the aforementioned "Rally god".

It is just too much of the "same ol same ol' "American bullsheeeet that my dear country is too infamous for.

Here is a far better video, an answer back as it were and from a bunch of guys who have passion,and humor, who do more with less, and who know how to fight.
(The guy Kyle Sarasin has competed in US Rally and in his first rides in a loaned 10 year old GC8 Subaru was mere fractions off the pace of the alleged "Gods" of SRTUSA )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kh6HzUZuvPs

Ooops didn't read every single post to see this was already posted, still context helps.

[userwave]

i like this spoof on ken block's video
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/07/13/video-ken-block-gymkhana-spoof-is-criminally-awesome/

Americana at it's best? :)

[SubaruNorway]

Ken Block and Atko having fun in a MKII. Looks like Atko's been really bored not driving lately, look at those arms!

http://www.onalimbracing.com/photos/2009_Ken_and_Chris/

[WRCfan]

Now granted throwing away massive amounts of money just to embarrass oneself doesn't seem to bother either of them

It does not bother them, and it shouldn't bother you either, you have no say in their business activities. Business is one of the main reasons Ken is out making these videos, he has sponsors to keep happy and 4,457,171 views as of right now since one month ago on his 2nd edition video will be sure to have the Monster Energy people and Crawford Performance crew happy.



You Tube "look at me" made up things and allowed the armies of 12 and 14 y.o. boys all flood every forum in the world with praise such as "Block is right up there at the top" "He's a Pro!" and the aforementioned "Rally god".

I think thats taking it a bit far, Ken nor Travis isn't needing to prove himself to anyone, let alone any little 14 yr old boys who have no idea about even driving a car let alone power-sliding. Also once again, the `made for YouTube` has the video 4 million views in one month. Pretty intelligent marketing scheme if you ask me.



Here is a far better video, an answer back as it were and from a bunch of guys who have passion,and humor, who do more with less, and who know how to fight.
(The guy Kyle Sarasin has competed in US Rally and in his first rides in a loaned 10 year old GC8 Subaru was mere fractions off the pace of the alleged "Gods" of SRTUSA )
Parts were good, the guy did well in the underpowered Rex, had funny parts although there were parts of the video (swearing and swerving onto the grass shoulder behind the pickup) which were INCREDIBLY lame...I would watch kens video again before that one...young red necks swearing out the back of a pickup doesn't quite have the same appeal as good camera work and loads of tyre smoke...Ken wins hands down.

[janvanvurpa]

It does not bother them, and it shouldn't bother you either, you have no say in their business activities. Business is one of the main reasons Ken is out making these videos, he has sponsors to keep happy and 4,457,171 views as of right now since one month ago on his 2nd edition video will be sure to have the Monster Energy people and Crawford Performance crew happy.



I think thats taking it a bit far, Ken nor Travis isn't needing to prove himself to anyone, let alone any little 14 yr old boys who have no idea about even driving a car let alone power-sliding. Also once again, the `made for YouTube` has the video 4 million views in one month. Pretty intelligent marketing scheme if you ask me.


Parts were good, the guy did well in the underpowered Rex, had funny parts although there were parts of the video (swearing and swerving onto the grass shoulder behind the pickup) which were INCREDIBLY lame...I would watch kens video again before that one...young red necks swearing out the back of a pickup doesn't quite have the same appeal as good camera work and loads of tyre smoke...Ken wins hands down.

Excellent job of missing every point, couldn't have been by accident.

Kenny and Travvie's extremely modest results speak for themselves.
And over produced, carefully staged fluff is transparent.

You really cannot fail to see that.

[WRCfan]

Excellent job of missing every point, couldn't have been by accident.

Kenny and Travvie's extremely modest results speak for themselves.
And over produced, carefully staged fluff is transparent.

You really cannot fail to see that.

I heard you the first time, now sit back and think about it from the other side in which I explained in my post previous.

If you wouldn't mind answer me these 3 questions:

-How is having a video on YouTube with 4 million views not good for DC,Monster and Crawford Performance?
-Why would Ken have to prove himself to little 12 and 14 yr old boys?
-How does Ken and Travis spending change your life?


Regarding abilities, Travis backflips MX bikes for a living, I don't ever expect him to settle down mentally to finish a 3 day WRC event on a regular basis. He is a showman and without doubt the worlds most talented motorcycle rider ever.
Ken, not WRC material although this is no reason to be hating on him because as a business man (and a very smart and successful one too) he has built a bit of a cult following doing big smokey skids in a high tuned car which has brought about massive exposure for the people who give him money to undertake these smokey skids.
Calling them average drivers is very open to interpretation, but they are some of the best America has to offer and anyway, only the Euro guys make for real WRC drivers anyway.

[janvanvurpa]

I heard you the first time, now sit back and think about it from the other side in which I explained in my post previous.

If you wouldn't mind answer me these 3 questions:

-How is having a video on YouTube with 4 million views not good for DC,Monster and Crawford Performance?
-Why would Ken have to prove himself to little 12 and 14 yr old boys?
-How does Ken and Travis spending change your life?


