Economic downturn

[schmenke]

How bad are things currently in your neck of the woods? Has the current global (dare I say) recession affected you or your family? Has your employment and/or income been affected?

The oil and gas industry is what drives the provice of Alberta's economy and we have been enjoying an economic boom during the last few years. However, the economy has taken a complete 180 deg. turn in the last couple of months. Many of the petro-companies here have recently announced the cancelation of several $ billions of capital investment in the province. I work for an engineering services company that has gone from a hiring binge to potential lay offs in the upcoming weeks :mark: . Fortunately, my job is secure, for now.

[Hazell B]

Well, it's made no real change to my takings at market, but plant, shrub and tree sales have stopped two months early. A few of my customers for pet food have lost their jobs though (mainly construction based) so it will get worse for me as a result, perhaps.

My partner is sure his job is safe, but I think not. He makes glass for large buildings (6m long, 3m high and so on) and I feel new office blocks and luxury homes will soon stop being built elsewhere, not just here in the UK.

I have noticed a steep drop in quality at all auctions, so people are selling their unwanted tat rather than dealing in genuine good stuff. Silver's almost free at the moment as everyone's cashing in jewellery for the melting pot. Few nice but useless items are selling for their real value.

Farmers are selling up fast, too. Land prices are down a bit and no new farmers are coming in to the job in many areas - yet normal people are buying land as an investment (rather than houses or whatever) and letting it lie uncropped. That's going to end up making our imports a bit higher and add long-running problems once the economy gets going again.
Plus the dolts buying land with no use for it will lose money :laugh:

[GridGirl]

The economic downturn hasn't directly affected my. I have a decent job, an affordable mortgage and an uneconomincal car that I can still afford. I know I'm lucky. :)

At work I spent pretty much all of the summer working in our pensions department due to a staff shortage and having previous experience. If I were to be given just 0.0001% of the fall I've seen in the value of pensions funds I'd still be a multi-millionaire. Only the Asia excluding Japan market seemed to be making any gains and theres not much investment there anyway. The investment reports were down right depressing and most of the minutes were detailing planned staff cut backs.

Now I'm out of pensions and I dont think I've seen so many bank requests to see if clients are breaking the covenants placed upon their lending. Although, to be honest its not the companies that I'm most worried about as it's my charity clients that are stuggling most. When times are tough I guess charity starts in your own home and not that of others. :(

[gloomyDAY]

Well the bad times has hit our family like a freight train.

My dad was laid-off earlier this year. He was a machine operator for a fiber glass company and worked there for almost 20 years. It happened around March and I remember coming back from the WRC event in Mexico and being surprised that my dad was home on a weekday. That's when he broke the news, so ever since we've been struggling.

My mom works at Disneyland's main hotel. She may have to get her hours cut back since there's going to be an enormous drop-off in vacationers next year.

My job is somewhat safe, but my new boss is troublesome. She micromanages every movement that I make at the bank and it rides my nerves. Most likely I will have to leave or I'll get fired. Either way my time at the bank has a fixed number of days.

As for the future? Who knows? I'm definitely going to buy a gun (http://dynamicarmament.com/items/long-guns%7Eshotguns/ruger-long-guns/mini-30-7-62x39-ss-syn-18-5-rukmini30-p-detail.htm) and that's one thing I know is certain.

[Drew]

Yes, quite a bit. A few months ago £1 was €1.3 or thereabouts and now it's €1.18, so all of a sudden I've technically lost a bit of money. Then I of course had quite a bit of savings in an icesave account, which left me extremely short, so much I almost had to quit university or somehow manage to get a job and study at the same time.

Although I don't really think Italy has payed much attention to this talk about a credit crunch, they carry on striking every week you know :p :

[Daniel]

I'm not sure if there's been much of an impact on me. I had to leave my job at Christmas last year due to my work visa running out. Got that sorted in May and it did take me a little while to find a job but that was mainly down to me being a tad lazy, Caroline being on holiday for 6 weeks and me selling Wii Fits on ebay for a good profit which kept a bit of money coming in for a while :) The shares I bought in the company i worked for last year are worth very little now but they'll rebound I'm sure and if they don't then it's no great deal to be honest. I do think jobs are getting a lot more difficult to find though. I'm just hoping once I'm finished temping here I can get another temp job or perhaps get a job here :mark:

My parents are both still working and no one else in my family has lost their job yet :)

For me as long as I find myself some permanent work I think this may end up being a positive thing as we're looking to move into a nicer house which is a bit bigger and has nice views and a double garage which we probably wouldn't have been able to afford had house prices taken a tumble.

Hope the ride isn't too rough for everyone on the forum :)

[cdn_grampa]

How bad are things currently in your neck of the woods? Has the current global (dare I say) recession affected you or your family? Has your employment and/or income been affected?

The oil and gas industry is what drives the provice of Alberta's economy and we have been enjoying an economic boom during the last few years. However, the economy has taken a complete 180 deg. turn in the last couple of months. Many of the petro-companies here have recently announced the cancelation of several $ billions of capital investment in the province. I work for an engineering services company that has gone from a hiring binge to potential lay offs in the upcoming weeks :mark: . Fortunately, my job is secure, for now.

I'm curious - is this mainly due to oil sands projects being put in limbo ??

Without a lot of detail - highrise / condo projects in and around Vancouver are being delayed / cancelled supposedly due to difficulty in additional financing. Hard to judge how many "greater fools" still think the 2010 winter olympics will save their a$$.

[cdn_grampa]

Additional stuff - I went to 50% cash a good while ago then in mid sept. went to 60% cash - thank goodness. Problem now is - what to do - once companies start [ about now ] reporting 3rd quarter earnings and probably announce dividend / distribution cuts then where do prices go ?? How does one keep from becoming the "greater fool" ?? Rhetorical question.

Really hard to make any logical choices right now. But since when was there anything logical about stock markets.

[Roamy]

How bad are things currently in your neck of the woods? Has the current global (dare I say) recession affected you or your family? Has your employment and/or income been affected?

The oil and gas industry is what drives the provice of Alberta's economy and we have been enjoying an economic boom during the last few years. However, the economy has taken a complete 180 deg. turn in the last couple of months. Many of the petro-companies here have recently announced the cancelation of several $ billions of capital investment in the province. I work for an engineering services company that has gone from a hiring binge to potential lay offs in the upcoming weeks :mark: . Fortunately, my job is secure, for now.


I am so far in the fuching tank they have to pump sunlight to me.
If it cost a nickel to go around the world I couldn't get out of sight

other than that it is just peachy

[Tazio]

Sucking air over here! :( Like Gramps luckily my assets are mostly in Legal Tender. If development remains stagnant in Southern Ca., I’ll be selling toys by 2010.

[Rudy Tamasz]

Increasing cost of living is the biggest problem of our family. But then I hope this cloud will have a silver lining for us. In our country the gov't has built a bulky and costly welfare system, which feeds nicely a lot of lazy folks. If that system falls apart, the purchasing capacity of many people will fall sharply, prices will have to fall, at least in some segments of the market and I hope I will be able to buy some property pretty cheap. Let see if this pet theory of mine works.

[Storm]

How bad are things currently in your neck of the woods? Has the current global (dare I say) recession affected you or your family?

It has affected the media and the stock market more so than anybody else..Photos of share brokers holding their heads are common in the newspapers as the BSE Sensex has collapsed from around 20k to 8.5k during this year on just "fears of recession".

