Bank Error in Your Favour

[Camelopard]

I guess a lot of you have heard about the couple in NZ who did a runner after having $NZ10 million ($US5?) put into their account by mistake, I'm curious to know what you would do.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/05/21/2576790.htm

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/05/26/2581343.htm

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/05/25/2579774.htm

It seems that may not be charged with theft:

"The detective heading the inquiry has told the New Zealand Herald newspaper the couple may not be charged with theft because they have not physically handled the cash.
Instead, it is more likely they will face charges relating to using a computer to access the money."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/05/26/2580805.htm

[Roamy]

yea these poor fools will probably go to prison for the rest of their lives while Bernie Madoff will get house arrest and hang out in his 7 million dollar pad.

[Magnus]

Maybe they had a good plan, but I do not believe I would take my chances, if I found myself in their place. Ok, maybe they were facing bankrupcy, but in the long run, I think it would be a good thing to just tell the bank about their mistake. They would at least have one up on the bank; useful for tougher times perhaps...

[gloomyDAY]

Steve Miller Band - Take the Money and Run

[leopard]

I never get used to checking my balance, perhaps once in one or two months, I'll tell the bank two months later once I noticed it, send back full amount, if they don't ask me the interest I'll buy goat and make big lunch and dinner with friends...

[Wade91]

if the bank is stupid dumb enough to make a stupid mistake like that in the first place, then there is no reason why the couple should not have kept the money

[Hondo]

If I knew enough about the banking system to know of a way to transfer the funds into a sort of escrow account, I'd do that. The last figure I saw was $8 million in US dollars so I'd siphon off the interest being paid on the money while negotiating my "finders fee" for it's safe return to the original bank.

If they can pay ridiculous bonuses to their executives for losing money, they can afford a bonus to me for finding their money.

In addition, the final settlement would have a clause stipulating that the poor fool that made the error wouldn't lose their job.

[Hazell B]

I was thick enough to tell the woman in our Halifax that she'd counted my cash in wrong and it was a hundred quid less than she thought. Will I never learn? :(

[Daniel]

I was thick enough to tell the woman in our Halifax that she'd counted my cash in wrong and it was a hundred quid less than she thought. Will I never learn? :(
Nah you're just honest. I did something similar the other day at a cake stall for a charity. They gave me a pound too much back in change and as soon as I realised I told them and gave it back :)

[Daniel]

if the bank is stupid dumb enough to make a stupid mistake like that in the first place, then there is no reason why the couple should not have kept the money
You really have the most strange morals and ethics of someone I've ever seen. So for instance, if I leave the keys to my car somewhere and someone steals the car it's alright because I left my keys there? You're having a laugh dude. These people are just common thieves. I hope they're tracked down and they have to give the money back as well as go to jail.

[Wade91]

You really have the most strange morals and ethics of someone I've ever seen. So for instance, if I leave the keys to my car somewhere and someone steals the car it's alright because I left my keys there? You're having a laugh dude. These people are just common thieves. I hope they're tracked down and they have to give the money back as well as go to jail.
the bank GAVE the money to these people, if someone gives you a gift does that mean your stealing it? if you walk up to someone on the street and grab their wallet, then you are stealing money that you have no right to, but if someone walks up to YOU and hands you money, then the money is yours

that was a stupid mistake for the bank to make in the first place

[Jag_Warrior]

the bank GAVE the money to these people, if someone gives you a gift does that mean your stealing it? if you walk up to someone on the street and grab their wallet, then you are stealing money that you have no right to, but if someone walks up to YOU and hands you money, then the money is yours

that was a stupid mistake for the bank to make in the first place

Well, let's look at a similar situation. You're at a restaurant with valet parking. You're driving a Honda Accord, which they take to the parking area. When you finish dinner, the valet brings a car around and presents it to you. It's a new Ferrari F430. Do you drive off in it and say, "stupid mistake... stupid valet... stupid restaurant"?
Just curious.

[Ranger]

the bank GAVE the money to these people, if someone gives you a gift does that mean your stealing it? if you walk up to someone on the street and grab their wallet, then you are stealing money that you have no right to, but if someone walks up to YOU and hands you money, then the money is yours

Bad analogy.

A better one would be if you were walking down the street and found $500 in an envelope with the intended addressee written on it.

Does it make you entitled to the money in that envelope?

