Let the Silly Season begin!

[keysersoze]

Now that we know there's going to be a 2010 F1 season, we have a lot of speculating to do!

Assuming contracts are worth little these days, my notions are:

McLaren: Hamilton staying, Kovalainen maybe--LH likes him as a teammate--Rosberg likely

Ferrari: Massa likely to stay, Raikonnen leaving, replaced by Alonso, Kubica or Rosberg

Brawn: Button staying, Barrichello off to one of the new teams or retiring, replaced by a veteran (Raikonnen or Rosberg)

Renault: Alonso is 50/50, Piquet Jr out, replaced by Grosjean

Red Bull: Vettel staying, Webber may be shopping himself to Brawn, Renault or Williams

'Yoter: Trulli and Glock staying on

BMW: Kubica probable, Heidfeld to Williams?

Williams: Rosberg leaving, replaced by Webber or Heidfeld, Nakajima staying

Toro Rosso: Buemi back for sophomore season, Bourdais to sportscars or Indycars, replaced by a Red Bull development driver

Force India: Liuzzi and Sutil, Fisichella (sadly) to new team or into retirement

[gloomyDAY]

You forgot 3 teams.

[ShiftingGears]

Brawn: Button, Barrichello
Barrichello's performances have been a bit sub-par barring last weekend. Nonetheless he is still 2nd in the championship. But he will be 38 next year, that would make him the oldest driver since Gerhard Berger, so there are questions about him. He is by far the most likely candidate though.
Red Bull: Vettel, Webber
Three and a half points difference after 8 races of 17 warrants no changes. They are both very good drivers who by all accounts, work very well together.
Toyota: Trulli, Glock
Trulli is solid, Glock has been a bit disappointing this year. However, Toyota won't make any changes for next year, I am fairly sure.
Ferrari: Massa, Raikkonen
Both drivers already contracted, Raikkonen for possibly his last year in F1. 2011 is the interesting silly season for Ferrari.
McLaren: Hamilton, Kovalainen
Will both be there I'm pretty sure, unless there is another major intra-team blow-up.
Williams: _____?, _____?
Rosberg is looking elsewhere and Nakajima is only there because of Toyota. Maybe Nakajima will be replaced by another driver in Toyota's driver program if he doesn't improve. In any case Toyota will have a Japanese driver on the grid next year.
Renault: Alonso, ______?
This depends. Alonso is quite influential within the realms of Renault, and Piquet is a bit sporadic. Grosjean is very likely going to be there if he wins GP2 this year.
STR: Buemi, _______?
Bourdais may be there next year, somehow I think it is unlikely as he is not the most politically astute F1 driver, might press STR's decision given his sometimes questionable performances anyway.
BMW: ______?, _______?
BMW may want both drivers but both drivers might not want BMW.
Force India: Fisichella, ______?
I hope they get rid of Sutil. Fisichella at 35 is much faster and more consistent than Sutil. Having said that, Vijay probably won't drop him, which would be a shame.
Campos: Pantano, ______?
I think Pantano is a certainty here, any guesses for the second car?
Manor: ______?, _______?
No idea.
USF1: ________?, _______?
Brook Johnson? I have no idea. Is Windsor aiming for an all-US lineup straight up or just people from US motorsport? I think the best option would be 1 from each, the US drivers in the IRL at the moment wouldn't cut it in F1.

[Ranger]

Brawn: Button, Barrichello
Barrichello's performances have been a bit sub-par barring last weekend. Nonetheless he is still 2nd in the championship. But he will be 38 next year, that would make him the oldest driver since Gerhard Berger, so there are questions about him. He is by far the most likely candidate though.

Red Bull: Vettel, Webber
Three and a half points difference after 8 races of 17 warrants no changes. They are both very good drivers who by all accounts, work very well together.

Toyota: Trulli, Glock
Trulli is solid, Glock has been a bit disappointing this year. However, Toyota won't make any changes for next year, I am fairly sure.

Ferrari: Massa, Raikkonen
Both drivers already contracted, Raikkonen for possibly his last year in F1. 2011 is the interesting silly season for Ferrari.
McLaren: Hamilton, Kovalainen
Will both be there I'm pretty sure, unless there is another major intra-team blow-up.

Williams: _____?, _____?
Rosberg is looking elsewhere and Nakajima is only there because of Toyota. Maybe Nakajima will be replaced by another driver in Toyota's driver program if he doesn't improve. In any case Toyota will have a Japanese driver on the grid next year.

Renault: Alonso, ______?
This depends. Alonso is quite influential within the realms of Renault, and Piquet is a bit sporadic. Grosjean is very likely going to be there if he wins GP2 this year.

STR: Buemi, _______?
Bourdais may be there next year, somehow I think it is unlikely as he is not the most politically astute F1 driver, might press STR's decision given his sometimes questionable performances anyway.

BMW: ______?, _______?
BMW may want both drivers but both drivers might not want BMW.

Force India: Fisichella, ______?
I hope they get rid of Sutil. Fisichella at 35 is much faster and more consistent than Sutil. Having said that, Vijay probably won't drop him, which would be a shame.

Campos: Pantano, ______?
I think Pantano is a certainty here, any guesses for the second car?

Manor: ______?, _______?
No idea.

USF1: ________?, _______?
Brook Johnson? I have no idea. Is Windsor aiming for an all-US lineup straight up or just people from US motorsport? I think the best option would be 1 from each, the US drivers in the IRL at the moment wouldn't cut it in F1.

Certainly more interesting than last year's silly season anyway!

[woody2goody]

Ok here goes lol: (drivers in brackets I rate as possibilities)

Brawn: Button and Barrichello (Davidson if Rubens retires)

RBR: Vettel and Webber

Toyota: Trulli and Glock

Ferrari: Massa and Raikkonen (Alonso) - Those Alonso rumours are always in the back of my head. In that case I think kimi should be binned off. Massa is great for Ferrari and should be kept for a long time.

McLaren: Hamilton and ? (Rosberg, Raikkonen, de la Rosa) - I like Kovy, but I'm not sure anymore that he's anything more than just very good. If Alonso goes to Ferrari (unlikely I know), would Kimi ever consider going back to McLaren or do you think he will retire? Also could it be Nico or even, shockingly, de la Rosa again?

Williams: Rosberg and Nakajima (Hulkenburg) - I reckon this will stay the same. I think both men have done enough to keep their seat. Kazuki's lack of points is more to do with the competitiveness of F1 than a lack of ability. Nico hulkenburg should be at least under consideration though.

Renault: Alonso and di Grassi (Piquet, Grosjean, Kovalainen) - I think Nelsinho's chance has come and gone. Has has shown flashes but not enough. I think the second driver is likely to be the patient di Grassi and not Grosjean for reasons explained below. Maybe Heikki could return if sacked by McLaren as he was good for Renault last time.

STR: Buemi and Bourdais (Hartley, Alguesuari (sp?)) - I can see them keeping both Sebs for '10. Both men have driven pretty well this year I think barring one or two mishaps. Youngsters Jaime Alguesuari and Brendon Hartley (RBR tester) could be considered if they decide to oust either of their current drivers.

BMW: Kubica and Heidfeld - I don't see any reason either should leave after good seasons in 07 and 08. BMW are likely to produce next year despite their struggles this season.

Force India: Fisichella and Liuzzi (Sutil, Chandhok, Karthikeyan) - I think Tonio is the best man for the job alongside Fisi who has had some great races this year. Sutil has been ok but I maintain that Liuzzi is a better driver 90% of the time. Chandhok, being Indian and pretty good has a chacne, and so does Narain, as India's highest profile driver, even though he's said he's not sure whether he wants to drive for Force India.

Campos: Grosjean and Petrov - I think Campos will stick with their current drivers who have done so well for them in GP2. The Frenchman Grosjean has a lot of potential, and Vitaly Petrov (RUS), seems to be a racer in the Heidfeld mode who will bring you consistency.

US F1: Summerton and Andretti (Speed, Hildebrand, Patrick, Allmendinger, Villeneuve) - Jonathan Summerton seems like he has talent, and I have an inkling that Marco Andretti could take the second seat as he has tested for Honda previously and didn't do a terrible job. It could be one of IRL star Danica Patrick, John Hildebrand from A1GP, Scott Speed if he isn't kept on for the 2010 Sprint Cup, or AJ Allmendinger if he wants to go back to his open-wheel roots. Maybe Jacques Villeneuve has a shot here, you never know.

Manor: I have no idea, but as they are a British team, it wouldn't surprise me if they ran at least one Brit. My candidates are: Anthony Davidson, Jacques Villeneuve, Giorgio Pantano, Christian Klien, Gary Paffett or Paul di Resta.

[maximilian]

Ok here goes lol: (drivers in brackets I rate as possibilities)
Campos: Grosjean and Petrov - I think Campos will stick with their current drivers who have done so well for them in GP2. The Frenchman Grosjean has a lot of potential, and Vitaly Petrov (RUS), seems to be a racer in the Heidfeld mode who will bring you consistency.

Petrov would probably also bring Russian oil money?
One driver I have a probably wrong gut feeling about for USF1 is Graham Rahal.

[CNR]

it is hard to say but it looks like the driver will be carrent testdrivers
what will make it hard is the f1 super licence take brendon hartley he tested for redbull last year

promising young driver was awarded his super-license just in time for May's Spanish Grand Prix.

[gloomyDAY]

Paul di Resta going to make the grid?

That guy has too much talent to piss it away in DTM.

[Cozzie]

BRAWN: Button and Kubica

Button is a certainty to stay on, more than likely with number one on his car. If Barrichello maintains second in the championship (which I don't think he will) then he is likely to stay, if not I expect him to hang up the gloves. I would put my money on Kubica for the second seat as he has talent which is going to waste in the BMW. Other possibilities include Rosberg or Webber.

RED BULL: Vettel and Webber

Vettel has a contract and is the future star of the sport. He is a certainty to remain. As long as Webber keeps on doing what he is doing then I think he will stay, unless Ross Brawn come knocking on his door. On the off chance that Webber leaves I would nominate Rosberg as the most likely candidate or maybe Kubica...

TOYOTA: Trulli and Glock

Glock is contracted and is doing enough to keep his seat at the moment. Toyota is the best option right now for Trulli so he should stay on. Not much possibility of a change here.

FERRARI: Massa and Raikkonen

Massa has a contract and is doing more than enough with a struggling Ferrari right now. Kimi will probably stay on for one more year and then retire. Ferrari is the pinnacle so I doubt he would wish to move to another team. Unless something is seriously wrong behind the scenes Kimi will be at Ferrari in 2010 with Alonso ready to take over in 2011. If that is not the case Alonso would gladly jump in next year I'm sure.

MCLAREN: Hamilton and Rosberg

Lewis is the golden boy and is contracted for a long time yet. I don't think Kovi is really up to the McLaren standard and unless Hamilton wants him there he is as good as gone. Rosberg is the most likely candidate to take Kovi's place, Lewis might feel uncomfortable with a competitive team-mate but he will just have to get used to it. Other possibilities include Kubica or Heidfeld.

WILLIAMS: Nakajima and Hulkenberg

Toyota will make sure Williams keep the underperforming Nakajima...for now. I would regard current test driver Hulkenberg a near certainty unless he gets a better offer (BMW?), Kovalainen, Senna and Liuzzi may be outsiders though...

RENAULT: Alonso and Heidfeld

Alonso will probably have to spend one more year with Renault before his long awaited Ferrari drive presents itself. Piquet Jr has no chance of retaining his drive in 2010 so the race is on for the number two driver. I think Briatore will be unlikely to take another gamble on a rookie (Grosjean) and will instead let him cut his teeth at Campos. Heidfeld is consistent and would be competitive without upstaging Alonso.

STR: Buemi and Senna

If they even still exist by time 2010 rolls around Buemi should still be around as he has been reasonably impressive so far. Unfortunately I don't think Bourdais will remain as he seems to be a bit out of his depth. Bruno Senna should slot in nicely here as Buemi's team-mate. Jaime Alguersuari and Brendon Hartley also may find themselves with an outside chance of getting an early promotion...

BMW: Kovalainen and Klien

With Heidfeld and Kubica both shopping around I think it will be a new look BMW in 2010. They may take a chance on Kovalainen who is a race winner despite his poor form with McLaren. Test driver Christian Klien is still only in his twenties and may be given a second chance to prove himself. Webber, Hulkenberg, Rosberg and Barrichello might be persuaded to join instead of Klien.

FORCE INDIA: Sutil and Liuzzi

Sutil will have a good weekend every now and again and I think that will be enough for him to maintain his seat. Surely Fisi can see he is past it (we all can) and should move aside. Liuzzi will replace him unless he manages to get himself in a Williams. Senna also might be in the picture...

CAMPOS: Grosjean and Petrov

Grosjean should step up to F1 with Campos unless Flav is willing to take a punt on him in a Renault. Petrov will bring in money and consistency which Campos will desperately require. Gary Paffett may also be in with a chance.

USF1: Andretti and Hildebrand

J. R. Hildebrand is on course to take the Indy Lights title and appears to be quite a talent. If USF1 want two Americans then he should have a chance at obtaining a drive. Andretti is the most obvious choice as team leader and he is almost a certainty to do just that. Summerton and (cringe) Danica Patrick may also be in with a shot.

MANOR: Davidson and Pantano

Anthony Davidson deserves a drive in F1 although I doubt that he World Champion material. He would give the young Manor team a wealth of experience and is the obvious choice to lead the team. Pantano is another guy who deserves another shot and should slot into the second seat at Manor. Paffett may also be a shot although I have a feeling that they will pick at least one (relatively) unknown driver.

[wmcot]

Wow! After what F1 has been going through, the silly season doesn't seem so silly anymore!

[F1boat]

I'd love to see Jenson Button and Nico Rosberg in Brawn next year :)

[steveaki13]

I wonder if USF1 would put Scott Speed in one seat, at least for a year as he has a bit of knowledge of tracks and the sport.

[Mark]

Certainly with Alonso, I don't think he's going anywhere. Speculation was that he'll be at Ferrari, but Renault is as much built around Alonso now as Ferrari was built around Schumacher. I don't see Alonso ever leaving Renault again, he tried it once, didn't like it :p

[pino]

Alonso will drive for Ferrari next year, the only question is who he will replace : Massa or Kimi ? ;)

[Mark]

Alonso will drive for Ferrari next year, the only question is who he will replace : Massa or Kimi ? ;)

Fiver says you're wrong :p

[pino]

Fiver says you're wrong :p

Time will tell who's wrong ;)

[K-Pu]

My view:

FERRARI: Massa and Raikkonen because they have contract. Something really strange has to happen to change this.

MCLAREN: Hamilton and Kovalainen. Although many people put Kovalainen out of McLaren and Rosberg seems to be the logical replacement, maybe they´ll spend another season with their respective teams.

WILLIAMS: Rosberg and no idea. Nakajima has a chance to stay since he is not that bad and Toyota is supplying the engines. Anyway, his performance is not that good either, so he could be replaced by Hulkenberg. IMO it´s 50/50.

RENAULT: Alonso and Grosjean. Alonso qill wait until 2011 for Ferrari, and Piquet will be sacked. Grosjean seems to be the best option, but I have my doubts... What it is fairly clear is that Renault won´t look for a big name.

TOYOTA: Trulli and Glock are doing well.

RED BULL: Vettel and Webber are having a really good season, I don´t think they´ll go anywhere.

BRAWN: Button and Barrichello. And that´s good for Barrichello, really good.

