Alonso to help Massa ? [Archive]

ioan

12th October 2008, 17:25

My Spanish isn't top shelf so help me out please (I used google translator).

http://www.marca.com/edicion/marca/motor/formula1/es/desarrollo/1174538.html

Did Alonso say what I think he said?
Hamy won't be happy and Ron will be fuming.

The question is why people don't like Lewy?

gloomyDAY

12th October 2008, 17:35

Por último, tras comentarle que en Brasil no confían en que Raikkonen vaya a ayudar a Massa, aunque los aficionados creen que él sí lo hará ahora tiene un coche competitivo, dijo: "Sí, sin duda. Si puedo ayudar, ayudaré a Massa".Yes, Alonso will help Massa.

I'm not sure why McLaren would care seeing as if they already know the Spaniard's intentions.

Roamy

12th October 2008, 17:48

good for alonso

Tonieke

12th October 2008, 17:57

wonder how he is goin to do it...and why he not started today yet ?

Big Ben

12th October 2008, 18:03

It will be great if they get to the point where Alonso can help FM win the title :laugh: After nurburgring last year I didn´t think I´ll get to hear this from the Spaniard.

If McLaren wouldn´t be ran by a bunch of morons today he could be fighting for his 4th title. if it would still be a fight...

Big Ben

12th October 2008, 18:08

wonder how he is goin to do it...and why he not started today yet ?

you re right man! he should have done something to make Hamilton win less points :laugh:

ioan

13th October 2008, 10:17

Reported on Autosport now:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71379

Knock-on

13th October 2008, 10:23

:laugh: I'm beginning to think Fred doesn't like Lewis ;)

ShiftingGears

13th October 2008, 10:33

:laugh: I'm beginning to think Fred doesn't like Lewis ;)

Absurd!

ArrowsFA1

13th October 2008, 10:41

"Yes, no doubt, if I can help, I will help Massa" says future Ferrari driver.

pino

13th October 2008, 10:51

This is an old news ;)

Daniel

13th October 2008, 11:48

Alonso doesn't like Lewis and McLaren? Can you blame him after last year?

Dave B

13th October 2008, 11:55

Daniel

13th October 2008, 12:01

Revenge is sweet Dave. It's his choice who he supports :)

Ranger

13th October 2008, 12:05

Alonso will collide with Hamilton before the season's out. You heard it here first! :p :

Hondo

13th October 2008, 13:23

If they do collide, Alonso will have a hard time convincing anyone that it was unintentional.

PolePosition_1

13th October 2008, 13:45

Fair play to him for admitting it, I suppose. It's not an attitude I particularly admire, but it's a chance to get one over on his previous employers while endearing himself to a potential future one.

I think him being so close to Heikki in the drivers title will be the best way of getting one over on his former employers.

What I find amazing, is Alonso being the highest points scorer in the past 6 races, he has scored 35 points. Its a pretty telling story.

You can't help but feel if Alonso was in a top car this season, he would be a fair bit ahead of the current title contenders, who seem to be continously tripping up.

V12

13th October 2008, 16:21

Fair play to him for admitting it, I suppose. It's not an attitude I particularly admire, but it's a chance to get one over on his previous employers while endearing himself to a potential future one.

My thoughts exactly, to be honest, if I was in his shoes I'd be extremely tempted to do the same as I can be quite a vengeful person. Having said that, if I was in Alonso's shoes winning the race in Brazil, with Massa running 2nd and needing the win to overhaul Hamilton, would I let him through? I don't think so.

Knock-on

13th October 2008, 17:23

If they do collide, Alonso will have a hard time convincing anyone that it was unintentional.

All he has to convince is the FIA so not a problem ;)

Tazio

13th October 2008, 18:23

I believe Fred owes him one from when Lewis drove up his tailpipe
early in the season, causing Fred to retire!
Although I can't remember which race it was! :p :

jens

13th October 2008, 18:41

I don't think we can take those words too seriously. I doubt Flav would be particularly happy if Alonso rammed someone out and deliberately threw Renault's - his employer's - points away, although his reputation in the team is so good that they wouldn't sack him even for that.

