How Good has 2008 Moto GP season been so far ?

[alfa155btcc]

as the the Thread say what your guys views on this season so far does it rate as one of the best so far or could it be better, and who`s gonna be champion at the end ?

Whats gonna happen in the last 5 rounds ?

I think it has been one of the best seasons so far and very exciting alot better than F1 stuff :D , give me Moto GP any day.

I think The Docot will be Champ his 8th in Total WoW, think Pedrosa will nick 2nd place from stoner, Stoner has been the qualifying master but this means nothing come race day. Would also like Toseland to get a Podium maybe too early but not a bad rookie season for the englishman.

:s mokin: :s mokin: :s mokin: :s mokin:

[T-D]

1 race for the ages, but otherwise mostly pedestrian and unremarkable processions marked by ocassional mid-field scraps that we never see.

[ChrisS]

1 race for the ages, but otherwise mostly pedestrian and unremarkable processions marked by ocassional mid-field scraps that we never see.

Pretty much sums up my view of the season too. Also add that once again the tyres have often overshadowed the bikes and the riders

[ShiftingGears]

1 race for the ages, but otherwise mostly pedestrian and unremarkable processions marked by ocassional mid-field scraps that we never see.

Bingo. They tried fixing something that wasn't broke by changing to 800's.

[The Phantom]

It's easy to forget what went on earlier in the season. Lorenzo blew us all away for three races straight, no-one expected anything like that. Toseland did indeed impress early, but settled into the sort of rookie year that most expected from him.

Edwards had his usual flashes of brilliance before fading, and the less said of Hayden's year the better.

Up until Stoner crashed at Brno I thought we were in for a ripper of a run to the line, but he's single-handedly ruined the season for the fans! :p OK Rossi has done his bit too by being a lot more competitive than many expected - never rule out JB and The Doctor!

Some fairly processional races but overall it's been interesting; then again I'm here for more than just big names swapping paint at the front. Even the boring races are exciting for me.

[MrJan]

It's been lame ever since the 800s came in. Remember the battles of Rossi and Sete? The endless changes of position, 5 or 6 riders battling for the lead. By comparison I think that this season has been dull. It seems the only question is whether Rossi can peg Stoner back and if Dani can manage 3rd.

At least a few years back when Rossi was trouncing everyone you'd get decent battles down through the pack for nearly the whole race whereas now you might be lucky to see a 3 way fight for about 5 laps. The margins have changed drastically too, I remember a Brno when Loris won by about 7 seconds or something and I couldn't believe it, this season Vale won Brno by about 20 seconds at a jog :down:

As for the championship, I'll be very surprised if anyone breaches the gap to Rossi.

[CaptainRaiden]

Laguna Seca was the only brilliant one, and that is it. I'm really hoping for a scrap to finish in the remaining races. Maybe Stoner would want to prove that he is not scared of the doctor, and Rossi would want to prove that he can beat Stoner in a straight fight again on a wider track than Laguna (without starting 30 seconds ahead :p ).

Strange, isn't it? If you get the engine capacity down, you would expect the bikes to get slower and let the smaller factory teams and the midfield catch up to the front and provide maybe more overtaking moves, but so far it has been a disappointment. Only I think Catalunya last year between Rossi, Stoner and Pedrosa and Laguna this year.

[MrJan]

Laguna Seca was the only brilliant one, and that is it. I'm really hoping for a scrap to finish in the remaining races. Maybe Stoner would want to prove that he is not scared of the doctor, and Rossi would want to prove that he can beat Stoner in a straight fight again on a wider track than Laguna (without starting 30 seconds ahead :p ).

Even Laguna was over before halfway. What ever happend to the last lap battle?

[The Phantom]

Well, the Laguna clash actually went for 23 of 30 laps before Stoner went down in the soft kittylitter, but it was so agonising that it felt like the race had barely started ;)

But yeah, I can't recall a good last lap stoush for a while now. Unless you're talking WSB :)

[MrJan]

Well, the Laguna clash actually went for 23 of 30 laps before Stoner went down in the soft kittylitter, but it was so agonising that it felt like the race had barely started ;)

Realy?!!! Didn't seem like that long a battle, not like some of the stuff we've seen at Mugello etc.

Unlike the OP I've been very underwhelmed by this season. I had to record Misano because I was racing but fell asleep while watching and about 3 laps after Casey fell I just gave up and went to bed, that wouldn't have happened 3 or so seasons ago :down:

[MrJan]

Old Thread (http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120830&page=2&highlight=who+killed+moto)

Some may remember that I posted this thread last year (when I went under the name Miguel Sanchez), I still haven't seen what I'd consider a turnaround.

