Your Favourite Racer in F1

[Tallgeese]

Sebastian Bourdais!

I think he's capable, & has what it takes. He looks like a sniper, but simply doesn't have (or at least didn't have) the right equipment. Remember, in Melbourne he survived & was heading for 4th before an engine failure let him down, & on an old chassis!

He'll show what he's made of sooner rather than later!

[gloomyDAY]

Vettel.

I'll probably get flamed as a bandwagon-er, but my signature has been there since December. Der Seb is young, talented, and ready to stake a name for himself in Formula 1.

[Valve Bounce]

Sterling Moss - my all time favorite. :up:

[markabilly]

Scottie beam her up Speed--last of the truly great ones and a racer with a name without compare


so he never won. many greats have done the same, drivers like Sato, monterio, de la rosa, ide, Mark Webber....

[gloomyDAY]

Wait, is this for a current F1 driver? or all-time favorite driver?

If it's the latter, then Ayrton Senna.

[pino]

I am sure our friend Tallgeese means among current F1 driver, so I say Jarno Trulli...he makes a great red wine :lips: :p :

[F1boat]

Well, maybe Fernando Alonso from the current drivers.

[Tallgeese]

Wait, is this for a current F1 driver? or all-time favorite driver?

If it's the latter, then Ayrton Senna.


Agreed, although I meant today & currently racing. For me it's Bourdais, & I'd say I also think highly of Alonso.

On the other hand all time it's a tie between:

Ayrton Senna
Jim Clark

[yodasarmpit]

Has to be Eddie Irvine.

The reason, see link below.
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Eddie_Irvine

[markabilly]

Has to be Eddie Irvine.

The reason, see link below.
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Eddie_Irvine

Oh Yeah!!!
Actually all very entertaining, although he probably did not intend it....

If it has to include interviews over the last two years, then my fav would be Lewis.

YES my very favorite interview of all time was the one given by Kimi, but Eddie the Edmund, was always continously mouthing off in style which Lewis would learn from, since he would poke fun at himself rather than get all pomped up and such.

Lewis just keeps on giving me good reasons to throw rocks at him. Without that, my life would lose any meaning. Can not wait until mac finally gives him a WDC. It should flow deep.

[jens]

Jarno. With specific driving style a hard driver to pass and can have a headstrong attitude on racing circuit too to put him into a better position against rivals. Like at Spa after a spin he rejoined the track right in front of other drivers, creating a dangerous situation. Team orders are something, which don't get ignored often. The most famous examples of refusals to yield may be Brazil '81 and San Marino '82, but in Japan '06 Jarno refused to let Ralf through after team had asked him to do so.

[pettersolberg29]

Why not add a poll so we can see who the most supported driver is?

[wedge]

Personally I define racer as someone with an aggressive style who enjoys fighting for position so Mansell is my #1 and is my all time favourite. Of the current generation it is Hamilton, he is the natural successor Mansell :up:

[Rollo]

Wait, is this for a current F1 driver? or all-time favorite driver?

If it's the latter then it's Stewart.

If it's the former then it would either be Raikkonen, Hamilton or Kazuki Nakajima. If Kazumi didn't have that horror pitstop in Melbourne he'd be ahead of Rosberg in the points.

[Hondo]

Webber.

[harvick#1]

past - Michael Schumacher :champion:

Present - Sebastian vettel :D others: Sebastien Bourdais, Takuma Sato, Kimi, and Felipe

[PolePosition_1]

Fernando Alons.

All time favourite would be Damon Hill.

Though second would be Bourdais, he's a good guy and deserves a decent shot.

Someone mentioned Scott Speed, I liked him, he was a character, swearing at the stewards etc, its what we need in F1!, though I also felt he had talent and deserved a place in F1. Is he not doing incredibly well in america now?

[christophulus]

All time favourite would be Damon Hill.

Agreed, glad to see I'm not the only one!

At the moment? I honestly can't pick one. If pushed I'd have to say Hamilton, he's brought a new audience to the sport in the UK which has to be good, and he's not a bad driver either :p :

Honourable mention for Nakajima, who has done a much better job than I expected this year, in what is quite frankly an awful car.

