2008 Tour de Corse - official thread

[PLuto]

2008 Rallye de France - Tour de Corse, 13th round of World Rally Championship 2008

Official page: here (http://www.rallyedefrance.com)

[PLuto]

Entry list (http://www.autosport.cz/zavody/?id=488) contains 80 crews.

[Tom206wrc]

Thanks Pluto ;)


No Alexandre Bengué finally :(

[PLuto]

Thanks Pluto ;)


No Alexandre Bengué finally :(

No :mad:

[urabus-denoS2000]

SWRT should have given the 3rd car to Vouilloz or Bengue.
No disrespect for Tirabassi but I think that these 2 are a lot faster.

[urabus-denoS2000]

And Wilson is the first Stobart driver and Latvala the second :p :p :p

[Roy]

SWRT should have given the 3rd car to Vouilloz or Bengue.
No disrespect for Tirabassi but I think that these 2 are a lot faster.

Give? Who?
The driver gives money to drive. No team gives car seats away.

[urabus-denoS2000]

Give? Who?
The driver gives money to drive. No team gives car seats away.

Of course, I know that....
Its just the way things are in modern WRC...

[DonJippo]

Its just the way things are in modern WRC...

And they were different in some other times?

[urabus-denoS2000]

And they were different in some other times?

As far as I know they were different in the Group A era...
But if they werent I would be glad to be proven wrong.

[DonJippo]

As far as I know they were different in the Group A era...
But if they werent I would be glad to be proven wrong.

Teams have never have seats to give away just like that, not even on groupA time, either you are really talented or you bring enough money for the car, has always been like this in the past, now and in the future.

[jacko]

Teams have never have seats to give away just like that, not even on groupA time, either you are really talented or you bring enough money for the car, has always been like this in the past, now and in the future.
Exactly my thougts !!

[cut the b.s.]

Teams have never have seats to give away just like that, not even on groupA time, either you are really talented or you bring enough money for the car, has always been like this in the past, now and in the future.

Right now talent is not enough, talent and money or talent and marketability yes but talent alone goes nowhere in modern day WRC

[Tomi]

Right now talent is not enough, talent and money or talent and marketability yes but talent alone goes nowhere in modern day WRC

Or at least the talented guy is supposed to show where he goes compaired to other talented guys in WRC events with WRC car, thats not cheap theese days.

[Tom206wrc]

SWRT should have given the 3rd car to Vouilloz or Bengue.
No disrespect for Tirabassi but I think that these 2 are a lot faster.



If Vouilloz re-enters the WRC, it should be in a privateer C4, far better car than the factory Sub... ;)

[foffen]

Hi. Im going to Corsica in a week :) Wondering if anybody has any suggestions on any good places to stand and watch???

[PLuto]

I will be in Corse too (from next Monday), so you can arrive to a visit :)

[stanis]

Hi. Im going to Corsica in a week :) Wondering if anybody has any suggestions on any good places to stand and watch???

Hi, look into my Google map, there are few places...
http://maps.google.cz/maps/ms?hl=cs&gl=cz&ptab=2&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF8&msa=0&msid=101781781612086539975.00045840ca5d36d3e9237

[Tom206wrc]

OK now that Catalunya is over, let's discuss about Corsica :p :

[DIMI44]

OK now that Catalunya is over, let's discuss about Corsica :p :

For 3rd,4th etc. :rolleyes:

[User]

Bring it on!

Duval said on WRC.com that he's aiming to win here.

And as he said before he aimed at a P3 for Germany and Spain (well, we all now why that didnt happen in Spain), so he's gonna win!


...



I hope :D

[Langdale Forest]

I think that there is about a 90% chance of Loeb winning again.

[Wim_Impreza]

I should say 100 %.

[Langdale Forest]

You can never say 100% in rallying, but with Loeb you can almost.

[Tom206wrc]

I think that there is about a 90% chance of Loeb winning again.



And 20% of podium chance for Dudu...because in all case Ford will ask him again to let place to Hirvonen ;)

[wrc_flipper]

Got the Port d'Ajaccio web cam up and the WRC Trucks are arriving!

[Ghostwalker]

wrc flipper, do you have a link?

[wrc_flipper]

wrc flipper, do you have a link?

I will PM it to you - got moaned at last time I put a webcam link on

Flip

[bluuford]

Weather forecast for Tour de Corse:

Thursday: Nice weather morning 13 degrees afternoon up to 23 degrees, light wind. No rain.

Friday: Nice weather, 15 degrees morning and up to 23 degrees afternoon. No rain

Saturday: Nice weather again.. even nicer. 14 degrees morning 24 degrees afternoon Wind turns to the sea and reaches up to 6m/s. Still no rain expected

Sunday: Bit cloudy but no rain. morning temperature 15 degrees afternoon 21 degrees.

Weather looks even less exciting than it was in Spain:-) Rain possibility is as big as the possibility that Rautenbach wins in Corsica.