I take issue with JETFXs 'Krusty' comment as well. Yes I'm a Rossi fan but the thread was never about who won or lost, just how it was done. Likewise I don't have an opinion on control tyres, I just want racing that is enjoyable to watch which I still don't think is happening.

[ShiftingGears]

Strange, isn't it? If you get the engine capacity down, you would expect the bikes to get slower and let the smaller factory teams and the midfield catch up to the front and provide maybe more overtaking moves

Wheres the logic in that? It's not like the frontrunners are more disadvantaged than the midfield after a rule change like a reduction of engine capacity.

[CaptainRaiden]

Wheres the logic in that? It's not like the frontrunners are more disadvantaged than the midfield after a rule change like a reduction of engine capacity.

I didn't say they are disadvantaged. What I meant was that because of the reduced cost in making those 800 cc engines, it would probably be a bit lighter on the pockets of smaller factories, for example like Kawasaki and Ducati. I know it's not a big deal, but maybe producing smaller engines require smaller (albeit not a huge difference) budgets. I know the capacity was reduced in the name of safety, but probably they also had cost-cutting in mind while doing that.

They probably thought that this rule change would help smaller factories put more cash into other departments like aero and suspension etc. However, they didn't cap the budgets and didn't have an idea what bigger factories would do. Like how Honda had a revolutionary design in 2006, a new bike to suit the new regulations, and we are back to square one. The midfield gets year old bikes from HRC.

However Ducati was able to work their 800cc engine into an evolution of their GP6 bike, it clicked and Preziosi and Stoner turned it into a championship winner GP7. Bigger factories have experience working with big 1000 cc racing engines, but the same can't be said about smaller factories. Probably for some manufacturers like Ducati, it's easier to work with an 800 cc motor in MotoGP than a bigger 990 cc one. I know they have bigger capacity motors working fine in SBK, but MotoGP is different. That's all I'm saying.

[ShiftingGears]

I didn't say they are disadvantaged. What I meant was that because of the reduced cost in making those 800 cc engines, it would probably be a bit lighter on the pockets of smaller factories, for example like Kawasaki and Ducati. I know it's not a big deal, but maybe producing smaller engines require smaller (albeit not a huge difference) budgets. I know the capacity was reduced in the name of safety, but probably they also had cost-cutting in mind while doing that.

I doubt there'd be reduced cost. Theres always areas within the engine which can be modified, no matter how big it is. And the R&D involved in changing to 800's disadvantaged the smaller teams anyway.

[CaptainRaiden]

I doubt there'd be reduced cost. Theres always areas within the engine which can be modified, no matter how big it is. And the R&D involved in changing to 800's disadvantaged the smaller teams anyway.

Maybe not. Maybe teams like Ducati already had quite good expertise in running 800 cc mills for a long time. Same could be said about Kawasaki, so they really didn't have to try extra hard or shell out that many more bucks for R&D.

Maybe they struggled during the days of 990cc, especially in the case of Ducati and their desmodromic valve engines, which are more expensive and complicated to maintain. However, nobody foresaw the pickle some of the smaller teams are in now.

Also, the rule is ridiculous, much like F1. The bikes are now almost as fast as their 990 cc predecessors and we have more riders getting injured than ever.

[ArmchairBikeFan]

This year has been intriguing, but not that exciting apart from Laguna. The off-track soap opera stuff has been good fun, like Dani's tyre tantrum. Some of the races have been horrible snoozefests, though.

[neninja]

Apart from the odd mid pack battle the MotoGP has been over shadowed most weeks by the two strokes.

It's been like watching F1 but with an occasional overtake early on in MotoGP. The spectacle has not been helped by Stoner's sudden attack of the wobbles which has denied us at least a couple of potential fights at the front.

Hopefully things will level next year as this year the tyres have played too big a part (again) and some teams have taken to long to get on the pace (or haven't got there at all like Kawasaki)

[MrJan]

This year has been intriguing, but not that exciting apart from Laguna. The off-track soap opera stuff has been good fun, like Dani's tyre tantrum. Some of the races have been horrible snoozefests, though.

Indeed, the off track stuff has been interesting but how long has it been since we were less interested in racing than the rest of the circus?

