Running in an engine?

[Daniel]

Hello all. As I mentioned on another thread I'm getting a new car soon and was just wondering what people recommend in terms of running it in?

Looking over the net there seem to be varying schools of thought.

1 - Baby the engine for a long period and steadily raise the RPM till you're using the full rev range.

2 - Baby the engine for a short while and raise the RPM as above.

3 - Get the car and drive it like a rental. Apparently this beds the components in better.

The only thing they seem to agree on is not running it for long periods at constant RPM. Others mention special running in oils and other things.

Now I know there are a lot of people here who know their stuff about engines, so what would they reccomend as a run in procedure for my car when it arrives? :)

[redrover]

Make sure no constant revs on the Highway. Don't rev to hard a lot but you can still do it occasionally. We tend to try and do at least 500m on a competition engine before putting it on a dyno.

Red

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Do new cars really need to be run-in like old ones did?

[Mark]

Do new cars really need to be run-in like old ones did?

Older cars needed running in for several thousand miles with gradually increasing load on the engine. Certainly I remember my Dad getting a new car and he was told not to go above 50mph for the first 2,000 miles!

My cars the dealers have just told me to vary the speeds and no harsh acceleration or braking during the first 1,000 miles. After that away with you!

[Daniel]

My cars the dealers have just told me to vary the speeds and no harsh acceleration or braking during the first 1,000 miles. After that away with you!

I wouldn't trust a dealer as far as I could throw them :p

[GridGirl]

I've never thought about running an engine in.....women drivers eh?

I drive alot of miles on the motorway and ended up having my first car checkup for 1000 miles after about 10 days of owning it. I only really noticed that my fuel consumption had increased quite a bit after about 5000 miles. I've heard diesels take longer to bed in though.

[Mark]

. I only really noticed that my fuel consumption had increased quite a bit after about 5000 miles. I've heard diesels take longer to bed in though.

Increased or decreased? :confused:

[GridGirl]

Decreased...I was thinking about how I needed less petrol but the inverse is true about fuel consumption. I think I started on about 30mph and now average about 38mpg.

[Firstgear]

Daniel, get with the times!! Cars (like everything else nowadays) are disposable. So just use & abuse as you see fit for 6-8 months and then replace. :p

When we bought our last car, we were told not to do any towing until broken in. Also, I recall the first oil change was quite early.

[markabilly]

I've never thought about running an engine in.....women drivers eh?

I drive alot of miles on the motorway and ended up having my first car checkup for 1000 miles after about 10 days of owning it. I only really noticed that my fuel consumption had increased quite a bit after about 5000 miles. I've heard diesels take longer to bed in though.
diesels? Oh yeah
In 1999, I bought an f250---after about 1,500 miles took it in because it just did not have power, thought it was a problem , guy said about 25K it will start really breaking in
True enough

At 100k, I had passengers asking me what mods i had done to the engine, chips? exhaust, and the answer was nothing---at somewhere over 175k miles, it still rocking even better

as to new gas engines, the thought is that through computers, the engines are built to much better tolerance, so the parts do not need breaking in as before---the only really critical "break-in" consideration, are the engine rings and pistons, in that if there is some "gap" from uneven wear on break in, it can increase oil consumption, but with the superior computer assembly of engine parts, that is not a problem

One reason to vary speeds was to reduce acceration through engine braking creates a vaccumm to pull oil up past the rings and keep the upper part of the engine lubed----

HOwever, with an auto transmission in overdrive, that does little good---if you leave it in regular or low gear, you will get that effect, but in OD will do nothing
it is only when you feel the engine "braking" the car, with foot off the gas and brake, that the vaccum which causes the braking effect, also pulls the oil up into the upper part of the cylinder

[Daniel]

Daniel, get with the times!! Cars (like everything else nowadays) are disposable. So just use & abuse as you see fit for 6-8 months and then replace. :p

I intend to keep this car till it starts to fall apart which will hopefully be a long time in the future :p

[Mark]

as to new gas engines, the thought is that through computers, the engines are built to much better tolerance, so the parts do not need breaking in as before--

That's true, the old designs were somewhat 'approximate' so you needed to run them for a while before they could be reshaped into the correct form, and then throw away the oil with all the crap in it.

As you say manufacturing is much better these days.

