Sarah Fisher and Forsythe Racing [Archive]

ChicagocrewIRL

24th April 2009, 15:38

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/motor/irl/2009-04-23-fisher-forsythe_N.htm

Since Forsythe has become a consulting firm instead of a race team, Sarah seems to be the perfect client for the wealth of knowledge and experience that their people could provide. This, however, assumes that Forsythe has managed to retain his core people.

I guess in the end it all comes down to funding. Sarah just doesn't give up. She is amazing in that regard.

MDS

24th April 2009, 21:22

Forsythe let a lot of people go, but kept his brain trust intact. I had thought that this team had gone away, but they are still working with Conquest and Sarah Fisher.

They announced an Indy Lights program that didn't come into being this year, and they were said to be working on a sponsorship program for both an ALMS team and an IRL team. One a thing is certain Forsythe won't come in to run last. If he comes in, he will have the best equipment, drivers and crew his sponsors will pay for. He's got too much pride (or anger?) to come into the ICS and run 20th every week.

The biggest rumor I heard is that Forsythe had linked up with Red Bull and was going to run Sebastien Bourdais and another, younger, development driver like Mikhail Aleshin, or possibly Neel Jani or Robert Doornbos. However, when Torro Rosso decided to keep Bourdais, they were no-longer interested in funding an IRL program and backed out of the deal.

RJL25

25th April 2009, 02:26

While Forsythe owned Champcar, he self funded the team through his own company Indeck because he knew that the struggling championship needed the "big names" of Forsythe and Newman Haas in the championship, but when the merger happened, he no longer needed to do this for the good of the sport, so he made the decision to only run if he could find alternative funding to field a competitive team.

So far it hasn't happened, but he wouldn't have kept his race facility and core engineering crew together for no reason at all, and by continuing as a consulting company for other IRL teams, he maintains up to date knowledge of the championship for if/when he returns.

Hopefully it will happen sooner rather then later, another fully competitive team is something this championship could really benefit from.

RJL25

25th April 2009, 02:31

Could you imagine a five way championship battle between the likes of Penske, Ganassi, AGR, NHL and Forsythe? If Forsythe came back with proper funding, and NHL found a proper sponsor for Doornbos's car, it could happen! Throw in the new chassis/engine combination the IRL are working on which hopefully will be awesome and suddenly the glory days of American open wheel racing in the early '90s would no longer seem a distant memory.......

garyshell

25th April 2009, 04:46

After the absolutely low class stunt Forsythe pulled on PT last year he can rot in hell. To be honest, I hope he never fields another team of his own. I am glad to see his employees have jobs assisting other teams, but I really could care less to see his name ever adorn another car again, in any series.

Bitter? You bet your a$$ I am bitter.

Gary

SarahFan

25th April 2009, 05:01

garyshell

25th April 2009, 05:19

Gary.... you going to the 500 this year?

any other races?

I may be going to the 500, probably the Kentucky race as it is right across the river from me, and definitely Mid Ohio. Why do you ask?

Gary

RJL25

25th April 2009, 06:47

Chamoo

25th April 2009, 07:29

by a "low class stunt he pulled on tracy" do you mean not fielding a car even though Paul had a contract? or something else? Because Teams shut down all the time due to a lack of funding, and quite often it involves a driver who had time left on his contract... I don't know why your so bitter about that if that is what you are bitter about... Forsythe had self funded PT's ride for a number of seasons, but he made a decision not to continue self funding the ride, what do you expect that the guy should go broke just to keep PT in a ride? Why can't PT stand on his own two feet and find another drive? He's only had 2 years to find one......

I was going to take a stab at this one, but since it is directed at Garyshell, I'll let him have the first go at you.

RJL25

25th April 2009, 08:30

hey listen I like PT I think he is great for the sport! And if there is something other then Forsythe choosing not to compete in the IRL last year despite PT being under contract then I will immediately retract my comments, however if that IS the issue Garry has, then I do not understand.. race teams close all the time, the Subaru World Rally team closed this year despite both drivers still being under contract, it happens all the time, and particularly if you consider that Forsyth was self funding for so long, this is just a case of a guy no longer willing to self fund the team any longer... nothing wrong with that.