[maxu05]

The races have been both interesting and boring IMO.
Interesting off the track, and boring on the track, with some notable exceptions of course. The reason for the racing being boring is not because of the tyres, or the switch to 800cc, or the bikes not having enough power. The real party pooper is the electronics that control traction, engine braking and braking. Motogp was doing OK with Bridgestone and Michelin fighting for title rights until traction control came into it. How can so many great riders struggle all of a sudden ? Melandri, Hopkins, Edwards, Hayden, (just to name a few) are all having a hard time). Look at Casey before the 800cc era began, blindingly quick, but crashed every other Sunday, then, enter the 800cc traction control era and he is a super star,(nothing against Casey by the way, not criticising, just looking at it from a different perspective). Is Casey making mistakes, or is the computer on board making them ? I would love to see the 800's stay, minus the electronic aids, then we will see a more even playing field. I think we would see the odd surprise victory from a satelite team from time to time, wich would be the boost that Motogp needs.
Ok, I will go back to my box now :)

[ChrisS]

I didn't say they are disadvantaged. What I meant was that because of the reduced cost in making those 800 cc engines, it would probably be a bit lighter on the pockets of smaller factories, for example like Kawasaki and Ducati. I know it's not a big deal, but maybe producing smaller engines require smaller (albeit not a huge difference) budgets. I know the capacity was reduced in the name of safety, but probably they also had cost-cutting in mind while doing that.

They probably thought that this rule change would help smaller factories put more cash into other departments like aero and suspension etc. However, they didn't cap the budgets and didn't have an idea what bigger factories would do. Like how Honda had a revolutionary design in 2006, a new bike to suit the new regulations, and we are back to square one. The midfield gets year old bikes from HRC.

However Ducati was able to work their 800cc engine into an evolution of their GP6 bike, it clicked and Preziosi and Stoner turned it into a championship winner GP7. Bigger factories have experience working with big 1000 cc racing engines, but the same can't be said about smaller factories. Probably for some manufacturers like Ducati, it's easier to work with an 800 cc motor in MotoGP than a bigger 990 cc one. I know they have bigger capacity motors working fine in SBK, but MotoGP is different. That's all I'm saying.

800cc are in no way cheaper to make than the 990cc engines In fact making an 800cc engine in 2007 starting with a blank paper is quite more expensive than making a 990cc engine in 2006 starting with a base model with 4 years development. Everyone was expecting the bigger factories were going to have an advantage early on because of that.

In adition to the initial R&D costs. 800cc engines rev higher, so much higher that the 990s that spring valves have trouble handling the revs and teams started using pneumatic valve engines.Also smaller engines use smaller parts, yet these smaller parts are stressed much more that the old 990cc parts and therefore need to be much stronger. The drop in ccs is 20% yet only about 10% drop in power shows how much more the 800s are stressed.

As for experience, what experience did the big factories had with 1000 cc racing engines? Even in SBK the Japanese used to race 750cc engines (with the exception of the RC51) until the rules changed in 2003 (after MotoGP went to 4-stroke)

[MrJan]

Firstly, bit thrown by John not having the Chinese flag, just though "oh no not another Aussie chancer" :D :p :

Secondly I think that while it may not have happened the initial idea of bringing in the 800s was to reduce cost and speeds. It was obvious that costs would go up in terms of research etc but the idea was that it'd pay off by allowing the smaller fuel tanks/less fuel thing. Ultimately though it all went tits up :)

[Corny]

Good on it's winner yes, but apart from that very bad I'm afraid.. Only the quali's have been quit okay

I think we could've had far more battles for first place, but as Casey will always crash when coming on little pressure, that has not been the case..

Though I don't think that anyone in this field is up to Rossi in a fight.. Maybe Elias or Hopkins, but unfortunately we never see them fight for the first place.

[MrJan]

Though I don't think that anyone in this field is up to Rossi in a fight.. Maybe Elias or Hopkins, but unfortunately we never see them fight for the first place.

I don't agree. On equal terms I think that Casey and Lorenzo are the only guys capable, Pedrosa is good but can't pass. The other guy who would actually make Valentino sit up is JT, Toseland is the most agressive rider out there and given a little extra pace I reckon he could give Vale a right battle. Neither Hopkins nor Elias are consistently quick enough to give Rossi a half decent fight IMO :)

[The Phantom]

Lorenzo is up to giving Rossi a fight, although his racecraft is still developing (like Stoner).

I used to be in the 'Pedrosa can't pass' camp until recently when I watched my 2006 season review DVD - maybe it was just rookie courage, but he made some killer passes in that season. He does seem to have lost it a little since then I think but I reckon he's got it in him.

Anyway all we need is for Stoner to stay on the bike and we should have some great racing to the end of the season :s mokin:

[leopard]

I can't expect Elias to give more than only some surprise for the extra ordinary performance than it should.

Both Hopkins and Toseland in many occasion were quiet aggressive. Provided they ride for the first bike or either Honda, Yamaha, or Ducati, they may be able to give Rossi a meaning worthy of pressure. As of this stage, No sooner had they ridden aggressively, they ended up the race at gravel. :)

[Ranger]

800cc's have been rubbish. :( Laguna Seca has been the precious little good racing we've seen in '08 from about 12 rounds now. A far cry from my first season watching MotoGP in 2006, where at least 4 races off the top of my head weren't settled until the last corner of the last lap (sometimes later than that!)