[Daniel]

diesels? Oh yeah
In 1999, I bought an f250---after about 1,500 miles took it in because it just did not have power, thought it was a problem , guy said about 25K it will start really breaking in
True enough

At 100k, I had passengers asking me what mods i had done to the engine, chips? exhaust, and the answer was nothing---at somewhere over 175k miles, it still rocking even better

as to new gas engines, the thought is that through computers, the engines are built to much better tolerance, so the parts do not need breaking in as before---the only really critical "break-in" consideration, are the engine rings and pistons, in that if there is some "gap" from uneven wear on break in, it can increase oil consumption, but with the superior computer assembly of engine parts, that is not a problem

One reason to vary speeds was to reduce acceration through engine braking creates a vaccumm to pull oil up past the rings and keep the upper part of the engine lubed----

HOwever, with an auto transmission in overdrive, that does little good---if you leave it in regular or low gear, you will get that effect, but in OD will do nothing
it is only when you feel the engine "braking" the car, with foot off the gas and brake, that the vaccum which causes the braking effect, also pulls the oil up into the upper part of the cylinder

So what you're saying is perhaps baby it for a little while, then use it as normal, do a bit of engine braking and don't keep it at constant revs? :)

[markabilly]

So what you're saying is perhaps baby it for a little while, then use it as normal, do a bit of engine braking and don't keep it at constant revs? :)
engine braking does the most good ;)

not keeping it at constant revs is a form of that, cause at constant revs, it will not pull the oil up---


otoh in full auto or od---there is not much difference as the braking effect is not really there, so it really makes little difference, and why this is not mentioned by manufacturers, i know not

even now some companis do a one to three mile break in before the car leaves the factory control by keeping it out of od, and driving it very hard up to max revs (hardly babying it at all!!), and then letting the vehicle engine brake the car speed

under normal wear and tear the old 1999-2000 ford desiel would run fine up until about 400k to 500k, when ring wear would start excessive oil consumption, and for considerably less than the cost of a new engine, pull the heads off, put on new rings ONLY, and the thing will easily run another 400 to 500k miles

recommended break in after replacement of piston rings, is to immediately take truck, leave it in regular drive (not OD)--run it very hard up to max revs, and then let engine braking slow it down to about 25 mph, and then do it again , for 10 to 15 times

start checking for blue smoke, if none, let her go.

if there is, do it all over again until blue smoke is gone-----if it does not eventually go away after several sequences, then you have some other problem or need additional work done, or one or more of the new rings was bad

[Mark]

All this talk of overdrive etc. Myself and Daniel have a choice of 5 gears, none of which are marked 'overdrive' :p

[markabilly]

All this talk of overdrive etc. Myself and Daniel have a choice of 5 gears, none of which are marked 'overdrive' :p
well I assume you mean a "manual"----auto trannies do have some sort of "highway" or "OD" or "high" gear and for various reasons, engine braking does not work very well with those gears
you can feel it when it happens (and you know that you just b messing with me!!)

[Easy Drifter]

Keep the RPM relatively low until the engine is warmed up. No more than 12,000 RPM.
Once throughly warm you can use maximum RPM or 19.000. :D

[Mark]

Keep the RPM relatively low until the engine is warmed up. No more than 12,000 RPM.
Once throughly warm you can use maximum RPM or 19.000. :D

What if you are limited to 18,500? :(

[Daniel]

Keep the RPM relatively low until the engine is warmed up. No more than 12,000 RPM.
Once throughly warm you can use maximum RPM or 19.000. :D
So I should get it up to 99mph (top speed) and then drop it into 2ng gear you say? :D

[Mark in Oshawa]

Of course....if you really want to liven things up, get a hold of some nitromethane...


It has been said at more than one drag strip, Gasoline you wash parts in, Alcohol you drink, and Nitromethane you RACE with....lol

Not sure if you would void the warranty, but it would be FUN!!

[Easy Drifter]

Ah yes, nitromethane. You should get a real bang out of that.
Especially if it gets a little unstable. You don't want to know what you have then but it ends in glycerine.

[Steve Boyd]

Hello all. As I mentioned on another thread I'm getting a new car soon and was just wondering what people recommend in terms of running it in?

Looking over the net there seem to be varying schools of thought.

1 - Baby the engine for a long period and steadily raise the RPM till you're using the full rev range.

2 - Baby the engine for a short while and raise the RPM as above.

3 - Get the car and drive it like a rental. Apparently this beds the components in better.

The only thing they seem to agree on is not running it for long periods at constant RPM. Others mention special running in oils and other things.

Now I know there are a lot of people here who know their stuff about engines, so what would they reccomend as a run in procedure for my car when it arrives? :)
Look in the glove box - you will find a book - read the bit about running in - easy!

[Daniel]

The car doesn't have a glovebox Steve.

[GridGirl]

Does the car even exist yet, let alone have a glovebox? :p

[Daniel]

It does exist. It's somewhere between Poland and the UK at the moment :) It just doesn't have a glovebox

[Jag_Warrior]

So I should get it up to 99mph (top speed) and then drop it into 2ng gear you say? :D

That's the spirit! Drive that mutha like you stole it!!! :s mokin:

One question though, are you going to use synthetic oil?

[GridGirl]

Ah OK, I didn't know whether it had been build yet seeing as they have long waiting lists on the 500.