Regarding abilities, Travis backflips MX bikes for a living, I don't ever expect him to settle down mentally to finish a 3 day WRC event on a regular basis. He is a showman and without doubt the worlds most talented motorcycle rider ever.
Ken, not WRC material although this is no reason to be hating on him because as a business man (and a very smart and successful one too) he has built a bit of a cult following doing big smokey skids in a high tuned car which has brought about massive exposure for the people who give him money to undertake these smokey skids.
Calling them average drivers is very open to interpretation, but they are some of the best America has to offer and anyway, only the Euro guys make for real WRC drivers anyway.


You choose quite loaded, nearly inflammatory words making dialog difficult.
Pastrana is very talented at the TRICKS he does with a motorcycle, but it is beyond absurd to refer to a trick rider as "the worlds most talented ever".
That does not deserve time, shame on you for pretending to be serious with that.
Being retired from professional OUTDOOR moto-cross, I am not impressed at the SORT of tricks and stunts that most US "fans" are(what is openly referred to as the 12-20 something "Target demographic" which I see you're in) which in essence are very difficult, very dangerous stunts with sometimes motorcycles thrown in but it could just as well be skateboards (yawn), snowboards (yawn), 2 foot long "skis" (yawn) or tiny childrens bicycles (yawn).
Its all the same 'tricks" and the rub is the 30 minutes of "build up and hype' to 2-3 seconds of execution ratio.

Of course all the hype crap is good for DC Shoes et al, they can make more millions from the 12- to whatever Target Demographics crowd, buy more semis, more motorhomes, crowd out more of my friends in the service parks, demand from series organisers less stage mileage, and vacuum up all the easily impressionable so called "media".

Their spending, which buys the huge excessive ostentatious (maybe 10 or more times the budget each than the next 5 competitors in the US) presented to inexperienced folks here as "professional" which many somewhere in their little heads associate with "earning a living" leads many many less experience folks at events I go to to conclude "There's no way I can ever compete with THAT" and that hurts me in a number of ways.
Directly as I manufacture nice gravel rally suspension, and build engines and boxes, diffs etc.
Indirectly as a sometimes competitor at events.

When Fred Bloggs decides he can't compete and becomes a "spectator and consumer" rather than a driver/car builder that hurts me in sales and at entry fees.
Entries have gone up 300-400% or more less and less people enter and the "Dog and Pony Show" demands more space, more accommodation of VIPs, all kinds of Officials to be flown out to every event to do mundane tasks we have previously forever done with local talent (eg scrutineering, Safety steward, Stewards etc) at the same time entries are trending ever downward-even before this current world wide slump.

The example earlier of some guy coming to a simple single venue event with nearly WRC levels of expenditure to beat up on a bunch of garage built cars
should be understandable to anybody who actually has ever competed.

Real competitors RELISH A GOOD HARD FIGHT but that is not the American way and is definitely not the model of the Travvie and Kenny and SRTUSA crowd.
Their modus operandii is Spend 10 times more than the next 5 guys and then call yourselves The Best!

At what.

You are obviously a big FAN, I'm an old competitor. You're impressed and IMHO, naive and talking TALK. I'm not impressed (while never arguing their brutal effectiveness at conveying their "story"---it's a story that is UNINTERESTING and indeed, plainly spoken bullsheet) with mere staged antics.

Little point arguing. You be a fan there in Tokyo, I'll go build suspension and help local guys build cars.

[WRCfan]

Post is a bit all over the place but oh well,

Bigger budget, complaining about that is like pissing into the wind, it does suck but nothing is going to change.


Travis: Thats another discussion, go watch 199lives and see there is more to the man then FMX.

Travis and Ken are winning the events, this makes them the best by motorsport standards. Until someone beats them they will continue to be the "champions". Has worked this way since the beginning of time. Bigger budget than anyone else, this too has been happening for a long time, nothing new, it sucks big time although modern motorsport has become this way and nothing we can do about it.

Your boy in a 10 year old borrowed subaru, he still has to beat Ken and Travis. He isn't the only one, there is a lot of "real" talented young drivers out there too who can't get their break, that's just how it is.

Sorry to hear that business is slowed down with the larger operations, it sucks when it impacts peoples daily lives. Sad instance and one thing which does suck about modern motorsport.

As for knowing nothing, I have been rallying, driver and co-driver, my father drove for many years, I grew up around rally cars. Been watching the WRC since I was young. 17 years of going to the WRC and 25 years of being at rallies.

It seems you jumped to a conclusion that because I am only 25 you can tell me all your pearls of wisdom assuming I know nothing. Happens a lot here. Rally is nothing new to us in NZ...

No hard feelings or animosity, we both have differing opinions, the issues affect your daily life at times as you mentioned so of course I see your viewpoint. I guess we just have to agree to disagree (to a certain point).