TORO ROSSO: Buemi and I have no clue. Bourdais leaves but there could be a lot of canditates to get his seat.

BMW: Kubica and Heidfeld. What options do they have?

Force India: Sutil and Liuzzi. Fisichella out. I´ll miss him, but he has a lot of chances to be booted.

CAMPOS: Petrov and no idea. Grosjean has gone to Renault, and his seat can be filled by anyone. Maybe Javi Villa?

MANOR: The most I-have-no-idea of all

USF1: Not much idea here, but I propose Villeneuve and Danica Patrick. The gimmick team! :D

[jens]

Malllen, Panis turned 38 right before his retirement in 2004 too. :p :

Anyway, to me the interesting rumours have been that BMW is interested in replacing Heidfeld with Rosberg. Nico seems to be some kind of a hot property in this silly season, having been linked to both BMW and McLaren... maybe somewhere else? Anyway, I wonder, where would Heidfeld go if he indeed will be replaced. I'm quite convinced he would find a seat somewhere, he is good enough of a driver to continue racing in F1. For instance I even wouldn't rule out Brawn if Ross is seeking for a driver, who is capable of putting more pressure on Button.

Another key is that how dissatisfied is Kubica with BMW. But again - where would he go? McLaren (not competitive either at the moment), Toyota (would sound a bit unbelievable anyway?), Brawn (financial future is unclear). Does he have belief in BMW for one more season if nothing else works out?

All in all:
BrawnGP - Button & Barrichello/Heidfeld/Kubica/Davidson/Senna/Mr X. I think the second seat may become clearer together with the clarification of financial future as potential sponsors may have their say too, who would they like to see in the team.
Red Bull - Vettel & Webber. Don't see any reason for change.
Toyota - Trulli & Glock. Recently there were rumours like Toyota is looking for a "younger top star" to replace Jarno, but TBH I have no idea, who is available, interested in Toyota and would do a better job than their current No1.
Ferrari - Massa & Räikkönen/Alonso. Don't really know, what to make of these Alonso rumours. Haven't been many of those recently though.
Williams - Hülkenberg & Nakajima/Rosberg/Davidson/Heidfeld. The 'new' Nico should almost surely join Williams, but driver alongside him is a questionmark. Surely they would need an experienced driver alongside a rookie? Interesting that Toyota engine contract continues in 2010, but does it include Nakajima as well? Can't discount an outsider like Davidson either. And after all, what does Rosberg himself think? Williams has been improving lately, does he believe in the team for one more season?
McLaren - Hamilton & Kovalainen/Rosberg. I think that with the uncompetitiveness of the car, Lewis' underperforming and Rosberg's other options Heikki's chances of contiuing have risen.
Renault - Alonso? & Grosjean. If Alonso doesn't get to Ferrari, he'll continue there for one more year. Test driver Grosjean I think will very likely get promoted to a race driver role. If Alonso leaves, then they should hire an experienced driver alongside Romain, but who could that be? Well, first we have to see, what other changes in driver market will we see if FA moves.
BMW - Kubica & Heidfeld/Rosberg. Talked about Heidfeld's possible options above. Wonder whether Kubica will move. But difficult to guess where at the moment.
STR - Buemi & Hartley. Another RBR's young driver gets promoted, who is after all current reserve driver for RB/STR, so he must be rated highly by RBR even if the results from the lower series don't indicate that so clearly.
Force India - Fisichella/Liuzzi/Sutil. After the opening races I was almost sure Sutil & Liuzzi would make up FI's line-up for 2010, but with Fisi raising his game I'm not so sure any more. No-one knows, what might Mallya himself be thinking at the moment about the whole situation.

New teams? USGPE will have at least one American driver if not both, Campos at least one Spanish driver (a youngster or someone like Gene/DLR) plus someone else (Petrov/Pantano/an F1 reject from 2009), Manor - err, maybe someone, who has been driving for their team in Formula 3.

[AndyL]

A lot of people are suggesting that the new teams will come in with new drivers... I think there's a lot of value for those teams to target a very experienced driver like Heidfeld, Barichello or Fisi. Fisi being the most likely to be available. Davidson, as some have suggested for Manor, would be another good choice I guess given his reputation as a tester.

[CNR]

dose Vitantonio Liuzzi have a contract with Force India to race next year ?



"There are good chances for me to get back to racing in F1 with Force India," Liuzzi is quoted as telling Italy's Autosprint magazine.
"I have a contract until 2011, while Fisichella and Sutil's contracts expire at the end of the year," he added.

[christophulus]

Just a few:

Brawn - Button & Senna (?)

Barrichello will leave to be replaced by a pay-driver, possibly Senna as funds are going to be tight next year. Mercedes could slide one of their drivers over there instead.

Ferrari - Massa & Raikkonen

Just can't see Raikkonen leaving yet. I think this whole thing with Alonso is hot air, he may appear in 2011 but not next year.

McLaren - Hamilton & Rosberg

Sadly I think Rosberg will jump ship to McLaren, who will have a much more competitive car and offer a lot more cash :(

Williams - Nakajima & Heidfeld/Fisichella/Barrichello

Strange one this. Nakajima will stay, Williams seem impressed and Toyota give them engines. I hope they retain Rosberg but if not I think they have to go for a solid (if unspectacular) driver for at least one year. I'd like to see Barrichello there but can see Heidfeld returning.

BMW - Kubica & ?

Provided they're still in F1, I can see them ditching Heidfeld but no idea who they'd replace him with. Kubica could walk if they don't improve rapidly, but again I don't know where he'd go to.

Toro Rosso - Buemi & ?

Bourdais is off in my opinion. Buemi has done enough to stay but a lot will depend on who owns the team come next year. If they're bought out by a new entrant anything could happen.

Renault - Alonso & Grosjean/Di Grassi

Piquet has improved but surely time is up. One of Flav's new drivers will partner Alonso.

Force India - Sutil & ?

They need a change I think. Fisichella could be removed and Sutil will have to prove himself. Another possible seat for Heidfeld/Barrichello to offer their experience for a year.

Same:

Red Bull - Vettel & Webber
Toyota - Trulli & Glock

New teams? Not a clue, I'll leave that to the more informed members :)

[ioan]

Williams - Nakajima & Heidfeld/Fisichella/Barrichello

Strange one this. Nakajima will stay, Williams seem impressed and Toyota give them engines. I hope they retain Rosberg but if not I think they have to go for a solid (if unspectacular) driver for at least one year. I'd like to see Barrichello there but can see Heidfeld returning.

I doubt Heidfeld will consider them again after their fall out in 2005.

[ShiftingGears]

I doubt Heidfeld will consider them again after their fall out in 2005.

I think the only drivers with at least two years experience who would actually consider a move to Williams, if offered, would be one of the Force India drivers, or Kovalainen.

[ClarkFan]

Alonso will drive for Ferrari next year, the only question is who he will replace : Massa or Kimi ? ;)

If you are right, Kimi. Massa still has the fire and has done well enough Ferrari won't show him the door. Kimi seems a bit uninvolved since he won the championship in 2007.

But does Ferrari really want Alonso? :confused: Sure he is talented, but also a prima donna. What happens when/if Massa is faster? Rosberg would be easier to deal with, if he is up to snuff as a tester.

Sorry to see the sad state of Williams. No really top drivers linked to them if Rosberg leaves and forced to take a pay driver to keep their engines. It looks like the decline and fall of Team Lotus all over again. :(

ClarkFan

[ClarkFan]

USF1: Not much idea here, but I propose Villeneuve and Danica Patrick. The gimmick team! :D
:eek:

Don't wish that on us, please! F1 already has a low reputation in the US after the tire fiasco at Indianapolis. That teaming would kill it for at least a generation! :bigcry:

ClarkFan

[ioan]

Rosberg would be easier to deal with, if he is up to snuff as a tester.

Rosberg at Ferrari :?:
No way. He's not good enough to aspire to be a Ferrari driver. he's fast every now and than but that's all, a good journeyman.

[CNR]

I wonder if USF1 would put Scott Speed in one seat, at least for a year as he has a bit of knowledge of tracks and the sport.

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/148909/1/usf1_evaluating_american_drivers__and_danica_is_on _the_list.html


Q:would redbull pay for his drive

[DazzlaF1]

Petrov would probably also bring Russian oil money?
One driver I have a probably wrong gut feeling about for USF1 is Graham Rahal.

Good shout, id go for him to be partnered by one of either Jonathan Summerton, Charlie Kimball or even a dramatic return for Scott Speed. Patrick though i think is a massive longshot. If they were to go for an overseas driver though, id imagine it would be one who is well known on the american scene so maybe Dan Wheldon perhaps?

as for the others, heres how i think it would end up (ignore the numbers, they're just representative of the current championship positions)

BRAWN: 1. Jenson Button, 2. Rubens Barrichello or Anthony Davidson
RED BULL: 3. Sebastian Vettel, 4. Mark Webber
TOYOTA: 5. Jarno Trulli, 6. Timo Glock or Kazuki Nakajima
FERRARI: 7. Felipe Massa, 8. Fernando Alonso or Kimi Raikkonen
WILLIAMS: 9. Nico Rosberg or Kazuki Nakajima, 10. Kazuki Nakajima or Nico Hulkenberg
McLAREN: 11. Lewis Hamilton, 12. Heikki Kovalainen or Paul Di Resta or Pedro de la Rosa
RENAULT: 14. Fernando Alonso or Romain Grosjean, 15. Romain Grosjean or Nelson Piquet or Lucas di Grassi
BMW SAUBER: 16. Robert Kubica, 17. Nick Heidfeld
STR: 18. Sebastien Buemi, 19. Sebastien Bourdais or Brendon Hartley
FORCE INDIA: 20. Giancarlo Fisichella or Vitantonio Liuzzi, 21. Adrian Sutil or Vitantonio Liuzzi or Karun Chandhok
CAMPOS: 22. Vitaly Petrov, 23. Jaime Alguersuari or Javier Villa
MANOR: 24. Paul di Resta or Anthony Davidson, 25. Gary Paffett or Adam Carroll or Roberto Merhi
US F1: 26. Graham Rahal, 27. Scott Speed or Jonathan Summerton or Charlie Kimball

[UltimateDanGTR]

if USF1 where goign for someone form overseas, Dan Wheldon would be good like already mentioned. but what about Dario Franchitti?

[DazzlaF1]

if USF1 where goign for someone form overseas, Dan Wheldon would be good like already mentioned. but what about Dario Franchitti?

Probably wont happen, I remember though he had a test for Jaguar years ago

[jens]

I doubt Heidfeld will consider them again after their fall out in 2005.

Well, it all depends on how will the driver market pan out. If Heidfeld has only two options, Williams or retire, then he would surely rather join Williams rather than completely drop out of F1. But having said that, I'm not really sure, why should BMW be keen on getting rid of Heidfeld, who has actually been matching Kubica this year.

[woody2goody]

if USF1 where goign for someone form overseas, Dan Wheldon would be good like already mentioned. but what about Dario Franchitti?

Dario and Dan Wheldon are the ones that I forgot about. Dario would be a good safe pair of hands with bags of experience, just not in an F1 car.

Just thought of some more candidates:

Ryan Briscoe
Antonio Pizzonia
Justin Wilson
Ryan Hunter-Reay
Adam Carroll
Mike Conway

[CNR]

Montoya is getting the handle on stock car racing

JUAN PABLO MONTOYA“This racing is incredible.’’


Juan Pablo Montoya offered some friendly advice to IndyCar star Danica Patrick, a free agent who could possibly opt to jump to NASCAR in 2010.

may be 2 drivers off the list

[DexDexter]

Alonso will drive for Ferrari next year, the only question is who he will replace : Massa or Kimi ? ;)

I would actually like to see Kimi and Fernando in the same team, that could actually work, they seem to have a lot of respect for each other. I don't think it's going to happen though.

[Schultz]

Dario and Dan Wheldon are the ones that I forgot about. Dario would be a good safe pair of hands with bags of experience, just not in an F1 car.

Just thought of some more candidates:

Ryan Briscoe
Antonio Pizzonia
Justin Wilson
Ryan Hunter-Reay
Adam Carroll
Mike Conway

Pizzonia???? One of the worst F1 drivers prior to Ide.

Briscoe has atleast some track experience as well as F1 experience. Plus I would of course love to see another Aussie in F1 :D

[CNR]

will one old driver be back ?
http://www.crash.net/f1/news/149158/1/coulthard_questions_if_he_hung_f1_helmet_up_too_so on.html


David Coulthard has suggested that in hindsight, he might have hung up his F1 helmet too soon – as the 13-time grand prix-winner hinted that he may be tempted back into the cockpit for another crack at the legendary Le Mans 24 Hours in the future.

The Scot walked away from the top flight at the end of his 2008 campaign with Red Bull Racing, following almost 250 starts that yielded no fewer than 535 points and 62 podium finishes – making him statistically the most successful British driver of all time, and the fourth-most successful driver in F1 history outright, behind only multiple world champions Michael Schumacher, Alain Prost and Ayrton Senna.

His final season was far from his most glorious, however, with just a brace of points finishes, albeit one of them up on the rostrum with third place in the Canadian Grand Prix in Montreal – and ahead of his home race at Silverstone mid-summer, the 38-year-old announced that he would be stepping down at the end of the year, albeit remaining at the energy drinks-backed outfit as a consultant and occasional test driver.

Given RBR's outstanding success in 2009, however – with two victories for successor Sebastian Vettel – and in light of the ban on in-season testing taking the pressure off drivers to a certain extent and allowing for more relaxation and 'down time', Coulthard confessed that he had perhaps underestimated his physical capability to cope with what has become a less punishing schedule and as such had made his decision a touch too hastily.

[555-04Q2]

I would actually like to see Kimi and Fernando in the same team, that could actually work, they seem to have a lot of respect for each other. I don't think it's going to happen though.

Frodo would destroy the Iceman in the same cars.

[Sonic]

Rosberg at Ferrari :?:
No way. He's not good enough to aspire to be a Ferrari driver. he's fast every now and than but that's all, a good journeyman.

Oh Purrrrlleeeaaaasssse! Have we learnt nothing from Button this year?? The car is the key and the difference between the best and the worst driver on the grid is no more than 3-5 tenths.

Put Nico (or Naka for that matter) in a Ferrari and he'd be right on par with Massa (or Kimi if he's still there).

The reason Nico is fast "now and then" is down to his car - much as it pains me to to say it as a Williams Fan.

[ioan]

Oh Purrrrlleeeaaaasssse!
Put Nico (or Naka for that matter) in a Ferrari and he'd be right on par with Massa (or Kimi if he's still there).

:laugh: Good joke!

[Sonic]

Thanks. Glad you liked it. I do try! :D

We'll see what the punchline is next year.

[ioan]

Thanks. Glad you liked it. I do try! :D

We'll see what the punchline is next year.

Nico will probably become Lewy's new puppy! ;)

[Sonic]

A puppy has WAY too much bark to be Hamilton's "team" mate. Something more like a cat. Or even better a hamster. ;) *that puts me in the running 4 the second mac seat methinks*

[Nikki Katz]

Ooh, lemmie think... I usually do this and predict no movement (I was right last year!), but I think I can see quite a lot for next year. Admittedly a lot of this is guesswork!