If you had headed into the old town centre here around Diwali you would have been crazy to even say the word recession though.....there were queues just to get into the shops!

[Camelopard]

As I work for the gov dept that administers welfare payments my job is going to get busier! I was intending to retire in 18 months although I'll probably have to reconsider that now, mind you I could just make my wife work untill she is 65!

From a purely selfish point of view I can't see us going overseas next year as the aussie dollar has dropped significantly against the euro. We had hoped to go to Rally Poland, now we might have to make do with Rally Australia even is connelly is in charge of it. :mad:

[leopard]

Not sure that this thing is going worse or better. I am getting used to have out dinner on my way home from work. I found its price now increased nearly twice than that of last year or so. I can still do it every other day to spend the same amount of money as used to be. This could mean purchasing power on the same food went down, but from food court owner point of view this situation will give them advantage from selling food at higher price.

[cdn_grampa]

More errata:

Currently all I can think of doing is watching trade volumes - the no more buyers or sellers syndrome. I hate jargon but the oft mentioned "capitulation". No signs of it yet on the TSX which I almost exclusively invest in. Got caught by the currency risk,C$ vs. US$,with the Q's [ NASDAQ 100 ] a while back - got out even but it took two years to do it.

Four investment kinds of risk:

Capital risk. Interest rate risk. Currency risk. Government/political risk.

Guess which is the most dangerous and unpredictable. I have lost track of how much money has been "printed" by central banks lately - ?? $3 trillion so far ?? Central banks - what a farce.

Re: signs of consumer pullback on discretionary spending.
On a micro level - I have two 13 yr old grandkids in BMX - we just finished our first "section" of indoor - I expected to see a reduction in entries - there was no discernible difference from last year. Maybe it's to soon since the Oct. meltdown for it to register with people. And yet oodles of retail stores are being closed. I just don't get it - yet.

Iit is just after closing right now - North American markets have taken another ~ 5% - 6% hit today. Will be interesting to look at DJ / NASDAQ / S&P futures later on tonight:

http://money.cnn.com/data/premarket/ --->>> "After-Hours"

Enough for now - gets confusing and not fun.

[MrJan]

Me, my brother and my old man are all involved in the construction industry so things are a bit shakey. My brother seems to have landed on his feet, came back after 18 months doing sod all in Toronto and walked into a cushy job with good pay.

My old man is less lucky. He is in his late 50s and works for a company which has just announced 450 job losses. He thinks that he will be out of a job by the end of this week and is obviously worried about being re-employed elswhere (who wants someone near retirement when you can have a 26 year old with the same qualifications?).

I'm actually fairly busy at the moment. Because it's just me and my boss he seems to be saying yes to any work that is sent his way due to being worried that it'll all dry up. Undoubtedly work is a bit slower but this time last year was dead and you always have down periods.

[schmenke]

I'm curious - is this mainly due to oil sands projects being put in limbo ??....

Yep. Once again the adminstrators of this province have put all their eggs in one basket. With the oilsands industry quickly applying the brakes there is precious little to fall back onto. Alberta will soon feel the effects of this downturn far worse than any other province, including Ontario.
I have a buddy who works for Petro-Canada and they have just announced their first round of terminations...

Price per barrel is now < $50.00 :mark:

[Hazell B]

Me, my brother and my old man are all involved in the construction industry so things are a bit shakey.


Some business bod in the City claimed about 30% of those employed in construction either directly or indirectly would lose their jobs by 2010's end last week. Looking at home sales and failing small firms who rent office space in this area, I'd say he's not far wrong.

We've been planning a self build for six months but have decided not to even put in for the planning permission yet, even though we have all the finances sorted :(

[cdn_grampa]

Breaking News !!

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20081121.WBstreetwise20081121112035/WBStory/WBstreetwise

[52Paddy]

I work for a courier company (push-bike) but it is only temporarily. I will be going to college in September 2009 and this is a year to take a break, and save for college fees and accommodation.

I'm technically self employed and on commission so, naturally, I have bad weeks and good weeks. Still living with parents, I never really need a lot of money because I don't pay any bills. I hand money up to my parents, pay my brother for buying me a bike and save in the credit union. Around this time of year, things usually begin to get busy. This week was great for me but before that it had been very quiet. One of the base controllers had been laid off and that meant more couriers had been merged on bases (i.e. there would be less jobs available for everyone.) One of the couriers left, another got fired and others are contemplating leaving (or pretending to contemplate...)

I'll stick with the job until next summer. I just hope that when I go to college I won't fall into difficulty and will be able to sustain myself over the four years in it. I'm not expecting to be able to afford a car or fashionable clothes (probably have to give nights out a miss and beg for ciggies too!!) but as long as I can make a living of sorts and get by I'll be happy. Hopefully the recession will not affect this too much.

On the subject of Citibank, 2 employees have been laid off in the Dublin Citibank in the IFSC (Irish Financial Services Centre.) Also our government says it will have to borrow €700 billion next year just to 'stay afloat.' Not good for our general economy so :mark:

[MrJan]

Some business bod in the City claimed about 30% of those employed in construction either directly or indirectly would lose their jobs by 2010's end last week. Looking at home sales and failing small firms who rent office space in this area, I'd say he's not far wrong.

We've been planning a self build for six months but have decided not to even put in for the planning permission yet, even though we have all the finances sorted :(

Well if it's only 30% then I'm in the clear. My Dad was made redundant today :( Still there seem to be a few things around for him to do, it's just getting to them first :)

[Garry Walker]

Well, I run a property company and it is safe to say that for real estate brokers, money doesn`t come by as easily as it did even in 2007. Thankfully, unlike quite a few companies who got too greedy, I knew not to get involved in too many new development projects, so it is not that bad.
Won`t be giving or getting any bonuses this year though :rotflmao:

[Tazio]

Sucking air over here! :( Like Gramps luckily my assets are mostly in Legal Tender. If development remains stagnant in Southern Ca., I’ll be selling toys by 2010.And so it begins. I sold my ALFA today. :( A passerby gave me a compliment on it.
I asked him if he wanted to buy it! Next thing I knew I was handing him the keys.
Funny it was the same scenario when I bought it in 2000. This guy is an ultra-wrench that knows
Italian sport cars inside-out, and every other way! Plus it needed work I didn't see myself doing!
I'm going to miss "Celeste"
My daughter named her :(

[Mark]

I'm going to miss "Celeste"
My daughter named her :(

Nice name. My fiancee named my new car 'Jim' :p

[MrJan]

I gave my car a name the other day when the door handle came off in my hand. I think it was:


"You useless f***ing piece of f***ing Japanese f***ing Honda s***" :D

[leopard]

Nice name. My fiancee named my new car 'Jim' :p

I forgot my girlfriends' name.

[Tazio]

Nice name. My fiancee named my new car 'Jim' :p Here is the irony!
Celeste is a custom ALFA color (Aqua Metallica) my daughter was taking intermediate Italian in Junior College Before I found the window sticker that was included in service records longer than the Old Testament that the original owner gave me. I asked her what she thought the color would be (in Italian) I said "some kind of Verdi", to which she replied "Dad Italians wouldn’t call a car like that green! It's probably something like “Celeste" She was most likely high on pot. I told her that although the color was not Celeste I would christen it so :p :

[schmenke]

Mine is called "POS" :mark:

[555-04Q2]

Worldwide times are tough, but we are pretty secure over here in little old South Africa. Our government has excess budgets for the next two to three years, our economy has slowed slightly but nowhere near a reccession. The main concern for most people is the constant increase in the cost of living.