[aryan]

In no particular order, I like these:

Davidson.

Heidfeld.

Hamilton.

Fisico.

DC.

Jarno.

Kimi.

[ioan]

Has to be Eddie Irvine.

The reason, see link below.
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Eddie_Irvine

He has one hell of a character!
Hamilton could learn a few things from him, like how to hype yourself without looking like an idiot!

[PolePosition_1]

He has one hell of a character!
Hamilton could learn a few things from him, like how to hype yourself without looking like an idiot!

Well dunno, if I remember correctly many thought Irvine was an absolute idiot when he was in F1. Its only know he has gone that the consensus is that the man was hugely entertaining and a good character for F1.

Personally I agree with you, he was a true character, and its what F1 needs. But when we get characters in F1, we just tend to run them down and down (Montoya, JV being most recent victims), and once they've gone we complain of having PR robots.

In many respects, Hamilton is fast becoming a driver with character, he's arrogant, tells the press Kimi has no balls, refuses to admit a mistake when he is wrong. I like that, its entertaining, its what F1 needs. I honestly thought Hamilton would be a total PR robot when he came into F1, but to be fair he has shown some true character, which I think is generally good for F1.

[Garry Walker]

He has one hell of a character!
Hamilton could learn a few things from him, like how to hype yourself without looking like an idiot!

Well, to be fair, some of the quotes on his wiki page are indeed quite idiotic and I also remember quite many people laughing at his constant comments about being the 2nd best driver in f1.

[ioan]

Well, to be fair, some of the quotes on his wiki page are indeed quite idiotic and I also remember quite many people laughing at his constant comments about being the 2nd best driver in f1.

I always saw Irvine's quotes as being humorous even if sometimes bordering on stupid, still I prefer it to the outright idiotic self-hyping quotes of Hammy.

[MrJan]

I always saw Irvine's quotes as being humorous even if sometimes bordering on stupid, still I prefer it to the outright idiotic self-hyping quotes of Hammy.

Irvine was far more arrogant than Hamilton and proud of it.

I would argue that Massa shouldn't be included in this thread as it's after the favourite 'racer' which I'm not sure Felipe is :p : A fantastic driver no doubt but I'm not convinced that he has what it takes in a dog fight.

Hamilton is my boy at the moment, also Kubica is pretty damn good.

[Garry Walker]

I always saw Irvine's quotes as being humorous even if sometimes bordering on stupid, still I prefer it to the outright idiotic self-hyping quotes of Hammy.

Yes, mostly that is true. Irvine was more of a wind-up funny kind of guy, whereas with Hamilton the vibe is quite different and he really does seem to think of himself as the Black Jesus.

[Garry Walker]

A fantastic driver no doubt but I'm not convinced that he has what it takes in a dog fight.


What do you mean by that?

[ioan]

What do you mean by that?

That he didn't see Felipe pass Hamilton on the outside in Hungary! ;)

Nor did he see him passing Rosberg twice and Heidfeld too in Monza while riding the kerbs in the wet!

[Garry Walker]

That he didn't see Felipe pass Hamilton on the outside in Hungary! ;)

Noone has EVER passed Hamilton on the outside ;)

[ioan]

Noone has EVER passed Hamilton on the outside ;)

Yeah, now that I think about it, it must be that I had a problem with the screen and it never happened! :D ;)

[MrJan]

What do you mean by that?

I don't think that he is as capable in an out and out race as Schumacher, Senna, Hamilton etc. (feel free to kick off that I mentioned LH with the other 2 :D ) A lot of people have been talking about KRs lack of genuine racing recently, especially in Monza when he did jack and I think that Massa is the same.

I'm not saying that he can't overtake, just that I wouldn't put him down for one of those dogfights like JPM and MS had or the Villeneuve/Arnoux scrap. Felipe just strikes me as a bit of a pussy cat at times and I think that given a wheel to wheel fight or a march up the field.