Brawn - Jenson Button, Bruno Senna
Red Bull - Sebastian Vettel, Mark Webber
Toyota - Jarno Trulli, Timo Glock
Ferrari - Felipe Massa, Fernando Alonso
Williams - Kasuki Nakajima, Nico Hulkenberg
McLaren - Nico Rosberg, Lewis Hamilton
Renault - Heikki Kovalainen, Romain Grosjean
BMW - Nick Heidfeld, Robert Kubica
Toro Rosso - Sebastian Buemi, Takuma Sato
Force India - Adrian Sutil, Vitantonio Liuzzi
USF1 - Giancarlo Fisichella, J R Hildebrand
Campos - Giorgio Pantano, Lucas di Grassi
Manor - Sebastian Bourdais, Robert Wickens

[CNR]

has Brendon Hartley been signed up to race for Campos or Manor

Red Bull makes F1 reserve driver change
http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=334850&FS=F1

Brendon Hartley has been stepped down from his role as reserve driver for Red Bull's two F1 teams.
The energy drink-owned teams on Wednesday said the New Zealander will be replaced at the remaining races of this season by another teenager, Spaniard Jaime Alguersuari.

[AndyL]

has Brendon Hartley been signed up to race for Campos or Manor

Red Bull makes F1 reserve driver change
http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=334850&FS=F1

I'm suprised at all these young reserve drivers with no experience in an F1 car, not even testing AFAIK. If one of the main drivers was indisposed would they really throw one of these youngsters straight into a race weekend?
I guess they must be working on the assumption that they'll never use the reserve driver, and it's cheaper to employ Brendon Hartley or Jaime Alguersuari than it would have been to keep DC on retainer all year.

[ioan]

I'm suprised at all these young reserve drivers with no experience in an F1 car, not even testing AFAIK. If one of the main drivers was indisposed would they really throw one of these youngsters straight into a race weekend?
I guess they must be working on the assumption that they'll never use the reserve driver, and it's cheaper to employ Brendon Hartley or Jaime Alguersuari than it would have been to keep DC on retainer all year.

Like if DC could ask for much more money given his on track behavior during the last seasons.

[Sonic]

I'm suprised at all these young reserve drivers with no experience in an F1 car, not even testing AFAIK. If one of the main drivers was indisposed would they really throw one of these youngsters straight into a race weekend?
I guess they must be working on the assumption that they'll never use the reserve driver, and it's cheaper to employ Brendon Hartley or Jaime Alguersuari than it would have been to keep DC on retainer all year.

It does seem odd. Back in the day when youngsters were test drivers they actually had to TEST! I doubt DC would have been top 6 when he stepped into the williams in '94 if he'd not even driven the car aside from some straight line work.

[K-Pu]

Fresh rotten news from Spain, Alonso to Ferrari...

http://www.as.com/motor/articulo/formula-automovilismo-deportes/dasmot/20090630dasdaimot_1/Tes

I translate some of the "signs" they see to put Alonso into a Ferrari next season...

"If the plan goes ahead, Fernando Alonso will be announced as first pilot at Ferrari for 2010 and until 2014."

"Despite what has been said, there are no strong economic penalties if the current pilots (at Ferrari) go away."

"Banco Santander has no influence on the arrival of Alonso. Emilio Botin (Banco Santander head honcho) goes to the red team as a consequence of Alonso´s contract, which seems, as for today, to be almost closed. The presence of the financial entity is indeed another sign of his landing at Maranello"

"But there are more signs of FErrari preparing the arrival of their new star. The most notable, the celebration of the world finals of the Scuderia at Cheste. For the first time in their history, the last stage of all european and american tourisms of the mythic Cavallino Rampante will be out of Italy. Mugello used to be the final scenario of this event which is attended by all Ferrari clubs from Europe."

"This year it takes place from 12 to 15 november (a week after the last F1 race at Abu Dhabi), and Fernando Alonso may be the great surprise on sunday."

"His contract with Renault does not allow him to drive other car or wear other overalls until 31st december, but with casual clothes he could attend the red call. Moreover, there is a huge marketing campaign set in order to seize the asturian pilot´s popularity".

IMVHO, this is a pile of sh*t.

[Sonic]

IMVHO, this is a pile of sh*t.

indeed

[pettersolberg29]

Heidfeld talking to 8 teams for next season, including BMW.

[jens]

Eight teams? Current ones or are the new ones included too? It would be easier to ask, who isn't he negotiating with! Erm, Ferrari? Red Bull? He might have a slight chance in getting to other teams. :p :

[ioan]

Eight teams? Current ones or are the new ones included too? It would be easier to ask, who isn't he negotiating with! Erm, Ferrari? Red Bull? He might have a slight chance in getting to other teams. :p :

From the current teams he is for sure not negotiating with Ferrari, and I would add Williams with whom he had a tense tenure and an early end of the collaboration.

[DazzlaF1]

From the current teams he is for sure not negotiating with Ferrari, and I would add Williams with whom he had a tense tenure and an early end of the collaboration.

I would'nt be suprised if US F1 are one of them, if they want an overseas driver for their new operation, it would be better to go for an experienced sesoned campaigner, and Heidfeld certainly fits the bill.

But realistically, I think both he and Kubica will end up staying at BMW.

[pettersolberg29]

If its 8 I would assume it wouldn't be McLaren, Ferrari, Red Bull, USF1 and Manor. I think Renault or staying at BMW is probably the most likely - from what I've heard he's keen on joining Alonso at Renault or Button at Brawn.

[Dzeidzei]

Here it goes, my 2 cents.

Brawn - Jenson Button, Nico Rosberg
Red Bull - Sebastian Vettel, Fernando Alonso
Toyota - Jarno Trulli, Timo Glock (altho not sure about Jarno)
Ferrari - Felipe Massa, Kimi Räikkönen
McLaren - Lewis Hamilton, Heikki Kovalainen
Renault - Mark Webber, Romain Grosjean
BMW - Nick Heidfeld, Robert Kubica

The rest: who cares.

And some reasoning: Nico is really the key here, not Fernando. Nico would be stupid to get the drive at McL where he´ll only a 2nd grade service like Heikki. At Brawn he´ll be able to really shine. Fernando´s best option is the RB drive and that´ll make the RB lineup a lot stronger. It´ll also show how good Seb really is.

Heikki will stay at McL b/c thew golden boy wants it. Kimi will continue and might even extend his drive. Mark will finally be at Renault altho it´s years too late.

[markabilly]

Ferrari--Vittels and Freddie

go together like a horse and buggy........

http://www.bild.de/BILD/sport/motorsport/2009/07/01/spanier-berichten/wechselt-red-bull-pilot-sebastian-vettel-in-der-formel-1-zu-ferrari.html

[Garry Walker]

Heidfeld talking to 8 teams for next season, including BMW.

And none of them wants him.

[AndyL]

I'm suprised at all these young reserve drivers with no experience in an F1 car, not even testing AFAIK.

...

would they really throw one of these youngsters straight into a race weekend?

Apparently yes! If James Allen is right, Bourdais is out and Jaime Alguersuari is in for Hungary:
http://allenonf1.wordpress.com/2009/07/09/geoff-willis-out-at-red-bull/

[ioan]

And none of them wants him.

Well, they are talking to him, so they are interested, something Bourdais can't brag about. :D

[pettersolberg29]

BMW and Renault want him - traditionally 2 of the biggest teams. Brawn are also speaking to him so he's hardly being shunned...

[ioan]

BMW and Renault want him - traditionally 2 of the biggest teams. Brawn are also speaking to him so he's hardly being shunned...

You shouldn't take Gary seriously, he just needs to get some attention every now and then.

[Nikki Katz]

Alguersuari??? Who???

If Bourdais has to go, then at least replace him by someone half decent, maybe Sato, Pantano or Senna.

I admit that I had to search wiki for Alguersuari. He's the reigning British F3 champion, though Asmer who won it the previous year turned out to be rubbish. He's currently in WSR, is in 8th place, which is behind the likes of Martinez and Fauzy. Hmmm....

To be fair though, he is significantly ahead of Hartley, who's in 17th.

[ioan]

Let's give the guy a chance before judging him, Bourdais had 1 and a half season to show what he is capable of, now he can go back Indy.

[Tazio]

I'd like to see Klien get another shot.

[ioan]

I'd like to see Klien get another shot.

Me too, but he isn't a Red Bull driver anymore and I can't say it's his fault.

[Ranger]

Apparently yes! If James Allen is right, Bourdais is out and Jaime Alguersuari is in for Hungary:
http://allenonf1.wordpress.com/2009/07/09/geoff-willis-out-at-red-bull/

Alguesuari is well behind his own rookie team-mate in WSR, this would be a silly decision, one nonetheless driven by money.

[Tazio]

Me too, but he isn't a Red Bull driver anymore and I can't say it's his fault.Dietrich Mateschitz made a business decision that gave CK the short end of the stick IMO!

[pino]

Apparently yes! If James Allen is right, Bourdais is out and Jaime Alguersuari is in for Hungary:
http://allenonf1.wordpress.com/2009/07/09/geoff-willis-out-at-red-bull/

He's right, this will be last GP for Bourdais.

[Valve Bounce]

Won't make no difference; he ain't gonna do better than Bordais

[ShiftingGears]

I'd like to see Klien get another shot.

Why? Coulthard had the measure of him, and Klien never displayed anything special as a driver.

[I am evil Homer]

He definitely struggled at the start but was showing real signs of improvement in terms of strong stints in races and consistency.

[I am evil Homer]

Alguersuari??? Who???

If Bourdais has to go, then at least replace him by someone half decent, maybe Sato, Pantano or Senna.

I admit that I had to search wiki for Alguersuari. He's the reigning British F3 champion, though Asmer who won it the previous year turned out to be rubbish. He's currently in WSR, is in 8th place, which is behind the likes of Martinez and Fauzy. Hmmm....

To be fair though, he is significantly ahead of Hartley, who's in 17th.

I agree he seems very average to me....and but for the backing of Red Bull and Repsol wouldn't be in contention. Meanwhile drivers like DiResta and Green have to make do with DTM!!

[ioan]

Won't make no difference; he ain't gonna do better than Bordais

Drawing conclusions before the guy even get's his first chance?! :rolleyes:

[Tazio]

Why? Coulthard had the measure of him, and Klien never displayed anything special as a driver.I can't quite put my finger on it but he seems like the kind of driver that could mature into something special.
You are right, he got one shot. How many ever even get that :up:

[jens]

If Alguersuari gets the race seat, then I think we are finally seeing the consequence of the testing ban. If a young driver can't get any mileage in an F1 car, then the only alternative option is to simply send him to a Grand Prix race! Of course an enormous risk, considering Jaime's lack of experience. But considering that Red Bull has a second team too, who is trundling at the back anyway, they can afford such gambles without really losing anything if the gamble doesn't pay off as expected. Expected? Actually, I don't think there are any expectations on JA anyway, just to hope he doesn't crash too much and gets some valuable race mileage.

Alguersuari is still very young and isn't he the youngest British F3 champ ever? He hasn't been doing too well in WSR, but as mentioned, he is still relatively inexperienced and has still a lot to improve. So he may be very talented, the only concern I have is that he may be indeed rushed into F1. Hopefully the difficulties faced in the highest class won't ruin his confidence and career.

[jens]

I would like to add that... according to James Allen blog Rubens Barrichello might join Williams in 2010! :eek:

[ioan]

I would like to add that... according to James Allen blog Rubens Barrichello might join Williams in 2010! :eek:

Did he find a sponsor or what?!
He will probably be replacing Rosberg who goes to McLaren.

[pettersolberg29]

Did he find a sponsor or what?!
He will probably be replacing Rosberg who goes to McLaren.

Maybe Heidfeld will replace Rubens, no?

And I agree with the above poster as well in thnking Klien deserves another chance - he never proved his quality which I think is a loss and a shame.

[jens]

Klien had three years in F1 and based on these he was never going to develop into anything better than a second-tier driver. Of course you may make a case that several average or below-average drivers have had a longer career, but teams constantly search for real deals and one must prove his worth quite quickly to earn a long-lasting place on the grid.

Bourdais is a perfect case. I don't think he is a "slow driver" as such, but he seems such type, who needs everything to be 100% to go really well: top team, #1 driver, a suitable car, time to adapt to the car/changes, etc. In Champ Car those requirements were fulfilled. Even in the second half of 2008 in F1, after adapting to STR3, Le Seb was reasonably quick. But with totally new cars in 09 he once again has struggled to adapt. He has never been a real priority or No.1 in STR either, which hasn't helped him. But the team doesn't care - they can't endlessly wait for a driver to finally click with the car, especially if he is already having multiple seasons in F1.

Who knows, maybe Bourdais would be leading the championship if he was in a Brawn instead of Button - No.1 driver, great car, etc he would like. But this isn't the case - he has to prove himself in a more difficult environment. And hasn't done that convincingly.

So... Klien should have had the measure of DC to extend his career. If Klien had beaten DC in 2006, surely Red Bull would have extended contract with the younger guy rather than the old hand? Instead of this, Red Bull was disappointed in Klien and dropped him. Instead of him, Red Bull found the real deal in Vettel.

[pettersolberg29]

I know what you mean about Klien however I think he's far better than drivers like Piquet, Nakajima, Bourdais, Buemi and Fisi so I think he should get another chance.

[jens]

I know what you mean about Klien however I think he's far better than drivers like Piquet, Nakajima, Bourdais, Buemi and Fisi so I think he should get another chance.

Probably he is indeed better than the first three, but I'm not so sure about Buemi (unproven) and Fisichella (who, we shouldn't underestimate, has had a lot of brilliant races in his career too besides the disappointments that people's memories seem to be concentrated on). However, I suppose quite a fair amount of drivers are better than Piquet & Nakajima, which makes driver choice difficult. ;)

But as mentioned above, replacing Bourdais with Alguersuari has nothing to do whether the young lad would do better than Seb or whether he would results-wise be a better choice than Klien, Davidson, Sato or whoever - it's simply an exercise of giving testing mileage to youngster in the currently very restricted F1. I wouldn't be surprised if Hartley got a few GP's at the end of the season too.

[pettersolberg29]

What I meant to say is that Klien is better than Fisi and Buemi are now, although Fisi was great and Buemi may be one day...

It is a good idea giving young lads a go I suppose, as they need to start somewhere. I just hate seeing the careers of talented drivers like Klien and Davidson going down the drain while people like Buemi and Algues-whatever get their drive without working hard.

[jens]

By the way, one more comment on evaluating the silly season. :)

It's worth noting that both Williams and Renault are in quite a similar situation, both are on the verge of losing their lead driver and both are intending to bring in a rookie driver for 2010 at latest (Hülkenberg and Grosjean respectively). This means that both teams need an experienced lead driver, but neither Nakajima nor Piquet are able to carry that role.

Also neither of the teams seem really attractive to drivers at the moment. Okay, let's imagine a few movements - Alonso joins indeed Ferrari and Barrichello Williams, Rosberg moves to BMW. So Kovalainen stays in McLaren and Heidfeld goes let's say to Brawn. Who will become Renault's new No.1 driver? Who?

[pettersolberg29]

How about Heidfeld?

[Garry Walker]

Well, they are talking to him, so they are interested, something Bourdais can't brag about. :D

I couldnt care less about Bourdais, the only reason I showed support to him once upon a time was that he was against vettel in the same car (and very often I have to say, he was beating vettel) :D

If it wasnt for F1 having some new teams next year, I would bet money on Heidfeld not having a driver for next season.



I know what you mean about Klien however I think he's far better than drivers like Piquet, Nakajima, Bourdais, Buemi and Fisi so I think he should get another chance.
If he is "far" better than those guys, why did he perform so badly ?
He had 3 seasons to show his worth, he did nothing. Most guys never get so many chances as that guy did.


