A question for NASCAR fans.

[OWFan19]

I made a comment in another thread and some took it the wrong way. But it made me think of asking a few questions.

What do you think of Open Wheel Racing?

Do you watch it?

If not, why?

[cgs]

i used to, but found it boring. i do watch the indy 500 every year though.

[harvick#1]

used to but one person ruined it all, Danica Patrick.

CCWS is a bore, guys are bad drivers, outside of Sebastien

[Sparky1329]

I used to watch CART races now and then but it was boring. I like stock car racing better.

[Hoss Ghoul]

I watch F1, IRL, and CC. Used to enjoy CART immensely.

However compared to U.S. open wheel racing the competition is much tougher in NASCAR, there is greater driver talent, and the caliber of the teams is higher.

I don't think IRL and CC are necessarily any less exciting (as any given race in either series can be more interesting than a given Cup race) other than as excitment relates to the points above.

[BenRoethig]

I used to be primarily an Indycar guy. In my heart I guess I still am. I liked seeing all the different tracks. When the IRL was formed I switched to CART when CART died and the all road course champ car took over I lost interest. I still tune in for the 500, but everything is a shadow of what it was. For the record I think both sides were and still are equally at fault. In my opinion, if a series is all oval or all road course it gets pretty stale and boring. As for F1, I honestly can't stand watching it. It might have the most advanced technology and best people, but the quality of racing is awful.

[Jonesi]

I made a comment in another thread and some took it the wrong way. But it made me think of asking a few questions.
What do you think of Open Wheel Racing?
Do you watch it?
If not, why?

What do you mean by "Open Wheel Racing"?
If you mean Formula Cars, I love it when run correctly. I was calling the cars which ran Indy "Formula USAC" before there was a CART. But I also liked F1, CanAm, IMSA and SCCA sports cars.
If you mean sprint/midget short track stuff, I've watched it some, doesn't really interest me.

[Lee Roy]

I love Formula One. To me it's the pinacle of auto racing. I always watch it on TV, and the USGP was the only race I attended last year. (I've been to all of the USGP's in Indy, and I live on the east coast.)

For American Open Wheel Racing, I used to have a passing interest in CART and the IRL. I used to attend a few of their races. But now that they are a spec car (everyone runs the same car) and use crate engines (an engine provided to everyone by the organization and no teams are allowed to try to improve them) there just isn't anything to interest me in those series anymore. If you don't have either the teams or manufacturers competing to build a better car or better engine, then what's the point?

[call_me_andrew]

I love stock car racing and open wheel racing equally. I don't care if it's F1, NASCAR, CCWS, IRL, go-karts, lawn mowers, horses, or people. I just want to see racing.

[jslone]

To me F1 is not the pinnacle of racing,not any more,if it was,more of the field would have a chance of winning instead of a select few,same with the cars,to me Nascar has the best racing and sports cars have the best technology.

[muggle not]

I made a comment in another thread and some took it the wrong way. But it made me think of asking a few questions.


OK, explain exactly what you meant by your comment in the other thread so that those that took it the wrong way will understnad.

[OWFan19]

I said the racing will be boring. I am tired of the phantom yellow flag for debris. I think restrictor plates make for horrible racing. Commericals every several minutes. The cars go fast, but still lumber compared to the IRL and Champ Car. Sometimes the races are good, but it seems like they drag out over a 5 hour period. It just becomes too much. I use to sit and watch NASCAR all day, but now its the start and the last 10 laps.

[Cole_Trickle]

Like others have said, I used to follow CART closely, but started to lose interest when the car count dropped, oval count dropped, spec chassis/engine (though up until the end of last season that mainly becuase of Reynard going bankrupt), races got boring etc etc...

I've always been a fan of NASCAR, but only got pay TV last year so then was been the first time I've been able to see it other than a few Daytona, Talladega and Indy Races on free-to-air (Australia). I love the massive amount of cars, the bumping and grinding, close racing, the infinite adjustability of the cars, the soft tyres etc etc... and I'm off to see some races next year :D

The debris cautions and some of the 1.5mi tracks can get annoying I'll admit, but those are my only major gripes about the racing.

[dwboogityfan]

Aside from F1, open wheel racing seems really weak to me right now. I love F1 and enjoy both the racing and technology but aside from that watch very little.
I used to watch and enjoy Indycar in the early/mid nineties before the split which has done neither Champ Car or Indy Racing any good. The Indy 500, once the premiere event in all of motorsports is now a laughing stock and has been replaced by the Daytona 500 as Americas great race. I find this saddening for OWR.
NASCAR right now is the only top class level of racing in America. Both Champ Car and IRL seemingly want to be international series but have been struggling. However, of the two I believe Champ Car is making the most progress as a series and is slowly starting to recover. The IRL seems to get worse every season and I doubt it will still exist in 5 years time. Its time for these two warring factions to re-unite and give America the top class OWR series it deserves.