Nonetheless he is a great controller of an F1 car which I think is shown by how many of his victories come from the front row.

[ioan]

I don't think that he is as capable in an out and out race as Schumacher, Senna, Hamilton etc. (feel free to kick off that I mentioned LH with the other 2 :D ) A lot of people have been talking about KRs lack of genuine racing recently, especially in Monza when he did jack and I think that Massa is the same.

I'm not saying that he can't overtake, just that I wouldn't put him down for one of those dogfights like JPM and MS had or the Villeneuve/Arnoux scrap. Felipe just strikes me as a bit of a pussy cat at times and I think that given a wheel to wheel fight or a march up the field.

Nonetheless he is a great controller of an F1 car which I think is shown by how many of his victories come from the front row.

Felipe can be very aggressive when needed, and if the title fight goes down to the last few laps of the last GP than you will see that too.
What I like about him is that he's mature enough not to throw away points when he knows that the championship it's only decided by the points standings and not by how many brave (read bordering on dangerous and idiotic) moves one makes.

[MrJan]

The Hungary thing was alright but Hamilton barely defended the position (simply caught out I think).

When does Felipe ever really throw a pass up the inside of someone though? It's so rare that he'll pull one of those moves out of the bag that makes you go 'whoaa' like that JPM one up the inside of Michael at Brazil.

[ioan]

When does Felipe ever really throw a pass up the inside of someone though? It's so rare that he'll pull one of those moves out of the bag that makes you go 'whoaa' like that JPM one up the inside of Michael at Brazil.

3 of them passes on the inside 10 days ago in Monza, in the wet! ;)

[Garry Walker]

Yeah, now that I think about it, it must be that I had a problem with the screen and it never happened! :D ;)

You were drunk probably :D


I don't think that he is as capable in an out and out race as Schumacher, Senna, Hamilton etc. (feel free to kick off that I mentioned LH with the other 2 :D ) A lot of people have been talking about KRs lack of genuine racing recently, especially in Monza when he did jack and I think that Massa is the same.Massa and Kimi are both great racers.
But I agree that they both have had some "weak" moments. Kimi at some starts last year and Massa at Hockhenheim this year for example, where he made it too easy for Hamilton. But they can both overtake very well. Countless examples of that. Just look at Spa for some Kimi moves and Canada for some Massa moves.
Hamilton is more of the Mansell and Montoya reckless class, more agressive and balls to the wall racer.



I'm not saying that he can't overtake, just that I wouldn't put him down for one of those dogfights like JPM and MS had or the Villeneuve/Arnoux scrap. Felipe just strikes me as a bit of a pussy cat at times and I think that given a wheel to wheel fight or a march up the field.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5WsM8MRvHk ?

[wedge]

I don't think that he is as capable in an out and out race as Schumacher, Senna, Hamilton etc. (feel free to kick off that I mentioned LH with the other 2 :D ) A lot of people have been talking about KRs lack of genuine racing recently, especially in Monza when he did jack and I think that Massa is the same.

I'm not saying that he can't overtake, just that I wouldn't put him down for one of those dogfights like JPM and MS had or the Villeneuve/Arnoux scrap. Felipe just strikes me as a bit of a pussy cat at times and I think that given a wheel to wheel fight or a march up the field.

Nonetheless he is a great controller of an F1 car which I think is shown by how many of his victories come from the front row.

Suzuka 2005 showed us he's a demon overtaker he put 2 wheels on the grass to pass Webber and passed Fisi on the start of the last lap

[MrJan]

Felipe can be very aggressive when needed, and if the title fight goes down to the last few laps of the last GP than you will see that too.


But as I haven't seen any of that aggressive nature it's okay for me to think that it's not there. When I see several situations that show otherwise then I'll consider hima racer but for the minute he's just a grid place conversion kinda guy.


What I like about him is that he's mature enough not to throw away points when he knows that the championship it's only decided by the points standings and not by how many brave (read bordering on dangerous and idiotic) moves one makes.