What is good news though, is these are the times when smart people make sh!tloads of money, while others lose millions.

[J4MIE]

I've just been offered a new contract at work so I must be doing something right (surprisingly!). Still crap money though :(

[jim mcglinchey]

[quote="555-04Q2"], our economy has slowed slightly but nowhere near a reccession. The main concern for most people is the constant increase in the cost of living.

yeah, thats how it started here too.

[BeansBeansBeans]

I work in the construction industry, so it is a bit of a worry. I'll definitely be alright in the short term (next six months) but after that, who knows. My commision is down about £200 per month, so I'm having to tighten my belt.

[555-04Q2]

[quote="555-04Q2":1eeeltds], our economy has slowed slightly but nowhere near a reccession. The main concern for most people is the constant increase in the cost of living.

yeah, thats how it started here too.[/quote:1eeeltds]

We're not aligned to the US's problems the way the rest of the "Western" world is. We dont have virtual money, ala USA style, we have real money in our pockets. We still have a booming construction industry, solid banking system (probably one of the top 5 in the world actually), excess budgets etc.

Times will be tough over here in 2009, as with everywhere else, but not as bad as the majority of the world is going to find times in 2009. We personally made serious money this year and already have our order book filled for the first 8 months of 2009 with 50% deposits secured.

[Hazell B]

Last sunday the market I attend (which is about 60% retailers like me, 40% car boot sellers) was packed with people selling their goods. One woman was selling her entire wardrobe of clothes not worn very often, such as formal dresses and coats, for a quid an item. Idiot - she had paid £15 for a stall, plus petrol to get there, and was in a car she told me cost her over £300 a month on finance.

Send back the car and keep your clothes, dipstick :rolleyes:

[Daniel]

Last sunday the market I attend (which is about 60% retailers like me, 40% car boot sellers) was packed with people selling their goods. One woman was selling her entire wardrobe of clothes not worn very often, such as formal dresses and coats, for a quid an item. Idiot - she had paid £15 for a stall, plus petrol to get there, and was in a car she told me cost her over £300 a month on finance.

Send back the car and keep your clothes, dipstick :rolleyes:
Yeah but if she sends the car back and moves to a smaller house then she'll be a nobody! A nobody I tell you!

Hazell, this would be a good time to buy an Audi cheaply so you can tailgate people and look a knob in general on the cheap :p Not all Audi drivers are knobs of course! Just most of them! :D

[Drew]

Last sunday the market I attend (which is about 60% retailers like me, 40% car boot sellers) was packed with people selling their goods. One woman was selling her entire wardrobe of clothes not worn very often, such as formal dresses and coats, for a quid an item. Idiot - she had paid £15 for a stall, plus petrol to get there, and was in a car she told me cost her over £300 a month on finance.

Send back the car and keep your clothes, dipstick :rolleyes:

This is when the smart people get paid back! :D

[GridGirl]

She surely can't have been selling her clothes before getting rid of the car? :s Besides if they were decent clothes why sell them on a car boot for a quid when you can get alot more on ebay? :s When I go to formal doo's and the like I buy brands like Coast and then sell whatever I've bought on ebay afterwards. If you do your research and buy the right dress, your killer outfit will go down a storm and you might even be in profit afterwards. The woman sounds like a right moron. :confused:

[schmenke]

...I buy brands like Coast and then sell whatever I've bought on ebay afterwards...

Do you wash them first? :p :

[GridGirl]

No, you can't just wash a good quality formal dress....men! :rolleyes: I get them dry cleaned when I take in my workwear and make sure they are my 5th and free item. :D Urghh, I just realised how much money I could save if I didn't take my suits to the dry cleaners. If the credit crunch hits me at least I now know where I can save money before I resort to actually selling my clothes. :p

[Mark in Oshawa]

I can tell you that even my industry which is usually chronically short of drivers is now not really short at all. There has been a lot of contraction in the trucking industry in North America. The good news is, the company I work for is also a warehousing company for generic brand diapers, paper products, over the counter drug products, generic kitchen brands of non-food products and basically a warehousing for stuff that most families cannot do without. So I will have a job. The sad news is that isn't enough to keep ALL the trucks moving all the time, so now I am facing less miles and more crap work when there isn't something for our company on the truck. We have to source some of our loads off of load brokers or from other companies...and it is getting harder and harder.

Lucky for me, my wife is a Dental Hygienst. It is recession proof to be in the health industry...at least so far.

Schmenke. Too many people in your part of the world keep getting sucked into this world is great deal when the price is going up. The price of oil was driven up by speculators and when the recession hit, demand flat lined. It was long overdue and while I hate seeing people being laid off, I do think a few greedy sods out your way need this kick right in the teeth.

I do know that the oilsands being mothballed is only temporary until the price of oil scoots back up but from what I have read, once oil dips below 50 bucks US a barrel, it isn't economical to be in Fort Mac no more....

[jens]

Economic downturn hasn't had direct (negative) influence on me yet as actually things have gone upwards - I have recently found a job, which I hope to use as a platform for greater future experiences. Looking at the positive side, every low also creates some new opportunities. In some areas prices are falling, so if possible, it would be good to try to make the most of this situation.

[BDunnell]

Economic downturn hasn't had direct (negative) influence on me yet as actually things have gone upwards - I have recently found a job, which I hope to use as a platform for greater future experiences. Looking at the positive side, every low also creates some new opportunities. In some areas prices are falling, so if possible, it would be good to try to make the most of this situation.

Excellent news for you!

[Hazell B]

She surely can't have been selling her clothes before getting rid of the car? :s

Yep, she was. Oddly, we've also had a rash of Merc owners setting up their first ever car boot stalls in recent weeks. One of them arrived in the dark and parked right over the front of my stall and when I explained he was about ten yards outside the correct areas, he told (yes, told!) me to fetch him the parking attendant straight away. Bless, he thought car boot sales have valet parking :laugh:


Besides if they were decent clothes why sell them on a car boot for a quid when you can get alot more on ebay?

That's what I asked her, though I didn't really know much about ebay's used clothes sections as I've never seen them. She said she couldn't be bothered and just wanted some easy cash now. That's how short sighted some people are - I bought a Marks & Spencer wool dress coat from her as it was still tagged and wrapped for a quid. They're £179.99 and still in stock now! Frankly I was tempted to take it back to Marks and say I'd lost the reciept!
Being honest, I didn't .... but half wish I had :p :

[schmenke]

...Schmenke. Too many people in your part of the world keep getting sucked into this world is great deal when the price is going up. The price of oil was driven up by speculators and when the recession hit, demand flat lined. It was long overdue and while I hate seeing people being laid off, I do think a few greedy sods out your way need this kick right in the teeth.

I do know that the oilsands being mothballed is only temporary until the price of oil scoots back up but from what I have read, once oil dips below 50 bucks US a barrel, it isn't economical to be in Fort Mac no more....

The "Oil Patch" has always been a boom-'n-bust economy. The sad part is that many people here, including IMO the government, took the recent "boom" years for granted and now reality has hit them like a slap in the face. In some ways this downturn is a good thing. This province has been suffering from a shortage of quality labour (both trades and professionals) so we've forced to hire less-than-stellar performers and as a consequence the quality of our work suffered. The non-performers are now the first to go...
Also, the housing market here has been out of control with property values waaaaay over-priced. Things have now settled to more reasonable levels.