[Alexamateo]

the bank GAVE the money to these people, if someone gives you a gift does that mean your stealing it? if you walk up to someone on the street and grab their wallet, then you are stealing money that you have no right to, but if someone walks up to YOU and hands you money, then the money is yours

that was a stupid mistake for the bank to make in the first place

Wade, I don't mean to be piling on, but we're really talking about a clerical error. Let me give you an reverse example from real life. I know you live in Nashville, well, I sell in Nashville among other places. Let's say you have a company called Wade91 Landscape, and I sell to you. There's also a Wade91 Landscape in Memphis, and I sell to them too. Well the Memphis company orders some trees and I ship them, but when I go to do the invoice, I clik on the wrong Wade91 and bill you instead. Can I now expect you to pay their invoice? Of course not, you're going to call me up and say that I billed the wrong customer.

In a similar vein, there's a local vendor for me called White Oak Farm, well there's also a White Oak Farm in Georgia. He gets checks all the time made out in his name for product he didn't ship. A corporate Accounts Payable person just picked the wrong vendor from the list when cutting checks. He laughs that, "some of the checks are very nice," but he can't keep them, they are not really his even though they are made out to him. It's just a clerical error, a mistake.

[Hondo]

I'm content with my solution. A couple of days of interest, maybe a reward. No need to be greedy here.

[Jag_Warrior]

If I knew enough about the banking system to know of a way to transfer the funds into a sort of escrow account, I'd do that. The last figure I saw was $8 million in US dollars so I'd siphon off the interest being paid on the money while negotiating my "finders fee" for it's safe return to the original bank.

If they can pay ridiculous bonuses to their executives for losing money, they can afford a bonus to me for finding their money.

In addition, the final settlement would have a clause stipulating that the poor fool that made the error wouldn't lose their job.

As soon as you used a wire or electronic transfer to access or move the money from the original account, you'd face the same criminal charge that they are... especially if you then tried to negotiate a deal with the bank before you'd return the funds.

[Hondo]

Thats why I went with the "If I knew enough about...". Works for me. I'll leave the money in my account and demand the interest for the time it was in there. Maybe I'll get a toaster out of the deal.

[Daniel]

the bank GAVE the money to these people, if someone gives you a gift does that mean your stealing it? if you walk up to someone on the street and grab their wallet, then you are stealing money that you have no right to, but if someone walks up to YOU and hands you money, then the money is yours

that was a stupid mistake for the bank to make in the first place

You really are priceless. Remind me never to give you a lift or anything EVER without counting the pennies in the ashtray......

If you accidently get something delivered to your address that it clearly meant to go to your next door neighbour does that mean it's OK to take it and keep it? No! It's common theft either way.

[Roamy]

Well, let's look at a similar situation. You're at a restaurant with valet parking. You're driving a Honda Accord, which they take to the parking area. When you finish dinner, the valet brings a car around and presents it to you. It's a new Ferrari F430. Do you drive off in it and say, "stupid mistake... stupid valet... stupid restaurant"?
Just curious.


YES If it is a Ferrari get in it and drive like hell. Anything else - leave it :p

[Jag_Warrior]

YES If it is a Ferrari get in it and drive like hell. Anything else - leave it :p

Yeah, but with my luck, it would be this guy's car:
http://superiorsquad.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/michael-corleone1.jpg

What happened to Jag_Warrior?

Who? Never heard of him. Fugetaboutit... :vader:

[Garry Walker]

You really are priceless. Remind me never to give you a lift or anything EVER without counting the pennies in the ashtray......

If you accidently get something delivered to your address that it clearly meant to go to your next door neighbour does that mean it's OK to take it and keep it? No! It's common theft either way.

Have you read this guys posts before? He is obviously not the sharpest person around.

[Wade91]

Well, let's look at a similar situation. You're at a restaurant with valet parking. You're driving a Honda Accord, which they take to the parking area. When you finish dinner, the valet brings a car around and presents it to you. It's a new Ferrari F430. Do you drive off in it and say, "stupid mistake... stupid valet... stupid restaurant"?
Just curious.
its not the same, you would be stealing the car, it wouldn't matter that the valet encuraged you to do it, however in a case like that i think the valet company should share atleast half the responsabilty, for a stupid mistake like that

but its not the same as someone taking their OWN money and GIVING it to someone like this bank did,

what a stupid mistake by that bank

[Jag_Warrior]

its not the same, you would be stealing the car, it wouldn't matter that the valet encuraged you to do it, however in a case like that i think the valet company should share atleast half the responsabilty, for a stupid mistake like that

but its not the same as someone taking their OWN money and GIVING it to someone like this bank did,

what a stupid mistake by that bank

These people knew it wasn't their money - that's the bottomline. That's why they transferred it and ran away like thieves in the night. No different than the car.