Mature/boring, all the same to me :D As a MS fan I don't think you can comment about dangerous and idiotic moves but we'll let that one lie. Personally I like a proper racer who has the stones to do something a bit different. Points mean prizes but only in the history book as far as I'm concerned and I'll remember Colin McRae before Richard Burns.

Some people ride the consistencey boat and that's cool but I prefer someone to really go for it on every race which is why I'm a fan of LH, McRae, Solberg and Valentino Rossi :)

[MrJan]

Suzuka 2005 showed us he's a demon overtaker he put 2 wheels on the grass to pass Webber and passed Fisi on the start of the last lap

Wasn't that Kimi?


You were drunk probably :D

Massa and Kimi are both great racers.
But I agree that they both have had some "weak" moments. Kimi at some starts last year and Massa at Hockhenheim this year for example, where he made it too easy for Hamilton. But they can both overtake very well. Countless examples of that. Just look at Spa for some Kimi moves and Canada for some Massa moves.
Hamilton is more of the Mansell and Montoya reckless class, more agressive and balls to the wall racer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5WsM8MRvHk ?

Kimi I think is actually a really good racer (having seen him in Formula Renault) but for some reason is having a really rough patch.

Good hustle from both Massa and Kubica in the clip but I'd still like to see something in the dry because I'm not sure how much of that was racing and how much was just them floating into each other :D

Oh and balls to the wall is the way forward :cheese:

[PolePosition_1]

The Hungary thing was alright but Hamilton barely defended the position (simply caught out I think).

When does Felipe ever really throw a pass up the inside of someone though? It's so rare that he'll pull one of those moves out of the bag that makes you go 'whoaa' like that JPM one up the inside of Michael at Brazil.

Felipe Massa overtook more cars than any other driver in 2007.

[wedge]

Wasn't that Kimi?

Sorry I misread your post and I thought I edited my post and seems not.

[ioan]

But as I haven't seen any of that aggressive nature it's okay for me to think that it's not there.

Nah, you better buy a new TV set, cause yours might have a probem. :D



As a MS fan I don't think you can comment about dangerous and idiotic moves but we'll let that one lie.

MS made less dangerous/bonehead moves in his whole career than Hammy did in 2 seasons.

[ioan]

Felipe Massa overtook more cars than any other driver in 2007.

Facts aren't worth a dime, around here people only take opinions! Their own opinions! ;)

[Robinho]

rather boringly i like most of the current drivers.

i do like Hamilton, been waiting for him to hit F1 for years, and although his ego has grown with his career, i still am rooting for him.

Button, i really think could still do something great in the right car and i think i'd rather see him win a wdc over anyone else on the grid.

i've always liked Kimi, and Massa is growing on me.

i especially like the other new guys Kubica and Vettel,

of the rest i have soft spots for Fisi, Trulli, Webber even Alonso.

for no good reason i don't particularly like Heidfield, Piquet, Nakajima and i can't make up my mind about Rosberg

[Knock-on]

Rather boringly, I tend to follow the Brits and am proud to support them.

JB is a very fine pilot but not what I would call an out and out racer.

I would put DC in the same category but without Jensons ability although he was a good shoe in for McLaren as Heikki will prove.

There are only 3 real racers in F1 at the moment. Kubica, Alonso and Lewis.

Of those, I rate Lewis as the best racer although he does sometimes let a bit too much arrogance and bravado get on top of him.

However, this isn't a beauty parade or a popularity contest and I really only worry about what happens on track so by those rules, it's Lewis for me.

[MrJan]

Felipe Massa overtook more cars than any other driver in 2007.

Really??!!! :eek: Wow I did not realise that. Is that out on the track or just places made up from grid slot?


Nah, you better buy a new TV set, cause yours might have a probem. :D

If it's of my opinion that Massa isn't aggressive then a new TV won't change that. Nice bit of sarcasm though, even if it is one of the oldest 'jokes' in the book :up:


MS made less dangerous/bonehead moves in his whole career than Hammy did in 2 seasons.