P.s. I had to cancel my teeth-cleaning appointment this morning 'cause of the weather :p :

[schmenke]

...Frankly I was tempted to take it back to Marks and say I'd lost the reciept!
Being honest, I didn't .... but half wish I had :p :

Sell it on e-bay :D

[Easy Drifter]

Ont. has gone from a have Prov. to a have not and now receive equalization payments. Then there is Quebec! Nuf said! Cdns. understand.
Ont. has lost many thousands of jobs in forestry and now construction is slowing. The auto sector is in dire straights although the Japanese plants are doing OK. The big three kept building cars the public didn't want.
Before we sold our business (whew) we had a GMC pickup and a GMC van both 2005 models. Both had design problems that were years old. The pickup had what could have been an arm rest between the seats but it didn't fold down. It was upholstered and cut to fold but that was a $700 option! A hinge and a latch for $700?
We traded them in on a deal for a pair of 2007 Cobalts (off GM fleet rental). They seem to be pretty good cars but have cheap no weather tires and a design flaw for snow country. The wipers go into a well which packs with snow and ice. If the wipers do not retract properly they stop working until you clear the well. Great fun beside a busy highway in a blizzard. The Cobalt has been around for how many years?
We did not do too badly on the van but got hammered on the truck. Vans are basically work vehicles but pickups are often more toys, especially for kids. Times get tough but vans are still needed. Pickups nah.
Much as I hate govt. involvement they have to rescue the big three here and in the US. It is not just the thousands of employees of the companies but many thousands more who work for companies supplying them.
In the meantime the banks, who are still very profitable in Canada have tightened up credit big time and raised credit card fees. They are not even passing on the full cuts made to prime by the Bank of Canada who has also guaranteed a huge percentage of their mtge loans.
Right now the majority of strikes in this country are by Govt. workers or those in the public sector.
Many unions are balking at pay cuts or concessions. Duh. Would you rather take a pay cut or be out of work?
E-Bay here has slowed down and Canada Post is yet again jacking their parcel rates which hurts E-Bay sellers. It is far more expensive to ship in Canada than the US. Rev Canada has also won a court case forcing E-Bay to reveal the names and details of those who sell over a $1000.00 a month.
Ont. Public School teachers just rejected a 9% raise over 3 years. They want the raise plus equal prep time with high school teachers and other perks.
At least the Catholic Pubic School teachers and both high school teachers unions have accepted the Govt. offer.
York University support staff have walked demanding all sorts of perks plus increased salaries. The balance of 2008 is cancelled and the whole school year may be lost if a settlement isn't reached soon. 50,000 students may lose a year at what cost to the ecomomy? U of T staff are threating to go out. It is an even larger University.
Ah the heck with it. Time to get a drink!!!

[Daniel]

Paragraphs please :p

[GridGirl]

I got the dreaded potential redundancy letter tonight when I picked up my post. It's not suprising though as so many firm's in the industry I work in have got rid of many people already. Just great. :(

[Daniel]

I got the dreaded potential redundancy letter tonight when I picked up my post. It's not suprising though as so many firm's in the industry I work in have got rid of many people already. Just great. :(
Sorry to hear that! :(

[Hazell B]

.... potential redundancy letter .....

Let us hope it doesn't become actual redundancy.

Out of interest, does anyone know the real cost to firms of making somebody redundant? I know they quoted £16k on the news recently but that's including all the average costs for everyone - including massive appeals for wrongfull and so on - so in no way reflects the true sum.
Just like average house prices included twenty million quid homes a few years ago and were miles off the real cost, I expect 16k is about two and a half or three times the genuine average?

[Mark in Oshawa]

Sorry to hear about you being laid off Grid Girl. It isn't fun I know that.

In my industry, things are slowing down a lot BUT things have to move. That said, I have been sitting home this week awaiting something to do and I wont sit much longer. Some trucking companies have freight.....just not enough at mine.

I was offered a trip to Louisana leaving tomorrow (Wed.) but I would be sitting down there over the weekend hoping to find something to bring back and dispatch and the company would have to pay me layover. That wasn't going to happen....

[steve_spackman]

Sorry to hear about you being laid off Grid Girl. It isn't fun I know that.

In my industry, things are slowing down a lot BUT things have to move. That said, I have been sitting home this week awaiting something to do and I wont sit much longer. Some trucking companies have freight.....just not enough at mine.

I was offered a trip to Louisana leaving tomorrow (Wed.) but I would be sitting down there over the weekend hoping to find something to bring back and dispatch and the company would have to pay me layover. That wasn't going to happen....

i was going to go and drive the big rigs for the oil companies, but they have started to lay people off down this end...shame as its bloody good money.

i did work in the oil gas industry but the company i work for stopped the drilling...something to do with the US elections and Obama

[Mark in Oshawa]

Spackman, the price of oil is going back up. Obama will be good for the gas and oil industry if he does what he originally wanted to do, that is artificially restrict the price of gasoline and drive it up. What that will do to the price of oil may drive it up and in the end, that is good if you work in the oilfields. Believe me....this low price per barrel is great for the consumer but sucks if you are working in an oil field where it isn't profitable to take it out of the ground for less than 40 dollars a barrel.

[steve_spackman]

Spackman, the price of oil is going back up. Obama will be good for the gas and oil industry if he does what he originally wanted to do, that is artificially restrict the price of gasoline and drive it up. What that will do to the price of oil may drive it up and in the end, that is good if you work in the oilfields. Believe me....this low price per barrel is great for the consumer but sucks if you are working in an oil field where it isn't profitable to take it out of the ground for less than 40 dollars a barrel.

true very true Oshawa, but some oil gas companies down my end are laying people off left right and centre...worried about what may happen..a little short sighted if you ask me?

[Mark in Oshawa]

true very true Oshawa, but some oil gas companies down my end are laying people off left right and centre...worried about what may happen..a little short sighted if you ask me?

It is more about the price of oil dropping with demand dropping. Give the OPEC nations time to cut the production back and the price goes back up. They are short sighted but then again they wouldn't be the only ones in this economic malaise. When it comes to the oil business, it is about supply and demand in the end...whether anyone wants to believe it or not.

[GridGirl]

I'm not being laid off yet...well I hope not. We get to find out the departments where people will be going from tomorrow. I think I'll be fine for now but it's still not a good start to the year. There are only about 110-120 people at the firm I work for so either way I'll know everyone that ends up going. :(

My step-dad is a truck driver and he was forced to have an extended Christmas break. He'll also be temporsrily laid off for 'week' on statutory redundancy pay. My brother is an engineer and he'll be going on a four day week soon too. Urghhh

[Mark]

I'm not being laid off yet...well I hope not. We get to find out the departments where people will be going from tomorrow. I think I'll be fine for now but it's still not a good start to the year. There are only about 110-120 people at the firm I work for so either way I'll know everyone that ends up going. :(


Argh! Rubbish! Although I'm sure someone with your skills will have no problem finding alternative work if it comes to that, but probably at a lower salary level I guess.

Or you could go freelance much like wor Karen has done. Perhaps time to set up in Leeds? :p

[Dave B]

Here's hoping that "potential" doesn't turn in to "actual". All the best :) :up:

[Fred Basset]

No mention of the 27 M&S stores that are closing or the 400 jobs Barclays are shedding that were announced today?

[Mark]

No mention of the 27 M&S stores that are closing or the 400 jobs Barclays are shedding that were announced today?

If you want something to be mentioned then mention it. Don't moan about nobody else mentioning it!

M&S are only closing two full sized stores btw, the rest are food only shops.

