How to save USGP@Indy

[call_me_andrew]

I was thinking about this today and I realized the obvious answer: change the track. The oval will seat over 200,000 but most of those seats are too far from the road course to sell. But if we change the road course to use more of the oval, there are more seats to sell. If more seats can be sold, ticket prices would be lower. If ticket prices were lower, then more people could afford to go to the race (very important given the economy). And with no race in Canada, Indy would have a monopoly on Anglo-America.

If Bernie wants $20 million and Tony can sell 200,000 seats at $100 each, then we have a race.

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m315/mustang6172/itry3.jpg

[trumperZ06]

;) I don't think Tony can get enough fans buying tickets to meet the monetary requirements of Ecclestone.

:dozey: Not even with a Good Economy much less current conditions !!!

[goodf1fun]

only arabs have money now to spent in this sport... in 2-3 years it will be arabian F1 :D

[Nikki Katz]

I think that most of that track would be a bit fast for an F1 car. Although part of the twisty bit remains, that's essentially 3/4 of an oval with a little kink in it. F1 cars aren't built to withstand that, and other open-wheel cars have something of a reputation for injury, which I think that modern F1 wants to avoid.

I'm not really sure what the fanbase in America is; are there actually 20,000 people around Indiana that would pay $100 each anyway? But possibly I'm not the best person to ask on that as I'd never consider paying the extortionate fee for the British GP when you can see the whole track on telly for free.

With the current economic climate it's hard to tell what F1 will be like in a few years; personally I think it's more likely that the Brazilian GP will be axed than US and Canada reinstated, though I hope I'm wrong.

[Birdman5700]

I always though it would be smarter to use that backstretch insted of Hulman Blvd. But I think they need to keep the F1 cars off the banking in the turns so I came up with this layout. They would raced in a clockwise direction and it it would be just a little over 3.1 miles long
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g317/jello5700/Other/USGP-1.jpg

I went to the Speedway Museum last weekend and on the bus tour around the track the driver/tour guide said they expect F1 back in 2010 or 11. But im not sure Tony would want to redesign the track for a 3rd time in 10 year.

[wmcot]

I always though it would be smarter to use that backstretch insted of Hulman Blvd. But I think they need to keep the F1 cars off the banking in the turns so I came up with this layout. They would raced in a clockwise direction and it it would be just a little over 3.1 miles long


I would still like to see one banked turn left in, just to make Indy a unique track!

[markabilly]

I think that most of that track would be a bit fast for an F1 car. Although part of the twisty bit remains, that's essentially 3/4 of an oval with a little kink in it. F1 cars aren't built to withstand that, and other open-wheel cars have something of a reputation for injury, which I think that modern F1 wants to avoid.

I'm not really sure what the fanbase in America is; are there actually 20,000 people around Indiana that would pay $100 each anyway? But possibly I'm not the best person to ask on that as I'd never consider paying the extortionate fee for the British GP when you can see the whole track on telly for free.

With the current economic climate it's hard to tell what F1 will be like in a few years; personally I think it's more likely that the Brazilian GP will be axed than US and Canada reinstated, though I hope I'm wrong.


Actually I think they were bring in close to 100k in spectators at usgp---one of the largest crowds for f1

And while not my favorite track by any stretch, it probably has more of the "Bernie-type facilities" than any other track in the world and especially more so than any track in Europe (and esp Great Britain).....but so what....

yeah, more likely brazil will also go.......

[keysersoze]

[quote="call_me_andrew"]
If Bernie wants $20 million and Tony can sell 200,000 seats at $100 each, then we have a race.

So, besides the task of the logistics of holding an F1 race, what does Tony get?

[Roamy]

quote=call_me_andrew;567751]
If Bernie wants $20 million and Tony can sell 200,000 seats at $100 each, then we have a race.

So, besides the task of the logistics of holding an F1 race, what does Tony get?

Pass the bong please

[MrJan]

I've got an idea, let's not save the GP at Indy :p : The track is the suckiest suck fest that ever sucked and is a waste of space. I'm fine with a US GP but please don't let it be at that dull and depressing circuit. Indy is fine for holding the INdy 500 and all that roundy-roundy stuff but as an F1 circuit it is truely abysmal.

[markabilly]

I've got an idea, let's not save the GP at Indy :p : The track is the suckiest suck fest that ever sucked and is a waste of space. I'm fine with a US GP but please don't let it be at that dull and depressing circuit. Indy is fine for holding the INdy 500 and all that roundy-roundy stuff but as an F1 circuit it is truely abysmal.

Don't tell bernie that, his crew designed it and it has all the facilities that he thinks Silverstone should have....

[aryan]

And with no race in Canada, Indy would have a monopoly on Anglo-America.


No it would no. "Anglo"America" by definition includes England, and depending on your definition of the word America, might also include Brazil.

Indy would have a monopoly on North America.

[call_me_andrew]

I think that most of that track would be a bit fast for an F1 car. Although part of the twisty bit remains, that's essentially 3/4 of an oval with a little kink in it. F1 cars aren't built to withstand that, and other open-wheel cars have something of a reputation for injury, which I think that modern F1 wants to avoid.

The only fast parts are at the end of the straights. As long as the turns are slow, safety isn't a problem.


Actually I think they were bring in close to 100k in spectators at usgp---one of the largest crowds for f1

I think the 2007 race was closer to 150k. The first race had about 200k.


No it would no. "Anglo"America" by definition includes England, and depending on your definition of the word America, might also include Brazil.