What I meant to say is that Klien is better than Fisi and Buemi are now, although Fisi was great and Buemi may be one day...

It is a good idea giving young lads a go I suppose, as they need to start somewhere. I just hate seeing the careers of talented drivers like Klien and Davidson going down the drain while people like Buemi and Algues-whatever get their drive without working hard.

What the hell? Both klien and davidson had plenty of chances, they did nothing. How many years do they need? 15?

[ioan]

I couldnt care less about Bourdais, the only reason I showed support to him once upon a time was that he was against vettel in the same car (and very often I have to say, he was beating vettel) :D


Like once in a lifetime?! :D

Life must be difficult when you are hating a sucesfull driver and supporting a loser!



If it wasnt for F1 having some new teams next year, I would bet money on Heidfeld not having a driver for next season.


He doesn't even need a driver, he just needs a car! :laugh:

BTW don't get nervous, you're starting to make mistakes! :p :

[Garry Walker]

Like once in a lifetime?! :D You must be forgetting quite a few races last year :D



Life must be difficult when you are hating a sucesfull driver and supporting a loser!
If you say Massa and Kimi are losers, okay :)



He doesn't even need a driver, he just needs a car!

BTW don't get nervous, you're starting to make mistakes! Oops, that will teach me to reread my posts before posting them :D

I have to go now though, a poker evening is waiting and I am planning on taking my friends money from them :)

[ioan]

If you say Massa and Kimi are losers, okay :)

No, they are just the exception in your book, the loser being a certain google eyed French driver. :p :

PS: Let us know how much you lost at poker when you come back! :D

[pettersolberg29]

What the hell? Both klien and davidson had plenty of chances, they did nothing. How many years do they need? 15?

I know I shouldn't drop to your level, but its worth an argument. Please tell me how many chances Davidson got - only really one season with an unbelievably poor SuperAguri team wasn't it? How is that a gauge of his talent?
As for Klien, he may have had 3 years, but most of them were also in underperforming cars and he was very young at the time. He deserves more of another chance than Algesari or Seabass or whoever else you think deserves a go.

As for your comment on Heidfeld not deserving a drive for next year - you're not only mad, but also crazy. THE most consistent driver ever, and he has outraced RK this year. No way is he even in the bottom 6 or 7 F1 drivers - in fact I believe Piquet, Nakajima, Fisi, Sutil, Bourdais, Buemi, Kovalainen and even Rubens are worse than Nick, and all new drivers like Grosjean, Algesari and Hartley, as well as test drivers like Liuzzi have shown nothing to suggest they should oust him from a F1 seat.

[markabilly]

Alonso will drive for Ferrari next year, the only question is who he will replace : Massa or Kimi ? ;)
Kimi

Kimi to brawn,

Only question is will Ferrari also snatch Vettel and dump massa

[Bagwan]

Kimi to rally in an icecream truck ..
Jacques to Brawn .
Rubens to Williams .
Alonso to Ferrari .

[ShiftingGears]

Jacques to Brawn

:laugh:

[Garry Walker]

PS: Let us know how much you lost at poker when you come back!
:D

Count it and cry - 74 euros richer :D


I know I shouldn't drop to your level, but its worth an argument. :D You cannot drop to my level kiddo, we are not even remotely close, so inferior are you compared to me.

To illustrate my point - you are a Dacia Logan with a broken engine and no tyres whereas I am Ferrari Enzo :D



Please tell me how many chances Davidson got - only really one season with an unbelievably poor SuperAguri team wasn't it? How is that a gauge of his talent?
All he needed to do was to beat his joke of a teammate. He did not do that and that was enough. If you have a bad car, all you can do really is beat your teammate clearly and people will take notice. Davidson did not do that.



As for Klien, he may have had 3 years, but most of them were also in underperforming cars and he was very young at the time. He was always beaten by his teammates. I remember Webber with the SAME car even got a front row starting position and always far ahead of Klien. Klien is a nobody. I repeat again, in bad cars all you can do is beat your teammate and if you do, people will take notice.
Remember, Webber was in the same team, but he has a seat now and Klien doesnt. The difference? One of those drivers was beating his teammate and the other was regularly beaten by his teammate. Can you guess which is which?



He deserves more of another chance than Algesari or Seabass or whoever else you think deserves a go.jaime alguersuari is the same, not algesari.
But he has not had a chance yet, why does klien deserve another one when that guy has not even had one chance? How many times will klien waste a good seat?



As for your comment on Heidfeld not deserving a drive for next year - you're not only mad, but also crazy.
Where did I say he does not deserve a drive next year?



THE most consistent driver ever,
:rotflmao: Tell me at once which drugs you are using

[ioan]

:D

Count it and cry - 74 euros richer :D

Only?! I earn more than that in one hour! :p :

[Garry Walker]

Only?! I earn more than that in one hour! :p :
Sure, but do you enjoy that hour as much as I enjoyed the poker? :D

[ioan]

Sure, but do you enjoy that hour as much as I enjoyed the poker? :D

Given that it's my work, I do enjoy it.
Now, I don't know how much you enjoyed the poker so I can't compare it! ;)

[Garry Walker]

Given that it's my work, I do enjoy it.
Now, I don't know how much you enjoyed the poker so I can't compare it! ;)

Out of curiosity, what line of work are you in.

Many people hate their jobs, thankfully I dont belong in that category.

I enjoyed poker immensly, as I was playing very well :D

[ioan]

Out of curiosity, what line of work are you in.


Right now I'm in a long holiday, otherwise teaching CAD & CAM at the University at the moment.

[Ranger]

Well Bourdais is out.

Piquet could be out for Hungary, replaced by Grosjean.
Autosport (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/76961), Turun Sanomat (http://www.ts.fi/f1/sahkeet/60386.html)

Klien could be back in for 2010 in a BMW (which would be a big mistake).
link (http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/090714113220.shtml)

[markabilly]

:D


:rotflmao: Tell me at once which drugs you are using
all i can get, but not as many as i deserve.....

Kimi to ice cream truck, good one

but JV to brawn,??? not while brawn is there--I need some of bagwan's stash..

or better yet, klien back to beemer?? I definetly need some of the drugs that beemer is on....

[Bagwan]

[quote="markabilly"]all i can get, but not as many as i deserve.....

Kimi to ice cream truck, good one

but JV to brawn,??? not while brawn is there--I need some of bagwan's stash..

[quote]

I sell ice cream , so maybe I'll get a truck if Kimi wants to drive it .

Yeah , JV beat Ross , but he's not still stinging about that now , is he ?
I would prescribe a triple decker , with Chocolate on the bottom , Dandelion in the middle , and a big scoop of Maple chunk on the top .

Kimi , can you get that for the man ?

PS - you can't afford my stash , Billy .

[Roamy]

Kimi to rally in an icecream truck ..
Jacques to Brawn .
Rubens to Williams .
Alonso to Ferrari .


I don't know that Brawn would hire JV after the battles with MS. But for sure Alonso to ferrari - sounds like kimi will go to rAlly cars

[ShiftingGears]

Loeb to Ferrari
Kimi to Citroen

I expect this to appear on PlanetF1 as a rumour in a matter of days.

[pettersolberg29]

:D You cannot drop to my level kiddo, we are not even remotely close, so inferior are you compared to me.

To illustrate my point - you are a Dacia Logan with a broken engine and no tyres whereas I am Ferrari Enzo :D

Whatever you say... ;)



All he needed to do was to beat his joke of a teammate. Davidson did not do that.

Fair enough. I will admit I didn't know he was beaten by his teamamte that often; however Davidson was much less experienced at the time I think?


(Klien) was always beaten by his teammates. Klien is a nobody.

Disagree completely. Yes he was beaten, maybe even crushed, but Webber is a great driver with a lot of experience. Klien was young and inconsistent, but showed potential IMO. I still beleive one day he'll become a solid midfield driver.



jaime alguersuari is the same, not algesari.
But he has not had a chance yet, why does klien deserve another one when that guy has not even had one chance? How many times will klien waste a good seat?

Spelling noted, however his F1 career will most likely be so short and poor that I wont have to remember it for long. And I think Klien deserves a chance at a team like BMW, Renault or Williams - even if only for 5 races - just to see if he has a bit more in his locker. Alguersuari will have countless numbers of chances probably - he still has 15 years left in F1 at least. (I don't understand what you mean by 'the same'?)


Where did I say he does not deserve a drive next year?

You said "If it wasnt for F1 having some new teams next year, I would bet money on Heidfeld not having a drive(r) for next season."
True you never said he didn't deserve it, but you must think he's pretty poor to not get in among the top 10 teams at the moment.



:rotflmao: Tell me at once which drugs you are using

Heidfeld has the record for most race finishes in a row, least crashes, and as far as I know has had very few techincal issues ever. He knows how to treat a car well, and how to finish races. This is perfect for new teams or makes a great second driver. I never said he was consistently good, just consistent.

[ioan]

Heidfeld has the record for most race finishes in a row, least crashes, and as far as I know has had very few techincal issues ever. He knows how to treat a car well, and how to finish races. This is perfect for new teams or makes a great second driver. I never said he was consistently good, just consistent.

Honestly, do you think there is any use to lose your time with Garry?!
Take my advice, ignore him. He's just arguing for the sake of the argument, it's called trolling! :)

[pettersolberg29]

Honestly, do you think there is any use to lose your time with Garry?!
Take my advice, ignore him. He's just arguing for the sake of the argument, it's called trolling! :)

Thanks for the advice - I just can't resist a good argument, especially when I know I'm right...

[ioan]

Thanks for the advice - I just can't resist a good argument, especially when I know I'm right...

I somewhat understand you but you can't win an argument against someone who doesn't want to discuss but only to make you mad.

[pettersolberg29]

Thats very true Ioan.

[jens]

Klien could be back in for 2010 in a BMW (which would be a big mistake).
link (http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/090714113220.shtml)

This rumour doesn't make any sense at all - I can't believe they are seriously considering this option unless Heidfeld/Kubica has decided to leave BMW on their own will plus Rosberg or whoever else available has decided to refuse BMW's offer.

[Garry Walker]

Fair enough. I will admit I didn't know he was beaten by his teamamte that often; however Davidson was much less experienced at the time I think?
Davidson needed to consistantly beat Sato. More often than not they were equal and Sato is not exactly the guy who one should lose to.
Davidson has massive experience from testing BAR for years, he is one of the drivers who cannot complain about lack of experience.



Disagree completely. Yes he was beaten, maybe even crushed, but Webber is a great driver with a lot of experience. Klien was young and inconsistent, but showed potential IMO. I still beleive one day he'll become a solid midfield driver.Klien was also beaten by DC in their two seasons together and was less impressive against him than Doornbos was against DC in the few races RD got.
How many more chances does one deserve? Another season of losing to his teammate?
Drivers like Alonso and Kimi managed to use one chance they got and got into top teams, Klien did nothing impressive.



Spelling noted, however his F1 career will most likely be so short and poor that I wont have to remember it for long.Much like Kliens and Davidsons.



And I think Klien deserves a chance at a team like BMW, Renault or Williams - even if only for 5 races - just to see if he has a bit more in his locker. Alguersuari will have countless numbers of chances probably - he still has 15 years left in F1 at least. (I don't understand what you mean by 'the same'?)

Klien has had so many chances already, enough is enough. Time for younger drivers to get a chance.



You said "If it wasnt for F1 having some new teams next year, I would bet money on Heidfeld not having a drive(r) for next season."
True you never said he didn't deserve it, but you must think he's pretty poor to not get in among the top 10 teams at the moment.
So you admit I said nothing of the sort you claimed I said. Good, we are making progress.

Heidfeld is an okay driver, but I would not at all be surprised if there was little interest in him. He just is not a stand-out driver. Do I think there should still be a place for him in F1? Yes, he is a good driver, but not a great one. I would prefer him over a waste of seat like Klien every day.
Would I be even slightly sad if he retired or wouldnt be given a seat for next season? Absolutely not.



Heidfeld has the record for most race finishes in a row, least crashes, and as far as I know has had very few techincal issues ever. He knows how to treat a car well, and how to finish races. This is perfect for new teams or makes a great second driver. I never said he was consistently good, just consistent.
Just because he finishes races does not mean he is consistent, but rather that he has been lucky to have a car that is reliable for a long period of time and has not had idiots ram him out of the race.

[Garry Walker]

Honestly, do you think there is any use to lose your time with Garry?!
Take my advice, ignore him. He's just arguing for the sake of the argument, it's called trolling! :)

The only trolling (and I might add sad attempts at that) I have seen is you trying your luck at flaming me with Bourdais fanboy references.

Just because you yourself enjoy trolling so much does not mean that everyone else who takes hard views on things is trolling, but then again, in your twisted world, anyone who does not find Vettel and Heidfeld cute and superdooper, probably is at once considered a troll, no matter what the content of the posts are.

[Kimachu]

Finnish newspaper iltasanomat claims to have information that Rosberg has signed a contract with BMW...

[jens]

Klien was also beaten by DC in their two seasons together and was less impressive against him than Doornbos was against DC in the few races RD got.


Good that you mentioned him as with all that Klien-talk I was thinking about turning attention to that Dutchman sooner or later as well.

Doornbos is a perfect example of Red Bull's junior driver program and its inefficiency - case of throwing drivers one after another into F1 and replacing them frequently (Alguersuari, etc guys may face the same fate). Doornbos is a real example of not having got a proper opportunity of proving himself, not Klien. IIRC Doornbos outshone Albers at Minardi at the end of 2005 and didn't Robert outqualify DC on 2 occasions out of 3 during his brief comeback in 2006? This is the man, who I think really would have deserved another chance.

But people's memory is interesting - a driver, who got 3 (below-average) seasons is preferred/remembered over a guy, who got a handful of Grand Prix's and was impressive.

[Saint Devote]

I would actually like to see Kimi and Fernando in the same team, that could actually work, they seem to have a lot of respect for each other. I don't think it's going to happen though.

Alonso's argument was never between himself and Hamilton at Mclaren. Commentators on Speed last weekend spoke of argument between the two and they are wrong.

Alonso's argument was with Ron Dennis. That was the problem.

So I would think Alonso will okay anywhere as long as the team pays attention [also] to what he wants. Ron Dennis, as Alonso put it, never listened to him or paid him the due respect as a driver, a twice world champion expects.

[ioan]

Finnish newspaper iltasanomat claims to have information that Rosberg has signed a contract with BMW...

Williams must be pulling his hair.
First BMW quit him and now they also poached his best driver.

[Roamy]

Well he ain't won sh!t since JV left so he may as well re-sign him

[jens]

According to Autosport.com Trulli is close to continuing at Toyota.

[Ranger]

Williams must be pulling his hair.
First BMW quit him and now they also poached his best driver.

Nico Hulkenberg looks the goods, so Williams shouldn't be too worried.

On another note, is it possible we won't see a Japanese driver on the grid next year? It is clear that Nakajima is doing nothing and has been for some time.

[Saint Devote]

Why would Rosberg choose to go to BMW-Sauber? I think the newspaper is presuming. He should first speak to Kubica about how rigid the team is!

I think Rosberg will stay at Williams and he should. The team know how to win and the second part of 2009 they have begun to move up with Rosberg scoring points.

He will also be able to negotiate a preferrential deal with Williams as their number 1 driver.

He is a comfortable fit at Williams and one more year will not make any difference.

It is the 2011 season that will be the big musical chairs event because that is when Alonso and Raikonnen's contracts are up amongst others.

Also, he will be able to see which teams are best set with t new regulations.