[Fred Basset]

A store is a store is a store. Where do i say "full size"?
Over a 1000 jobs is a big hit

[Daniel]

A store is a store is a store. Where do i say "full size"?
Over a 1000 jobs is a big hit
Mark was merely saying that they're only small stores.... yes 1000 jobs is a big hit but at least it will help secure M+S's future.

[Mark]

A store is a store is a store.

No, it's not. A small concession employing a handful of people cannot be considered the same as a large department store employing over a hundred.

[Fred Basset]

1200 M&S jobs seems a lot to me hence a store is a store is a store

[Daniel]

1200 M&S jobs seems a lot to me hence a store is a store is a store

That's you opinion. Good for you. No one's forcing you to not think 1000+ jobs isn't a lot. You seem to have issues with people not outwardly and openly agreeing with your every word :confused: Why is that?

[Fred Basset]

Ummm no i don't have an issue at all. I stated a fact that 1200 is a lot of people. Now Daniel, i've broken my rule twice now of not conversing with you and i'm not planning on it happening again as it appears your still crying to people on a regular basis..so talk to yourself by all means as this fish ain't biting

[Daniel]

so talk to yourself by all means as this fish ain't whinin' no more

Good stuff :)

[Hazell B]

Are we allowed to misquote somebody like that?
It's not nice, however annoying somebody is being.

Anyway, Marks and Spencer will, I think, be one of the ones to vanish this year or early next. They've signed to buy several million quids' worth of green energy supplies, some new buildings and certain brands - contracts I'm pretty sure they can't back out of now - plus sales are lower in profit now. Other retailers offer equally good, yet more fashionable, clothes at far lower prices and smaller department stores have all the top brands M&S are used to grabbing the market in.

In short, they remind me of Woolworths sadly.

[Daniel]

Are we allowed to misquote somebody like that?
It's not nice, however annoying somebody is being.

Anyway, Marks and Spencer will, I think, be one of the ones to vanish this year or early next. They've signed to buy several million quids' worth of green energy supplies, some new buildings and certain brands - contracts I'm pretty sure they can't back out of now - plus sales are lower in profit now. Other retailers offer equally good, yet more fashionable, clothes at far lower prices and smaller department stores have all the top brands M&S are used to grabbing the market in.

In short, they remind me of Woolworths sadly.

I was merely making a point Hazell. I was quite happy to see Fred come back, honestly. But all he seems to have done since he's come back is moan and complain about the forums and how crap the posters and mods are here and so on and so forth.

Getting back on topic you could be right about M&S but I would think that with their large and fairly loyal customer base they'd be fairly secure but who know. I would have said Wedgewood/Waterford would be safe as well being a recognised name :crazy:

They don't remind me of Woolworths. At least I'd buy some of the stuff they do :p

[Fred Basset]

I was merely making a point Hazell. I was quite happy to see Fred come back, honestly. But all he seems to have done since he's come back is moan and complain about the forums and how crap the posters and mods are here and so on and so forth.



To make a point is not to go around altering someones comments to stir Danny..

Show me the links where i complained about posters and Mods???
Yeah i made an observation about how the forum had changed in the 3 years or so i was missing but sorry, never knew that was in the rules that you can't observe, At least i don't go around altering peoples words just to carry on digging like the little stirrer you are... You havn't changed have you

Anyway, thats the rule i made broken 3 times never to converse with you again but hey, i'm not having "inaccurate" facts said about me

Cheerio

[Daniel]

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=569690#post569690

For one, then your rant about how crap the UK is and the fact that you then went on to tell numerous people who live here and are happy with it how crap it is.

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=130667

This post pretty much sums up your prevous life on the forum and your current one as well and not even from one of the people with 10,000+ posts!
http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=560079&postcount=20

You know I was really quite happy to see you back. People seem to like you and I thought "let bygones be bygones" I even suggested to Mark that he give you another "t" on your name for olde times sake but all you've done since you've got back is spout about how crap the UK is and go straight into old rivalries with people. But you know..... whatever :)

[airshifter]

A store is a store is a store. Where do i say "full size"?
Over a 1000 jobs is a big hit

This angle is one the US government seems to neglect. 1000 jobs is 1000 jobs, but they only worry about "helping" huge corporations, thus killing more small companies who have to actually work through their problems.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Airshifter...that may be true but it is easy to try to save the Big 3 with one big bill in Congress than it would be to save 200000 small businesses with different levels of competance and pain caused by the banking crisis.

Politicians like easy solutions...one size fits all is the motto in this one...

[Easy Drifter]

These days to all the car manufacturers rely on parts made by, often small, independent suppliers. These companies may only employee a hundred people but they lose a company they supply and they can go out of business. Most of them supply more than one car manufacturer but the slowdown has meant layoffs in most plants.
It is very much a trickle down effect.

[Mark]

I think the closure of the M&S Simply Food shops (they are really shops rather than stores) says more about the business strategy of M&S than it does about the economy as a whole.

For those who don't know M&S specialise in own branded only, high quality, but high cost food. Which seemed to work fine for them in their city centre stores alongside the clothes retailing.

But they tried to bascailly go toe to toe with the supermarkets by opening their own supermarkets. Many companies have tried to go head to head with the likes of Tesco and Sainsbury's and ended up sunk, M&S isn't the first and won't be the last.

Brand snobs would shop at M&S food because they feel they are getting a good deal, but with the economic downturn on top, they are going to Tesco instead.

M&S had a similarly failed venture in Gateshead a few years ago when they opened a furniture store in the Metrocentre retail park, right next to IKEA. Once again charging way over the odds, that folded within 6 months.

[AndyRAC]

I think the closure of the M&S Simply Food shops (they are really shops rather than stores) says more about the business strategy of M&S than it does about the economy as a whole.

For those who don't know M&S specialise in own branded only, high quality, but high cost food. Which seemed to work fine for them in their city centre stores alongside the clothes retailing.

But they tried to bascailly go toe to toe with the supermarkets by opening their own supermarkets. Many companies have tried to go head to head with the likes of Tesco and Sainsbury's and ended up sunk, M&S isn't the first and won't be the last.

Brand snobs would shop at M&S food because they feel they are getting a good deal, but with the economic downturn on top, they are going to Tesco instead.

M&S had a similarly failed venture in Gateshead a few years ago when they opened a furniture store in the Metrocentre retail park, right next to IKEA. Once again charging way over the odds, that folded within 6 months.

Regarding 'Brand snobs' - isn't Waitrose meant to be the supermarket of the Middle and Upper classes? Yet, this has just had a bumper month according to reports. So why had M&S suffered if it has a similar clientale?

[Mark]

Regarding 'Brand snobs' - isn't Waitrose meant to be the supermarket of the Middle and Upper classes? Yet, this has just had a bumper month according to reports. So why had M&S suffered if it has a similar clientale?

Location, Location, Location?

[Daniel]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7817146.stm Sainsburys is doing well also.

Perhaps M&S's pseudo porno ads aren't working as well as they thought they would? M&S? S&M more like it!

M&S advert
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=U1bd29tgNbg&feature=related
M&S advert spoof
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=EHFKE6PD_6U

[jim mcglinchey]

[quote="Mark"]I but with the economic downturn on top, they are going to Tesco instead.

Lets knock that myth on the head. For general shopping Tescos arent cheap, and they are cutting back on the incentives, such as points, that made you overlook some of their high prices.

[Daniel]

Lets knock that myth on the head. For general shopping Tescos arent cheap, and they are cutting back on the incentives, such as points, that made you overlook some of their high prices.