Most likely that "help" could occur in such racing situations that if Massa is behind him and faster, he won't make "passing too difficult", but in turn he may block Hamilton quite heavily. For instance.

F1boat

13th October 2008, 18:59

If they do collide, Alonso will have a hard time convincing anyone that it was unintentional.

He must just wait for another 'racey" approach by Lewis.

Firstgear

13th October 2008, 19:53

Well, my translation of what Alonso said is that:

Lewis > Massa + Kimi + FIA

but....maybe...

Lewis < Massa + Kimi + FIA + Alonso

jens

13th October 2008, 19:58

Well, my translation of what Alonso said is that:

Lewis > Massa + Kimi + FIA

but....maybe...

Lewis < Massa + Kimi + FIA + Alonso

Yeah, another conspiracy theory - FIA has paid to Alonso to balance the championship fight. :D

jso1985

13th October 2008, 20:05

If they do collide, Alonso will have a hard time convincing anyone that it was unintentional.

But maybe he wouldn't even care about not convincing anyone... in the end all he might get is being DQ from the final standings but keeping his individual race results and being fully able to compete in the 2009 season... so like it happened on a sunny day of 1997... Alonso wouldn't give a rat's ass about such useless penalty!

still... I hope he doesn't do that, I want Hamilton to lose the championship not someone to make him lose the championship

wmcot

13th October 2008, 21:02

I want Hamilton to lose the championship not someone to make him lose the championship

After yesterday, it appears he's doing a fine job on his own! :)

(Remind you of last year at all?)

wmcot

13th October 2008, 21:04

If they do collide, Alonso will have a hard time convincing anyone that it was unintentional.

Senna didn't have to...and all he got out of it was a WDC!!!

Sleeper

13th October 2008, 21:08

I think him being so close to Heikki in the drivers title will be the best way of getting one over on his former employers.

What I find amazing, is Alonso being the highest points scorer in the past 6 races, he has scored 35 points. Its a pretty telling story.

You can't help but feel if Alonso was in a top car this season, he would be a fair bit ahead of the current title contenders, who seem to be continously tripping up.
People keep saying this, yet up till only a few races ago Alonso did a fair bit of tripping up himself (Monaco and Germany immediatley spring to mind).

gravity

13th October 2008, 21:16

^^ + his tire choice at Silverstone

Big Ben

13th October 2008, 21:33

^^ + his tire choice at Silverstone

If you were driving a mediocre car in changing weather conditions would´t you gamble a bit too with your tire choice.

jens

13th October 2008, 21:47

People keep saying this, yet up till only a few races ago Alonso did a fair bit of tripping up himself (Monaco and Germany immediatley spring to mind).

Canadian and French Grand Prix's weren't the most impressive ones either. Basically everyone has had his lows this year, but Alonso has managed to overcome them nicely and made up all previous misfortunes.

janneppi

14th October 2008, 06:22

Canadian and French Grand Prix's weren't the most impressive ones either. Basically everyone has had his lows this year, but Alonso has managed to overcome them nicely and made up all previous misfortunes.
That's because no one hardly notices if Alonso spins off the track from P12, one fluke win and one good drive and you'd think he's the second coming of Jesus. ;)

Big Ben

14th October 2008, 07:46

That's because no one hardly notices if Alonso spins off the track from P12, one fluke win and one good drive and you'd think he's the second coming of Jesus. ;)

You are right. It's easier to notice a wdc in a FERRARI who doesn't score a point in 4 races.

janneppi

14th October 2008, 07:50

Indeed, those in top cars have to perform well in all the races, otherwise they get rubbished. Those who drive for "lesser teams" can afford to poodle along or make silly mistakes.