[pdalbey]

As an OW fan, I really appreciate the honesty that the stock car fans have shown in this thread. It seems that this thread comes up on this forum about once a year and it turns into a big p1ssing match with OW fans saying NASCAR is boring taxi-cabs and NASCAR fans saying that rubbin' is racing and there are no American drivers in OW anymore. My personal feeling is that a race fan is a race fan and any series can provide good action. Personally, I enjoy IRL over NASCAR but I certainly have a passing interest in NASCAR and I do watch some of their races. I am also secure enough in my feelings to say that I am completely jealous of NASCAR's success and really hope that OW can get back to that level. Anyone that looks at history objectively will admit that in the early '90, OW and NASCAR were nearly equal in terms of American popularity. Unforutnately, that's not the case anymore. Still, I think that most NASCAR fans are open to OW racing, as indicated by the fact that they show up at Richmond, Kansas, and Chicagolan every year.

[DefStatic]

I made a comment in another thread and some took it the wrong way. But it made me think of asking a few questions.

What do you think of Open Wheel Racing?

Do you watch it?

If not, why?

Honestly, the biggest reason I don't watch most other racing, is because...

A.) Dont have much for local racing other than STOCK/Late Model Here


B.) At least online, a lot of Open Wheel, rally, euro, etc racing fans seem stuck up and snobby, and look down on NASCAR as if its some lower form of society. Doesn't make me want to get into what they are supporting.


C.) A lot of other racing isn't marketed as well, or as accessable in the USA. And believe it or not, a lot of other racing leagues, despite still seeming prestigious and all, are actually not making as much money as say NASCAR in terms of profit.

I do subscribe to SPEED channel, and am trying to learn more and more bout other racing leagues though. Hope everything I said makes sense.

[OWFan19]

I want to first agree with a post that this thread is very civil, and constructive. I have to agree with alot of posts in here.

It seems to me OW has an image problem. Wheter its who the drivers are, What the drivers are, or how the series looks in terms of a business. OW doesnt communicate with motorsports fans.

I dont think the fans are snobs, I think both series have its fair share of stereotypes. And of course the debate on which series has what will never end. I just want the option of enjoying another form of motorsport. And to figure out the why's in hopes that one day I can get the opportunity to change the status quo.

[pdalbey]

OW doesnt communicate with motorsports fans.

There is the complete basis of the problem with OW vs. NASCAR. NASCAR has succeeded because it connects with the fans on a personal level. The fans identify with the drivers and are beyond loyal to them. OW has not been able to have that connection. Unfortunately, it's a bit of a chicken and egg thing that the media won't promote it because of the lack of interest and the lack of interest is because the media doesn't promote it. I don't have any suggestions as to how to fix that problem but I at least recognize that it is a problem. I do find it interesting though to read articles nearly every year in the Richmond newspaper talking to NASCAR fans who are surprised by how exciting IRL races are and are interested in seeing more. This doesn't mean that they are absolving their ties to NASCAR but can actually be interested in different forms of racing. There is room in this country for both types of racing to thrive.

I do abhor the stereotypes that both sides of the racing world have been saddled with. I go not subscribe to the notion that OW fans are elitist, snobbish, wine-and-cheese, free-spending, techno-loving people that look down on other though those people do exist. Similarly, I do not agree that NASCAR fans are inbred, Wal-Mart word, backwoods, Confederate flag-toting southerners they are stereotyped to be. If you look at the crowd actually attending either a NASCAR or IRL race, I think most people will notice that there is a lot of crossover because ultimately, race fans are race fans.

[XM369]

Like many in the Uk i used to be a die hard F1 fan untill i discovered NASCAR a few years back, been to atlanta in 05 and am going to Lowes in may. Personally i would never goto another F1 race, you cant see a thing you only find out who won from the radio on the way home.

The other big problem is the slightest accident and you can loose half the field for the whole race, at least with nascar they get patched up and back out again for points, the whole thing is better managed and more professional in nascar than F1 and you yanks sure know how to put on a great show, loved every minuite of atlanta and i'm sure lowes will be better (especially if #48 wins!!!)

Paul

[jeffmr2]

I was a big F1 fan for years going back to when Mario Andretti was driving the black and gold jps lotus.As time as gone by ive found the racing becoming less and less exciting which ultimately got me into nascar around 2003.Since then ive been to 5 nascar events (7 by end of year).
I saw champcars racing on the oval here in the uk and has a really great time but somehow i think these OW cars are too advanced for ovals and like f1 theres not enough overtaking and for me.
However its all relative and given the choice of watching say f1 or rugby,cricket,golf,american football,ice hockey it would be f1 everytime.