You just said it yourself: "what a stupid mistake by that bank." And I agree with that. But that doesn't give you the right to be a crook. But if you want to be a crook, expect to be hunted down like an animal. Expect to have your family and friends spied on and harassed. I can't imagine what it's like to have Interpol on your azz. But I guess we'll see who is truly stupid while the Interpol boys are hunting these idiots down like dogs.

[Easy Drifter]

As soon as I saw Wade91 posting I knew what his attitude would be.
His morals are in line with his ethics and sense of right and wrong.

[Jag_Warrior]

As soon as I saw Wade91 posting I knew what his attitude would be.
His morals are in line with his ethics and sense of right and wrong.

From the great American classic, Ferris Bueller's Day Off: "I weep for the future."

I hope that Wade's overall attitude is not one shared by most of his generation. And I hope that once he gets out on his own, he grows out of this odd way of thinking.

[Easy Drifter]

Jag: We have quite a few members around Wade's age on the forum although a few do not post in Chit Chat. He seems to be an exception in his attitude. The others are literate and can express their opinions lucidly and present intelligent arguements.
I have never seen Wade91 participate in any of the many serious discussions in this area, just in lightweight items. I hope he at least reads the threads but I somehow doubt it. He might learn something if he did.
Maybe if he sees this he will start looking at the serious threads.
Actually I think this is the most serious thread he has participated in and with an opinion contrary to any honest person.

[Hazell B]

I'm content with my solution. A couple of days of interest, maybe a reward. No need to be greedy here.

Exactly right :up:

Keeping it is theft, pure and simple.

[Jag_Warrior]

Jag: We have quite a few members around Wade's age on the forum although a few do not post in Chit Chat. He seems to be an exception in his attitude. The others are literate and can express their opinions lucidly and present intelligent arguements.
I have never seen Wade91 participate in any of the many serious discussions in this area, just in lightweight items. I hope he at least reads the threads but I somehow doubt it. He might learn something if he did.
Maybe if he sees this he will start looking at the serious threads.
Actually I think this is the most serious thread he has participated in and with an opinion contrary to any honest person.

That's true. The member on this forum who has had me most fooled on his age was Harvick#1. He's been around for awhile and with the depth of his posts, I'd always assumed that he was at least in his 30's. Turns out he's closer to Wade's age... maybe a little older.

I thought for awhile that Wade was putting on an act. I thought he was likely some evil genius in his 50's or 60's, just gaming the rest of us to get his jollies. But no, he's for real.

All I can do is wish him luck.

[Wade91]

how could anyone in these peoples place even consider the idea of giving the money back? do you know what all you could do with kinda money? :p

[Daniel]

its not the same, you would be stealing the car, it wouldn't matter that the valet encuraged you to do it, however in a case like that i think the valet company should share atleast half the responsabilty, for a stupid mistake like that

but its not the same as someone taking their OWN money and GIVING it to someone like this bank did,

what a stupid mistake by that bank
So if you accidently transfer money to the wrong bank you should lose it? I happen to work for a large bank/credit card company and it don't work that way. If someone gives us money accidently and asks for it back and we know where the money is then we give it back. Which is how it should be.

I don't know whether it's because of your upbringing or perhaps because you've been homeschooled and don't have much life experience but you seem to have a really dodgy view of what is right and wrong Wade.....

[Wade91]

So if you accidently transfer money to the wrong bank you should lose it? I happen to work for a large bank/credit card company and it don't work that way. If someone gives us money accidently and asks for it back and we know where the money is then we give it back. Which is how it should be.