If that's you're opinion then okay. Personally I disagree and think that both are fairly similar in their aggressive racing style.


Facts aren't worth a dime, around here people only take opinions! Their own opinions! ;)

When we are stating our own opinions then it's usually best to use them ahead of facts. If I don't believe that Massa is an out and out racer then that is my opinion (I've been through this on another thread but you seem to be ridiculous simple and just don't get it).

If I were to say that statistically Massa can't overtake then I would be wrong, but I didn't. If, however, I say that I BELIEVE that Felipe would lose a dog fight in the majority of cases then that would be my opinion and doesn't need backing up. Of course I'm also not saying that he will lose every battle, just most of them. We shall see over the coming years no doubt but if it comes down to a mano a mano fight then I think that Alonso, Kimi, Kubica, Hamilton and several other drivers would probably beat Massa on a level playing field.

You think otherwise but I choose not to make stupid, snide little comments about it but actually provide a proper explanation as to why I think that.

Mind you I do find it funny that you should say that. Seems like you could be one of the most hypocritical people on these forums Ioan.

[Corny]

my signature ;)

[smithsan]

The Autoglym Festival is also the highpoint of the year’s celebration of 50 years of Formula Junior, with separate races for each of the three eras of the formula. Gathered together will be the biggest ever entry of FJ cars together with a party for ‘anciens pilotes’ from the 1950s and ’60s.
----------
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[driveace]

Best drivers at present must be Hamilton and Alonso
Hamilton because he is a racer and tries hard,i only hope the FIA decisions dont make him another over cautious driver.
Alonso because he can set a car up AND get the best out of a car as i dont believe the Renault is as good as he makes it look
Past drivers have got to be Jim Clark and Ayrton da silva Senna

[wedge]

MS made less dangerous/bonehead moves in his whole career than Hammy did in 2 seasons.

!991 Japanese GP - trashed the car at 130R in quali though he re-deemed himself by jumping straight into Piquet's car and outqualifying him!

1992 Hockenheim testing - Senna intimidates Schumi by ruining his laps. Schumi retaliates and does the same. At the end Senna tried to punch Schumi - who ducked!

1992 French GP - punts off Senna at Adelaide hairpin. Senna gives Schumi the evil eye and good telling off. Schumi gets spooked by this and crashes into Stefano Modena after the race is restarted.

1993 Hungarian GP - forces team-mate Brundle off the road in an effort to pass him.

[keysersoze]

Current: The Fish
All-time: Patrese

Past favorites: Speed, Zanardi, Villeneuve, Alesi, Ickx, Fittipaldi, Piquet

[ShiftingGears]

Fernando Alonso.

[ioan]

!991 Japanese GP - trashed the car at 130R in quali though he re-deemed himself by jumping straight into Piquet's car and outqualifying him!

1992 Hockenheim testing - Senna intimidates Schumi by ruining his laps. Schumi retaliates and does the same. At the end Senna tried to punch Schumi - who ducked!

1992 French GP - punts off Senna at Adelaide hairpin. Senna gives Schumi the evil eye and good telling off. Schumi gets spooked by this and crashes into Stefano Modena after the race is restarted.

1993 Hungarian GP - forces team-mate Brundle off the road in an effort to pass him.

Lewy did 3 dangerous moves in the last GP alone! :D

[MrJan]

Lewy did 3 dangerous moves in the last GP alone! :D

Where? The one where he just didn't realise Glock was aloingside or the one when Mark Webber turned in on him? Check the in car of Webber on Youtube to see that one.

[PolePosition_1]

MS made less dangerous/bonehead moves in his whole career than Hammy did in 2 seasons.

You've posted this comment on another topic, and I asked you to give me these examples, but you failed to respond.

However, if you see Hamilton as making 3 dangerous moves in Monza alone, where no one was taken out, no one hurt etc as dangerous, I'm not suprised you can make that claim. Basically, you see as overtaking as dangerous yes?

[PolePosition_1]

Really??!!! :eek: Wow I did not realise that. Is that out on the track or just places made up from grid slot?




