BOOM BOOOM N. Korea has Nukes

[Roamy]

Well now lets see what happens !!
As the idiots get Nukes - Maybe those Hyundai warranties are not that good after all. :p

he world’s intelligence agencies and defense experts are quietly acknowledging that North Korea has become a fully fledged nuclear power with the capacity to wipe out entire cities in Japan and South Korea, the Times of London reported.

[Easy Drifter]

Relax. Eki will soon be telling us why they absolutely need them for protection from---- well maybe from---- or possibly--- I've got it, from Finland. :D

[Eki]

Relax. Eki will soon be telling us why they absolutely need them for protection from---- well maybe from---- or possibly--- I've got it, from Finland. :D

Who knows. Finland is already considering invading Somalia:

http://www.yle.fi/uutiset/news/2009/04/finland_sending_minelayer_to_somali_waters_704501. html

Maybe next stop North Korea?

Maybe the Yanks will stop bullying them now?

[Eki]

Maybe the Yanks will stop bullying them now?
At least they probably won't invade them now.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Well now lets see what happens !!
As the idiots get Nukes - Maybe those Hyundai warranties are not that good after all. :p

he world’s intelligence agencies and defense experts are quietly acknowledging that North Korea has become a fully fledged nuclear power with the capacity to wipe out entire cities in Japan and South Korea, the Times of London reported.

What do you mean? Hyundai is South Korean. The bigger warranty is whats needed if their northern neighbours have nukes. :p

[Roamy]

what I am saying is they may not be Around to honor the warranty

[Dr. Krogshöj]

Countries don't make nukes to actually use them. That would kill the whole point.

[Tshbez]

As Obama said, with the USA being the ONLY country to have ever used nukes to kill hundreds of thousands of people, they should be the ones to set an example......

[Eki]

what I am saying is they may not be Around to honor the warranty
I doubt North Korea would be keen to use their nukes so close to home. They'd probably prefer to send them to the US or something. No wait, that would be an even surer suicide.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I doubt North Korea would be keen to use their nukes so close to home. They'd probably prefer to send them to the US or something. No wait, that would be an even surer suicide.


So again...WHY would they go to the point of getting them when they cannot even feed their own people without US aid?

As for their worrying about someone invading, they outnumber in soldiers in uniform by a 5 to 1 margin the ROK and US troops on the other side. No one is invading Eki. This is just the last acts of a paranoid madman who has no grip on reality, and no one with the balls to stop him from telling him to go away.

The country is a basketcase. What it needs is freedom and capitalism...what it has is missles that barely can hit an ocean, and some half-@ssed nukes that may or may not work.

You can surely see the pointlessness of this exercise? Oh wait a minute...it is all the American's fault right?

[Eki]

As for their worrying about someone invading, they outnumber in soldiers in uniform by a 5 to 1 margin the ROK and US troops on the other side. No one is invading Eki.
Tell that to the North Koreans, not me. They aren't convinced. I saw a BBC documentary on North Korea. They followed a North Korean family. Suddenly the lights went out and the family seemed to genuinely believe the blackouts were Americans' fault. The government propaganda (and that's the all information they get there) seems to have gone down well there, hook, line and sinker.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Tell that to the North Koreans, not me. They aren't convinced. I saw a BBC documentary on North Korea. They followed a North Korean family. Suddenly the lights went out and the family seemed to genuinely believe the blackouts were Americans' fault. The government propaganda (and that's the all information they get there) seems to have gone down well there, hook, line and sinker.


Yes..and I am sure if I dig enough on this forum I can find many instances where you defend the right of North Korea's government for this paranoia. You have defended other leaders who conduct themselves in this manner and blame the US for it. At some point, it should always be pointed out that nations that have democratically elected and free societies never have issues with the US to the point where a war is even considered.

Yet you Eki have always defended these despots and their actions to the point where we have wondered about your sanity.......

[Eki]

At some point, it should always be pointed out that nations that have democratically elected and free societies never have issues with the US to the point where a war is even considered.

The Soviet Union never had issues with its' neighboring countries to the point where a war was even considered as long as their policy and government were accepted by Moscow. The acts of the US ordering and sometimes enforcing its orders with military force that every country to must have democratically elected and free societies whether they want it or not doesn't sound very democratic and free. It's a paradox.

The US putting sanctions and threats on North Korea helps the North Korean leaders with their propaganda. They can shift the blame for the hardships of the North Korean people from themselves to the US. As long as the US puts pressure on North Korea and tells them what they should do, the North Korean leaders can convince their people that the US is a threat to the North Korean sovereignty and that's the reason why they need the nukes. I'm sure North Koreans are as proud to be North Koreans as Americans are proud to be Americans and they don't like foreigners telling them what to do and what not to do.

[Mark in Oshawa]

The Soviet Union never had issues with its' neighboring countries to the point where a war was even considered as long as their policy and government were accepted by Moscow. The acts of the US ordering and sometimes enforcing its orders with military force that every country to must have democratically elected and free societies whether they want it or not doesn't sound very democratic and free. It's a paradox..