Yes. Whenever we got to Tesco we spend far more than we would if we went to Sainsburys and did a similar shop. Plus the food isn't as good.

[Mark]

Lets knock that myth on the head. For general shopping Tescos arent cheap, and they are cutting back on the incentives, such as points, that made you overlook some of their high prices.

Perhaps not. But, considerably cheaper than M&S.

[Hazell B]

I would have said Wedgewood/Waterford would be safe as well being a recognised name.



Wedgwood (there's no 'e' ) have had massive debts for several years, so anyone who handles their stuff on the used market has been buying and stashing for some time now, knowing they'd vanish in all but name very soon. In fact, the auction values had levelled out, so I guess dealers thought it would have fallen by the wayside earlier than the name did.

If you see any pre-1970's Jasperware (the blue and white stuff, or pale green and white) buy it if it's under thirty quid. Prices are, I'm told, due a nice jump within six months or so ;) I've not bought any, but saw a friend of mine outbid on some recent TV show (Flog It or whatever) and he's been telling me about it's rises.

[Drew]

If you see any pre-1970's Jasperware (the blue and white stuff, or pale green and white) buy it if it's under thirty quid. Prices are, I'm told, due a nice jump within six months or so ;) I've not bought any, but saw a friend of mine outbid on some recent TV show (Flog It or whatever) and he's been telling me about it's rises.

Is watching these shows like a who's who of your friends? :p :

[Hazell B]

Is watching these shows like a who's who of your friends? :p :

It's sometimes so, which can lead to red faced moments when I mention I saw them at an auction and they claim not to have seen me, then I remember it was on TV not face to face :p :

Bought a £34 sack of horse feed this morning for £20.
The barter system really is working well in this climate :D

[Daniel]

Wedgwood (there's no 'e' ) have had massive debts for several years, so anyone who handles their stuff on the used market has been buying and stashing for some time now, knowing they'd vanish in all but name very soon. In fact, the auction values had levelled out, so I guess dealers thought it would have fallen by the wayside earlier than the name did.

My mistake :)

It's not my sort of stuff personally. We have 2 different sets of Denby stuff and it's not so fragile you can't use it day in day out and IMHO it actually looks nicer :p

[Hazell B]

Denby's a superb investment. Grab any, especially the 70's stuff, and stash it away. Prices are low enough to make it buyable but will soon turn to double or more once the market is sick of weedy china and Poole.

It's what I use at home too.

[Daniel]

Denby's a superb investment. Grab any, especially the 70's stuff, and stash it away. Prices are low enough to make it buyable but will soon turn to double or more once the market is sick of weedy china and Poole.

It's what I use at home too.

A woman of taste :p

We bought two sets of Denby Urban
http://www.debenhams.com/images/products/xlg/0502_IP8371_XLG.JPG

as well as some imperial blue stuff as well. I doubt it'll ever be worth anything tbh :p My sister in law wanted some Vera Wang Wedgwood on her wedding list. Needless to say no one bought her some. We could have got some but I thought it was too ugly to buy it :p

[jim mcglinchey]

That picture is from a magazine Daniel, heh heh.

Is this the the 'Show-Off your crockery thread' now? That would be so vulgar.
Do you like my Denby Midnight? And it's not from Ebay either.

[Mark in Oshawa]

You guys are talking about china!!! GUYS? China patterns? What is this? A shower for the bride? Someone getting married or something???????????

[Daniel]

You guys are talking about china!!! GUYS? China patterns? What is this? A shower for the bride? Someone getting married or something???????????
It's not China :p Denby is not China :p

Nice Denby Jim :)

Of course I didn't take the picture :p

[Mark in Oshawa]

It's not China :p Denby is not China :p

Nice Denby Jim :)

Of course I didn't take the picture :p

Whatever.....even my wife wouldn't be entertained for a minute and a half talking plates, cups and saucers.....


You want my attention..talk about FOOD that goes on the damn plates..lol

[Daniel]

Whatever.....even my wife wouldn't be entertained for a minute and a half talking plates, cups and saucers.....


You want my attention..talk about FOOD that goes on the damn plates..lol
Start a food thread then ;)

[Mark in Oshawa]

I just may have to....

[Hazell B]

Whatever.....even my wife wouldn't be entertained for a minute and a half talking plates, cups and saucers.....


You want my attention..talk about FOOD that goes on the damn plates..lol


I'm only interested in it's profitability!

As for food .... did you know milk prices to the producers (the farmers, not the bloody cows :p : ) has again been dropped? It's always tended to be a set price, whatever the handling company, so if one offers 2p a litre less, they all do. With farmers tied by location and contracts, they're stuck with the cuts.

Have milk prices dropped in the shops? No. Have cattle feed prices risen threefold? Yes. Is fuel, heating and cattle housing all up in price? Yes.

There's a hell of a lot of low reserve milking cattle hitting the meat auctions soon as farmers are dumping them, so expect milk to be imported more and more. Hardly good for the economy :s

[Daniel]

I'm only interested in it's profitability!

As for food .... did you know milk prices to the producers (the farmers, not the bloody cows :p : ) has again been dropped? It's always tended to be a set price, whatever the handling company, so if one offers 2p a litre less, they all do. With farmers tied by location and contracts, they're stuck with the cuts.

Have milk prices dropped in the shops? No. Have cattle feed prices risen threefold? Yes. Is fuel, heating and cattle housing all up in price? Yes.

There's a hell of a lot of low reserve milking cattle hitting the meat auctions soon as farmers are dumping them, so expect milk to be imported more and more. Hardly good for the economy :s

Every little helps...... the big supermarkets that it :rolleyes:

[Easy Drifter]

Interesting what supply and demand does.
Here a few years ago ground Pork and ground Chicken/Turkey sold for around a dollar a lb. if you could find them.
Now they vary from $3.49 to $3.99 a lb. after they became popular substitutes for ground Beef. Ground Beef has remained fairly steady, depending on grade, from as low as $1.29 to $2.99 a lb.
I pay $3.00 for 4 premade 6 0z ground elk or buffalo patties. Ie 24 Oz of meat.

[Mark in Oshawa]

All I know is the Farmer is the last guy to get any help or have any pull in the system. The Middlemen and the stores make all the profits. It isn't right in a sense but the system is what it is.....people smarter than me can try to explain it.

[steve_spackman]

All I know is the Farmer is the last guy to get any help or have any pull in the system. The Middlemen and the stores make all the profits. It isn't right in a sense but the system is what it is.....people smarter than me can try to explain it.

ive seen some farmers whom deal directly with the store.

this however is mainly done with the health food stores like whole foods etc.

[Hazell B]

ive seen some farmers whom deal directly with the store.

this however is mainly done with the health food stores like whole foods etc.


Don't get me wrong, about half the UK production for meat at one time or another hits the free market and goes to the highest bidder - but as the vast majority ends up in supermarkets the highest bidder isn't paying much. Dealing direct is tried, but the consumer is the one to blame for farmers losing cash as they choose to buy via supermarkets rather than butcher shops.

Anyhow, that's life these days. Farmers cope, eventually.