[Pieter Dams]

I used to be a big Champ Car fan in the late 90s, but ever since they started putting all of these Formula 1 rejects in their cars in stead of homegrown talent, I've lost interest. Why get a completely disinteresting guy like Timo Glock, Robert Doornbos or Tonis Katsemis in your car who'll just leave as soon as F1 calls anyway, when outspoken characters like James Hinchcliffe or Alex Barron are left without a ride? I especially resent Newman-Haas for hiring Sebastien Bourdais. He may be a great race car driver but he'll dump the CCWS for F1 as soon as someone offers him a ride. They need to put more North American guys in their cars, who really want to be in the series and who won't leave as soon as they get a chance in a better paying series. It's very import the IRL don't loose Sam Hornish jr to NASCAR the way the CCWS did AJ Allmendinger. Besides, Toyta Atlantic is full of American Open Wheel hopefulls. The only interesting driver in the whole CCWS is Paul Tracy and he's the only reason I still watch their races, now that AJ has decided to give up being a championship contender in Open Wheel and become a well-payed also ran in NASCAR.
I think the IRL does a better job of supporting homegrown talent and creating an interesting mix of ovals, road courses and street circuits (I've been to the GP of St Petersbug a couple of times) but their cars are just butt-ugly. But they do have a lot better and more interesting drivers than their arch rivals. Danica Patrick and Marco Andretti are not only American but also very outspoken and can always be counted upon to make some kind of interesting comment, be it on Eddie Cheever's age of Robbie Gordon's and Bernie Ecclestone's male chauvenism. I also subscribe to Indycar Series magazine and get a better idea of which drivers have interesting personalities and some background on what goes on behind the scenes.
Still, the channels that cover NASCAR do a much better job of providing the fans with everything they need to know about the sport. They have a great pre race show and because of the length of the races they have ample time to explain how stock car racing works. I do think the races are a little too long, but Champ Car's timed events are just amateurish. They have dubious race calls, penalise the wrong drivers and more often than not make a complete fool of themselves when something unexpected happens (like a wet Road America race). Both the IRL and NASCAR are much more professional. To me, the ideal Open Wheel series would have the IndyCar drivers and Paul Tracy racing in Champ Car machinery on a mix of the IRL and Champ Car tracks. But both series definitely need to get rid of their European Formula 1 rejects. It used to be so that you had Formula 1 which was very business like, conceited when it came to picking race tracks and high tech. And on the other side of the universe, you had CART which was all about showmanship and racing on a spectacular mix of street circuits, road courses, short ovals and superspeedways. I wish we could go back to that. Until that time, I have to say that I have more fun watching 43 noisy stock cars racing wheel to wheel with some great characters behind the wheel that go at it both on and off the track and are not too uptight to lend a hand to fix their race cars and spend some time with the fans. These guys race 36 weeks a year and still take part in the Bush series, dirt and sprint racing when the oportunity arises. Those are real race car drivers. I hope American Open Wheel racing will some day get back to that level. Until that time, I'll just keep watching the IRL races and Paul Tracy and, more often than not, keep getting frustrated.

[slorydn1]

I used to be a huge fan. I still watch the Indy 500 every year, religiously, as part of the Sunday Double ( the 500 followed by the Coke 600)....

Other than that, I believe the split killed the sport.

[cyd]

My Dad was a NASCAR fan and I used to laugh at what I perceived as "bumpkin" racing. The first race I ever saw live was F1 at Watkins Glen in.....err, let's just say a few years ago. I went to a couple CART races at Pocono and got really hooked. Then drivers retired and the split happened and I started losing interest. I sort of fell into NASCAR by helping someone do a fanstasy team and became totally hooked. I learned so much from "RPM Tonite" when it was on ESPN with John Kernan and Benny Parsons (R.I.P.) and found all the strategies and interviews really interesting. I was fortunate enough to meet Darrel Waltrip, Jeff Hammond, Junior Johnson and Richard Petty at Goodwood here in the UK---what a thrill!

I think the CART/IRL split has been a disaster for the open wheel series in the US; just take a look at the half-empty stands. Dover tried having IRL for a couple years but ended it because they were only selling about 20,000 tickets. While Danica may be irritating (and the media circus that follows her) I think it's great for the sport. And she's not too shabby of a driver, along with Katherine Legge and Sarah Fisher.

[oily oaf]

I'm a big fan of IRL. I love the gladiatorial aspect of oval racing compared to the bore fest that is F1 and other road based series.
I watched a couple of CART races at Rockingham Motor Speedway a few years back and loved it.
It was bloody cold though :(

[RaikkonenRules]

I watch all kinds of motorsport equally.