As i said though, if there is something else I am not aware of then I appologise.

Civic

25th April 2009, 11:35

I thought Forsythe didn't want to let PT go to pursue other opportunities. He was probably paid anyways, which would be good to me since I'd love to be paid for doing nothing!

MDS

25th April 2009, 14:14

In Forsythe's defense, at the time they didn't know they weren't going to be racing in a big time series during 2009. The plan was to start a mid-season ALMS team in 2008 and go full time in the ICS in 2009. But the economy went south and none of it happened.

The reason GF kept Paul under contract is because it is easier to build a team if you have "Name" driver in your stable. Especially if you're going after some big Canadian sponsors like Molsen and Air Canada.

I think the plan was to run Paul and James Hinchcliff in the two Canadian races, test like mad (Because part time teams aren't under the same testing restrictions) and come in with guns blazing this year, but honestly, most of us, Gerry included, knew the economy was going south and couldn't justify a $10 million outlay from Indeck to keep the team sponsored during a downturn.

That said, he's still collecting data with Conquest and Fisher, and I honestly thought he'd be in the IRL in 2010, and I don't know anymore. I have an uncle who worked for Forysthe from 1994 until last year. He's retired now, but still hears things from the shop and he tells me Gerry isn't done yet.

Mark in Oshawa

25th April 2009, 15:53

Many of us have issue with the fact that Forsythe kept PT from racing last year. He held on with a death grip PT's service's but he never put the car under him. I understand what Forsythe was trying to do, and he needed PT to have crediblity if he chose to go racing last year, but it was clear that it was almost a bitter need to ruin PT's chances at some point.

Paul was trying desparately to get a ride in NASCAR and wasn't allowed to. In the last year of Champ Car, Gerry could have gotten huge publicity for the series by letting Paul race in the inaugral NASCAR Nationwide series event at Montreal and yet wouldn't. His control over PT is legal, but it was really short sighted. There is no point to hanging onto PT if you have no plans long term for the man's career. At some point, you have to do the right thing for the talent. Paul was loyal to Gerry and never bad mouthed Gerry in a manner that was probably deserved. In short, Paul handled all of this with class and some decorum, but in light of the last two years, who is the loser for all of this? PT. He likely will never be a full time IRL player again and wont get a full time ride likely in NASCAR because this last year, he has been sitting, and 40 year old race drivers who are not behind the wheel all the time are quickly forgotten about and dismissed......

Chamoo

25th April 2009, 16:02

I think Forsythe also kept him under contract to hurt the IRL. He was not in favor of a merger because he thought if they held out another year the IRL would fall.

When it did happen, he held onto PT, but never put a car under him. He wouldn't let him run anything IRL unless it was with him, and at some point, he stopped trying to put a car under him. He began using PT to hurt the IRL by not letting them have him.

Then when PT and TG announced his Edmonton deal for 2008, that same day, Forsythe made headlines by announcing about an hour before the PT/TG press conference that Forsythe Racing would enter a two car team in the FIL series, taking a bit of attention off of the Edmonton press conference.

Basically, since the merger, Gerry has gone out of his way to &#@* the IRL up the tailpipe, and has used PT to do it.

Hoop-98

25th April 2009, 16:16

I think that when we think that we know what they think we are thinking with our dipstick Jimmy ;)

rh

ChicagocrewIRL

25th April 2009, 19:14

According to Davey Hamilton on the IndyCar.com webcast of practice, this second car for Sarah is DOA. There was a drop dead date and it has passed so the second car (Car # 68) will stay idle for the month of May unless Sarah manages to crack up her primary and T car.

SarahFan

25th April 2009, 19:51

I may be going to the 500, probably the Kentucky race as it is right across the river from me, and definitely Mid Ohio. Why do you ask?

Gary
just wonderin if you were hooking for milk and cookies with dfan

garyshell

26th April 2009, 04:52

by a "low class stunt he pulled on tracy" do you mean not fielding a car even though Paul had a contract? or something else? Because Teams shut down all the time due to a lack of funding, and quite often it involves a driver who had time left on his contract... I don't know why your so bitter about that if that is what you are bitter about... Forsythe had self funded PT's ride for a number of seasons, but he made a decision not to continue self funding the ride, what do you expect that the guy should go broke just to keep PT in a ride? Why can't PT stand on his own two feet and find another drive? He's only had 2 years to find one......