But still, there might be some fog on Friday and Sunday morning, but we will see :-)

[Tom206wrc]

Already plenty of pics on the french forum Forum-Auto... ;)


http://www.forum-auto.com/sport-auto/theme38/sujet378731-105.htm

[playmo]

I look forward so much to tarmac events! so much FUN!

urg! if corsica will be as exciting as catalunya, they migh as well go to the podium directly and save a lot of money by not starting at all the cars, they could show some re-run of some 90's rally and get thosands of more TV rating points, and have US (the real fans) happy wth memories (aren't those much better than the current situation?).

[Tom206wrc]

Normally shakedown has started ;)

[Buzz Lightyear]

i love these media blackouts...

imagine f1 with no qualifying or practive coverage.

[Leon]

i love these media blackouts...

imagine f1 with no qualifying or practive coverage.

WRC promotion...from bad to worse....to extinction...

[Micke_VOC]

Any news from the shakedown ??

[bluuford]

There are no news yet.. but at least the web page is giving its best: http://www.rallyedefrance.com/en/
Five stories today :-) Just helps you to go into the mood:-)

Somehow I have feeling that we are going to see very interesting tarmac rally in Corsica. There will be plenty of drama in JWRC and WRC as well :-) yeah, by the way. before the Spain I had the feeling that it is going to be boring:-)
There is very high possibility that someones engine is going to die. Loeb, Sordo, Duval, Mikko, Petter, Chris are all running third rally in a row with the same engine. And these have been very demanding (no canceled stages and no rain and Spain extremely fast).

[Daniel]

There are no news yet.. but at least the web page is giving its best: http://www.rallyedefrance.com/en/
Five stories today :-) Just helps you to go into the mood:-)

Somehow I have feeling that we are going to see very interesting tarmac rally in Corsica. There will be plenty of drama in JWRC and WRC as well :-) yeah, by the way. before the Spain I had the feeling that it is going to be boring:-)
There is very high possibility that someones engine is going to die. Loeb, Sordo, Duval, Mikko, Petter, Chris are all running third rally in a row with the same engine. And these have been very demanding (no canceled stages and no rain and Spain extremely fast).

Fast rallies aren't necessarily bad for engines. The engines get a lot of cooling on high speed stretches. It's rallies where there's a lot of acceleration and braking involved that kill engines.

[noel157]

Unofficial SD times:

Duval 3.44.9
Loeb 3.45.1
Sordo 3.45.6
Hirvonen 3.46.5
P Solberg 3.47.3
Atkinson 3.49.2
Tirabasi 3.49.5
Wilson 3.49.8
Latvala 3.50.3
Andersson 3.53.7
Gardemeister 3.53.

[AndyRAC]

i love these media blackouts...

imagine f1 with no qualifying or practive coverage.

There is nothing on the WRC site or on Autosport - the so called 'Bible of Motorsport'.

Haven't tried the event's website yet though.

[Tom206wrc]

Unofficial SD times:

Duval 3.44.9
Loeb 3.45.1
Sordo 3.45.6
Hirvonen 3.46.5
P Solberg 3.47.3
Atkinson 3.49.2
Tirabasi 3.49.5
Wilson 3.49.8
Latvala 3.50.3
Andersson 3.53.7
Gardemeister 3.53.



Thanks !!!! :)

[Norri]

Where you found the unofficial times?

[Catiocha7]

good time by Duval ...

[Viking]

From wrc.com

1. Duval: 3:44.9
2. Loeb: 3:45.1
3. Sordo: 3:45.6
4. Hirvonen: 3:46.5
5. Aava: 3:47.3
6. Mikkelsen: 3:47.6
7. P. Solberg: 3:48.3
8. Tirabassi: 3:49.5
9. Wilson: 3:49.8
10. H. Solberg: 3:49.9
11. Atkinson: 3:50.1
12. Latvala: 3:50.3
13. Gardemeister: 3:53.9
14. Rautenbach: 3:53.9
15. Andersson: 3:54.8
16. Ostberg: 3:55.4
17. Al Qassimi: 3:57.4
18. Jones: 3:59.8
19. Clark: 4:00.7

[Viking]

wrc.com also says it is a 2,2km stage, so Duval flat out made ... 35 km/h.... wow that is fast :D

[mdesign]

wrc.com also says it is a 2,2km stage, so Duval flat out made ... 35 km/h.... wow that is fast :D
In http://www.rallyedefrance.com/en/article.php?id=18407 they say 6.10 km

[Mirek]

Viking: Shakedown was changed from original.

It was finaly here (6,1 km as Mdesign mentioned):
http://fotogalerie.autosport.cz/albums/userpics/10002/shakedown~1.jpg

[Lalo]

Nice one, Francois!!

[Tom206wrc]

Remember Dudu was fastest on SD in Catalunya too... :mark:

[N.O.T]

the sd shows that duval will again have to slow down to let hirvonen get the points for 3rd place

[AlfaWRC]

It's funny to see again and again and again what people interpret into SD times...

It is only SD!!!

[VFTS]

Remember Dudu was fastest on SD in Catalunya too... :mark:

Not correct!