So if it doesn't have a glovebox where will you keep all you junk? ;) :p

[Easy Drifter]

No glove/junk box. Must be a real econobox. :p
Mind you we have a huge number of BMWs up here that are the economy model. They do not come equipped with turn/directional signals. :eek:

Don't know why but a far greater number of Bimmer drivers seem to fail to signal a turn than those driving any other make.

[Daniel]

Ah OK, I didn't know whether it had been build yet seeing as they have long waiting lists on the 500.

So if it doesn't have a glovebox where will you keep all you junk?

OK I'm not quiiiite telling the truth :) Not sure if you can make it out on this photo but there is a void where you can put your stuff :p Don't know why there's no glovebox tbh. Not necessarily a bad thing thought because gloveboxes just end up getting full of crap anyway.
http://www.caradvice.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/tc-500-dash-1.jpg

JW, I'll put whatever Fiat reccomends to put in it which is a fully synthetic Selenia oil.

Easydrifter, you're right about BMW's and turn signals! It does seem to be quite a common fault with them here as well :mark:

Now if the bloody car would just turn up I'd be rather happy.

[schmenke]

Pop one of these puppies into it :D

[Rollo]

JW, I'll put whatever Fiat reccomends to put in it which is a fully synthetic Selenia oil.

Seeing as the main enemies of engine life happens to be wear and most exacerbated during startup, it is the use of proper engine oil that holds the answer.

Among the 40 or so manuals that I have strewned through my office at home, the usual method of "bedding in" the bearings is to use a really crap grade of oil for about the first 5000 miles (7500km) and then in the first scheduled service, flush and change the engine oil to what it will use for the rest of its life.

The reason I suspect is that at something bigger than a molecular level, the surfaces need to be somewhat pitted so that they more or less act like a golf ball, and have a very small boundary layer of oil, which reduces friction et ergo wear.

The Honda City suggests using a 15W/60 oil for the first 2500km and then 5W/40 until the tolerances open up at about 90000km on the fifth major service.

So I assume the correct running in procedure is tied up in there somewhere.

[Daniel]

Pop one of these puppies into it :D
Schmenke, the the engine bay on this thing is so tiny that to change a headlight bulb you have to access it through a hatch in the inner arch :mark: I'm sure that's going to be fun when the bulbs go!

Easy Drifter, it is a shopping trolley to be fair but it's not a very cheap one :crazy: We probably could have got something else quite a bit cheaper but Caroline didn't really like the look of most other things and anything she liked I didn't like :mark:

Rollo, would you believe the first service for this thing will be @ 18k miles or 1 year? That's a flipping long time between oil and filter changes! If I had a driveway or garage I think I'd certainly think about doing oil changes @ 9k miles.

[schmenke]

...Rollo, would you believe the first service for this thing will be @ 18k miles or 1 year? ...

Is the trolley factory-lubed with synthetic then?

[Daniel]

I'd assume so!

[Rollo]

Amongst other things this morning, I spoke to one of our clients (who is a car dealer and currently owes the tax office a lot of money), and he said that the 500 has no viscosity requirement for its engine oil, and the the engines don't need to be run in at all.

It appears that they use Castrol Magnatec 5W/20 across the board which is both non-hygroscopic and non-compressible. I'm guessing that in the UK, they'd want to use a 0W/20 oil because the mornings are colder.

Because oil technology has marched on since the days of my Ka, it doesn't really surprise me that FIAT don't suggest a bed-in period for its engine oil.

[Dave B]

http://www.caradvice.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/tc-500-dash-1.jpg



Where's all the legroom gone? :eek:

[Daniel]

Legroom's fine actually. Can't say the same of the rear though!

[driveace]

I have had over 100 new cars as we used to do 1000 every week,on driver training.Just treat the car with respect if its yours.Gradually the engine and transmission will bed in and lose its stiffness ,and you will feel the differance I always found that with Ford Fiesta diesels ,that it was normally around 8 thousand miles that they ran better.My current one has done over 220 thousand miles does over 60 MPG and uses no oil,and runs sweet as a bird !

[Firstgear]

Legroom's fine actually. Can't say the same of the rear though!

Try cutting down on the fish 'n chips and fatty snacks and you might not have so much trouble finding room for your rear :D

[Daniel]

Try cutting down on the fish 'n chips and fatty snacks and you might not have so much trouble finding room for your rear :D
Oi! Can't remember the last time I even had fish and chips! Although I do have kebabs a bit too often :p

[J4MIE]

Kebabs......but you don't even drink Daniel :eek:

[Daniel]

Kebabs......but you don't even drink Daniel :eek:
I drink coke! Does that count? :p

[Jag_Warrior]

Well, since there have been no threads about warranty claims or questions about billowing oil smoke, should we assume that all is well? :D

[Daniel]

Yep, all is good, not used a drop of oil either :)

[Brown, Jon Brow]

I want a kebab now