Recent F1 or F1-capable tracks which do NOT have a Bernie contract...

[Somebody]

What the title said.

Immediately, the following leap to mind:

Silverstone
Hockenheim
Magny-Cours
Montreal
Mount Fuji*
Indianapolis
A1-Ring
Jerez

Not saying these are all definitively capable of holding a race next year, but just for argument's sake...

*Suzuka, I'm pretty sure, DOES have a Bernie contract...

[anthonyvop]

All are FIA sanctioned tracks.

[Koz]

What about Adelaide? Is it capable enough?

I think the new track they are building in NZ should be good enough?? (Atleast in theory lol)

[Alfa Fan]

All are FIA sanctioned tracks.

Doesn't matter. They've already said they won't stand in the way.

[Dave B]

There's no obvious reason why Silverstone, for example, couldn't now host the breakaway series, while F1 goes to Donington. So long as dates don't clash it could be wonderful!

[F1boat]

I think that there are extremely beautiful tracks in the USA as well. If they are good enough for Indy racing and Le Mans racing, they will be perfect for the new series as well, IMO. The new series should not chase facilities like FIA did, IMO. So I'd like to see Watkins Glen, Laguna Seca, Road America in the new calendar...

[Robinho]

we'll be back in the States, Canada and Mexico.

i'd tip portugal and france as well (but not Magny Cours)

Silverstone back, Imola amongst others. Good luck Fota, and please can ITV or C4 pick up the rights so i don't have to invest in Rupert Murdoch

[wmcot]

I think that there are extremely beautiful tracks in the USA as well. If they are good enough for Indy racing and Le Mans racing, they will be perfect for the new series as well, IMO. The new series should not chase facilities like FIA did, IMO. So I'd like to see Watkins Glen, Laguna Seca, Road America in the new calendar...

and Phoenix, Detroit...oh wait, wrong list! :)

Seriously, I'd like to see them run Miller Motorsports Park on the full track (all 24 turns) like ALMS did the first couple of years. It would be interesting to see who's engine works best 4000 feet above sea level!

[Mark]

W
Silverstone
Hockenheim
Magny-Cours
Montreal
Mount Fuji*
Indianapolis
A1-Ring
Jerez


Hockenheim is contracted to F1, albeit only 1 race every 2 years.

You can add Imola to that list too, I still miss that race.

What about Estoril?

They still race on a shortened version of the Adelaide track, so it wouldn't be impossible to race there again.

[ioan]

All the European tracks are FREE to host any race series they wish.
This has been decided and imposed by the EU Commission a couple of years ago.

[AndyRAC]

Relay the Tarmac through the forest at Hockenheim......

...well one can dream.

[Mark]

All the European tracks are FREE to host any race series they wish.
This has been decided and imposed by the EU Commission a couple of years ago.

You're right, of course. And indeed we've had top open wheel series running at the same track before, look at CART and F1 at Montreal.

There is a clincher in this one, rather than what Ferrari does, what matters is what will Monaco do? Being a temporary track they are only going to be hosting one race, and whichever series they choose will be helped on the way to victory, just like Indanapolis was decisive in America.

[Marshall]

Isn't the A1-Ring currently disused...I remember seeing pictures of a decrepit A1-Ring a little while back. Can't remember where though.

[Ghostwalker]

You're right, of course. And indeed we've had top open wheel series running at the same track before, look at CART and F1 at Montreal.

There is a clincher in this one, rather than what Ferrari does, what matters is what will Monaco do? Being a temporary track they are only going to be hosting one race, and whichever series they choose will be helped on the way to victory, just like Indanapolis was decisive in America.

i am not 100% certain. But i read somewhere that Monaco's GP would be in the series Ferrari choose to be in.

i dont have any source link or anything at thje moment but i know i've read that somewhere.

[F1boat]

what matters is what will Monaco do?

Prince Albert has stated that the Principality is not interested in a championship without Ferrari.

[Mark]

Prince Albert has stated that the Principality is not interested in a championship without Ferrari.

Well in that case it's the killer blow for the FIA if a new series is set up. It will have Ferrari, it will have the current champions and it will have Monaco.

FIA Formula 1 would die quickly!

[AndyRAC]

So Monaco have ditched both FiA events........hmm!!

[Oli_M]

I'm not sure on the current contractual arrangements of both the German and Japanese GP.

In Germany's case - is the contract with one promoter to hold the race, and they 'voluntarily' rotate it between the two tracks? Or, does one circuit have a contract for the odd numbered years and the other for the even years (etc)?

In Japan's case - was the contract originally with Fuji, who are then 'leasing' the Suzuka track every other year (whichever way the money flows....), or again is there now a new contract officially with FIA/FOM for rotation. And recently, Fuji 'said' it was not going to host any more races - is that official, have contracts etc been signed/annulled, or is it just 'what we are going to do'?