Shake Catalunya:
1)Loeb
2)Mikkelsen
3)Sordo
4)Duval

[Mirek]

Nice shakedown photos: http://www.ewrc.cz/ewrc/fotogalery.php?events=326&fotograf=46&all=1

And video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4LjVwNWmws

[c4]

More S/D pics

http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/photos-video-shakedown-corsica/

[Krigen]

Nice pictures :)

[User]

Duval in a Belgian newspaper: "Or I win, or I trash the car" :D

[Viking]

Duval in a Belgian newspaper: "Or I win, or I trash the car" :D

That is the real Duval back, not the one we have seen in Spain (obeying teamorders and stuff :) ).
Problem has been that he has done a lot more trashing than winning :D

[wwbroe]

Duval in a Belgian newspaper: "Or I win, or I trash the car" :D

I think he meant it a little bit sarcastic. :D

[Koppomsbo]

good morning all! soon we will be underway :)

[Brother John]

Good morning.
Duval said also that he wants to be at least faster than 1 Citroën.
He wants no team orders like in Spain! :s mokin: :p :

[Koppomsbo]

loeb on stage

[Viking]

I am hoping for Mikkelsen to continue his progress :up:
This is also Petters best tarmac rally, in fact he is the last one to beat Loeb here, in 2004.

[MikeD]

Hirvonen faster than Sordo on first split ... by a whole 1 sec.

[teufel]

I am hoping for Mikkelsen to continue his progress :up:
This is also Petters best tarmac rally, in fact he is the last one to beat Loeb here, in 2004.

Petter won Tour de Corse in 2003, Markko was the last to beat Seb here in 2004.

[Koppomsbo]

close call mikko vs sordo :)

[Viking]

Petter won Tour de Corse in 2003, Markko was the last to beat Seb here in 2004.

Sorry, my wrong, slapping myself now :)

[Brother John]

Petter is slow as usually. :dozey:

[bda]

Petter is slow as usually. :dozey:

Subaru is slow as usual!

[Viking]

Dont think Henning will win this one either.

[wwbroe]

The splits for Duval aren't so good either. :(

[Brother John]

The splits for Duval aren't so good either. :(

This was the stage where he went of with Citroën! ;)

[bda]

Big gaps back from 4th?

[AndyRAC]

Dont think Henning will win this one either.

Even slower than Wilson....

[Wimanna]

Duval hopes to improve on next stage, was not satisfied about this one

[bennizw]

Well he should improve! He said on before hand that he was going for a win, so he'd better show some winning speed.

[Brother John]

Mikkelsen 8 min. to late on the stage????????? :confused:

[Viking]

Problems for Mikkelsen :(

[Koppomsbo]

Problems for Mikkelsen :(


but he is doing ok on stage?

[Viking]

Mikkelsen 8 min. to late on the stage????????? :confused:

That could be 80sec penalty then?? :down:

[Halvis]

Dont think Henning will win this one either.

:laugh: :laugh:

To be serious, incredible how slow he is on tarmac...

[Tom206wrc]

Interesting...both Suzuki drivers slower than...Rautenbach :mark:

[Halvis]

but he is doing ok on stage?

Not really, slower than I would have expected.

[DonJippo]

Problems for Mikkelsen :(

No, problems for his co-driver...

[Viking]

That might be new codriver for Andreas :(

[Tom206wrc]

Mikkelsen was 9th on stage ;)

But if he was 8 minutes late that means many seconds penalty :(

[MikeD]

Stupid mistake from Mikkelsen and his co-driver. Throwing all away before the first stage because they got their start time wrong.

[MikeD]

Wasn't Munchi's supposed to be in this rally? Where will they do their 10th rally? Japan or GB?

[COD]

Stupid mistake from Mikkelsen and his co-driver. Throwing all away before the first stage because they got their start time wrong.

Has there been any explanation why thet were late, just an error or a technical problem on the road section???

[harriswrc]

Wasn't Munchi's supposed to be in this rally? Where will they do their 10th rally? Japan or GB?Japan

[MikeD]

Has there been any explanation why thet were late, just an error or a technical problem on the road section???

I think his co-driver simply read the start time wrongly which is completely unacceptable at this level.

[Viking]

Has there been any explanation why thet were late, just an error or a technical problem on the road section???

Calculation error from codriver

[MikeD]

Japan

Thanks - but isn't Barry Clark also supposed to drive for Munchi's in GB? (Or will that be without the possiblity for Manu points)

[Halvis]

I think his co-driver simply read the start time wrongly which is completely unacceptable at this level.

If that is correct, he has had two terrible mistakes in just 2 weeks - he threw away the Norwegian Rally Title 2 weeks ago, when he hadn't read the rules for which driver would win on equal points good enough. Mikkelsen and Fløene cruised in to 3rd in the last rally (would easily gotten at least 2nd if they tried), thinking that it was enough to win overall, when the rule actually said that if on equal points, the driver who was ahead/won the last rally would win.

So, Ostberg won the title on equal points.