Indy would have a monopoly on North America.

Yes, it would have a monopoly on North America, but its previous competition for the North American market came from Anglo America.

Furthermore, Anglo America means any country in North or South America where English is the primary language (i.e. United States and Canada). This is opposed to Latin America where Spanish, Portuguese, or French is the primary language.


So, besides the task of the logistics of holding an F1 race, what does Tony get?

Tony gets whatever profit he can make. If he can sell more seats than the minimum to pay Bernie, then he gets profit. If he can sell title sponsor rights, then he can lower the minium number of seats needed to pay Bernie and potentially increase profit.

[jso1985]

Both suggestions in this thread still givea crap track!

I'm 100% with a USGO but please do it somewhere else!

[ShiftingGears]

I was thinking about this today and I realized the obvious answer: change the track. The oval will seat over 200,000 but most of those seats are too far from the road course to sell. But if we change the road course to use more of the oval, there are more seats to sell. If more seats can be sold, ticket prices would be lower. If ticket prices were lower, then more people could afford to go to the race (very important given the economy). And with no race in Canada, Indy would have a monopoly on Anglo-America.

If Bernie wants $20 million and Tony can sell 200,000 seats at $100 each, then we have a race.

http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m315/mustang6172/itry3.jpg

Not a bad layout. Probably sub 1:00 lap times, however.

[ShiftingGears]

I always though it would be smarter to use that backstretch insted of Hulman Blvd. But I think they need to keep the F1 cars off the banking in the turns so I came up with this layout. They would raced in a clockwise direction and it it would be just a little over 3.1 miles long
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g317/jello5700/Other/USGP-1.jpg

I went to the Speedway Museum last weekend and on the bus tour around the track the driver/tour guide said they expect F1 back in 2010 or 11. But im not sure Tony would want to redesign the track for a 3rd time in 10 year.

Cramming the longest configuration into an oval doesn't make it good.

[call_me_andrew]

I figured lap times would be roughly the same. While the average speed would be up, this layout would be about half a mile (roughly 900 meters) longer.

[fan-veteran]

Well, in this particular design on this picture, the speed at the end of the front straight will be over 300 km/h for sure. Then we have a very fast "tamburello style" turn (turn No1 in Indy), then the first short straight (about 340 km/h) and a fast left corner (maybe almost 300 km/h) with some kind of security zone. Quite spectacular IMO ... but too dangerous for F1 world.

[call_me_andrew]

What are you talking about? It's still going clockwise.

[Tallgeese]

The only reason there should be a USGP at Indy is to show the Americans what real machines can do. Without exact estimates, I reckon an IndyCar would be 5-10 seconds behind an F1 car at the infield, & on the oval the F1 car would just tear the competition apart.

[Jag_Warrior]

The only reason there should be a USGP at Indy is to show the Americans what real machines can do. Without exact estimates, I reckon an IndyCar would be 5-10 seconds behind an F1 car at the infield, & on the oval the F1 car would just tear the competition apart.

American racing (sadly) has very little to do with the sophistcation of the machines anymore. Both NASCAR and the IRL are basically spec series which are almost totally personality dependent. IMO, the ALMS is our last, best hope. I don't think F1 has enough of a following here to get 200K people to Indianapolis. Even with $50 general admission tickets, that amount would be a small part of the weekend travel costs for a mostly fly-in crowd. The first USGP at Indy did get a healthy crowd. But once the shine and the newness factor wore off, the crowds steadily declined. IMO, there is more to it than just the track layout (although I agree that the current one is as boring as boring gets).

Not to make this political, but given that the recession seems to be deepening, I question whether George can secure the necessary title sponsorship to make another series of USGP's successful. He and his minions have been talking up title sponsorship for the IRL since the last one left several years ago. But like the many engine manufacturers targeted for 2011, that now seem to be ghosts or fantasies, the IRL doesn't appear to be any closer to a title sponsor today than it was a year ago. Open wheel racing just isn't that popular here (anymore).

To be honest, the more important goal for North America should be to (re)secure the Formula One race in Montreal. You could work on the infield roval at Indy for a decade and it still wouldn't hold a candle to Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, IMO.

[call_me_andrew]

The only reason there should be a USGP at Indy is to show the Americans what real machines can do. Without exact estimates, I reckon an IndyCar would be 5-10 seconds behind an F1 car at the infield, & on the oval the F1 car would just tear the competition apart.

Well an IndyCar team operates on a budget of $5 million per year, and Toyota F1 operates on a budget of $400 million per year. So what you get from a direct comparison would be how you can spend $395 million and only get 5-10 seconds for it.

Indy always had a healthy crowd, but unlike other F1 tracks, all the viewing areas are stadium seating. Even if 125,000 (roughly the seating capacity of Silverstone or Hockenheim) people show up, the place still looks empty on TV. The opposite effect would be Sebring which has very little permanent seating. 100,000 people could show up there and you would never notice it on TV.

[markabilly]

American racing (sadly)

To be honest, the more important goal for North America should be to (re)secure the Formula One race in Montreal. You could work on the infield roval at Indy for a decade and it still wouldn't hold a candle to Circuit Gilles Villeneuve, IMO.


Or work on the infield and all the rest of the track for two hundred years, and it would not hold a candle to L Seca.....and that ain't opion, that is FACT.

so to make my dream come true, each night I will light a candle and in maybe two hundred years, it will come true....

So much for the "purists" of f1......if it were not for the sponsors and the ambience of the off-track stuff at Monaco, that track woiuld have been gone a long time ago....