Today's Bargain ..... Armani (is that the right spelling?) in York's Designer Outlet are subletting half their shop and flogging all stock cheap. A £2400 dress at £295. It's even my size, so get your hands in your pockets :D

[schmenke]

Well, I must be doing something right as I just received notice of my yearly salary increase which was higher than I anticipated (which was nothing :s ) :D


<...off in search of Armani...>

[Jag_Warrior]

Today's Bargain ..... Armani (is that the right spelling?) in York's Designer Outlet are subletting half their shop and flogging all stock cheap. A £2400 dress at £295. It's even my size, so get your hands in your pockets :D

Designer dresses for how much???!!!
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1398/542389855_811a187e7b.jpg

[GridGirl]

Anyhow, that's life these days. Farmers cope, eventually.

Today's Bargain ..... Armani (is that the right spelling?) in York's Designer Outlet are subletting half their shop and flogging all stock cheap. A £2400 dress at £295. It's even my size, so get your hands in your pockets :D

All fine and well as long as you have somewhere to wear you nice £295 nice designer dress. :p I haven't been to that York outlet in ages, might have to pay it a visit sometime. :)

In other news, my department ended up being at risk of redundancies but on Wednesday we were told we were all safe. About 6 people in the entire company got letter telling them they were extending the period in which they were going to think about making them redundant and one of those people ended up walking out anyway. So all in all my employer pee'd off pretty much the entire workforce for nothing.

[Daniel]

Designer dresses for how much???!!!
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1398/542389855_811a187e7b.jpg

I only just noticed the big Palin badge she's got. Is that to remind her of who she is? :mark:

[Jag_Warrior]

:D

They were going to put another one on the other side, written backwards, for when she looked at herself in the mirror. But she started telling people her name was Neelap (nilaP).

[Hazell B]

I'm thinner than her :p :

[Jag_Warrior]

I'm sure that you are. You're likely much smarter too - what with knowing the difference between continents and countries. Plus, you're likeable.

[Daniel]

I'm sure that you are. You're likely much smarter too - what with knowing the difference between continents and countries. Plus, you're likeable.

It goes without saying that Hazell is smarter than her. I'm sure Hazell's dogs are smarter than Palin :mark:

[Hazell B]

I'm sure that you are. You're likely much smarter too - what with knowing the difference between continents and countries. Plus, you're likeable.


O Level Geography no less :D
(That means I can tell you France is shaped like an Armani boot, Germany's full of garlic and America is joined at the hip to England)
I can find my way to Alaska, too ;)

[Jag_Warrior]

:)

____

[steve_spackman]

I only just noticed the big Palin badge she's got. Is that to remind her of who she is? :mark:

id love to stick my cock in her ear and fook some sense into her

[jim mcglinchey]

..there we were thinking you were sensible, Steve...

[Camelopard]

Wow this is a huge amount to drop on a house, poor bloke, hope someone gives him help........ You're down that way aren't you vop? Maybe he could spend some time at your house until he gets back on his feet.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/01/26/2474515.htm?section=justin

[Camelopard]

Wow this is a huge amount to drop on a house, poor bloke, hope someone gives him help........ You're down that way aren't you vop? Maybe he could spend some time at your house until he gets back on his feet.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/01/26/2474515.htm?section=justin

Comon let's start the ball rolling, I'll gladly give this poor fellow $50 to help him buy his house back, anybody else going to help me?

Lehman's CEO sold Florida mansion to wife for $100

Posted Mon Jan 26, 2009 2:48pm AEDT
Updated Mon Jan 26, 2009 2:47pm AEDT
Fallen Lehman Brothers chief executive Richard Fuld sold his $US13.3 million mansion to his wife for just $US100 ($153) last November, according to Florida real estate records.
The 62-year-old executive, who could face civil lawsuits after overseeing the storied investment bank's collapse into Chapter 11 proceedings last September, transferred ownership of the 3.3 acres seaside home to Kathleen Fuld on November 10, records show.
The couple had jointly bought the home for $US13.75 million ($21 million) in March 2004, as first reported by Cityfile.com.
Mr Fuld has been blamed for Lehman's collapse on September 15 after it was weighed down by bad assets leading to the largest-ever US bankruptcy when it was unable to find a buyer to come to its rescue.
He was widely criticised for not acting quickly enough to save the 158-year old bank.
Though Mr Fuld told US legislators he took full responsibility for his actions and felt "horrible about what has happened to the company," he insisted he shared the blame with US regulators and Congress.
Mr Fuld, who was awarded $US22 million ($34 million) in compensation in fiscal 2007, stepped down as Lehman chief executive at the end of last year and did not receive any bonus or severance when he left.
- Reuters

[Jag_Warrior]

I don't know Florida real estate law, but hopefully this transaction will be disallowed after the civil suits are filed (and won), and Fuld declares bankruptcy. It's clear that all he's trying to do is hide (protect) his assets in anticipation of civil action.

Because Mrs. Fuld is now a party to this transaction, it would be amusing to see his her get pulled into any future litigation too - maybe they'll both be wiped out... I can only hope.

[Camelopard]

Seems there is no Economic Downturn for some, especially when it is at the taxpayers expense.... :)

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/01/27/obama-officials-tells-cit_n_161202.html

Sounds like Socialism to me, the Government telling private companies what they can and can't do with their money, or is it the taxpayers money? Whose money is it, I'm confused! :)

The high-flying execs at Citigroup caved under pressure from President Obama and decided today to abandon plans for a luxurious new $50 million corporate jet from France...

ABC News has learned that Monday officials of the Obama administration called Citigroup about the company's new $50 million corporate jet and told execs to "fix it."

[Camelopard]

Another good news story out of wall street, well good news if you are an investment banker!

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/01/30/2478245.htm?section=justin

Obama lashes out at 'irresponsible' bonus payments

By Washington correspondent Michael Rowland (http://www.abc.net.au/profiles/content/s1888091.htm?site=news)
Posted 4 hours 11 minutes ago
US President Barack Obama has lashed out at investment bankers who pay themselves huge bonuses at a time when taxpayers are bailing out their institutions.
Mr Obama has been angered by reports Wall Street bankers have paid themselves more than $US20 billion in annual bonuses, the same amount they received in 2004.
Mr Obama says he cannot believe such payments are being made as many big banks teeter on the edge of collapse, and at a time they are also accepting billions of dollars in government help.
"That is the height of irresponsibility. It is shameful," he said.
The President says the investment bankers need to start behaving responsibly and do their bit to help pull America out of recession.

[jim mcglinchey]

They are no less greedy in the UK. Sir Fred Godwin CEO of the Royal Bank of Scotland presided over the biggest corporate loss in UK history, £28 billion no less, but still troughed a £2.8 million bonus.Niiiiiiiice.

[Rollo]

The BBC reports that the World Economic Forum found "no answers" to the Economic crisis, however I fear that they asked the wrong people:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/davos/7863684.stm

Another participant summed up the state of the discussion as "we don't know what to do, only that we need to do something and we need to do it fast".

The World Economic Forum was in Davos, but they should have asked Davros.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/norfolk/content/images/2005/03/15/davros_dalek_resurrection_terry_malloy_400_400x300 .jpg

I bet that he would have EXTERMINATED the Economic Crisis in no time.

[leopard]

Besides, I was worried about any discussion held in Davos to solve certain issue would produce fruitful decision...

[steve_spackman]

quote...

It is hard to imagine any sector of the American economy more driven by ideology, delusion, and propaganda than the armed services. Many people believe that our military is the largest, best equipped, and most invincible among the world's armed forces. None of these things is true, but our military is, without a doubt, the most expensive to maintain. Each year, we Americans account for nearly half of all global military spending (http://www.tomdispatch.com/post/175007%20), an amount larger than the next 45 nations together spend on their militaries annually.