I don't know whether it's because of your upbringing or perhaps because you've been homeschooled and don't have much life experience but you seem to have a really dodgy view of what is right and wrong Wade.....
anyone can withdraw money anytime after the deposset it anyway though, of cource you have to pay a penilty if you withdraw money early if its tied up in a CD, maybe its diffront if you accadently........ but although you "give" banks your money, its not exactually like a gift becouse you can always withdraw it,

where as money in someones bank account, is only withdrwable by the people who created it,

if someone writes you a check and you cash it, are you stealing the money?

the bank "gave" these people the money, so now the money is theres

[Daniel]

anyone can withdraw money anytime after the deposset it anyway though, of cource you have to pay a penilty if you withdraw money early if its tied up in a CD, maybe its diffront if you accadently........ but although you "give" banks your money, its not exactually like a gift becouse you can always withdraw it,

where as money in someones bank account, is only withdrwable by the people who created it,

if someone writes you a check and you cash it, are you stealing the money?

the bank "gave" these people the money, so now the money is theres
This IS an English speaking forum you know :rolleyes:

[Wade91]

This IS an English speaking forum you know :rolleyes:
well, thats good to know, becouse i dont know any other langruge

[Jag_Warrior]

anyone can withdraw money anytime after the deposset it anyway though, of cource you have to pay a penilty if you withdraw money early if its tied up in a CD, maybe its diffront if you accadently........ but although you "give" banks your money, its not exactually like a gift becouse you can always withdraw it,

where as money in someones bank account, is only withdrwable by the people who created it,

if someone writes you a check and you cash it, are you stealing the money?

the bank "gave" these people the money, so now the money is theres

Let me (briefly and basically) explain this, Wade. No more analogies, as that clearly isn't working. The bank did not "give" these people this money. A loan was made to them. A mistake was made in the amount of the loan. The incorrect amount was placed in their account. Now the bank is calling the loan and attempting to recover its money. Had these people not run away, this matter could have been easily resolved. But if it's as you say, and it's really a gift of some sort, why did they run??? Why are they hiding??? People run & hide when they know they've done something wrong.

And BTW, on the matter of EFT's... dozens of entities are cleared to put money in and take money out of my accounts. On rare occasions, mistakes are made. If my utility company takes out too much, do you think I'm going to let them keep the money? Of course not. If my brokerage firm puts too much money in my account, do you think they're going to let me keep the money? Would I even expect to be allowed to keep the extra funds? No! #1, I'm not stupid. And #2, I'm not Ghandi, but I'm also not a crook.

These people knew they were doing something wrong, they ran and now their lives are going to be ruined because of it. Why you don't get that, I'm not sure. It's not that hard to understand.

[Wade91]

Let me (briefly and basically) explain this, Wade. No more analogies, as that clearly isn't working. The bank did not "give" these people this money. A loan was made to them. A mistake was made in the amount of the loan. The incorrect amount was placed in their account. Now the bank is calling the loan and attempting to recover its money. Had these people not run away, this matter could have been easily resolved. But if it's as you say, and it's really a gift of some sort, why did they run??? Why are they hiding??? People run & hide when they know they've done something wrong.

And BTW, on the matter of EFT's... dozens of entities are cleared to put money in and take money out of my accounts. On rare occasions, mistakes are made. If my utility company takes out too much, do you think I'm going to let them keep the money? Of course not. If my brokerage firm puts too much money in my account, do you think they're going to let me keep the money? Would I even expect to be allowed to keep the extra funds? No! #1, I'm not stupid. And #2, I'm not Ghandi, but I'm also not a crook.

These people knew they were doing something wrong, they ran and now their lives are going to be ruined because of it. Why you don't get that, I'm not sure. It's not that hard to understand.
oh, well, i AM sure that these people knew how the bank would react, but the bank gave them the money and now its theres, so the bank can take that and stick it where the sun dont shine!

[Daniel]

oh, well, i AM sure that these people knew how the bank would react, but the bank gave them the money and now its theres, so the bank can take that and stick it where the sun dont shine!
You don't get it! Just because you posess something doesn't mean it is yours.

Let me put it another way. If I have a Ferrari and am getting someone to come out and clean it for me and I give the key to someone who I think is the detailer and say "give it a good clean" and he drives off with it it's still STEALING!!!!!!

[Wade91]

weather it was legal or not, shouldn't even matter, these people did very good taking the money that the bank gave them,

anyone could live such an awesome life with that much money

[Jag_Warrior]

weather it was legal or not, shouldn't even matter, these people did very good taking the money that the bank gave them,

anyone could live such an awesome life with that much money

:rolleyes:

God bless you, son. God bless you.