Regards

WRCfan

[janvanvurpa]

Post is a bit all over the place but oh well,

Bigger budget, complaining about that is like pissing into the wind, it does suck but nothing is going to change.


Travis: Thats another discussion, go watch 199lives and see there is more to the man then FMX.

Travis and Ken are winning the events, this makes them the best by motorsport standards. Until someone beats them they will continue to be the "champions". Has worked this way since the beginning of time. Bigger budget than anyone else, this too has been happening for a long time, nothing new, it sucks big time although modern motorsport has become this way and nothing we can do about it.

Your boy in a 10 year old borrowed subaru, he still has to beat Ken and Travis. He isn't the only one, there is a lot of "real" talented young drivers out there too who can't get their break, that's just how it is.

Sorry to hear that business is slowed down with the larger operations, it sucks when it impacts peoples daily lives. Sad instance and one thing which does suck about modern motorsport.

As for knowing nothing, I have been rallying, driver and co-driver, my father drove for many years, I grew up around rally cars. Been watching the WRC since I was young. 17 years of going to the WRC and 25 years of being at rallies.

It seems you jumped to a conclusion that because I am only 25 you can tell me all your pearls of wisdom assuming I know nothing. Happens a lot here. Rally is nothing new to us in NZ...

No hard feelings or animosity, we both have differing opinions, the issues affect your daily life at times as you mentioned so of course I see your viewpoint. I guess we just have to agree to disagree (to a certain point).



Regards

WRCfan

I looked at your profile and looked you up a bit, I never assume somebody doesn't know anything, I assume the arrive at the positions----even if their conclusions are the same as mine---by their own possibly unique route in a kinda "A thousand roads lead to Rome" way and all.
Also knowing you to be a NZer AND 25, that the likelihood of you NOT ARGUING on general principals was zilch.

First, Travvie and Kenny winning means they were the fastest, it does NOT MEAN they were the BEST, and the HUGE difference in their full on corporate level approach clouds the issue when just behind are the garage built guys.
A reasonable, indeed common observation is "That guy there in 3rd (or whatever) is doing pretty damn good considering"

So OK just because you've been involved, doesn't mean statements like "Travvie is the bestest EVAR!!!"(and yeah I know what he's done in the past, but it seems being crazy, smoking stuff and crashing a lot and above all meant getting so called "factory rides" (as Americans call sponsorship from US Distributors) or misstating that an essentially bought victory means they are the "best" should go unanswered. If you watch the sloppy driving and see the really oafish mistakes you'll see why I make a precise point on it.

The big thing different from your experience and anybody here in Rally is your "Big Budget" classes and individuals are what could be called the icing on the cake, but there IS a fairly good FOUNDATION of club cars and crews with decent builds and decent series and by our US standards HUGE entry lists.

We have no foundations and in the 25 years I've been involved (and at my first event in CARS in 1984 I said (now remember I was retired from actually pay the rent, buy the truck, make a living at it International moto-cross) "Man what this sort needs is LOTS MORE CARS!"
I found a US magazine from 1977 with a 1976 season review and it saidf "What this sport needs is MORE CARS"

But a typical American fixation with hype and publicity has meant the collectively "we" have constantly sought succor in some external "Big Idea" like bring the WRC right here to Washington State back in 85/86/87/88, THAT was going to be the publicity "Breakthrough" that would lead to Valhalla---and rivers of Other People's Money.
Didn't work.
The one event vacuumed up all the energy of all the workers/officials.
1988 final Nation has 13 entries (bear in mind our population).

Then it was decided shorter events were the key and with the new turbo 4wd cars, and different classes between the club and "Pro" classes.

Didn't work.

Then the Subarus arrived and they teamed up with the same prep shop that now runs the cars and found Trustifarians to pay them to be called "factory drivers" and brought over some good Pommes and quite literally would rig results and apply penalties to assure results (I had friends on the "inside" at Manufacturer's Rally Council who told me of the shenanigans internally).
And THIS was going to be the thing which made rally into "the next BIG THING"

Club entries plummeted as fees doubled, then tripled.

Then it was decided that we needed "personalities" from "action" sports, and that would be the thing to set the USA on fire.

We still don't have a solid foundation, and have very low turnout.

ALL the enormous attention to just the top 2 or 4 crews diverts ALL the meager US sponsorship resources to one place and that generates a snow ball effect. TONS of bought air time means more money for the ones with more than enough already, and nothing for even guys just a couple places being the Kenny and Travvie show..

All the while the fields shrink.

MOST half civilised places have a decent club foundation upon which is overlaid a promoter "Top" level.

American motorsport people don't form of join clubs in the sense we know clubs from S/NL/F/D/GB etc experience.

[ioan]

He might not be a rally driver but sure enough he controls a car better than that Latvala guy. :p :

[gloomyDAY]

He might not be a rally driver but sure enough he controls a car better than that Latvala guy. :p :http://lgo.mit.edu/blog/drewhill/files/nuclear-explosion.jpg