[Camelopard]

Was Economic Upturn for these 2 judges, until they got caught, what a disgrace:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/02/13/2490498.htm?section=justin

US judges admit jailing children for money

Posted 56 minutes ago
Updated 57 minutes ago

Two judges have pleaded guilty to accepting more than $US2.6 million ($3.9 million) from a private youth detention centre in Pennsylvania in return for giving hundreds of youths and teenagers long sentences.
Judges Mark Ciavarella and Michael Conahan of the Court of Common Pleas in Luzerne County, Pennsylvania, entered plea agreements in federal court in Scranton admitting that they took payoffs from PA Childcare and a sister company, Western PA Childcare, between 2003 and 2006.

I guess they won't go to prison, maybe they could place them under house arrest with Bernie.

[leopard]

The bright side of the story that the Judge Mark C has admitted his own fault and take it for the account and risk of himself.

[cdn_grampa]

Hard to believe this subject dropped from interest.

What do you make of this crazy market rally ??

Dead cat bounce ?? Sucker's rally ???

I have nothing to say other than I am at a total loss to understand it seeming to hold. Mind you 4 or 5 days does not make a run.

But just because some thief at Citicorp makes a pronouncement and then more of his cohorts as well makes all the other stuff just disappear ??

Puzzled.

Looking at the futures tonight - tomorrow [Teusday that is ] looks like more of the same:

http://money.cnn.com/data/premarket/

[Camelopard]

This I'd like to see!

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/03/18/2518988.htm?section=justin

"Republican Senator Charles Grassley has suggested AIG executives should adopt a Japanese approach toward accepting responsibility for their failings by resigning or committing suicide."

[Camelopard]

It seems that the global financial crisis is all 'my' fault! :)

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/03/27/2527652.htm?section=justin

[Drew]

A university professor who warned that bankers could be "hanging from lampposts" during G20 protests next week has been suspended from his job.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7967096.stm

[Tazio]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7967096.stmI guess the Regents at The University of East London, don't apreciate British humor :dozey:

[Hazell B]

This downturn just gets stranger and stranger in my world of buying and selling antiquie stuff.

Just got back from a normal, smallish auction reeling at one lot's price. It was a 19th centuary table cabinet by F L Hausberg (Liverpool) valued at £3000-5000. Went for £60,000! Yet some good gold Albert chains barely met scrap value and silver was almost free when it was wrapped around watches or other slightly unfashionable items.

Sixty grand for a bit of box that's no use at all, yet twenty quid for three silver watches that worked!

[Malbec]

This downturn just gets stranger and stranger in my world of buying and selling antiquie stuff.

Just got back from a normal, smallish auction reeling at one lot's price. It was a 19th centuary table cabinet by F L Hausberg (Liverpool) valued at £3000-5000. Went for £60,000! Yet some good gold Albert chains barely met scrap value and silver was almost free when it was wrapped around watches or other slightly unfashionable items.

Sixty grand for a bit of box that's no use at all, yet twenty quid for three silver watches that worked!

Its the same with cars though, if you bought a Porsche or a Bentley a couple of years ago you're screwed, but if you spent a bit more and bought a multimillion dollar classic then things are still hunky-dory, the classic car auctions haven't seen much change in custom at all.

The mega-rich are still mega-rich, and now that the recession has hit they've got more time on their hands to enjoy themselves, its merely the super-rich and below that are suffering.

[Hazell B]

A sixty grand box doesn't appeal to the mega rich, though.

The buyer was a fifty-something woman in a cheap anorak. She's not a dealer (in fact I'd lay money she was an auction novice the way she flapped about) and only came for that one lot, having had a condition report earlier.
Just been looking at some auction results and it seems dealers are paying top dollar oop north and far less down south at the moment. Odd.

[Fred Basset]

Business is booming over here :)

Morning Hazel :wave:

You still in touch with LK?

[markabilly]

we have learned nothing in 2100 years or so

"The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest we become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance."





- Cicero - 55 BC

[markabilly]

we have learned nothing in 2100 years

"The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest we become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance."




ciero, about 55 bc

[Mark in Oshawa]

Markabilly....wasn't it Benjamin Franklin that stated "the nation will be in trouble when the people vote to start giving themselves money from the treasury". I believe that sums up the last budget don't it?

[markabilly]

Markabilly....wasn't it Benjamin Franklin that stated "the nation will be in trouble when the people vote to start giving themselves money from the treasury". I believe that sums up the last budget don't it?
Well, Bama would say what did ole Benjie know anyway ???(right after Bama asked Porkbarrell Pelosi what to say)

[52Paddy]

Our 'Emergency Budget' was unleashed last Tuesday. I don't know the full details of it, and haven't been bothered to look it up. I'll just get angry like everybody else has. Its clearly not good news and I just hope that when I finish my college degree (4 years from now, failing any setbacks) most of this crap will have blown over. Otherwise I'm in for it.

[markabilly]

Our 'Emergency Budget' was unleashed last Tuesday. I don't know the full details of it, and haven't been bothered to look it up. I'll just get angry like everybody else has. Its clearly not good news and I just hope that when I finish my college degree (4 years from now, failing any setbacks) most of this crap will have blown over. Otherwise I'm in for it.

no problem , the latest is out sourcing or global levraging all those jobs for rookies anyway....

I would suggest taking a year or two off from college and going around the world, working at mac donald or some such....the food and pay may be crap, but once you are out in the real world, you will never ever get the same chance
But I forgot, in addition to curing cancer completely, eliminating all nukes, turning the world green, health care for everyone, redcing both taxes abd the deficit, all during his first term, bama will be quranteeing full employment for everyone....

[52Paddy]

I would suggest taking a year or two off from college and going around the world, working at mac donald or some such....the food and pay may be crap, but once you are out in the real world, you will never ever get the same chance


Well, I haven't started college yet. I finished school almost a year ago and then went into couriering on a pushbike. I've been doing that for about nine months. It gets me a taste of paying my own way without making the full commitment of living alone (I tried it for a month, found it a bit difficult and defeating my purpose of working: to save money for college!)

I definitely agree that a year out is a good idea and its doing me great. Unfortunately its not easy to just opt out of a year of college when you start the course. If you do so, you must pay your full fees and are not entitled to 'free education' per se, for the following years. :s

Unless its under medical grounds.

[Camelopard]

Lock her up, throw away the keys!

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/america-wants-to-see-ruth-madoff-behind-bars-1667292.html


"Ruth Madoff was at the side of history's biggest swindler for the duration of his extraordinary fraud and – from talk show hosts to tabloid readers, from Madoff's victims to FBI officers – it seems the whole of the US is speculating how much she knew, how much responsibility might be hers, and how much she should pay."

"Finally, it has been revealed that she made a number of large withdrawals from brokerage accounts in the UK and in the US in the weeks before her husband's scheme collapsed, including a $10m withdrawal on the day he confessed to their sons."

[steve_spackman]

Lock her up, throw away the keys!

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/america-wants-to-see-ruth-madoff-behind-bars-1667292.html


"Ruth Madoff was at the side of history's biggest swindler for the duration of his extraordinary fraud and – from talk show hosts to tabloid readers, from Madoff's victims to FBI officers – it seems the whole of the US is speculating how much she knew, how much responsibility might be hers, and how much she should pay."

"Finally, it has been revealed that she made a number of large withdrawals from brokerage accounts in the UK and in the US in the weeks before her husband's scheme collapsed, including a $10m withdrawal on the day he confessed to their sons."

Im sure that kept her busy....