They didn't eh? What was Hungary in 56? How about Czechslovokia in 68? They enforced their will. Whereas Canada disagrees with the US on quite a few occasions, Vietnam and Iraq being two, yet there are no threats. Nations the US has been involved with are not democracies, but often dictatorships. Not that they have a sterling record of being right, I will grant you that, but on the whole the US is much more tolerant of nations that disagree with them and their policies than the former Soviet Union was. Both sides were playing out a morality play over communism often to the detriment of the 3rd parties to be sure, but as many Russians or former Soviet citizens from places like the Baltic states will tell you, they have a heck of a lot more faith in what the US was selling as a society than what the Politiburo of Brezhnev or Stalin was selling.


The US putting sanctions and threats on North Korea helps the North Korean leaders with their propaganda. They can shift the blame for the hardships of the North Korean people from themselves to the US. As long as the US puts pressure on North Korea and tells them what they should do, the North Korean leaders can convince their people that the US is a threat to the North Korean sovereignty and that's the reason why they need the nukes. I'm sure North Koreans are as proud to be North Koreans as Americans are proud to be Americans and they don't like foreigners telling them what to do and what not to do.

The Clinton's backed way off and talked to the North Koreans at every opportunity. They have given aid to the North, and did throughout the last few decades. The US is the bogeyman Kim uses to hold his people in bondage, which is the same tact Castro and Chavez will use now.

The North Koreans are spending money on ICBM's when they have had people starving and eating grass to survive. Please spare me your BS how this is justified. The US isn't going to invade North Korea now, next week or a year from now as long as the North doesn't do anything really retarded like launch a missle with a live warhead at the US.

[EuroTroll]

The acts of the US ordering and sometimes enforcing its orders with military force that every country to must have democratically elected and free societies whether they want it or not doesn't sound very democratic and free. It's a paradox.

Oh dear... :rolleyes:

There are peoples, then, that don't want a free egalitarian society? How did you reach that wonderfully clever conclusion? :rolleyes: How do you know the will of these people? It is represented, perhaps, by the will of tyrants who rule them? Or by the government-controlled media?

"Yes, none of that for me. Freedom of speech, representative government - that's all rubbish. What I want is to be imprisoned when I say something critical about the rulers. Executed when I do something against ruling order. Yes, that's the life for me!" :rolleyes:

[Mark in Oshawa]

Studiose, you live in a Baltic nation which was up til recent history under the thumb of Moscow. You of all people understand what freedom means....Eki I am afraid wants to ignore this from the safety of his little hole in Helsinki

[millencolin]

Countries don't make nukes to actually use them. That would kill the whole point.

Valid point, but remember, we are dealing with Kim-Jong Il here, he is not normal. And if 'Team America - World Police' has taught me anything, he is an angry emotional ilrational ronery little man... Not Good

[F1boat]

stidiose, I think that Eki is right. My opinion is that some countries prefer more security and less freedom. I think about Russia and their "sovereign democary" experiment and, of course, some Muslim countries, which, to me, seem happy with theocratic government.

[EuroTroll]

stidiose, I think that Eki is right. My opinion is that some countries prefer more security and less freedom. I think about Russia and their "sovereign democary" experiment and, of course, some Muslim countries, which, to me, seem happy with theocratic government.

My main point was: how do we - how can we - know what the majority of the people want, unless there's democracy, representative government and independent media?

People prefer order to chaos, sure. That's why Russians prefer Putin to Yeltsin (some of them, in fact, would prefer Stalin to Yeltsin :eek: ). I'm sure many Iraqis would prefer Saddam's regime to the current situation where you have to wonder, when leaving home in the morning, whether you will see your loved-ones again in the evening.

But essentially, I do believe there's a common basic human yearning for egality, truth, justice for all... And these things are only obtainable in a free society.

If the Russian people didn't want democracy, why would it even be necessary for the ruling KGB clique to play democracy? :) But they do, and it is necessary.

Why is it necessary for dictators around the world to hold mock elections to establish their power for another number of years? You know the countries I mean. The ones where the leader gets 97% of the votes with 95% turn-out.. :)

Why don't they just say, "F*** you, peasants. I am your leader for as long as I live, 'cause God has deemed it so. Those who oppose me, I will destroy. And there will be order in the land."

Doesn't really work anymore, does it?

Because everyone knows democracy can work. It can work well. You can have freedom and order - they are not mutually exclusive. And of the many forms of government that have been tried throughout history, it is surely... the least bad. :)

[Eki]

stidiose, I think that Eki is right. My opinion is that some countries prefer more security and less freedom. I think about Russia and their "sovereign democary" experiment and, of course, some Muslim countries, which, to me, seem happy with theocratic government.
True. I've even seen on TV elderly Russians who missed the Stalin regime, because at least then they had food to eat and an apartment to live in.

With freedom should become responsibility. What good is freedom if people just use it to f**k things up?