No what I am angry about is his holding on to PT all the while knowing he was not going to field a car, robbing Paul of any chance of getting in a car last year. It was a no class action on Forsythe's part. One which I will never understand or forgive. The point was he would not LET Paul stand on his own then.

Gary

garyshell

26th April 2009, 04:56

In Forsythe's defense, at the time they didn't know they weren't going to be racing in a big time series during 2009.

BS. This was all about Forsythe's anger over how the unification went down. He was pissed of and pulled a "I'm taking my marbles and going home" stunt that hurt Paul in the process but good old Gerald didn't give a damn about Paul all he cared about was his own freakin' ego. SOB.

Gary

MDS

26th April 2009, 06:43

BS. This was all about Forsythe's anger over how the unification went down. He was pissed of and pulled a "I'm taking my marbles and going home" stunt that hurt Paul in the process but good old Gerald didn't give a damn about Paul all he cared about was his own freakin' ego. SOB.

Gary

Uhm, I know Gerold, have known him since I was about 12, so I respectfully disagree with your assessment.

And unless Kevin Swieck, another man I know and respect, was lying, I doubt your read on things were correct.

"We've got a Formula Atlantic deal this year and we're planning on going ahead with that, we announced the Indy Lights programme last week and we're looking at both ALMS and the IndyCar Series," he said. "I'd say the ALMS and IndyCar programmes are about 95 percent done."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69310

Again, as I heard it their sponsorship fell apart.

garyshell

26th April 2009, 07:01

Uhm, I know Gerold, have known him since I was about 12, so I respectfully disagree with your assessment.

And unless Kevin Swieck, another man I know and respect, was lying, I doubt your read on things were correct.

If Gerold was not doing what I said, I'd sure like to know why Paul was not released to drive for someone else last year. Are you telling me that Gerold was NOT angry about how the unification came down? What did Swieck say?

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/69310

Again, as I heard it their sponsorship fell apart.

Karma came a knockin'.

Gary

MDS

26th April 2009, 13:33

Paul wasn't released because Gerry was using him as a carrot to attract sponsors

TURN3

26th April 2009, 17:22

Paul wasn't released because Gerry was using him as a carrot to attract sponsors

How does the fact PT filed a lawsuit against GF factor into all of this? Supposedly, he didn't pay PT in full for the final Champ Car season and while having him under contract didn't continue to pay him last year. If he was trying to keep PT under contract then he has an obligation to pay him under the terms of the contract and any other terms within it. Supposedly there was a clause in the contract that required a car and team to race. So regardless of GF's logic, he is in fact an SOB for not upholding a contract.

I too can't believe he has no intention of coming back. Hiring the engineering talent he has (Siewick) and using the Conquest & Fisher deals to collect data is surely not for collectibles.

MDS

26th April 2009, 19:14

His contract with Gerry also required he field PT a car in Champ Car or a series of equal stature.

I'm not a contract lawyer, so I don't understand why there had to be a lawsuit, seems like GF violated it by not crossing over to the IRL, or putting an entry in a NASCAR series for him.

Also, what I never understood is, if Gerry was going to continue to pay PT, why not loan him out to a team like Conquest or HVM while you continue to build your team. That's what I would have tried to do.

garyshell

26th April 2009, 22:18

Paul wasn't released because Gerry was using him as a carrot to attract sponsors

Sorry, I don't believe that for one single nanosecond. I don't doubt it was what you were told, I just don't believe it was the truth. I used to really admire Gerold. But not after last year, I have ZERO respect for him now. And most likely never will again.

Gary

MDS

26th April 2009, 23:43

Sorry, I don't believe that for one single nanosecond. I don't doubt it was what you were told, I just don't believe it was the truth. I used to really admire Gerold. But not after last year, I have ZERO respect for him now. And most likely never will again.

Gary

Whatever, I'm sure Gerry won't lose any sleep over that decision.