ArrowsFA1

14th October 2008, 07:52

Canadian and French Grand Prix's weren't the most impressive ones either. Basically everyone has had his lows this year, but Alonso has managed to overcome them nicely and made up all previous misfortunes.
At the start of the year Alonso knew he didn't have a car capable of winning races. Now he does. That makes a difference to a driver.

Storm

14th October 2008, 10:51

Indeed, those in top cars have to perform well in all the races, otherwise they get rubbished. Those who drive for "lesser teams" can afford to poodle along or make silly mistakes.
Are you serious to suggest that people aren't watching keenly how a double world champ (who was rumoured all year to go to Ferrari or BMW) is doing?
i.e is he spinning and making mistakes or not....Alonso did make lots of mistakes this year early on (especially trying hard to pass cars, and like Britain, gambling on tyres to make his car go faster) but that was when the car was completely crap...since it started showing a decent speed he has been amazingly consistent and fast. The same can't be said of many in "top" cars...especially the red cars

leopard

14th October 2008, 11:06

Why would Alonso help Massa, Massa will not lose his legitimacy of the tittle on account of someone's help. Besides, Alonso is not teammate of Massa ...

Big Ben

15th October 2008, 08:36

Why would Alonso help Massa, Massa will not lose his legitimacy of the tittle on account of someone's help. Besides, Alonso is not teammate of Massa ...

let me give you a hint: because of his deep feelings for RD and LH.

PolePosition_1

15th October 2008, 08:57

I believe Fred owes him one from when Lewis drove up his tailpipe
early in the season, causing Fred to retire!
Although I can't remember which race it was! :p :

Malasyia this year I think. And Brundle outrightly accused Alonso of brake testing him, and didn't even apologise.

PolePosition_1

15th October 2008, 09:03

Are you serious to suggest that people aren't watching keenly how a double world champ (who was rumoured all year to go to Ferrari or BMW) is doing?
i.e is he spinning and making mistakes or not....Alonso did make lots of mistakes this year early on (especially trying hard to pass cars, and like Britain, gambling on tyres to make his car go faster) but that was when the car was completely crap...since it started showing a decent speed he has been amazingly consistent and fast. The same can't be said of many in "top" cars...especially the red cars

Definately, at beginning of the year, Alonso did undeniably make several mistakes. However thats simply because he was pushing the car over the limit. And that was needed to make any kind of progress above the car. Fact the car is now coming together, he is on the limit, consistantly.

If you look at the type of laptimes he produces on important stints, he just laps continously within 1-2 tenth, and at laptimes incredibly close to his fastest laps.

With regards to Alonso's comments to helping Massa, I wouldn't think he was talking about purposely shoving Lewis off track. I think he is simply refering to fighting Hamilton on track as hard as possible etc.

F1boat

15th October 2008, 09:39

Malasyia this year I think. And Brundle outrightly accused Alonso of brake testing him, and didn't even apologise.

It was Bahrain.

ioan

15th October 2008, 10:11

Malasyia this year I think. And Brundle outrightly accused Alonso of brake testing him, and didn't even apologise.

I think it was Bahrain. As for taking Brundle's opinion as the right one :whistle:

ioan

15th October 2008, 10:12

It was Bahrain.

Right! That's when Lewy ran into Alonso's gearbox.

TMorel

15th October 2008, 11:17

I'd be pretty damn *$#%'ed off if I was Renault.
He should be trying his hardest to do well for the team, not to settle any old grudges.

ioan

15th October 2008, 13:39

I'd be pretty damn *$#%'ed off if I was Renault.
He should be trying his hardest to do well for the team, not to settle any old grudges.

He is doing his best right now, winning 2 races in a row!
I bet Renault are more than happy with him and as long as he gets them the 4th place in the WCC he can do whatever he wants.

15th October 2008, 13:45

With regards to Alonso's comments to helping Massa, I wouldn't think he was talking about purposely shoving Lewis off track. I think he is simply refering to fighting Hamilton on track as hard as possible etc.