BBC during Practise 1 this morning said Estoril and Hock had already expressed interest in holding a race, I would personally imagine the new track in the Algarve is a strong possibility. Jerez for Spain?

And will Monza follow Ferrari? One would have to assume so.

[superocean]

FOTA needs to run multiple races in North America. I'll attend them as long as it's not Indy-a-no-place. New York, Miami, Long beach streets alternating could be cool. Road, Laguna, Miller would be cool too. alternating races a few years would be good to allow some closer to attend the races. Montreal is too far but Laguna, long beach Miller are all within my range.

This topics got me thinking about what Honda is thinking now. Rejoin FIA or Join FOTA so they don't lose out on the North American market. Indy/IRA is pretty non existant IMO, I don't have VS channel.

Less races in the Bahrain Dirt is a plus. Hate that sandtrap.

[Somebody]

Hockenheim is contracted to F1, albeit only 1 race every 2 years.
No, like Fuji, they've dropped off the rotation. Apparently, they can't make Bernie Fees pay even every second year.

[Mark]

No, like Fuji, they've dropped off the rotation. Apparently, they can't make Bernie Fees pay even every second year.

I see. Lets hope, as a result of this we'll see a new F1 which sticks to the traditonal venues and doesn't drop the historic tracks in favour of soulless tilke-dromes in the middle of nowhere.

[Easy Drifter]

Let's face it. The FOTA series could go to more or less any track they wanted, especially if they run under FIM authority. Heck they could even decide to run on the dirt at Smoke's Eldora Speedway!
FIA reack rules and licencing won't apply to them.
Other series could follow. LMS and LeMans basically thumb their noses at the FIA in many ways and ALMS would follow.

[Oli_M]

I am assuming that we will see races at Qatar (Losail circuit) and Dubai (Dubai Autodrome) as I'm sure those circuits have been trying to get GPs for many years.

Also, just looked it up, and from what I can find, Monza's contract with Bernie/FIA expires after this years race, making it a good possibility for choosing the FOTA side.

So far, it seems like people (and teams!) have mentioned races in Europe, N America, Australia and Japan. Do we think S America or any other Asian countries are possible?

[RJL25]

I know its massively dangerous, I know it will require massive track modifications, but for next years Australian GP, man up F1 and run it at Bathurst! Then we'll seperate the men from the boys!

[Dave B]

I know its massively dangerous, I know it will require massive track modifications, but for next years Australian GP, man up F1 and run it at Bathurst! Then we'll seperate the men from the boys!
I'd love to see that, but you'd also spend half the weekend seperating the men from the trees.

[ioan]

No, like Fuji, they've dropped off the rotation. Apparently, they can't make Bernie Fees pay even every second year.

Bring back the old Hockenheim with it's long fast forest bends!

[RJL25]

I'd love to see that, but you'd also spend half the weekend seperating the men from the trees.

probably, but surely it couldn't be any more dangerous then monaco... except for the fact that F1 cars would be fairly well honking over the top of the mountain! Even a touring car is nudging 200km/h over skyline

Just imagine it thought... an F1 car doing this... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6G8fSoKmrQ&feature=related

[ioan]

I'd love to see that, but you'd also spend half the weekend seperating the men from the trees.

At least Webber already has some experience re landing with a car in a tree.

[Ent]

At least Webber already has some experience re landing with a car in a tree.

Twice in the same weekend, if I recall!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00348/leman385_gear_348912a.jpg

[MDS]

Maybe Surfer's would buck up the extra money to get the new league on the schedule.

[Somebody]

http://allenonf1.wordpress.com/2009/06/19/lunchtime-update-from-silverstone/
No-one on the FOTA side is saying how much preparation has already been done, but I gather that one of the team principals has been on the phone to several tracks which have recently hosted F1 events and are no longer hosting events, like Indianapolis, Montreal, Silverstone.

Ferrari owns Mugello, while Imola is ready to host these cars again after a major refurbishment. The teams seem to feel that the logistics of putting a new series together are not as much of a problem as is being suggested, especially getting the tracks and track operations together. The TV deals would be the tricky bit.

[Jag_Warrior]

http://allenonf1.wordpress.com/2009/06/19/lunchtime-update-from-silverstone/
The TV deals would be the tricky bit.

If this is going to happen next year, quite soon FOTA's going to have to go ahead and pull the trigger on a TV deal - and tell the FIA that next year is a no go. If there are FOTA races in North America, I would call in sick or dead to attend. But the races HAVE to be on TV to have any sort of global audience.