[Viking]

If that is correct, he has had two terrible mistakes in just 2 weeks - he threw away the Norwegian Rally Title 2 weeks ago, when he hadn't read the rules for which driver would win on equal points good enough. Mikkelsen and Fløene cruised in to 3rd in the last rally (would easily gotten at least 2nd if they tried), thinking that it was enough to win overall, when the rule actually said that if on equal points, the driver who was ahead/won the last rally would win.

So, Ostberg won the title on equal points.

And Fløene said he wanted to quit after that one.....

[Tom206wrc]

Nice first stage by Pierre Marché, the official Suzuki France driver(2nd in Jwrc behind Prokop) !!!! :up:

[malscar]

Looks like Sordo is starting to pull back Mikko. .8 up on the third split

[A.F.F.]

Good morning.

And in case we don't see today, good afternoon and good night.

Ooh I just love these tarmac rallies :mark:

[MikeD]

Looks like Sordo is starting to pull back Mikko. .8 up on the third split

This is where it's getting nasty for Hirvonen. He simply cannot afford to let Loeb and Sordo get a 1-2 on this rally. Then he will be 16 points behind and all Loeb needs is a 5th place in one of the two last raliies.

So now it's do or die for Hirvonen.

[bluuford]

Nice first stage by Pierre Marché, the official Suzuki France driver(2nd in Jwrc behind Prokop) !!!! :up:

Looks like title contenders are thinking more about title than driving :-)
Oiger 7th and Burkart 10th :-) That will be interesting rally :-)

[COD]

So Sordo allredy passed Hirvonen, Duval next?

[Tom206wrc]

Sordo takes 2nd from Hirvonen on SS2 :p :

[MikeD]

JWRC: Ogier is 6.4 sec. in front of Burkart after SS1 (The only two drivers who can win the JWRC title)

[bluuford]

Urmo should be between Conrad and Wilson?
Ok seems he is late as well

[Koppomsbo]

pg had a flat tyre just before finish of ss1

[Viking]

Urmo should be between Conrad and Wilson?
Ok seems he is late as well

Maybe he felt sorry for Mikkelsen :confused: he for sure should run before Conrad.

[Brother John]

And which engine will be broken first? Who go off road there as firstly this weekend? ...........! :s mokin:

[Viking]

Who go off road there as firstly this weekend? ...........! :s mokin:

Kosciuszko???

[René]

Aava 6 mn late at TC 2 = 1 mn penalty the waking up is difficult this morning....

[bluuford]

Seems like Urmo has got some kind of problems:-) 60 sec penalties and very slow on the stage.. I think that it will be C4 engine that is going to give up and it will be car nr 25 :-(

[Brother John]

Aava 6 mn late at TC 2 = 1 mn penalty the waking up is difficult this morning....

That is what you gets with second hands C4 cars.
It is not the first time that private drivers get SH!T cars from Citroën. :rolleyes:
QUESTION STOHL AND CARLSSON. :p :

[bluuford]

Oiger is even slower on the second one:-) Or burkart is just faster.. I will tell you.. JWRC fight will be very interesting this weekend

[René]

That is what you gets with second hands C4 cars.
It is not the first time that private drivers get SH!T cars from Citroën. :rolleyes:
QUESTION STOHL AND CARLSSON. :p :


I don't know if it's car probs, but last week I was in Catalonia and Urmo made a nice Rally with very impressive passages! And good result too !

[Mirek]

I don't know if it's car probs, but last week I was in Catalonia and Urmo made a nice Rally with very impressive passages! And good result too !

Is crash that good result? ;)

[Buzz Lightyear]

Good morning.

And in case we don't see today, good afternoon and good night.

Ooh I just love these tarmac rallies :mark:

This sh*t is just plain boring.... I would rather have hemroids

[Mirek]

Guys, watch JWRC. It will be much more exciting ;)

[MikeD]

Oiger is even slower on the second one:-) Or burkart is just faster.. I will tell you.. JWRC fight will be very interesting this weekend

Ogier ended up being the fastest of the two on SS2. Burkart doesn't deserve the JWRC title IMHO.

[René]

]Is crash that good result? ;)

Before it of course ! ;)
He must learn and we cannot judge drivers on their mistakes, otherwise we could send the half of the competitors at home.

[Buzz Lightyear]

Ogier ended up being the fastest of the two on SS2. Burkart doesn't deserve the JWRC title IMHO.

You could say the same for Richard Burns when he won the WRC.

[Mirek]

René: Understand, no problem ;)

Tom206: Marché lost a lot on SS2... :(

[MikeD]

You could say the same for Richard Burns when he won the WRC.

I also did ;) But he did after all win one Rally, Burkart hasn't won a single rally this year - Ogier has won 3.

[René]

Sordo stoped in the stage .........

[Woodeye]

I also did ;) But he did after all win one Rally, Burkart hasn't won a single rally this year - Ogier has won 3.

And I thought that the one who has the most points at the end of the year deserves to win.. :mark:

[DonJippo]

Sordo stopped on stage.

[Brother John]

There you have it already, Sordo stopped. :p : Who will be next?

[Buzz Lightyear]

Crashed or Mechanical.... poll now open

my vote, crashed

[MikeD]

Sordo stoped in the stage .........