They're not smart at all. Interpol has caught people a helluva lot smarter than these amateurs. Hopefully they live it up as fast as they can. Because the good times will come to an end very shortly. When they're caught, we'll revisit this topic and you can tell us how awesome their circumstances are then.

[GridGirl]

Wade, have you ever had money stolen from your bank account? I've had money taken from my account before, from New York ATM machines infact. I shred all my unwanted financial information but my debit card got cloned at a petrol station and ended up in the hands of criminals on the other side of the pond. Did I contact the the bank and ask them to stop my card and give me my money back? Of course I did. Just because thieves got 'my money' doesn't mean it was theirs or they had a right to take or keep it.

I actually have a fraud case with one of my clients where a substantial cheque was paid to Mrs X. Y instead of an unrelated Mr X. Y. Mrs X. Y has since spent the money and is pleading poverty as regards to paying it back. The bank has since admitted partial liability seeing as the cheque was altered to read Mrs instead of Mr and will repay half the money back. My client is still out of pocket but it was their own fault for originally sending the cheque to the wrong person. I suppose the moral of the story is to double check everything.

[Jag_Warrior]

oh, well, i AM sure that these people knew how the bank would react, but the bank gave them the money and now its theres,

Well Wade, I might agree with you there. One of my favorite shows last year was The Wire. There was a very well written character on that show who had a life philosophy very similar to yours. He was a "stickup boy" (robbed drug dealers). Good ol' Omar Little. Anyway, he was in the process of robbing a drug dealer and the drug dealer said, "hey, that's my money!" To which Omar replied, "money ain't got no owners, yo... only spenders."

So yeah, right now, that money is "theres" - they are the new spenders. But when they hear the words, "You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law"... that will be a pretty good indication that the money "aint theres no mo...yo." I guess it'll have some new spenders at that point, huh? :)

Anytime you play with the bull, there's always that chance you'll get the horns. Omar wound up in a pool of blood with a large hole in his head. But you know, I guess the ride was good up to that point.

[Wade91]

well, theres no doubt that theres some evil people looking for this couple, but they are in another country and hopfully will never be found, it may be in their best interest to move around quite a bit for a while but they may be well hid already, as long as they dont get cought, thay have done very well

[GridGirl]

Im quite sure that the evil people won't catch them if they can manage to hide in a country that doesn't have an extradition treaty with New Zealand. :p Man, they are well on course for a brilliant life where they are in constant fear of being caught. They'll love it. :p

[Jag_Warrior]

Wade, your funy.

[Easy Drifter]

Well Wade I can tell you that the Surpreme Court of Canada does not agree with your perverted view of life.
Nor do the New Zealand Police or Interpol, not to mention the bank.

[Wade91]

Well Wade I can tell you that the Surpreme Court of Canada does not agree with your perverted view of life.
Nor do the New Zealand Police or Interpol, not to mention the bank.
i never said they did

[Wade91]

Im quite sure that the evil people won't catch them if they can manage to hide in a country that doesn't have an extradition treaty with New Zealand. :p Man, they are well on course for a brilliant life where they are in constant fear of being caught. They'll love it. :p
a huge new house somewhere will probalby and nice new car will probalby help keep their minds off the worry ;)

[Easy Drifter]

Yup, a very clever way to hide. Spend huge sums of money when you just arrive in some country with Interpol and every police force (or tinpot dictator looking for the slice of the pie) searching for you.
If, by any chance, you pulled of such a stunt you would be discussing your strange views of right and wrong in a court very quickly.
I do not agree with some of the people on this forum a lot of the time. We engage in debate and sometimes not too politely.
However, in case you haven't noticed, no one in this thread is agreeing with you. Some of those are people I rarely agree with.
That alone should tell you something.
I do feel sorry for you as your attitude to life is going to make things very difficult for you in a few years.
I do not know if you read the many very serious threads that appear on here from time to time but you should.
I almost never agree with Eki but I do respect his opinions. He may not think so, but I do.
Your's I don't.

[Camelopard]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/08/09/2650391.htm?section=justin

[race_director]

sacking the employing is not the option i guess . the bank is hiding many things from the world .


every bank has a maker/checker system . so when a employee posts the entry it has to be checked and authorized by the supervisor.


how come only the lady got fired . why not he boss ???

[Wade91]

i guess that person just isn't cut out for that job :s