It is too soon now and BNW-Sauber is the LAST team a driver like Rosberg should sign for.

I am positive Keke would not agree that BMW-Sauber is a team to sign for either.

[Saint Devote]

A team consisting of Hulkenberg and Rosberg would be an excellent fit. I reckon Toyota would still supply them but they could always rely on Cosworth power if not.

Mercedes-Benz might also be an engine supplier - nothing is out of the question. M-B have declared that they will supply three teams anyway......

[ShiftingGears]

I think Rosberg will stay at Williams and he should. The team know how to win

They've had one win since Sam Michael has been technical director. That's one win almost five years ago.

[ioan]

I reckon Toyota would still supply them but they could always rely on Cosworth power if not.

Mercedes-Benz might also be an engine supplier - nothing is out of the question. M-B have declared that they will supply three teams anyway......

Not sure about that.
The rules as they are specify that an engine manufacturer can only supply a number of teams, not half the grid.

[Ranger]

Not sure about that.
The rules as they are specify that an engine manufacturer can only supply a number of teams, not half the grid.

That rule is under review as I understand, such that 4 teams can have the same engine.

[DexDexter]

They've had one win since Sam Michael has been technical director. That's one win almost five years ago.

Exactly. Teams like Lotus etc. also won races and then went bust. When Williams last won races they were a manufacturer-backed team, now they are independent and absolutely nothing suggests they will get back to their winning days.

[ioan]

That rule is under review as I understand, such that 4 teams can have the same engine.

It might be under review, probably by the FIA :\ , however as far as we know the FOTA insists to run by the 2009 rules, which state that a manufacturer can only supply engines to 2 teams a 3rd team needs an agreement from the other teams.

You think the others will agree that Mercedes supplies half the grid or more?!
First of all it's lost money for them and secondly it puts them into a strategic inferiority.

[Copse]

A team consisting of Hulkenberg and Rosberg would be an excellent fit. I reckon Toyota would still supply them but they could always rely on Cosworth power if not.

Mercedes-Benz might also be an engine supplier - nothing is out of the question. M-B have declared that they will supply three teams anyway......

Just won't happen. If Nakajima is out, Kobayashi will take his place (unless he ends up at Cologne, of course). Toyota will not let Williams chose both drivers.

[jens]

As for Rosberg and the question Williams vs BMW-Sauber and why on Earth he should choose BMW... Well, Williams has been doing well this year and also I guessed in pre-season that the new rules might suit them and as an experienced team they may take an advantage of it. To say in another way - with radical rule changes maybe the budget hasn't counted as much as some clever innovational ideas. But if the rules are stable, then the better-finances team may find their proper development rhythm, which they maybe didn't find initially, and start moving upwards.

But Rosberg's task is to choose the right team in the long run, not based on current performance. And I suspect teams like Brawn, Williams and unfortunately maybe Force India as well will struggle more in 2010 than now, with factory teams gradually regaining their power. Brawn is already seemingly running out of money and their recent drop of performance (lack of development pace) maybe a direct result of this. And probably Rosberg also bets on the assumption that in 2010 all factory teams will be ahead of Williams again like in 2008 (with the exception of Honda).

BMW-Sauber, however, seems like a team, who can find a good stable and consistent platform for continuous improvement with relatively stable rules (like that consistent rise in 06-08), but seem a bit lost with radical changes. At least that's my guess. But another question is - why BMW if Nico wants to leave Williams? Brawn's concerning situation has already been mentioned. Red Bull and Ferrari are both very enticing teams, but both seem already filled. What about McLaren? Back in 2007 Keke Rosberg blocked Nico's move to McLaren, after arguably an offer was made, and I think it is Keke's firm understanding that as long as Hamilton stays in McLaren, it's not worth joining them to become a #2. And finally - BMW vs Toyota vs Renault. All of them have a reputation of being a "nearly-team" in recent years, so all in all with such way of argumentation Rosberg family may have concluded that BMW is worth a bet. Although admittedly I don't quite see them challenging a championship in short future.

Another issue that has been raised here is that maybe in 2010 there won't be any Japanese drivers in F1. Entirely possible, although it can't be ruled out that Sato might find a seat somewhere (even in a new team?) with the help of sponsorship. Kobayash is barely average in GP2, so I can't believe he is going to join F1 in any way. Nakajima is so hopeless that I think it may be worth for Williams to take a bet on paying both the Toyota engines and also second race driver's salary rather than get both for free. But I don't know their exact financial situation and what can they afford themselves.

[maximilian]

So what do we have so far?
(CAPS are confirmed or almost confirmed, names without questionmarks "likely")

McLaren: HAMILTON / Rosberg? Glock?? Kovalainen??
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso? Raikkonen??
BMW: Kubica / Klien? Rosberg? Heidfeld?
Renault: Grosjean? Alonso?? Heidfeld? Kovalainen??
Toyota: TRULLI / Glock? Heidfeld?
Toro Rosso: BUEMI / Loeb? Alguersuari??
Red Bull: WEBBER / Vettel
Williams: Hülkenberg / Nakajima
Force India: Liuzzi / Sutil? Fisichella?
Brawn: Button / Senna? Barrichello?
USF1: Rahal? Speed? Andretti?? Barrichello?? Villeneuve??
Campos: DE LA ROSA / Pantano? Senna? Petrov?
Manor: Di Resta? Di Grassi? Davidson? Villeneuve??

[ClarkFan]

It might be under review, probably by the FIA :\ , however as far as we know the FOTA insists to run by the 2009 rules, which state that a manufacturer can only supply engines to 2 teams a 3rd team needs an agreement from the other teams.

You think the others will agree that Mercedes supplies half the grid or more?!
First of all it's lost money for them and secondly it puts them into a strategic inferiority.

Depends on what happens with the other manufacturer rumors circulating. If Toyota pulls out, engine makers like Mercedes may have to pick up more teams, especially if someone decides to continue the entry of the current Toyota team.

ClarkFan

[ioan]

Depends on what happens with the other manufacturer rumors circulating. If Toyota pulls out, engine makers like Mercedes may have to pick up more teams, especially if someone decides to continue the entry of the current Toyota team.

ClarkFan

AFAIK all manufacturers accepted to supply engine + transmission packages for 5.5 millions € / season.

So if any of the manufacturers pulls out the remaining 4 + Cosworth will supply the 12 remaining teams, with a limit of 2 teams / manufacturer + a third team if the other teams agree.

Having any of the manufacturers supply more than one third of the grid will not be beneficial for the sport, IMO

[DexDexter]

What about McLaren? Back in 2007 Keke Rosberg blocked Nico's move to McLaren, after arguably an offer was made, and I think it is Keke's firm understanding that as long as Hamilton stays in McLaren, it's not worth joining them to become a #2.
.

Spot on, Kovalainen's recent treatment confirms that the team is centered around Hamilton and the second driver is always going to have a hard time, which is by the way totally fine if that's their strategy. Talking about Nico, people seem to consider Nico as German, well in reality he is from Monaco and has lived there all his life.

[maximilian]

Spot on, Kovalainen's recent treatment confirms that the team is centered around Hamilton and the second driver is always going to have a hard time, which is by the way totally fine if that's their strategy. Talking about Nico, people seem to consider Nico as German, well in reality he is from Monaco and has lived there all his life.

If Nico is as good as I think he could be, he may well prove consistently quicker than LH, and win the team over. Norbert Haug has already strewn him roses, and I am sure Mercedes would LOVE to have a German poster boy ;)

[cos]

So what do we have so far?

Manor: Di Resta? Di Grassi? Davidson? Villeneuve??

How about Chilton and Carroll?
http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/f1-first-drivers-linked-to-2010-manor-seats/

[maximilian]

How about Chilton and Carroll?
http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/f1-first-drivers-linked-to-2010-manor-seats/
Indeed... updated below!
(CAPS are confirmed or almost confirmed, names without questionmarks "likely")

McLaren: HAMILTON / Rosberg? Glock?? Kovalainen??
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso? Raikkonen??
BMW: Kubica / Klien? Rosberg? Heidfeld?
Renault: Grosjean? Alonso?? Heidfeld? Kovalainen??
Toyota: TRULLI / Glock? Heidfeld?
Toro Rosso: BUEMI / Loeb? Alguersuari??
Red Bull: WEBBER / VETTEL
Williams: Hülkenberg / Nakajima
Force India: Liuzzi / Sutil? Fisichella?
Brawn: Button / Senna? Barrichello?
USF1: Rahal? Speed? Andretti?? Barrichello?? Villeneuve?
Campos: de la Rosa / Pantano? Senna? Petrov?
Manor: Chilton? Carroll? Di Resta? Di Grassi? Davidson?

[Roamy]

hey maximillian Andretti can't even beat Patrick - How in the world could you think he may be able to come to F1. Or maybe Windsor is dumb as a post!

[jens]

McLaren: HAMILTON / Rosberg? Glock?? Kovalainen??
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso? Raikkonen??
BMW: Kubica / Klien? Rosberg? Heidfeld?
Renault: Grosjean? Alonso?? Heidfeld? Kovalainen??
Toyota: TRULLI / Glock? Heidfeld?
Toro Rosso: BUEMI / Loeb? Alguersuari??
Red Bull: WEBBER / VETTEL
Williams: Hülkenberg / Nakajima
Force India: Liuzzi / Sutil? Fisichella?
Brawn: Button / Senna? Barrichello?
USF1: Rahal? Speed? Andretti?? Barrichello?? Villeneuve?
Campos: de la Rosa / Pantano? Senna? Petrov?
Manor: Chilton? Carroll? Di Resta? Di Grassi? Davidson?

I don't think Glock is or has ever been in serious contact with McLaren - these were most likely empty rumours. Toyota has pretty much confirmed Glock will be driving at their team in 2010.

You can add more drivers as potential candidates for Williams drive in 2010, like Barrichello and Heidfeld. And Rosberg isn't completely ruled out yet either.

Just my observations. :)

[jens]

I have 'silently' been pondering, whether Kubica is satisfied at BMW and whether he could consider moving on, and now James Allen in his blog has finally brought out a possible move - Kubica is linked with a Renault drive.

[DexDexter]

I have 'silently' been pondering, whether Kubica is satisfied at BMW and whether he could consider moving on, and now James Allen in his blog has finally brought out a possible move - Kubica is linked with a Renault drive.

The question is what would Renault offer that BMW doesn't? As far as I know, Renault has not recruited any new design people so I think they are going to struggle in the coming years as well just like Toyota (sorry).

[Tazio]

Talking about Nico, people seem to consider Nico as German, well in reality he is from Monaco and has lived there all his life.Guess again!

Nico Rosberg (born June 27, 1985 in Wiesbaden, Germany) is a racing driver for the Williams Formula One team. He races under the German flag in Formula One, although he competed for Finland earlier in his career. He holds dual nationality from both countries.

In Formula One, as for all FIA world championships, a driver's nationality is defined by their passport. Rosberg races under the German flag in Formula One as of 2009.

Sorrrry :)

[ioan]

The question is what would Renault offer that BMW doesn't? As far as I know, Renault has not recruited any new design people so I think they are going to struggle in the coming years as well just like Toyota (sorry).

Not that BMW did recruit any top shelf people that I'm aware either.

[ioan]

Guess again!

Nico Rosberg (born June 27, 1985 in Wiesbaden, Germany) is a racing driver for the Williams Formula One team. He races under the German flag in Formula One, although he competed for Finland earlier in his career. He holds dual nationality from both countries.

In Formula One, as for all FIA world championships, a driver's nationality is defined by their passport. Rosberg races under the German flag in Formula One as of 2009.

Sorrrry :)

What the heck is with this rant of yours?!

Dex is right. NR has dual nationality but grew up and now lives in Monaco.

Nationality and passport are great to brag about, but does he feel German, or Finnish or Monegasque?!

[Tazio]

What the heck is with this rant of yours?!

Dex is right. NR has dual nationality but grew up and now lives in Monaco.

Nationality and passport are great to brag about, but does he feel German, or Finnish or Monegasque?!
Call it a rant if you wish But Rosberg is a Grman F1 Driver by the rule of the sporting regulations.
As for his personal life. That is for the tabloids to argue!
Why don't you ask him personally, and then get back to me smart @ss!

[DexDexter]

Call it a rant if you wish But Rosberg is a Grman F1 Driver by the rule of the sporting regulations.
As for his personal life. That is for the tabloids to argue!
Why don't you ask him personally, and then get back to me smart @ss!

I feel a ban in the air.

[DexDexter]

Not that BMW did recruit any top shelf people that I'm aware either.

True. Basically there is no better car for Kubica for next year.

[ioan]

I feel a ban in the air.

I got the impression that the elders of the forum are a bit stressed these last couple of weeks.

[maximilian]

hey maximillian Andretti can't even beat Patrick - How in the world could you think he may be able to come to F1. Or maybe Windsor is dumb as a post!
I personally don't think Andretti would be a good choice, but he is certainly being rumored as one of the candidates, probably more because of the possibility of the famous name making yet another return to F1. One could also argue that his youth still makes him a driver with potential to grow and develop into a decent racer. But I am by no means his advocate, I just listed him, as he was mentioned in a few places as a possibility, and as it may make sense from a marketing point of view for USF1.

[maximilian]

Another update, based on recent comments:
(CAPS are confirmed or almost confirmed, names without questionmarks "likely")

McLaren: HAMILTON / Rosberg? Raikkonen?? Kovalainen?? Sutil??
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso? Raikkonen??
BMW: Kubica / Klien? Rosberg? Heidfeld?
Renault: Grosjean? Alonso?? Heidfeld? Kovalainen?? Kubica??
Toyota: TRULLI / Glock? Heidfeld?
Toro Rosso: BUEMI / Loeb? Alguersuari??
Red Bull: WEBBER / VETTEL
Williams: Hülkenberg / Nakajima? Heidfeld?? Berrichello??
Force India: Liuzzi / Sutil? Fisichella?
Brawn: Button / Senna? Barrichello?
USF1: Wurz? Rahal? Speed? Andretti?? Barrichello?? Villeneuve?
Campos: de la Rosa? Gene? / Pantano? Senna? Petrov?
Manor: Chilton? Carroll? Di Resta? Di Grassi? Davidson?

I don't think there have ever been this many silly season questionmarks! Seems like almost everything is up in the air...

[Dave B]

Right now one might as well post:

McLaren: HAMILTON / Kovy / Wurz / Villeneuve / Patrick / Jackson / Presley / Benedict XVI / CarlMetro's dad

:p

[Giuseppe F1]

Will we see Badoer in Massa's seat for Valencia 09?

[maximilian]

Will we see Badoer in Massa's seat for Valencia 09?
Maybe Marc Gene would be more likely. Or Rossi might give his debut! :D
With the long break to that race, probably Massa will be just fine!

[ioan]

Maybe Marc Gene would be more likely. Or Rossi might give his debut! :D
With the long break to that race, probably Massa will be just fine!

Looks like Massa won't race this season anymore.
I hope they bring back MS from his retirement, he's certainly better than Gene and Badoer together.

[jens]

The question is what would Renault offer that BMW doesn't? As far as I know, Renault has not recruited any new design people so I think they are going to struggle in the coming years as well just like Toyota (sorry).

Heh. :) Well, although there might not seem to be a big difference, then while BMW hasn't shown even any tiny sign of improvement, Renault seems to be at least improving, even though slowly. The in-season development pace of Brawn, Toyota and BMW have been the worst so far. And BMW's already for the second year in a row.


Looks like Massa won't race this season anymore.