F*ck :(

[teufel]

You could say the same for Richard Burns when he won the WRC.

Not the same class, not the same quality of the opponents...
Look at this year's JWRC, it should be a two horse race between Ogier and Prokop, the others are so far behind, imo.

[Viking]

Sordo stoped in the stage .........

So Citroen has to put away their Manu WRC Champagne then?

[MikeD]

And I thought that the one who has the most points at the end of the year deserves to win.. :mark:


Guess it's a matter of opinion. The one who has the most points wins, but there are times where I don't think it's the one who deserves the title. Others will of couse think differently.

[Leon]

So Citroen has to put away their Manu WRC Champagne then?

...And Duval will not be allowed to thrash it...

(if he wants a WRC future)

[bluuford]

I think that Oiger is lacking experience on the competition side. Most of the wins have been without much pressure. And you can clearly see it from today's results. I just tried to compare with last year when Urmo and PG were fighting with each other.. then they were the fastest in JWRC as well. But of course, Oiger does not need to push much.

[MikeD]

Sordo did crash - not mecanical

[bluuford]

by the way: http://www.vysledky-rally.cz/vysledky/?rz=875&filtr=
Comments for third stage are running with second stage :-)

anyway.. very bad rally for citroen so far Their home rally and 50% of their C4-s are already in trouble. Home walls are heavy :-)

[Micke_VOC]

anyway.. very bad rally for citroen so far Their home rally and 50% of their C4-s are already in trouble. Home walls are heavy :-)

but very good for the championship ...

[bluuford]

Broken damper for Aava.. and top 8 stage time :-)

[Viking]

Subaru might not have the best car, but battle between their drivers is fierce :)

[Micke_VOC]

Puncture for Wilson ?

[Buzz Lightyear]

Puncture for Wilson ?

You tend to get punctures when put the car off. Going slow and then putting the car off... oh dear. :mark:

[bluuford]

Puncture for Wilson ?

Went off into the trees.. spectators pushed back on road and reached to the finish with broken front and very wobbling wheel and tire.

[Viking]

Mikkelsen and Aava could be in the points at the end of the day :up:

[noel157]

Mikkelsen has 1.20 penalty
Aava has 1.00 penalty.
But early days yet, another 2.5 days to go.

[Zes]

Mikkelsen and Aava could be in the points at the end of the day :up:

And Suzuki's on the podium...

[AndyRAC]

You tend to get punctures when put the car off. Going slow and then putting the car off... oh dear. :mark:

Which isn't clever, if he put it off when he was on the pace - that would be different, but putting it off when going 'slow'. Don't like bashing Matt, but he's now in the third year of the 5 year plan - and he's not coming close to setting top 3 times. And in the weakest era of the WRC.

[Viking]

And Suzuki's on the podium...

I think my prediction is more likely :)

Anyway more has happened here in 3 stages than in the whole rally in Spain!

[Fly]

In JWRC, good stage times set by Marche, Augoyard and especially 23 years old Campana.
It looks like there's deepness in France's "team". There is a future in rallying for my neighbours.

[Wim_Impreza]

Anyway more has happened here in 3 stages than in the whole rally in Spain!

That's every year the same. ;)

[bluuford]

I think that we are going to see a lot in the afternoon. looks like the dirty road causes a lot bad at the tail end of the competitors line. 13 drivers of 71 are already retired from the day! And if you look at the entry list then you can see that from starting number 84 to starting number 93 all but one car have been retired! An that one has lost a lot of time.

[I am evil Homer]

Which isn't clever, if he put it off when he was on the pace - that would be different, but putting it off when going 'slow'. Don't like bashing Matt, but he's now in the third year of the 5 year plan - and he's not coming close to setting top 3 times. And in the weakest era of the WRC.

I think that's telling about his ability. He's in a decent car, not world beating but a year old Focus is still a good car. I don't expect Wilson to beat Loeb, Mikko, Sordo or JM-L but I was hoping to see some improvement in stage times, mixing it with the Subbes regulalry.

[tmx]

Ford have a chance at the manufacturer title again.

[Viking]

Henning "I am in front of Sordo" :laugh:

[turves]

Henning "I am in front of Sordo" :laugh:


thats the best quote of the year...

[bluuford]

Ford have a chance at the manufacturer title again.

To have a realistic chance, then at least one of the Fords should finish in front of Citroen in France and then Ford must finish 1-2 the remaining events and hope that Henning can finish in front of Sordo in some events.

Well now the conditions are equal and we will see what happens with Duval´s times.

[mdesign]

To make the championship interesting loeb and citroen should get zero points in corsica. But that would need some "help" from Loeb's C4 engine

[cut the b.s.]

You could say the same for Richard Burns when he won the WRC.


Maybe, but I could argue he deserved it more than Gronholm in '00, definitely over his career Burns deserved a title. Burkart has never really looked like real championship winning material, the points flatter him some in this, the weakest JWRC yet

[MikeD]

I sometimes wonder if the rallyworld will ever see a tarmac driver like Loeb again. Am I alone with that one?

[jonkka]

Depends on what you mean by "driver like Loeb"...