[Eki]

Valid point, but remember, we are dealing with Kim-Jong Il here, he is not normal.
Is he even alive or nothing more than a vegetable that the real rulers of North Korea use as a facade? With Saddam Hussein the Americans who interrogated him noticed that he didn't actually know much about what was going on in his country. Could be the same with Kim-Jong Il.

[Roamy]

Take him out !!

[EuroTroll]

Take him out !!

Who? Stalin? He's already dead, don't you know. :p :

[SportscarBruce]

Maybe the Yanks will stop bullying them now?

At least they probably won't invade them now.

Excuse me, who crossed the 39th parallel in force back in 1950?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War

In regards to Fat Man, Little Boy, and WWII;

The Busido Code of warfare had no word in its dictionary for surrender up to that point.

The Code of Bushido in WWII was used as a tool to motivate the ignorant masses to murder and die in the name of the emperor. For example, the rape, torture and murder of over 300,000 "unarmed" civilians in Nanking was justified by the arrogance and racism of the Code. The estimated 10 million Chinese (mostly civilians)killed starved and murdered with biological weapons by the Japanese was not at all "honorable".The military in control of the government and the puppet "divine" emperor used the Code to brainwash and control the ordinary soldier. Some of the Code's character traits such as Justice, Unselfishness, Righteousness, Honor and Virtue were a joke in WWII. Using the "divine wind" or kamikaze to die in large numbers for naught was renamed "passing wind" by U.S. pilots.Blind obedience in the name of Country-- what a waste.The Japanese people deserved better.

In WW2, when the Japanese were held prisoner in Cowra prison Australia, many Japanese prisoners could not understand the quality of the treatment which the Australian guards gave them. They received a good standard of housing and were well fed. Although treated so well, the Japanese were not happy and often attempted suicide. Many also changed there names so that their parents assumed they were dead rather then disappoint them. This was because of the way they were taught to follow the Bushido code.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_Code_of_Bushido_and_what_happened_with _it_in_World_War_2

However horrible the acts undertaken to force a peace, thankfully the Japanese people have since rejected such a militaristic philosophy demanding blind obedience to a solitary figure of power.

Obviously the people of North Korea are subjected to a similarly self-destructive overly nationalistic personality cult.

Unfortunately these facts escape some who herald a tyrant's newfound capability of mass destruction while rushing to hurl stones at imagined oppressors...

[chuck34]

Excuse me, who crossed the 39th parallel in force back in 1950?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_War

In regards to Fat Man, Little Boy, and WWII;

The Busido Code of warfare had no word in its dictionary for surrender up to that point.

The Code of Bushido in WWII was used as a tool to motivate the ignorant masses to murder and die in the name of the emperor. For example, the rape, torture and murder of over 300,000 "unarmed" civilians in Nanking was justified by the arrogance and racism of the Code. The estimated 10 million Chinese (mostly civilians)killed starved and murdered with biological weapons by the Japanese was not at all "honorable".The military in control of the government and the puppet "divine" emperor used the Code to brainwash and control the ordinary soldier. Some of the Code's character traits such as Justice, Unselfishness, Righteousness, Honor and Virtue were a joke in WWII. Using the "divine wind" or kamikaze to die in large numbers for naught was renamed "passing wind" by U.S. pilots.Blind obedience in the name of Country-- what a waste.The Japanese people deserved better.

In WW2, when the Japanese were held prisoner in Cowra prison Australia, many Japanese prisoners could not understand the quality of the treatment which the Australian guards gave them. They received a good standard of housing and were well fed. Although treated so well, the Japanese were not happy and often attempted suicide. Many also changed there names so that their parents assumed they were dead rather then disappoint them. This was because of the way they were taught to follow the Bushido code.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_Code_of_Bushido_and_what_happened_with _it_in_World_War_2

However horrible the acts undertaken to force a peace, thankfully the Japanese people have since rejected such a militaristic philosophy demanding blind obedience to a solitary figure of power.

Obviously the people of North Korea are subjected to a similarly self-destructive overly nationalistic personality cult.

Unfortunately these facts escape some who herald a tyrant's newfound capability of mass destruction while rushing to hurl stones at imagined oppressors...

Bruce man save yourself. Don't get sucked in to trying to convince Eki that he's a fool who doesn't understand history. I've been trying for a while now, and I've just been wasting my time. I'm in too deep now, I must keep going. But you, you can still get out. Go man leave now before it's too late. :-)

[SportscarBruce]

Thanks for the warning but don't worry, I'll not waste my time. In instances like this you don't talk to folks who are permanently entrenched in political extremism in hopes of changing their perspective with rational debate, you talk over and past them to the larger audience.

[555-04Q2]

Valid point, but remember, we are dealing with Kim-Jong Il here, he is not normal.

And George W Bush was normal :confused: Most people would differ.

[Mark in Oshawa]

True. I've even seen on TV elderly Russians who missed the Stalin regime, because at least then they had food to eat and an apartment to live in.

With freedom should become responsibility. What good is freedom if people just use it to f**k things up?


Freedom means you have to be repsonsible for your own welfare. Those who cant understand that shouldn't expect me to pay for their welfare really should they?