Sure that the situation is so bad? But if that's the case, I'd nominate Mr Michael as replacement too.

[ioan]

Sure that the situation is so bad?

I don't know how bad it is, but it could certainly turn very ugly if there is not enough time for recovery.

I had brain concussion a long time ago (23 years ago) and it took many years until I could say I was 100% OK again.

[Robinho]

i expect the concussion will be the deciding factor (despite the surgery), assuming, as reported/rumoured it was reltively minor (as it can be) surgery, non invasive and he heals quickly he physically could be fit in around 6 weeks, but depending on the seriousness of the concussion it might take him a little longer.

thats said, Kovy and Kubica have both suffered massive accidents and concussion in the last couple of years and both had less than 4 weeks out (i think Kovy was fit for the next race)

i'd guess (and at this stage its just a guess) that we may see Massa back this year, he'll miss this and probably the next 2 races, but if he recovers well he'll be back sooner rather than later. all of that also assumes he's comfortable getting back in the car - it was a scary incident and he may struggle more mentally than physically to just jump back in a drive.

it would be great to see Michael back for a few races, just to see what he can do in that car and if he can still cut it against the current crop, but in reality i expect it'l be Badoer or Gene

[jens]

I can't really think any advantages Gene or Badoer have over M. Schumacher. MS himself may not be a young man any more, but it's not like LB or MG are significantly younger.

[Robinho]

the deciding factor wil be if MS wants to come back and do some races. he's not a contracted reserve driver, like Gene or Badoer. i imagine MS would be the 1st choice, but to be honest i doubt he'd want to come and fill in for a few races and will leave it to one of the contracted testers

[DazzlaF1]

Will we see Badoer in Massa's seat for Valencia 09?

Marc Gene's the more likely bet id imagine.

[ClarkFan]

Looks like Massa won't race this season anymore.
I hope they bring back MS from his retirement, he's certainly better than Gene and Badoer together.
And just imagine how Ecclestone and CVC would react to that development - ringing of trumpets and shouted hosannas!

:p

ClarkFan

[CNR]

McLaren: HAMILTON / Raikkonen
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso Kubica
USF1:Barrichello

[Dave B]

Massa must now be a key to the driver market: if he retires expect Ferrari to make a move for Kubica to partner Alonso - now that could be spectacular!

[ioan]

Massa must now be a key to the driver market: if he retires expect Ferrari to make a move for Kubica to partner Alonso - now that could be spectacular!

Kubica?
He's the most overrated driver on the grid, IMO.

If it happens that Felipe doesn't come back to racing than they will keep Kimi and bring in another driver, but Kubica?!
I think it will most probably be Alonso or Vettel.

[seb_sh]

What contract does Vettel have? Red Bull will definitely not want to loose him.

IMO Ferrari should get Alonso, he's probably the most complete driver on the grid atm and a proven winner, precisely what they need.

[Big Ben]

McLaren: HAMILTON / Raikkonen
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso Kubica
USF1:Barrichello

Hmmm... Raikkonen back in a McLaren... I would surely like that...And Alonso in a competitive car again (hopefully)

[jens]

Massa will comeback, so don't speculate that way. ;)

BMW's withdrawal may change some situations now. Kubica is now certainly going to leave somewhere and also Rosberg is going to drop his plan of moving to post-BMW stuff. But the unstability of current F1 makes driver market a bit shaky too. For example Kubica has been linked to Renault, but as the French manufacturer's future is unclear as well, can Robert really commit to them? Heidfeld could "do a Button" and hope that Sauber saves his F1 drive.

[CNR]

Hmmm... Raikkonen back in a McLaren... I would surely like that...And Alonso in a competitive car again (hopefully)

this was from peter windsor (australian tv f1 correspondent) that Raikkonen may go back to McLaren

[CNR]

Massa will comeback, so don't speculate that way. ;)


http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hZL4O74AuFCZPVu46lEpnuLXEFzQD99OAUAO0

Also on Wednesday, Brazilian driver and friend Popo Bueno said Massa had asked about his chances of racing in Valencia in three weeks, the next race on the F1 calendar.

[TMorel]

silly season? can it get any sillier than what's actually happening?
Who would have thought it !

I'd like to see Kimi give rallying a proper shot, not just the odd event. that'd be one rumor I'd love to see

[Roamy]

Massa must now be a key to the driver market: if he retires expect Ferrari to make a move for Kubica to partner Alonso - now that could be spectacular!

I have seen nothing that would lead me to believe Kubica would be spectacular in comparison to Alonso.

[Saint Devote]

Right now one might as well post:

McLaren: HAMILTON / Kovy / Wurz / Villeneuve / Patrick / Jackson / Presley / Benedict XVI / CarlMetro's dad

:p

:D You think that the Vatican would allow the Sunday Mass to be held later AFTER the grand prix?

[Saint Devote]

And just imagine how Ecclestone and CVC would react to that development - ringing of trumpets and shouted hosannas!

:p

ClarkFan

LOL!!!
I have no idea what hosannas are but I hear the trumpets!!!

[Saint Devote]

silly season? can it get any sillier than what's actually happening?
Who would have thought it !

I'd like to see Kimi give rallying a proper shot, not just the odd event. that'd be one rumor I'd love to see

So would I. He should go drive in rallying in 2010 and we could have Alonso in the seat.

[Valve Bounce]

SchM at STR.

[harsha]

McLaren: HAMILTON / Rosberg? Raikkonen?? Kovalainen?? Sutil?? Kubica?
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso? Raikkonen?? Kubica?
Renault: Grosjean? Alonso?? Heidfeld? Kovalainen?? Kubica??
Toyota: TRULLI / Glock? Heidfeld? Kubica?
Toro Rosso: BUEMI / Loeb? Alguersuari??
Red Bull: WEBBER / VETTEL
Williams: Hülkenberg / Nakajima? Heidfeld?? Berrichello??
Force India: Liuzzi / Sutil? Fisichella?
Brawn: Button / Senna? Barrichello? Heidfeld?
USF1: Wurz? Rahal? Speed? Andretti?? Barrichello?? Villeneuve?
Campos: de la Rosa? Gene? / Pantano? Senna? Petrov?
Manor: Chilton? Carroll? Di Resta? Di Grassi? Davidson?

[Shifter]

McLaren: HAMILTON / Rosberg? Raikkonen?? Kovalainen?? Sutil?? Kubica?
Ferrari: MASSA / Alonso? Raikkonen?? Kubica?
Renault: Grosjean? Alonso?? Heidfeld? Kovalainen?? Kubica??
Toyota: TRULLI / Glock? Heidfeld? Kubica?
Toro Rosso: BUEMI / Loeb? Alguersuari??
Red Bull: WEBBER / VETTEL
Williams: Hülkenberg / Nakajima? Heidfeld?? Berrichello??
Force India: Liuzzi / Sutil? Fisichella?
Brawn: Button / Senna? Barrichello? Heidfeld?
USF1: Wurz? Rahal? Speed? Andretti?? Barrichello?? Villeneuve?
Campos: de la Rosa? Gene? / Pantano? Senna? Petrov?
Manor: Chilton? Carroll? Di Resta? Di Grassi? Davidson?

Good summary, but what of Rosberg? He's proven himself, and you've only tied him to McLaren. If I was any team manager I'd be gunning hard for him right now for 2010.

[harsha]

Good summary, but what of Rosberg? He's proven himself, and you've only tied him to McLaren. If I was any team manager I'd be gunning hard for him right now for 2010.

probably cause I want Rosberg @ Mclaren...that looks to be the best bet for him...

I don't see any other option for Rosberg really...you could count ferrari if Massa pulls out and they need someone to partner Raikkonen / Alonso...then again you could have a Rakka / Alonso team or a Massa / Alonso team or continue with the same status quo...

I wouldn't rule out Rakka shifting back to Mclaren too

[Valve Bounce]

How about Rosberg and SchM at STR, with the latter as owner/driver. First time since Brabham.

[Shifter]

I'd certainly enjoy seeing Rosberg at McLaren. I was not particularily sold on him for awhile but as of late I feel like he is getting the most out of the Williams chassis.

[DexDexter]

this was from peter windsor (australian tv f1 correspondent) that Raikkonen may go back to McLaren

I don't think so but they do understand what Kimi is about a lot better than the people at Ferrari it seems. If Ron Dennis came back, then I could see Kimi there.

[ioan]

I don't think so but they do understand what Kimi is about a lot better than the people at Ferrari it seems. If Ron Dennis came back, then I could see Kimi there.

That's why McLaren never ever allowed him to do what he wanted, while Ferrari have granted him to run in rallies during the F1 season! :rolleyes:

[Valve Bounce]

I don't think so but they do understand what Kimi is about a lot better than the people at Ferrari it seems. If Ron Dennis came back, then I could see Kimi there.

Yeah!! rumour has it that McLaren have offered Kimi a double loo if he came back.

[Dave B]

That's why McLaren never ever allowed him to do what he wanted, while Ferrari have granted him to run in rallies during the F1 season! :rolleyes:
You don't think it's because Ferrari know they're not fighting for either championship this year?

[Dave B]

Kubica is now officially open to offers, according to his manager:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77430

[jens]

I think Rosberg will end up in either McLaren or Williams, depending on his fear of becoming #2 driver alongside Lewis and attitude about facing a team-mate battle with him. But I don't know, what is he exactly thinking.

For Kubica the most likely scenario might still be Renault, provided they stay in F1. If they don't, anything among McLaren, Toyota, Brawn or even Williams is possible.

[ClarkFan]

Yeah!! rumour has it that McLaren have offered Kimi a double loo if he came back.
And a lap dance before qualifying!

ClarkFan

[ioan]

You don't think it's because Ferrari know they're not fighting for either championship this year?

He did run in rallies last season too, and this year before the season start.
Also McLaren wasn't fighting for any championship in 2006 and they knw he was out to Ferrari and still didn't let him do it.

I guess it's just that Domenicalli isn't the control freak Ron was.

[ioan]

Apparently there won't be too many new drivers in those 6 new seats next season!

6 places, 1 taken by De La Rosa, 1 by Heidfeld and 1 by Kubica + apparently Villeneuve might want to return too and Piquet will probably manage to pick up one of those too.

[Roamy]

And a lap dance before qualifying!

ClarkFan


Or maybe a couple shot of Hamilton's girl friend :eek: :eek: :p

[christophulus]

If Rosberg does jump across to McLaren (and I can understand him doing so), Williams could do worse than move for Kovalainen. Heidfeld and Barrichello are possible but I reckon Kova would be a better bet - Rosberg has improved at Williams so Kova could do the same. Hulkenberg & Nakajima would be a pretty weak pairing.

Kubica? Rumours of him replacing Alonso at Renault seem feasible - depends if Flav can put up with him criticising the car I guess!

[woody2goody]

How about Rosberg and SchM at STR, with the latter as owner/driver. First time since Brabham.

Is that a real possibilty? I'd be excited if that happened. Either Buemi or Alguersuari I'm guessing in the second car?

[William Hunt]

I think Kubica will go to Renault and partner Grosjean there (if they are still there next year) or otherwise he might partner Button at Brawn. Heidfeld is also a possibility for Brawn, he's a teamplayer and an excellent driver to back up Jenson. Barrichello will retire. I expect Alonso to partner Massa at Ferrari.

Rosberg probably moves to McLaren with Hülkenberg filling his seat.
If Nakajima doesn't stay (normally he will stay) then Kovalainen or Heidfeld could move to Williams. Frank Williams always liked Heidfeld, but that would make 2 Germans so Kovalainen more likely.

Piquet could move to a possibly new founded team by his father (instead of BMW Sauber).

Toyota shall line-up an unchanged line-up if... they don't opt out of F1, which is a real possibity. If that happens Trulli & Glock will be wanted by several teams.

USF1 might run with Alexander Wurz and Graham Rahal (best young US driver).

Torro Rosso & Red Bull will keep their drivers.

Manor might take their young star Roberto Merhi to F1 and will probably partner him with an experienced driver; they will probably wait to see who's available (Heidfeld, Kovalainen, Glock if Toyota exits, Bourdais, Davidson or Sato or all good options).

Campos will field at least one Spaniard (de la Rosa, Gene, Roldan Rodriguez or Javier Villa) and possibly Petrov or Pantano.

[ioan]

Is that a real possibilty?

I doubt it.


I'd be excited if that happened. Either Buemi or Alguersuari I'm guessing in the second car?

Well, if as Valve speculates MS and Rosberg will be driving for STR than I can't see any free place for SB or JA.

[ioan]

Just a thought, but what if Renault decide to pull out and Piquet buys the team?!
I'd love to see Flav's mug if that happens! :D

[ClarkFan]

:D You think that the Vatican would allow the Sunday Mass to be held later AFTER the grand prix?

During the race - the homily over team radios, wafers at the first pit stop, and wine at the second. :D

ClarkFan

[seb_sh]

Just a thought, but what if Renault decide to pull out and Piquet buys the team?!
I'd love to see Flav's mug if that happens! :D

Hehehe that would be sooo ironic. :D

[CNR]

do the new teams do what usgp is going to do and get 1 experienced driver for the first year

Giancarlo Fisichella
Nick Heidfeld
Rubens Barrichello

if Sauber was to take the team back would they get back some redbull backing and access to the redbull young drivers

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/279641,speculation-over-sauber-continuing-in-f1-without-bmw.html


Munich - There is speculation that Sauber team could continue in some guise despite the decision by BMW to pull out of Formula One at the end of the season. Team founder Peter Sauber admitted that the BMW-Sauber team will struggle to maintain a presence in F1 following BMW's move Wednesday but Mercedes motorsport director Norbert Haug pointed to the creation of Brawn GP following Honda's withdrawal late last year.

[William Hunt]

If Sauber takes full control of the team again (he still owns it for 20%) and wants to run it next year then he would need to find extra backing very fast. In the current climate that's not easy. I would look at a paydriver for one of the 2 seats in that scenario. Paydrivers have in the past helped teams to survive.

[William Hunt]

A quick guess on a possible 2010 line-up:

1. Jenson Button (Eng) Brawn
2. Nick Heidfeld (D) Brawn
3. Mark Webber (Aus) Red Bull
4. Sebastian Vettel (D) Red Bull
5. Fernando Alonso (Esp) Ferrari
6. Felipe Massa (Bra) Ferrari
7. Jarno Trulli (Ita) Toyota
8. Timo Glock (D) Toyota
9. Lewis Hamilton (Eng) McLaren
10. Nico Rosberg (D / Fin) McLaren
11. Kazuki Nakajima (Jap) Williams
12. Nico Hülkenberg (D) Williams
14. Romain Grosjean (Fra / Ch) Renault
15. Robert Kubica (Fra) Renault
16. Sebastian Buemi (Ch) Torro Rosso
17. Jaime Alguersuari (Esp) Torro Rosso
18. Adrian Sutil (D) Force India
19. Vitantonio Liuzzi (Ita) Force India
20. Nelson Piquet Jr. (Bra) Piquet Super Nova * (BMW Saubers's entry)
21. Roldan Rodriguez (Esp) Piquet Super Nova *
22. Alexander Wurz (Aut) USF1
23. Graham Rahal (USA) USF1
24. Adam Carroll (N-Irl) Manor
25. Roberto Merhi (Esp) Manor
26. Giorgio Pantano (Ita) Campos - Dallara
27. Pedro de la Rosa (Esp) Campos - Dallara

[Valve Bounce]

If Sauber takes full control of the team again (he still owns it for 20%) and wants to run it next year then he would need to find extra backing very fast. In the current climate that's not easy. I would look at a paydriver for one of the 2 seats in that scenario. Paydrivers have in the past helped teams to survive.