[MikeD]

Depends on what you mean by "driver like Loeb"...

... as fast as him. (without throwing the car of the road)

[N.O.T]

I sometimes wonder if the rallyworld will ever see a tarmac driver like Loeb again. Am I alone with that one?

quite likely.... before Loeb was Panizzi who seemed unbeatable on tarmac and that wasn't long ago...

also bear in mind that Loeb was french gravel champion...funny.

[jonkka]

Impossible to compare - so question is absurd...

[xavier]

quite likely.... before Loeb was Panizzi who seemed unbeatable on tarmac and that wasn't long ago...


Still between 2000 and 2002 Gilles got 6 win out of 13 tarmac events.
Seb, Between 2003 and 2008, got 20 out of 25! and 15 out of 16 since 2005.

So clearly Gilles' dominance on Tarmac is nowhere close to Seb's.

[jonkka]

Still between 2000 and 2002 Gilles got 6 win out of 13 tarmac events.
Seb, Between 2003 and 2008, got 20 out of 25! and 15 out of 16 since 2005.

So clearly Gilles' dominance on Tarmac is nowhere close to Seb's.

Mike said "speed", not "wins".

[AndyRAC]

Still between 2000 and 2002 Gilles got 6 win out of 13 tarmac events.
Seb, Between 2003 and 2008, got 20 out of 25! and 15 out of 16 since 2005.

So clearly Gilles' dominance on Tarmac is nowhere close to Seb's.

Though, it must be said that the competition is pretty weak nowadays. That's taking nothing away from Seb, who is a legend of the sport.

[N.O.T]

Still between 2000 and 2002 Gilles got 6 win out of 13 tarmac events.
Seb, Between 2003 and 2008, got 20 out of 25! and 15 out of 16 since 2005.

So clearly Gilles' dominance on Tarmac is nowhere close to Seb's.

yes but back then the competion on tarmac was fierce since almost all factory teams hires tarmac specialists (puras, bugalski, delecour...) with the current rules teams prefer more complete drivers and don't waste money on specialists

[MikeD]

JWRC: Burkart losing 10 sec to Ogier on this stage.

[René]

JWRC: Burkart losing 10 sec to Ogier on this stage.

Ogier uses the Loeb method, the first run to see and the second to break! :cool:

[jonkka]

Where is Mikko?

[Wimanna]

Where is Hirvonen?

[N.O.T]

GPS problem i guess

[jonkka]

Mikko 3.3s faster than Loeb on split 3! :eek:

[N.O.T]

3 seconds faster than Loeb on spit 3 !!

[teufel]

GPS problem i guess

I hope!

[KKS]

It's rhythm so fast for Mikko

[MikeD]

GPS problem i guess

Looks to be a problem for both Fords (Duval is also missing). But Mikko is back on third split 3.3 faster than Loeb

[N.O.T]

Loeb follows exactly the same pace as this morning....so he is playing it safe.

[N.O.T]

Loeb 1 second slower than his morning pass....

[Wimanna]

Looks to be a problem for both Fords (Duval is also missing). But Mikko is back on third split 3.3 faster than Loeb

Duval starts behind Henning Solberg, no?

[N.O.T]

Hirvonen lost a lot in the last 2 splits...

[MikeD]

....ehhhhh Mikko lost 6 sec on that split. Looks to be a mistake...

[KKS]

wow... Atko behind only 0.1 at overall

[MikeD]

Breaking news: GM (General Motors) is close to being declared bankrupt. I guess that's the imidiate end of the possibility of Opel comming into the WRC with their S2000. It will most likely also be the end of Chevrolet in the WTCC

[wwbroe]

Breaking news: GM (General Motors) is close to being declared bankrupt. I guess that's the imidiate end of the possibility of Opel comming into the WRC with their S2000. It will most likely also be the end of Chevrolet in the WTCC

Where did you got this news from? Is it sure yet or just supposing? :(

[MikeD]

Where did you got this news from? Is it sure yet or just supposing? :(

Epn News which is a business site. The news is currently affecting the leading Index's all over Europe (FTSE, CAC, DAX, IBEX etc.)

Damn this financial crisis which has so far cost me £12.000. Not funny at all :(

[noel157]

Breaking news: GM (General Motors) is close to being declared bankrupt. I guess that's the imidiate end of the possibility of Opel comming into the WRC with their S2000. It will most likely also be the end of Chevrolet in the WTCC

Unlikely to fail, US Gov giving US$25 billion of loans to US car industry. But you're right, non core activity will most likely go. Anyway, back to T de C.

[jonkka]

Epn News which is a business site. The news is currently affecting the leading Index's all over Europe (FTSE, CAC, DAC, IBEX etc.)

Damn this financial crisis which has so far cost me £12.000. Not funny at all :(

GM's bankruptcy is not a certain thing at any level, though they'll be going through hell (as are all other automobile manufacturers, especially American ones).

PS: Try short-selling, it's best way to deal with stocks going down.

[MikeD]

GM's bankruptcy is not a certain thing at any level, though they'll be going through hell (as are all other automobile manufacturers, especially American ones).