No, that stat was taken from actual real overtaking for position on track.

[Knock-on]

You've posted this comment on another topic, and I asked you to give me these examples, but you failed to respond.

However, if you see Hamilton as making 3 dangerous moves in Monza alone, where no one was taken out, no one hurt etc as dangerous, I'm not suprised you can make that claim. Basically, you see as overtaking as dangerous yes?

Come on PP, you're an intelligent man.

You must know when you're getting trolled :D

ioan always posts this sort of rubbish and restates it until he believes it's fact.

You Lewy, Ron, McLaren Lovers / Ferrari, Schumi haters are all the same ;)

[MrJan]

No, that stat was taken from actual real overtaking for position on track.

Never realised that, must have passed me by because I was so busy hating Ferrari (that's what it's all about you know) ;) :rolleyes:

[ioan]

You've posted this comment on another topic, and I asked you to give me these examples, but you failed to respond.

However, if you see Hamilton as making 3 dangerous moves in Monza alone, where no one was taken out, no one hurt etc as dangerous, I'm not suprised you can make that claim. Basically, you see as overtaking as dangerous yes?

Yes we had the discussion about Hamy being dangerous during the Italian GP.
If you think that pushing a car on the wet grass at 200+ kph, banging wheels under braking from 300+ and other such moves aren't dangerous than what use would it have for me to come up with all his dangerous moves as long as you ignore them? Should I waste half a day just to hear the same old story, that if no one died it was OK?!

[MrJan]

Yes we had the discussion about Hamy being dangerous during the Italian GP.
If you think that pushing a car on the wet grass at 200+ kph, banging wheels under braking from 300+ and other such moves aren't dangerous than what use would it have for me to come up with all his dangerous moves as long as you ignore them? Should I waste half a day just to hear the same old story, that if no one died it was OK?!

I really don't remember this. Who was it and do you have a video? Obviously we have to rely on hard facts at all times, not just what you thought you saw. The only person I remember on the grass was Glock on the exit of the first chicane but then I have a tendancy to not pay attention during Grand Prix.

I'm fine with accepting dangerous moves when they were actually dangerous.The Webber thing I thought was silly but on watching in car with Mark it looks like he was the one who turned in. The Glock one I genuinely think that Lewis wasn't aware that he was there and if we were all to expect Lewis to get out of the throttle at Spa then Timo should have lifted :p : Having competed myself, albeit at the lowest level of motorsport, I know how much time you spend concentrating and how rarely you check the mirrors, especially as you are concentrating on getting a good exit. At least that's how it is for me :D

[ioan]

I really don't remember this. Who was it and do you have a video? Obviously we have to rely on hard facts at all times, not just what you thought you saw. The only person I remember on the grass was Glock on the exit of the first chicane but then I have a tendancy to not pay attention during Grand Prix.

I'm fine with accepting dangerous moves when they were actually dangerous.The Webber thing I thought was silly but on watching in car with Mark it looks like he was the one who turned in. The Glock one I genuinely think that Lewis wasn't aware that he was there and if we were all to expect Lewis to get out of the throttle at Spa then Timo should have lifted :p : Having competed myself, albeit at the lowest level of motorsport, I know how much time you spend concentrating and how rarely you check the mirrors, especially as you are concentrating on getting a good exit. At least that's how it is for me :D

You just proved my point. :D There is no use to waste my time when all it will come to is you guys trying to find excuses for Lewy.

[PolePosition_1]

Yes we had the discussion about Hamy being dangerous during the Italian GP.
If you think that pushing a car on the wet grass at 200+ kph, banging wheels under braking from 300+ and other such moves aren't dangerous than what use would it have for me to come up with all his dangerous moves as long as you ignore them? Should I waste half a day just to hear the same old story, that if no one died it was OK?!

Well, it all depends.