"Hello! this is Nelson"

[Saint Devote]

Its enough!!! Time for Barrichello, Fisichella, Trulli and Heidfeld to BOW OUT!

For crying out loud - these guys are past their peak, have raced in f1 for ever and a day and it is time to give some other drivers a go.

I cant stand drivers that never know when to leave - it reminds me of the late - and much missed James Hunt's comment - its always the bores that stay at a party until the very end! But likely they WILL STILL be around in 2010......

I think now that Kubica is available turns the driver market on its head.

I think Alonso will stay with Renault for another year with Flavio and then move to Ferrari in 2011.

I think Mclaren - above desires from Mercedes - will sign Kubica and therefore Rosberg will stay with the improving Williams team.

With Red Bull, Ferrari, Mclaren, Williams [Nakajima is likely to be retained because of Toyota], Toyota, Renault, Force India and Toro Rosso all pretty much set then the seats available will probably be at Brawn[1], Manor[2], USF1[2], Campos Meta[2] and TBA[2].

And some of the likely fillers are Hulkenberg, Wurz, only the lord knows why, he is a useless racing driver along with De La rosa and Gene.

I would still like to know how an American driver will be selected. There is not a single outstanding driver that is worthy of promotion to f1. If USF1 does select Rahal or any other American at this stage then clearly they are not serious about their task.

Wurz and Rahal in USF1 - reach for the vodka!

[DexDexter]

Its enough!!! Time for Barrichello, Fisichella, Trulli and Heidfeld to BOW OUT!

For crying out loud - these guys are past their peak, have raced in f1 for ever and a day and it is time to give some other drivers a go.

I cant stand drivers that never know when to leave - it reminds me of the late - and much missed James Hunt's comment - its always the bores that stay at a party until the very end! But likely they WILL STILL be around in 2010......



If Fisi and Trulli need to go, so do Glock and Sutil then, since they've failed to match those team mates of theirs who are past their peak. IMO it's good to have older experienced drivers in the mix as well.

[Valve Bounce]

Let those who are good enough stay; let those who don't measure up go.

[ioan]

Its enough!!!

Said our local holly spirit! :laugh:

[Sonic]

If Fisi and Trulli need to go, so do Glock and Sutil then, since they've failed to match those team mates of theirs who are past their peak. IMO it's good to have older experienced drivers in the mix as well.

Indeed. Age has nothing to do with it - only skill. Just last week most of us were laughing at JV's suggested return, and most of the same people are dribbling at the prospect of MS getting back behind the wheel. Last time I looked Shumi was older than JV.

[Saint Devote]

If Fisi and Trulli need to go, so do Glock and Sutil then, since they've failed to match those team mates of theirs who are past their peak. IMO it's good to have older experienced drivers in the mix as well.

Formula 1 is not about experience - they can use their experience in sports cars. F1 is about the quickest drivers competing for the world championship of motor racing and the best learn quickly.

These days drivers have careers that lasts for too many years without results. In the past teams were better at assessing their drivers.

In 2010 if a driver such as Hulkenberg does not find a drive and Fisichella or the other past it - he never really had it to begin with - drivers have drives then that is not f1 being the best that it can.

Barrichello, Kovaleinnen, Fisichella, Trulli, Heidfeld, Nakajima, Sutil and Glock should all be out if there are good potential drivers around.

When Jackie Stewart retired and Francois Cevert was killed, did Ken Tyrrell look at drivers that had been around for years? No.

He went for drivers that he assessed capable and considered their potential. He selected Jody Scheckter and Patrick Depailler.

That is f1.

[Saint Devote]

During the race - the homily over team radios, wafers at the first pit stop, and wine at the second. :D

ClarkFan

:) and as they climb the podium they would then kiss Bernie's ring!

[Saint Devote]

I think Kubica will go to Renault and partner Grosjean there (if they are still there next year) or otherwise he might partner Button at Brawn. Heidfeld is also a possibility for Brawn, he's a teamplayer and an excellent driver to back up Jenson. Barrichello will retire. I expect Alonso to partner Massa at Ferrari.

Rosberg probably moves to McLaren with Hülkenberg filling his seat.
If Nakajima doesn't stay (normally he will stay) then Kovalainen or Heidfeld could move to Williams. Frank Williams always liked Heidfeld, but that would make 2 Germans so Kovalainen more likely.

Piquet could move to a possibly new founded team by his father (instead of BMW Sauber).

Toyota shall line-up an unchanged line-up if... they don't opt out of F1, which is a real possibity. If that happens Trulli & Glock will be wanted by several teams.

USF1 might run with Alexander Wurz and Graham Rahal (best young US driver).

Torro Rosso & Red Bull will keep their drivers.

Manor might take their young star Roberto Merhi to F1 and will probably partner him with an experienced driver; they will probably wait to see who's available (Heidfeld, Kovalainen, Glock if Toyota exits, Bourdais, Davidson or Sato or all good options).

Campos will field at least one Spaniard (de la Rosa, Gene, Roldan Rodriguez or Javier Villa) and possibly Petrov or Pantano.

A great mistake and bad management to place nationality ahead of capitalism - but alas that is the way of the world.

[markabilly]

MS at str, along with rosberg??
Perhaps with a ferrari engine or maybe a mercedes?
MS cutting the ties that bind?
Another Jack B.?
Spread the rumor valve, if enough people say it, then it must be true and it will be a self fulfilling prophecy that would top the good reverend jimmi jones' taste for kool aid

[5001]

This is who think be in F1 next season Caps confirmed
Brawn: Button,Senna
Red Bull:WEBBER,VETTEL
Ferrari: MASSA,RAIKKONEN
Toyota:GLOCK,Sato
McLaren:HAMILTON,Rosberg
Williams:Kovalainen,Nakajima
Renault:ALONSO,Grosjean
Toro Rosso:Buemi,Alguesuari
Force India:Sutil,Chandhock
USF1:Villeneuve,Summerton
Campos Meta :D eLarossa,Petrov
Manor :D eResta,Davidson
The team that buys/replaces SauberBMW:Kubica,Heidfeld

With all guesses there will be some dead certs and a few surprises
also there will probably a driver that nobody has mentioned in this thread that will get a drive next year

[CNR]

this dose not look like a joke now
Grid girl gears up
http://www.business24-7.ae/Articles/2009/8/Pages/06082009/08072009_18ebeea857334843aa5741025f5e4ba5.aspx


It is somewhat unsettling when tales of her predecessor fail to elicit even a flash of recollection in the successor.

Perhaps the throne has been gathering dust too long.

Yet cobwebs never come into the equation in the fast and furious world of motorsport. So the question remains: Why is it, when it comes to women at the top level of motorsports, the only image available is of pit-babes sashaying down the race track before the lights go green?

It would certainly explain the reason why Natacha Gachnang had difficulty recalling the last woman to compete in Formula One.

Gachnang herself is on the threshold of earning an entry into F1. She has test-driven for Adrian Campos who make their debut next year and is currently honing her skills in this season's re-launched F2 series.

In retrospect, when she confessed to not having seen the last women driver in F1 – Giovanna Amati – it really was not that much of a surprise. It is nearly two decades since Amati drove, after all.

So why hasn't F1 seen a female driver since 1991-92?

"From the start of your career you need to be very focused," says Gachnang. "Generally, parents may be very hesitant to get their little girl into karting. Karting does not have a good image. It is oily and dirty. Parents certainly prefer that their little girl attends dancing classes.

"Education and values in the society are also part of the problem."

Before the opening F2 race in Valencia, Spain, in May, the 21-year-old said times have changed. She realises she now has it easier than female drivers of the past.

"I was too young to have seen Giovanna and the other women race," she says. "I believe times are different. These girls never had a real chance to race properly, like I did, thanks to my family."

When Sebastien Bourdais was sacked from Toro Rosso last month, there was talk of Gachnang joining her cousin Sebastien Buemi in the team. Jaime Alguersuari eventually took the vacant seat, but the Swiss national was far from disheartened.

[I am evil Homer]

This is who think be in F1 next season Caps confirmed
Brawn: Button,Senna
Red Bull:WEBBER,VETTEL
Ferrari: MASSA,RAIKKONEN
Toyota:GLOCK,Sato
McLaren:HAMILTON,Rosberg
Williams:Kovalainen,Nakajima
Renault:ALONSO,Grosjean
Toro Rosso:Buemi,Alguesuari
Force India:Sutil,Chandhock
USF1:Villeneuve,Summerton
Campos Meta :D eLarossa,Petrov
Manor :D eResta,Davidson
The team that buys/replaces SauberBMW:Kubica,Heidfeld

With all guesses there will be some dead certs and a few surprises
also there will probably a driver that nobody has mentioned in this thread that will get a drive next year

Is Trulli retiring?

[DexDexter]

This is who think be in F1 next season Caps confirmed
Brawn: Button,Senna
Red Bull:WEBBER,VETTEL
Ferrari: MASSA,RAIKKONEN
Toyota:GLOCK,Sato
McLaren:HAMILTON,Rosberg
Williams:Kovalainen,Nakajima
Renault:ALONSO,Grosjean
Toro Rosso:Buemi,Alguesuari
Force India:Sutil,Chandhock
USF1:Villeneuve,Summerton
Campos Meta :D eLarossa,Petrov
Manor :D eResta,Davidson
The team that buys/replaces SauberBMW:Kubica,Heidfeld

With all guesses there will be some dead certs and a few surprises
also there will probably a driver that nobody has mentioned in this thread that will get a drive next year

Glock and Sato would be a terrible line-up for Toyota.

[Knock-on]

this dose not look like a joke now
Grid girl gears up
http://www.business24-7.ae/Articles/2009/8/Pages/06082009/08072009_18ebeea857334843aa5741025f5e4ba5.aspx

You are seriously joking.

Nobody would grant her a super Licence. She'd kill herself.

I mean, she hasn't won a fecking race even in formula BMW.

This really must be a joke :(

[Dave B]

You are seriously joking.

Nobody would grant her a super Licence. She'd kill herself.

I mean, she hasn't won a fecking race even in formula BMW.

This really must be a joke :(
You have no idea how many press releases I get from managers saying their driver is going to be the next big thing in F1. They're BS designed to fool gullible sponsors, but occasionally a desperate website will publish them thinking they've got a scoop.

Can't blame kids for wanting to make it to F1, honestly I can't, but over-enthusiastic and unrealistic managers don't help their careers.

[Roamy]

You are seriously joking.

Nobody would grant her a super Licence. She'd kill herself.

I mean, she hasn't won a fecking race even in formula BMW.

This really must be a joke :(

Actually you may want to review the indycar results before making this claim.
In addition she is beating Marco Andretti like a drum at a led zeplin concert.
I have not compared her to other x f1 drivers but I am sure she is whipping a few of these guys as well. I hope she take the job with Ganassi as that will define her potential.

[DexDexter]

Actually you may want to review the indycar results before making this claim.
In addition she is beating Marco Andretti like a drum at a led zeplin concert.
I have not compared her to other x f1 drivers but I am sure she is whipping a few of these guys as well. I hope she take the job with Ganassi as that will define her potential.

She hasn't won any indycar races where they turn right as well. Beating Marco doesn't mean anything, he hasn't won anything and is clearly not F1 material.

[Roamy]

I am not disagreeing - but she has won a indycar regardless of which way you turn.

[jens]

Its enough!!! Time for Barrichello, Fisichella, Trulli and Heidfeld to BOW OUT!

For crying out loud - these guys are past their peak, have raced in f1 for ever and a day and it is time to give some other drivers a go.

I cant stand drivers that never know when to leave - it reminds me of the late - and much missed James Hunt's comment - its always the bores that stay at a party until the very end! But likely they WILL STILL be around in 2010......



Could debate about other two, but I certainly disagree about Trulli and Heidfeld. Those guys are certainly not past their prime (well, at least comparing their current performances to their supposed "best ones").

They never know, when to leave? Sorry, but 2009 could (at least in theory) have been Barrichello's best chance ever. Trulli and Heidfeld were hoping that their teams would finally make a major breakthrough. Those guys keep fighting as long as they see even a tiny chance to succeed in F1. In 2008 some may have said that Button and Webber are "past their prime" and never achieved anything, hence should retire - see, those guys are now fighting for the WDC. Anything can happen in F1. :p :




These days drivers have careers that lasts for too many years without results. In the past teams were better at assessing their drivers.

In 2010 if a driver such as Hulkenberg does not find a drive and Fisichella or the other past it - he never really had it to begin with - drivers have drives then that is not f1 being the best that it can.

Barrichello, Kovaleinnen, Fisichella, Trulli, Heidfeld, Nakajima, Sutil and Glock should all be out if there are good potential drivers around.


Yes, the keyword here is if. But the reality is that there are no better good "potential" drivers around, which is why most of them will stay in F1. Hülkenberg seems like a real deal. Who else? Increasingly inconsistent Grosjean? Di Grassi, who himself is already becoming an "oldie" in GP2 (4th year there). That's why experienced blokes are kept - rookies are inferior to them. And the real question is not about "they haven't had results for years", it's about the value they bring to the teams. Even "without shiny results" (which on most occasions has been down to uncompetitive machinery, nothing else really) those experienced blokes are more valuable than average rookies.

Let's look at rookies since 2006 - only Hamilton, Kubica, Vettel and maybe Rosberg have shown to be better than those "old past their prime blokes" - this means roughly one rookie per season. And you want all experienced drivers out to bring a lot of the rookies in, even if maybe barely one of them could be an improvement? Meanwhile most of them would be a step backwards.

[Roamy]

The problem with teams is they don't test drivers straight up. That is what they should do. If you are on the team you should have to compete to keep your spot. But then again contracts come in to play. I think the MS return will either be good or bad for the oldies.. One advantage to oldies is they tend not to bend up as much equipment.
So we have a couple of youngsters to watch the rest of the year so we will see.

[keysersoze]

Its enough!!! Time for Barrichello, Fisichella, Trulli and Heidfeld to BOW OUT!

For crying out loud - these guys are past their peak, have raced in f1 for ever and a day and it is time to give some other drivers a go.

I cant stand drivers that never know when to leave - it reminds me of the late - and much missed James Hunt's comment - its always the bores that stay at a party until the very end! But likely they WILL STILL be around in 2010......

All four of the drivers you cited are EXTREMELY quick. Just because they haven't won lately doesn't mean they are past it. Why should a driver move on just because, in your estimation, they've been around too long? Like in ANY field, an employee should be allowed to work as long as he wants to while being effective. And a driver's effectiveness is NOT YOUR CALL. That's why they pay the team principals the big bucks--THEY get to decide.

As far as Hunt's comments--well, he never was the paragon of acceptable / professional behavior--so thanks for helping to disprove your own point by selecting an unreliable example. On the other hand, perhaps I could turn your own analogy against you by saying it's only the bores who leave a party BEFORE it's over; after all, it's a PARTY--why the heck would you leave?

[gm99]

Actually you may want to review the indycar results before making this claim.
In addition she is beating Marco Andretti like a drum at a led zeplin concert.
I have not compared her to other x f1 drivers but I am sure she is whipping a few of these guys as well. I hope she take the job with Ganassi as that will define her potential.

I think Knock-on was talking about Natacha Gachnang, who the article was mainly about (don't know why they decided to post a picture of Danica to illustrate it).