Recently, Kenny Roberts Sr. was too right to call the people who came up with this 800c rule 'idiots'.

[ChrisS]

The races have been both interesting and boring IMO.
Interesting off the track, and boring on the track, with some notable exceptions of course. The reason for the racing being boring is not because of the tyres, or the switch to 800cc, or the bikes not having enough power. The real party pooper is the electronics that control traction, engine braking and braking. Motogp was doing OK with Bridgestone and Michelin fighting for title rights until traction control came into it. How can so many great riders struggle all of a sudden ? Melandri, Hopkins, Edwards, Hayden, (just to name a few) are all having a hard time). Look at Casey before the 800cc era began, blindingly quick, but crashed every other Sunday, then, enter the 800cc traction control era and he is a super star,(nothing against Casey by the way, not criticising, just looking at it from a different perspective). Is Casey making mistakes, or is the computer on board making them ? I would love to see the 800's stay, minus the electronic aids, then we will see a more even playing field. I think we would see the odd surprise victory from a satelite team from time to time, wich would be the boost that Motogp needs.
Ok, I will go back to my box now :)

I think tyres and electronics are a result of the smaller displacement. Manufacturers use advance electronics to get the most of the 800cc engines. Because of the higher corner speeds, much more is required by the tyres and play much greater role.

[Wim_Impreza]

It is very disappoiting when you know every MotoGP race will be boring for the first place. Even for the other top-10 positions, we haven't seen much fights this season. Season 2008 for MotoGP is over, we know the World Champion, we know that there won't be much overtaking. I follow MotoGP since 1998 and since the 800's and electronic parts on the bikes, it is really boring.

Lucky WSBK is always very exciting.

[alfa155btcc]

Hoping for an exciting Motegi race next weekend, season has been ok i think, with ofcorse the highlight being Laguna Seca (Proper Racing) if that did`nt get you blood pumping then nothing will and you should`nt be on this forum.

As has been said earlier in this thread/post i don`t think anyone has the mental strength of Rossi and for those that think Stoner will have one day by that time the doctor will be an old man LOL , :D :D :D

[Corny]

has there are been a year where we did not have a last-lap thriller? 'cause I can't remember.. And it seems like there's a big chance we will not get one :(

[Wim_Impreza]

Lucky that there are Superbikes and Supersport this weekend, much more interesting. ;)

Lucky that there are Superbikes and Supersport this weekend, much more interesting. ;)

Agreed..........I currently find Superbikes, Supersport and Superstock categories much more interesting to watch with their larger fields and more competitive racing on machinery we can more readily identify with.

So far this year and with few exceptions, 125 and 250 races have been more interesting to watch than the "premier class".

:s nore:

Better TV coverage of the whole field = More sponsors = More competitors.

[leopard]

So far this year and with few exceptions, 125 and 250 races have been more interesting to watch than the "premier class".

:s nore:

I don't hope this boredom is in place because this year Rossi's elbow start working. :)

I don't hope this boredom is in place because this year Rossi's elbow start working. :)

Greetings Snoozing pussy
I have enjoyed seeing Rossi go at it with Stoner but wish there were more competitors in the field who could be up there with them consistently .http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/images/icons/cry.gif

[alfa155btcc]

Greetings Snoozing pussy
I have enjoyed seeing Rossi go at it with Stoner but wish there were more competitors in the field who could be up there with them consistently .http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/images/icons/cry.gif

the truth is at the moment there is no one good enough to stand up to the plate with Rossi, his physical and more importantly mental strength is far better than anybody out there , Stoner will be there or there abouts next season and pedrosa may come good (little baby ) and i hope Dovizioso gets a good crack at the whip, and Lorenzo once he grows up a bit will definately challenge, but if Rossi has a great bike under him then whoever cam beat him will be champ.

as for Motegi this weekend hope we have a good tussle, as Rossi does not need to win race to claim this seasons title i dont think that will stop him going for it, but in the past it has been a Ducati track so if stoner is ok then he could be the man to beat this weekend as long as he does`nt fall off.

:D :D :D

[Corny]

indeed Alfa, if stoner would've stayed on his Ducati we would've had far more fights..

[alfa155btcc]

what are the times of free practice today then at some un godly hour i expect, here`s hoping for a great weekend of racing in all 3 classes.
:D

[alfa155btcc]

After first free practice for Moto GP class first 3 as follows -

1.Stoner
2.Pedrosa
3.Rossi