Firstly, with Glock, it has to be presumed he didn't see him (in my opinion). Former F1 driver Martin Brundle has said this, looking at the circumstances, you'd have to say he probably didn't see him, so I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt. I'm not comfortable on judging someone as a dangerous on an assumption he saw him. Was it dangerous? Yes, but thats because they're racing cars at 200+ km/h in the wet. Its going to be a dangerous sport. I don't believe he intentionally push Glock onto the grass, so it wasn't him being dangerous, just dangerous conditions.

If he did see him, I'm going to agree it was dangerous. But I'm not willing to judge someone as dangerous because he saw him, when all circumstances suggest he didn't. Schumacher in Canada 1998 done a much more serious offence in coming out of the pits and just forcing Frenzten off track and pitting him into the gravel trap and out of the race. But he claimed he didn't see him, and I gave him benefit of the doubt, despite conditions being much more in direction of he did see him compared to Hamiltons situation.

With regards to Webber, just watch the footage, Webber turns into Hamilton. Its Webbers actions which caused the banging of wheels. I don't think we can class Hamilton as dangerous for defending and another driver turning into him.

[ioan]

Well, it all depends.

Firstly, with Glock, it has to be presumed he didn't see him (in my opinion). Former F1 driver Martin Brundle has said this, looking at the circumstances, you'd have to say he probably didn't see him, so I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt. I'm not comfortable on judging someone as a dangerous on an assumption he saw him. Was it dangerous? Yes, but thats because they're racing cars at 200+ km/h in the wet. Its going to be a dangerous sport. I don't believe he intentionally push Glock onto the grass, so it wasn't him being dangerous, just dangerous conditions.

If he did see him, I'm going to agree it was dangerous. But I'm not willing to judge someone as dangerous because he saw him, when all circumstances suggest he didn't. Schumacher in Canada 1998 done a much more serious offence in coming out of the pits and just forcing Frenzten off track and pitting him into the gravel trap and out of the race. But he claimed he didn't see him, and I gave him benefit of the doubt, despite conditions being much more in direction of he did see him compared to Hamiltons situation.

With regards to Webber, just watch the footage, Webber turns into Hamilton. Its Webbers actions which caused the banging of wheels. I don't think we can class Hamilton as dangerous for defending and another driver turning into him.

One more post that proves there is no point in continuing to "discuss" about this, Hamy get's the benefit of doubt no matter what.

[MrJan]

You just proved my point. :D There is no use to waste my time when all it will come to is you guys trying to find excuses for Lewy.

Not an excuse, just how I remember it.

Because I'm not just some yellow belly spouting rubbish here is the Webber video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eot15t4dQM0&feature=related

And the Glock one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65dmyU9AmG0


To me it looks like Lewis is just taking his line in each video, you obviously see different. There is a slight movement on the Webber one but the way I see it is that Mark had plenty of room and actually turned in a bit early causing the contact. With Glock I still think it was an accident but, meh.

I'm trying to be reasonable with you here and saying that I say your point of view (I just don't agree). I accept how these 2 incidents might be viewed as reckless and dangerous, even if I don't think that they were. Perhaps you would now be courteous enough to tell me where you think the third incident was and preferably give a link to video or pictures because I seriously can't remember it.

Don't be a complete c*** now because I have genuinely tried to be level and reasonable because I would like to know where this 200 mph incident took place.

I don't just give Lewis the benefit of the doubt. When I saw the Webber touch live I thought that it was reckless and could seriously jeopardise both drivers race. Likewise the whole Canada thing was stupid and there have been other instances where LH has been too hot headed and done immature things. Perhaps you would like to stop being so hypocritical and actually open your eyes to the possibility that it's not all his fault. Watch the video a few times (with your eyes open) and tell me at what time (roughly using the timer along the bottom of the video) you think Lewis should have made a different move, considering he was racing


Thank you :)

[ioan]

Not an excuse, just how I remember it.

Because I'm not just some yellow belly spouting rubbish here is the Webber video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eot15t4dQM0&feature=related

And the Glock one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65dmyU9AmG0


To me it looks like Lewis is just taking his line in each video, you obviously see different. There is a slight movement on the Webber one but the way I see it is that Mark had plenty of room and actually turned in a bit early causing the contact. With Glock I still think it was an accident but, meh.