If Gachnang makes it to F1, it would be solely because of her gender, as she has been mightily unimpressive in F2 this year and AFAIK not won a single race in any category after leaving karts. There are other more qualified women around, in particular fellow Swiss Simona de Silvestro, who is currently leading the Formula Atlantic championship and has won several races in that category, and Brazilian Ana Beatriz, who has won races in Indy Lights, where she finished third in the standings last season.

[Saint Devote]

All four of the drivers you cited are EXTREMELY quick. Just because they haven't won lately doesn't mean they are past it. Why should a driver move on just because, in your estimation, they've been around too long? Like in ANY field, an employee should be allowed to work as long as he wants to while being effective. And a driver's effectiveness is NOT YOUR CALL. That's why they pay the team principals the big bucks--THEY get to decide.

As far as Hunt's comments--well, he never was the paragon of acceptable / professional behavior--so thanks for helping to disprove your own point by selecting an unreliable example. On the other hand, perhaps I could turn your own analogy against you by saying it's only the bores who leave a party BEFORE it's over; after all, it's a PARTY--why the heck would you leave?

Haven't won recently? :-]
They have been around for ever, they have all demonstrated their limits and aside from Barrichello calling them grand prix winners is stretching it. They will never win again unless most of the grid runs out of gas or some other anomaly. They are not effective.

Of course Toyota have to actually become serious about winning and that is not likely given current mismanagement as well.

F1 evolves and just as a driver more than 2 or 300ths of a second slower than his teammate is no longer tolerated endlessly so is not being a potential consistent grand prix winner.

So given their dotage, their limited potential, the new rules and that their are drivers with unknown good potential there is no reason for them to continue racing in f1.

Formula 1 is not a "work environment" it is a sport, the top of motor racing and there should not be over the hill drivers anywhere.

You criticism of James Hunt illustrates your ignorance. There is no need for me to defend him, his results speak for themselves, and there are people far more capapble than myself such as Nigel Roebuck and Denis Jenkinson and Pete Lyons just to name several of the top in f1 journalism that support my view and not yours.

Your final comment says a lot about you - no wonder you defend the also rans.

[Knock-on]

I think Knock-on was talking about Natacha Gachnang, who the article was mainly about (don't know why they decided to post a picture of Danica to illustrate it).

If Gachnang makes it to F1, it would be solely because of her gender, as she has been mightily unimpressive in F2 this year and AFAIK not won a single race in any category after leaving karts. There are other more qualified women around, in particular fellow Swiss Simona de Silvestro, who is currently leading the Formula Atlantic championship and has won several races in that category, and Brazilian Ana Beatriz, who has won races in Indy Lights, where she finished third in the standings last season.

Yep, sorry Uncs, was not talking about Double Penetration ;)

[jens]

Haven't won recently? :-]
They have been around for ever, they have all demonstrated their limits and aside from Barrichello calling them grand prix winners is stretching it. They will never win again unless most of the grid runs out of gas or some other anomaly. They are not effective.


Most of the rookies are even less effective, just take a look at Piquet Jr or Nakajima.

Before this season no-one else than Ross Brawn himself had a choice, whether to hire your so-called 'over the hill' Barrichello for BGP in 2009 or take highly-hyped Senna plus sponsorship money. His choice is a clear reflection that those experienced blokes are still effective and valuable enough to keep them racing in F1.

[Saint Devote]

Most of the rookies are even less effective, just take a look at Piquet Jr or Nakajima.

Before this season no-one else than Ross Brawn himself had a choice, whether to hire your so-called 'over the hill' Barrichello for BGP in 2009 or take highly-hyped Senna plus sponsorship money. His choice is a clear reflection that those experienced blokes are still effective and valuable enough to keep them racing in F1.

Piquet and Nakjima were subjective selections. Only Briatore understands why he gave Piquet another season chance and we are all aware that Kazuki is an engine related placement.

I think - and have done from the start - that Senna would have been the better choice if he was the alternative. But I will not criticize Brawn because I have too much respect for him. I do think that on reflection Brawn would not select Barrichello again.

Barrichello has not demonstrated he is worthy of the seat and after his further outburst all we have is an over the hill driver that is past his best, embarassing himself and hogging a seat, while pretending that one day he will be world champion, also considering himself the absolute equal to Schumi - Rubens - GO ALREADY!!!!

[Saint Devote]

Ana Beatriz the unknown driver not to be confused with Ana Beatriz the Brazilian model.

[Saint Devote]

You have no idea how many press releases I get from managers saying their driver is going to be the next big thing in F1. They're BS designed to fool gullible sponsors, but occasionally a desperate website will publish them thinking they've got a scoop.

Can't blame kids for wanting to make it to F1, honestly I can't, but over-enthusiastic and unrealistic managers don't help their careers.

Why do they send you press releases?

[keysersoze]

Haven't won recently? :-]
They have been around for ever, they have all demonstrated their limits and aside from Barrichello calling them grand prix winners is stretching it. They will never win again unless most of the grid runs out of gas or some other anomaly. They are not effective.
.

A Grand Prix winner is a driver who has won a Formula One Grand Prix--period. For you to ignore or downplay the FACT that Fisi has won three and Trulli one (Monaco no less) demonstrates staggering arrogance.

[keysersoze]

Haven't won recently? :-]
You criticism of James Hunt illustrates your ignorance. There is no need for me to defend him, his results speak for themselves, and there are people far more capapble than myself such as Nigel Roebuck and Denis Jenkinson and Pete Lyons just to name several of the top in f1 journalism that support my view and not yours.



My ignorance? I commented that James Hunt wasn't the paragon of acceptable behavior. If you call a marijuana-smoking driver who didn't like to test, who quit in the middle of the 1979 season, who falsely blamed Riccardo Patrese for causing Ronnie Peterson's fatal accident (even AFTER video evidence exonerated the Italian), who was an alcoholic, who was a polarizing figure throughout his driving and commenting career--if you call that sort of man a paragon of acceptable behavior then it would be impossible to carry on any sort of responsible discussion with you.

[Roamy]

A Grand Prix winner is a driver who has won a Formula One Grand Prix--period. For you to ignore or downplay the FACT that Fisi has won three and Trulli one (Monaco no less) demonstrates staggering arrogance.

:up: :up:

[Roamy]

My ignorance? I commented that James Hunt wasn't the paragon of acceptable behavior. If you call a marijuana-smoking driver who didn't like to test, who quit in the middle of the 1979 season, who falsely blamed Riccardo Patrese for causing Ronnie Peterson's fatal accident (even AFTER video evidence exonerated the Italian), who was an alcoholic, who was a polarizing figure throughout his driving and commenting career--if you call that sort of man a paragon of acceptable behavior then it would be impossible to carry on any sort of responsible discussion with you.
:up: :up: :up:

BTW St Devote Are you educated??

[ClarkFan]

My ignorance? I commented that James Hunt wasn't the paragon of acceptable behavior. If you call a marijuana-smoking driver who didn't like to test, who quit in the middle of the 1979 season, who falsely blamed Riccardo Patrese for causing Ronnie Peterson's fatal accident (even AFTER video evidence exonerated the Italian), who was an alcoholic, who was a polarizing figure throughout his driving and commenting career--if you call that sort of man a paragon of acceptable behavior then it would be impossible to carry on any sort of responsible discussion with you.
Hunt was a scoundrel, a scaliwag, and a loudmouth. Damn, we could really use a few more like him now!

ClarkFan

[Garry Walker]

I think - and have done from the start - that Senna would have been the better choice if he was the alternative. But I will not criticize Brawn because I have too much respect for him. I do think that on reflection Brawn would not select Barrichello again.

Barrichello has not demonstrated he is worthy of the seat and after his further outburst all we have is an over the hill driver that is past his best, embarassing himself and hogging a seat, while pretending that one day he will be world champion, also considering himself the absolute equal to Schumi - Rubens - GO ALREADY!!!!

Find an easier sport to follow.

[Knock-on]

Hunt was a scoundrel, a scaliwag, and a loudmouth. Damn, we could really use a few more like him now!

ClarkFan

He was certainly a character. Like George Best, Mike Tyson, Gazza, Ronnie O'Sullivan etc, he had a spark of genius but was a flawed diamond.

Great fun but hardly a role model ;)

[ClarkFan]

He was certainly a character. Like George Best, Mike Tyson, Gazza, Ronnie O'Sullivan etc, he had a spark of genius but was a flawed diamond.

Great fun but hardly a role model ;)
Um, I certainly wouldn't slot Hunt with someone like Tyson. While Hunt was eccentric, he was also a sportsman and was close friends with many of his main competitors, including Lauda, Sheckter and Peterson. You can't fault his bravery either - he plunged into the fire to help pull out Peterson at Monza.

I can't really fault him for walking away from Wolf. The car was a disaster, and those were the days when drivers still frequently died when trying to make a car go faster than its potential.

I suspect that many of his issues may have sprung from undiagnosed mental illness - he wouldn't be the first to use alcohol and drugs to self-medicate for depression. :(

ClarkFan

[Knock-on]

Um, I certainly wouldn't slot Hunt with someone like Tyson. While Hunt was eccentric, he was also a sportsman and was close friends with many of his main competitors, including Lauda, Sheckter and Peterson. You can't fault his bravery either - he plunged into the fire to help pull out Peterson at Monza.

I can't really fault him for walking away from Wolf. The car was a disaster, and those were the days when drivers still frequently died when trying to make a car go faster than its potential.

I suspect that many of his issues may have sprung from undiagnosed mental illness - he wouldn't be the first to use alcohol and drugs to self-medicate for depression. :(

ClarkFan

Sorry CF, I didn't mean to taint James with the disgrace that is Tyson. Rather I was trying to point out that they all had a acute natural ability as well as a bit of a self destruct streak.

[Tazio]

Klien eyes race seat with BMW team


Just another guy in good machinery that might be thinking at this point in his career He's as good as button! What are the chances of him driving a competative car this season?
Unless he reeeeeeallly understands the car. I'm not taking any thing away from the Kube or blaming Nick the calculating German that
that aproach would have worked very well if the 2009 if BMW Chalenger Wasn' that slow out of the box. You put Nick in the 2010 Ferrari. If Massa (God forbid) can't drive. who knows It could be Fred and Slick Nick
Scary Novie!!!
Xbt30UnzRWw

[Ranger]

Kovalainen on notice:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77771

[jens]

I think parting ways would be beneficial for both McLaren and Kovalainen. HK seems to be a bit softer type of driver, who needs team support to unveil his potential and he can't excel in #2 driver role - like Fisichella. Kova has had only 1 (!) good race so far this season and that's way too few. In the second half of 2007 Heikki actually seemed like quite a competent racer, but the McLaren period has completely destroyed his reputation. Time to seek for a change.

On the other hand McLaren needs a more competitive driver to challenge for WCC in future years. Both RBR and Ferrari have two quite closely-matched top-class drivers and McLaren really can't afford to be any worse. Kubica, Heidfeld, Rosberg - all are available on the driver market and any of them would be a good choice IMO, better than Kova.

[gloomyDAY]

McLaren's second driver knows that he'll have to play 2nd fiddle to Hamilton, right? I think the perfect man for the job is Nick Heidfeld. Other drivers would want to have a clear #1 status on the team, so Kubica & Rosberg are not an option.


Klien eyes race seat with BMW team ....Hey betch!

Klien took a dump when he raced for Red Bull.
I doubt he's getting drive next year unless he starts crapping cash.

[Tazio]

Klien eyes race seat with BMW team

Hey betch!

Klien took a dump when he raced for Red Bull.
I doubt he's getting drive next year unless he starts crapping cash.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77757
Just reporting the news bro!!
No need to get your panties in a bunch :rolleyes:

[Saint Devote]

A Grand Prix winner is a driver who has won a Formula One Grand Prix--period. For you to ignore or downplay the FACT that Fisi has won three and Trulli one (Monaco no less) demonstrates staggering arrogance.

Yes, they have had some good races and won, but they are not winners in the sense that other drivers are.

They may have won races but they will never win races in the way that topline drivers do.

They have had their chance and far more. Time to go. There was a time when drivers did not hang around and around and around and around!

Lets keep f1 about the best not the wannbee neverwillbees.

[Saint Devote]

My ignorance? I commented that James Hunt wasn't the paragon of acceptable behavior. If you call a marijuana-smoking driver who didn't like to test, who quit in the middle of the 1979 season, who falsely blamed Riccardo Patrese for causing Ronnie Peterson's fatal accident (even AFTER video evidence exonerated the Italian), who was an alcoholic, who was a polarizing figure throughout his driving and commenting career--if you call that sort of man a paragon of acceptable behavior then it would be impossible to carry on any sort of responsible discussion with you.

I never mentioned behavior, you did. I talk about a driver's career - and ability which James had in bucket loads.

I refer you to the greatest motor racing scribes such as Jenks and Lyons and Roebuck amongst many that admired James and loved him as the warm and generous person that he was.

The driver that saw no point in making up the numbers and won grands prix to become a world champion.

A driver that was not afraid to speak his mind and got bored with racing and found that he enjoyed f1 better after his career.

You may try and besmirch James Hunt's memory but compared to people such as Lord Hesketh, Bubbles Horsely, Harvey Poselthwaite, Jochen Mass, Teddy Mayer, Jody Scheckter, Niki Lauda and others, your little attack means nothing.

You 'orrible li'l man!

[Saint Devote]

:up: :up: :up:

BTW St Devote Are you educated??

No. I went to school in the United States.

[Saint Devote]

Hunt was a scoundrel, a scaliwag, and a loudmouth. Damn, we could really use a few more like him now!

ClarkFan

:-]

[Saint Devote]

He was certainly a character. Like George Best, Mike Tyson, Gazza, Ronnie O'Sullivan etc, he had a spark of genius but was a flawed diamond.

Great fun but hardly a role model ;)

James was a great role model - if you believe in such a thing.

He was a courageous driver that new how to win and become a champion. He did not cowtow to anyone and the word boring was simply unknown to him.

George Best-like perhaps.

[Saint Devote]

Find an easier sport to follow.

I don't follow it. I live it.

Underwear feeling a little scratchy there gramps?

[Saint Devote]

I think parting ways would be beneficial for both McLaren and Kovalainen. HK seems to be a bit softer type of driver, who needs team support to unveil his potential and he can't excel in #2 driver role - like Fisichella. Kova has had only 1 (!) good race so far this season and that's way too few. In the second half of 2007 Heikki actually seemed like quite a competent racer, but the McLaren period has completely destroyed his reputation. Time to seek for a change.

On the other hand McLaren needs a more competitive driver to challenge for WCC in future years. Both RBR and Ferrari have two quite closely-matched top-class drivers and McLaren really can't afford to be any worse. Kubica, Heidfeld, Rosberg - all are available on the driver market and any of them would be a good choice IMO, better than Kova.

There is only one driver than can withstand the Hamilton pressure and is mentally tough enough, determined and unafraid, and his name is Kubica.

Rosberg must stay at Williams. Heidfeld at Mclaren would be worse than Kovaleinen.

[ioan]

I don't follow it. I live it.

In front of your TV set?! :rotflmao:

[ioan]

There is only one driver than can withstand the Hamilton pressure and is mentally tough enough, determined and unafraid, and his name is Kubica.

I almost thought you were talking about Superman! :laugh:

[Roamy]

There is only one driver than can withstand the Hamilton pressure and is mentally tough enough, determined and unafraid, and his name is Kubica.

Rosberg must stay at Williams. Heidfeld at Mclaren would be worse than Kovaleinen.

Alonso will unscrew his head and sh!t in his neck !! Alonso was screwed over by dennis but won't be at Ferrari!!