Well, yes, but that's far too realistic and sensible a suggestion to have any merit as a headline whatsoever!

You'd never make a Fleet Street reporter.

ArrowsFA1

16th October 2008, 10:38

Alonso:

"...first of all we need to have a competitive car here in Shanghai and in Brazil to be fighting with McLaren and Ferrari, and if we do that and Felipe Massa wins the race and I am second or third, I will be happy for Felipe to take as many points as possible and this is the only approach."

"You can be here forever, and you cannot misunderstand what I said. When we say all these things, my best relationship is with Robert and I would like to see him win the championship."

I will do my own job but when you see the results you prefer some teams to win or some teams to win compared to others. I will not be any key part to the championship, whatever driver wins will win because he did a better job in the last two races. You can take whatever you want from my comment but it is very simple."
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71424

Hamilton:

"I don't particularly have an opinion on it," Hamilton replied when asked about the comments.
"I focus on my job, if we can be competitive this weekend we will try and get points and be up front great, what the others do is up to them," he said.
Refusing to be drawn any further on Alonso's comments, Hamilton instead praised Renault's up-turn in form, which has resulted in the team winning the last two races.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71425

PolePosition_1

16th October 2008, 10:49

I think it was Bahrain. As for taking Brundle's opinion as the right one :whistle:

What are you suggesting here? I don't quite understand.

ioan

16th October 2008, 14:12

What are you suggesting here? I don't quite understand.

Not my problem.

PolePosition_1

16th October 2008, 16:21

Not my problem.

lol, you complain when I interpret what you say wrongly, and when I make an effort to understand what your trying to say you refuse to clarify what you meant.

janneppi

17th October 2008, 07:09

Are you serious to suggest that people aren't watching keenly how a double world champ (who was rumoured all year to go to Ferrari or BMW) is doing?
Yes, sort of. ;)
If you compare for example Massa who spun in one race, he was touted to be a dismal failure, when Alonso spun (into a wall?) and retired in another, there were no calls for him to raise his game.

i.e is he spinning and making mistakes or not....Alonso did make lots of mistakes this year early on (especially trying hard to pass cars, and like Britain, gambling on tyres to make his car go faster) but that was when the car was completely crap...the guys in the top teams aren't forgiven things like that so easily, they are expected to perform 100% in every race.

since it started showing a decent speed he has been amazingly consistent and fast. The same can't be said of many in "top" cars...especially the red cars
In how many races? ;)

janneppi

17th October 2008, 07:12

I'd be pretty damn *$#%'ed off if I was Renault.
He should be trying his hardest to do well for the team, not to settle any old grudges.
I'd be a bit miffed if I were Kubica, isn't he supposed to be Alonso's good buddy, no mention of Alonso trying to help him against hamilton or Massa. ;)

ArrowsFA1

17th October 2008, 08:38

Button's take (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71441) on Alonso's comments:

"Alonso is only saying what he has said because he just wants a reaction from everyone. He is not in the championship, so he just wants a bit of action. It's quite comical really."
:laugh: :up:

Big Ben

17th October 2008, 08:45

Button's take (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71441) on Alonso's comments:

:laugh: :up:

Not as comical as he is. What does Button know about F1 anyway? Is he still driving?

Ranger

17th October 2008, 08:47

Several Spaniards on the P-F1 forum said the comment was said in jest to start with. Predictably jokes get lost and mangled in translation.

Dave B

17th October 2008, 08:47

ArrowsFA1

17th October 2008, 08:56

I think it's classic gamesmanship from Alonso. I'm sure he has no intention of deliberately helping or hindering anybody, but he won't lose any sleep if his old mate Hamilton thinks he's got one more thing to worry about. :laugh:
And some say there are no characters left in F1 ;)

F1boat

17th October 2008, 09:31

ioan

17th October 2008, 13:04

Looks like Flavio would welcome Massa wining the Championship too:

"In my opinion Hamilton will try again to throw away the title," Briatore was quoted as saying by Gazzetta dello Sport. "He and McLaren were good last year already: to lose it with a 17-point advantage with two races to go is worthy of the Guinness World Records.