The loss of major sponsorships is really going to kick Ecclestone in the nads. One has to wonder what his pyramid scheme will be worth once the big players decide not to pay hundreds of million$ to support a second rate FIA series. Poor Bernie. Slavica might start requiring cash instead of a check each month.

[AndyRAC]

Bring back the old Hockenheim with it's long fast forest bends!

Yeah, absolutely!! I've already suggested that on another thread. It's a disgrace the way that circuit was ruined - and 'Tilke-fied'. Whose idea was that, I wonder?? :mad:

[BobGarage]

Twice in the same weekend, if I recall!

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00348/leman385_gear_348912a.jpg

the car did it twice, webber only once. The other time was peter dumbreck (spelling?)

[ClarkFan]

If this is going to happen next year, quite soon FOTA's going to have to go ahead and pull the trigger on a TV deal - and tell the FIA that next year is a no go. If there are FOTA races in North America, I would call in sick or dead to attend. But the races HAVE to be on TV to have any sort of global audience.

The loss of major sponsorships is really going to kick Ecclestone in the nads. One has to wonder what his pyramid scheme will be worth once the big players decide not to pay hundreds of million$ to support a second rate FIA series. Poor Bernie. Slavica might start requiring cash instead of a check each month.

Call in? I'd go AWOL, especially for Road America. Mid-Ohio would be cool, too, but the facilities are pretty primitive. Took my daughter there last month for a teenage driving course (with Tommy Byrne as an instructor) and nothing had been painted since I was there for ALMS races in 2006.

You are right about TV being a must - that is what is killing AOWR today, no mass exposure. But any new series (of the old one for that matter) needs to make the break to streaming PPV, where I think there is a lot of money being left on the table. I think the slowness to adapt is age-related; Bernie and Max are from the wrong generation (read: too old) to realize the potential.

As for money, shed no tears for BE. Remember, CVC paid him cold, hard cash on the barrelhead in the deal a few years ago. True, it was OPM (RBS to be exact), but that doesn't matter to Bernie. CVC just brought Bernie back back to run the show becasue he has the blackmail tapes on all the other players. (There must be some real doozies on Max! :eek :)

ClarkFan

[jso1985]

I'd choose

Algarve
Jerez
Paul Ricard
Zandvoort
Silverstone
Hockenheim
Monaco
Balatonring
Brno
Mugello
Dubai
Fuji
Surfers Paradise
Watkins Glen
Montreal(upgrade the tarmac though!)
Mexico City
Curitiba

[Somebody]

You are right about TV being a must - that is what is killing AOWR today, no mass exposure. But any new series (of the old one for that matter) needs to make the break to streaming PPV, where I think there is a lot of money being left on the table. I think the slowness to adapt is age-related; Bernie and Max are from the wrong generation (read: too old) to realize the potential.

You mean online PPV?

The main problem with any form of PPV is that sponsors demand FTA coverage - if it's not FTA, they cut their prices because they (and the sport in turn) get less exposure. And TV channels are increasingly demanding exclusive online rights in their territory as part of the deal - notice how the Beeb streams F1 every week? The sports that benefit from PPV money are the ones that don't have that much sponsorship income.

[tintop]

Relay the Tarmac through the forest at Hockenheim......

...well one can dream. Yesssss!

[ClarkFan]

You mean online PPV?

The main problem with any form of PPV is that sponsors demand FTA coverage - if it's not FTA, they cut their prices because they (and the sport in turn) get less exposure. And TV channels are increasingly demanding exclusive online rights in their territory as part of the deal - notice how the Beeb streams F1 every week? The sports that benefit from PPV money are the ones that don't have that much sponsorship income.

Logistics could be worked out - the streaming feeds could even include the ads plus the coverage missed in the live broadcast while the ads were running. This is pure extra money being left on the table. And online coverage is still hit and miss - it's not available in the US. I'd pay to watch F1 races. The cable package with Speed in it costs $100/month where I live. That's spending close to as much to watch a few races on TV as a flull season of autocrosses and lapping weekends. :burnout:

ClarkFan

[wmcot]

Logistics could be worked out - the streaming feeds could even include the ads plus the coverage missed in the live broadcast while the ads were running. This is pure extra money being left on the table. And online coverage is still hit and miss - it's not available in the US. I'd pay to watch F1 races. The cable package with Speed in it costs $100/month where I live. That's spending close to as much to watch a few races on TV as a flull season of autocrosses and lapping weekends. :burnout:

ClarkFan


Sign me up, too.

[UltimateDanGTR]

FOTA really need to get the new algarve track-that looks really good.

also, Id definatly want FOTA to go to Potrero do les funes in argentina-that looks like an amzing track-must go there.

so, vital races for fota:

Silverstone
Monaco
Spa
Algarve
Potrero do les funes