Don't get me wrong, I hope they survive, but the news is also on Bloomberg now.


PS: Try short-selling, it's best way to deal with stocks going down.

That's unfortunately is illigal in Denmark

[jonkka]

That's unfortunately is illigal in Denmark

What? Do they close the stock exchange if stocks go down, like in Moscow? Geez... try warrants then, that's bit riskier but those can't be illegal...

[wwbroe]

Back to Tour de Corse now, last stage of the day is live now. :D

[N.O.T]

agressive start by Atko

[N.O.T]

Again Loeb takes it easy he has exactly the same pace as this morning

[wwbroe]

agressive start by Atko

And Petter even more agressive start. :D

[KKS]

Subaru so strong car. 1st split shows it.

[wwbroe]

No split for Hirvonen?

[MikeD]

What? Do they close the stock exchange if stocks go down, like in Moscow? Geez... try warrants then, that's bit riskier but those can't be illegal...

Ok, thanks for the advise :)

[wwbroe]

Henning stopped in the stage? :confused:

[jonkka]

That's what WRR says

[MikeD]

Mikko 6.4 slower

[wwbroe]

Miko is on end of stage, so probably problem with tracking system.

[Corny]

Henning stopped in the stage? :confused:

Ah, maybe that's why Duval lost that 1.7 second :p

[wwbroe]

Henning is moving again, but allready loosing almost five minutes. :mad:

[N.O.T]

the battle of the subarus with latvala will be exciting tommorow....

[MikeD]

Please Colin .... no singing!

[Corny]

I think Duval can beat Mikko tomorrow, as he doesn't have to begin on a dirty road..

Just hope that it'll rain tomorrow or on sunday, maybe that's Duval's only chance

[Halvis]

I think Duval can beat Mikko tomorrow, as he doesn't have to begin on a dirty road..

Just hope that it'll rain tomorrow or on sunday, maybe that's Duval's only chance

Yes, he probably can, but will he be allowed? I don't think so...

[wwbroe]

Yes, he probably can, but will he be allowed? I don't think so...

I think you have a good point there, but even if he is allowed to attack maximum, i still think it will be very difficult to beat Loeb on this rally. ;)

[Halvis]

SS6 were a good stage for Petter, almost on pace with Mikko and Duval. Also good from Mikkelsen, back into the points!

[KKS]

I think Duval can beat Mikko tomorrow

Yes if course, But at Sunday he lose all Sat time and 1.7 seconds

[wwbroe]

Bettega is doing very well in his Honda and is only 4.6 sec of Prokop, who is leading the JWRC. ;)

[wwbroe]

But i am wrong, because it is Campana in his Clio R3 who is actualy leading the JWRC with 9.1 sec in front of Prokop. ;)

[Mirek]

Prokop had a puncture and dropped to second place.

Bettega is driving Clio, wwbroe (Honda in IRC) ;)

[wwbroe]

]Prokop had a puncture and dropped to second place.

Bettega is driving Clio, wwbroe (Honda in IRC) ;)

Oops, my mistake, i was thinking he was in Honda. Anyhow not doing too bad after all. ;)

[rx1352]

Thancs for the updat in the jwrc :rolleyes:

[Lalo]

What about Ogier? Where is he?

Good pace from Gardemeister in 7th, ahead of Mikkelsen. Doubt he can hold that possition, but it shows some improvement to the car's debut a year ago.

[Halvis]

What about Ogier? Where is he?

Good pace from Gardemeister in 7th, ahead of Mikkelsen. Doubt he can hold that possition, but it shows some improvement to the car's debut a year ago.

You have to consider that Mikkelsen has 1.20 mins penalty - so Garde is more than 1.10 slower than him in driving.

[Buzz Lightyear]

Summary

Loeb is in another planet.
Is Duval really not quicker than Mikko?
Latvala is learning.
Solberg has found his mojo.
Subarus only where they should have been with new car in Germany. OK.
3 British drivers pace is nothing short of a disgrace. Jones, Wilson, Clark.
Sordo seems to crack under pressure... he is not another Loeb.
Ogier lacks self belief. has not the confidence to push... he is not another Loeb.
Mikkelson should fine another co-driver.
Suzuki...poor. PG and Gardemonster will not like getting beatin by Rautenbach.

[Corny]

Loeb is in another planet.
Is Duval really not quicker than Mikko?
Latvala is learning.
Solberg has found his mojo.
Subarus only where they should have been with new car in Germany. OK.
3 British drivers pace is nothing short of a disgrace. Jones, Wilson, Clark.
Sordo seems to crack under pressure... he is not another Loeb.
Ogier lacks self belief. has not the confidence to push... he is not another Loeb.
Mikkelson should fine another co-driver.
Suzuki...poor. PG and Gardemonster will not like getting beatin by Rautenbach.
I thought I was negative al the time but you... :p

[COD]

Good pace from Gardemeister in 7th, ahead of Mikkelsen. Doubt he can hold that possition, but it shows some improvement to the car's debut a year ago.