"If someone gets in the Guinness like that, he can really repeat himself with just five points of advantage. In my opinion Massa will win the title."

He added: "Hamilton hasn't learned anything: we saw that in Japan. He should be told he is an F1 driver, not a martian. He is no Muhammad Ali. He is a youngster who still has to show his worth.

"He's a good driver, but the good drivers are also the ones that bring the results home. There are good forwards in football who always hit the post or the crossbar, and they just can't score. Then there are those who can throw it inside the net, and he is not one of them, for now.

"It's logical for me to root for Ferrari, as an Italian, as Flavio Briatore, and as Renault, for the relationship we have with Ferrari. McLaren, by contrast, accused us of espionage: we went on for four months for a silly thing that didn't exist."

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71478

Robinho

17th October 2008, 13:23

Looks like Flavio would welcome Massa wining the Championship too:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71478

good for him, it's nice to be different isn't it :)

Tazio

17th October 2008, 15:26

Originally Posted by autosport.com
"In my opinion Hamilton will try again to throw away the title," Briatore was quoted as saying by Gazzetta dello Sport. "He and McLaren were good last year already: to lose it with a 17-point advantage with two races to go is worthy of the Guinness World Records.

"If someone gets in the Guinness like that, he can really repeat himself with just five points of advantage. In my opinion Massa will win the title."

He added: "Hamilton hasn't learned anything: we saw that in Japan. He should be told he is an F1 driver, not a martian. He is no Muhammad Ali. He is a youngster who still has to show his worth.

"He's a good driver, but the good drivers are also the ones that bring the results home. There are good forwards in football who always hit the post or the crossbar, and they just can't score. Then there are those who can throw it inside the net, and he is not one of them, for now.

"It's logical for me to root for Ferrari, as an Italian, as Flavio Briatore, and as Renault, for the relationship we have with Ferrari. McLaren, by contrast, accused us of espionage: we went on for four months for a silly thing that didn't exist." Flav is just venting because Lewis is the only man in the Circus that gets more pu$$y than him!

Jimbo Mc

17th October 2008, 23:19

ShiftingGears

18th October 2008, 00:45

Alonso is the worst sportsman ive ever seen. He's a bad loser and childish. Should a WDC be sounding off about interfering in the title shootout? It's a disgrace. All Hamilton bashers just hate the English and are jealous. Lewis will be WDC 2008 and will carry it with more grace and honour than Alfonso ha ha ha...............Alonso should have drove his McLaren faster last year if he's so good..........loser :-)

If you want to call someone childish...do it without swinging around sweeping generalisations. It'll make your posts less ironic.

Tazio

18th October 2008, 04:15

IMHO I think Fred would relish a chance of being a difference maker in the WDC
regardless of who @ss he has to whip if it's at the sharp end of the race, including Saint Kubica.
It looks like the Renault is fast enough to afford him that opportunity. Fred's tasted blood,
but at the same time he is a pretty cool shark.
(background music from "Jaws" resonating in the background!- do-domp, do-domp, do-& etc)
Look for the young, and disadvantaged to be devoured by El Tiburón fresco first.

jso1985

18th October 2008, 04:19

Alonso is the worst sportsman ive ever seen. He's a bad loser and childish. Should a WDC be sounding off about interfering in the title shootout? It's a disgrace. All Hamilton bashers just hate the English and are jealous. Lewis will be WDC 2008 and will carry it with more grace and honour than Alfonso ha ha ha...............Alonso should have drove his McLaren faster last year if he's so good..........loser :-)

childlish? oh the irony...

back on topic, I think it's a classic Alonso's comment, wheter he's actually going to help or not Massa, he's just adding more wood to the fire, and if it works it can only benefit him...