I'm trying to be reasonable with you here and saying that I say your point of view (I just don't agree). I accept how these 2 incidents might be viewed as reckless and dangerous, even if I don't think that they were. Perhaps you would now be courteous enough to tell me where you think the third incident was and preferably give a link to video or pictures because I seriously can't remember it.

Don't be a complete c*** now because I have genuinely tried to be level and reasonable because I would like to know where this 200 mph incident took place.

I don't just give Lewis the benefit of the doubt. When I saw the Webber touch live I thought that it was reckless and could seriously jeopardise both drivers race. Likewise the whole Canada thing was stupid and there have been other instances where LH has been too hot headed and done immature things. Perhaps you would like to stop being so hypocritical and actually open your eyes to the possibility that it's not all his fault. Watch the video a few times (with your eyes open) and tell me at what time (roughly using the timer along the bottom of the video) you think Lewis should have made a different move, considering he was racing


Thank you :)

I understand that you disagree with my view, and I accept that. However I don't see why are you trying to get on my nerves with such posts?

[MrJan]

I understand that you disagree with my view, and I accept that. However I don't see why are you trying to get on my nerves with such posts?

I am seriously not trying to get on your nerves, far from it and I apologise if that is how it comes across.

Monza was a fee weeks ago and my memory isn't that great so when you say that LH made 3 stupid moves I can see where 2 of them are but would like to know when the other one happened.

This isn't for some pro-Lewis bull crap, I would just like to see a video or picture or even a report by someone that lets me know where it happened. You are always very quick to shoot down people for not having facts (myself included) but at the minute I've shown videos of the 2 incidents and explained why I disagree yet all you do is cast aside my comments with a snide remark.

I'm not going for an all out attack like Knockie, I would just like to have a civil 'conversation' about these incidents.

Oh and sorry to the mods for taking this one off-topic, there was a better placed thread for this but I can't remember which one it was :)

[PolePosition_1]

One more post that proves there is no point in continuing to "discuss" about this, Hamy get's the benefit of doubt no matter what.

If you don't want to discuss matters with people because they have a different point of view to yourself, I suggest message boards aren't the place for you.

Are you saying I should judge Hamilton on an incident on the provision that he saw Glock, which all pointers would suggest that he didn't?

And I'm afraid yes, he will get benefit of the doubt if I can't prove it beyond reasonable doubt in my mind. I just take an approach of innocent until proven guilty.

[ioan]

I am seriously not trying to get on your nerves, far from it and I apologise if that is how it comes across.

Monza was a fee weeks ago and my memory isn't that great so when you say that LH made 3 stupid moves I can see where 2 of them are but would like to know when the other one happened.

This isn't for some pro-Lewis bull crap, I would just like to see a video or picture or even a report by someone that lets me know where it happened. You are always very quick to shoot down people for not having facts (myself included) but at the minute I've shown videos of the 2 incidents and explained why I disagree yet all you do is cast aside my comments with a snide remark.

I'm not going for an all out attack like Knockie, I would just like to have a civil 'conversation' about these incidents.

Oh and sorry to the mods for taking this one off-topic, there was a better placed thread for this but I can't remember which one it was :)

There were a few other moves I didn't like, the one I remember best is when he barged his way past Fisi.

Don't ask me for which lap was or other details, my memory isn't that good either.

[ioan]

If you don't want to discuss matters with people because they have a different point of view to yourself, I suggest message boards aren't the place for you.

Didn't ask for your opinion about what I should or shouldn't do. So, please, do keep your suggestions for yourself.

[MrJan]

There were a few other moves I didn't like, the one I remember best is when he barged his way past Fisi.

Don't ask me for which lap was or other details, my memory isn't that good either.

Fair enough. Obviously you'll understand if I choose to ignore that incident then, being that you love having hard facts rather than opinions :)

Thanks for at least explaining, I'd rather that you also comment on the other videos and how you see it but it'll only end up in a slanging match so we'll steer clear :D

[Tallgeese]

Bourdais!