Not by as much as they should have... Besides, Garde's co-driver Tomi Tuominen said on WRR that they are disapointed because sec/km they are slower (compared to fastest) than in Spain

[Karbonyl]

Ogier lacks self belief. has not the confidence to push... he is not another Loeb.I disagree. I think Ogi is doing proffesional performance when securing the Sunday's finishing. He has no other target at this moment.

[Mirek]

Agree. And let's not forget it's Ogier's first ever season in JWRC and S1600 while most of others have several seasons experience.

[c4]

Some Day 1 pics
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/tour-de-corse-08-day-1-results/

[Lalo]

Here's Dani's accident: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeCCUVE4Fbs

He was very lucky not to fall off the road on the right side or to nosecrash. Pretty sure he can superrally. It doesn't seem very resious if you only look at the damage done, but it was a lucky escape for sure.

[Buzz Lightyear]

I disagree. I think Ogi is doing proffesional performance when securing the Sunday's finishing. He has no other target at this moment.

At this moment.. he lacks self belief. has not the confidence to push... he is not another Loeb. fact.

[wwbroe]

Here's Dani's accident: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeCCUVE4Fbs

He was very lucky not to fall off the road on the right side or to nosecrash. Pretty sure he can superrally. It doesn't seem very resious if you only look at the damage done, but it was a lucky escape for sure.

He will not restart in Superally because they found some damage to rollcage, so no Sordo today or tomorrow. :(

[wwbroe]

At this moment.. he lacks self belief. has not the confidence to push... he is not another Loeb. fact.

How can you tell this allready, do you think Loeb was so self-confident in his first season? I think Ogier is doing fine job, i am not saying it will be another Loeb, because it is far too soon to say something about that. He is just discovering the JWRC and was never in a WRC car, so how can you say allready if he will be any good or not? If you are that good in discovering real rally-gods then you should urgently become a rally-manager, you would be able to make a lot of money. :D

[wwbroe]

Good morning guys, first stage off the day should be live now. ;)

[Viking]

Good morning! day 2 is under way :)

[jonkka]

Morning... weary eyed but I am here...

[jonkka]

Duval on attack mode... it's a long way to Loeb but...

[KKS]

...Ogier.... He is just discovering the JWRC and was never in a WRC car, so how can you say allready if he will be any good or not?

At real rally - not ever, but he tested c4WRC at September

[KKS]

Duval on attack mode... it's a long way to Loeb but...

only 1st split as usual

[wwbroe]

Duval on attack mode... it's a long way to Loeb but...

He is loosing at second split, even compared to Miko.

[Viking]

Morning... weary eyed but I am here...

Celebrating the peace price??? ;)

[jonkka]

Celebrating the peace price??? ;)

Nah, I am not a social-democrat (like mr Ahtisaari) and never drink to his honor...

[wwbroe]

He is loosing at second split, even compared to Miko.

Faster then Miko on third split tough, and close to Loeb, but not faster.

[wwbroe]

And four seconds faster as Miko, so taking second place, that is just for a moment, untill Wilson will tell him to back off again. :D

[jonkka]

Duval's pace is somewhat removed from one needed to pressure Loeb...

[KKS]

Looks like Duval playing with Mikko splits. At end SS7 Duval be behind Mikko (Malcom wish)

[wwbroe]

Duval is taking second position, but only just.

[wwbroe]

Solberg's times aren't that bad if you compare them with Duval and Hirvonen, so maybe there is a little light at the end of Subaru's tunnel. :D

[User]

Duval is obviously faster then Mikko. Maybe he got permission to put some pressure on Loeb. We'll see :)

[jonkka]

Mikkelsen loses minutes

[wwbroe]

Urmo Aava is not on his usual speed neither, normally he should be fighting with Solberg, Latvalla and Atkinson :confused:

[Viking]

That looks like a puncture for Mikkelsen :(

[Tom206wrc]

Mikkelsen :s

[Viking]

Urmo Aava is not on his usual speed neither, normally he should be fighting with Solberg, Latvalla and Atkinson :confused:

He might move in to 7`th after this stage.

[MikeD]

Nah, I am not a social-democrat (like mr Ahtisaari) and never drink to his honor...

Good to hear you are not in the "red" camp (Would also have been a bad fit with your stock knowledge :D ), but motorsport fans rarely are.

[Lalo]

Aava up to 7th, ahead of Tirabassi. Garde down to 9th.

[MikeD]

Tirabassi is doing quite well...might end up scoring a point or two.

[Lalo]

Good display from Subaru so far. Petter complained of a little too understeer, but improvements in the car are easy to see.

Just some more tweeks and setup changes..

What a rally to forget for Mikkelsen. First the time penalty, then the puncture.. Despite that, he has shown good speed here.

I'm going to bed now. It's 4:30am here in Buenos Aires. See ya guys!

[Viking]

I have to go also, have to drive my daughter to a handball match. See ya later!

[MikeD]

Ogier is kicking the shït out of Burkart :D

[René]

Ogier is kicking the shït out of Burkart :D

With 25 kg of spare parts inside the car but obviously it does not look to penalize him.....