[WRC] News & rumours (part II)

[RS]

]What I realy hate is to make S2000 heavier and heavier to slow them down to match current gr.N performance...

Yes, one of the best things about watching an S2000 car is their agility.

Maybe the FIAs next bright idea will be to add 300kg to a WRCar and then we don't have to have new rules at all! Current Fords and Citroen's can then compete alongside the S2000s... (Just in case somebody from the FIA is reading, that was a joke)

[urabus-denoS2000]

It has been said a million times and it will be said a million more times.


Wouldn't you feel like an idiot to buy a S2000 for 300.000 euros and next year a N4 worth 100.000 (top GrN around 130-150.000) is as fast as your kit car...


Extremely stupid rules....

[WRC1]

agree 100%

[cannyboy]

It has been said a million times and it will be said a million more times.


Wouldn't you feel like an idiot to buy a S2000 for 300.000 euros and next year a N4 worth 100.000 (top GrN around 130-150.000) is as fast as your kit car...


Extremely stupid rules....

It's a pretty good way to keep costs down in S2000 - If a 100k gp n car is as fast as an S2000, customers will buy the grp n and force down S2000 prices from getting too crazy.

[sal]

It's a pretty good way to keep costs down in S2000 - If a 100k gp n car is as fast as an S2000, customers will buy the grp n and force down S2000 prices from getting too crazy.

Prices will never come down, engineers will see to that!

I'm all for level playing fields and dont want to see depleted fields however there are two manufacturers with Group N 4wd machinery against potentially six or seven with current or proposed S2000 cars. Surely the new class which is supposed to be the new top level should have the advantage as it's the WRC replacement class and Group n stays as the PWRC formula...

[DonJippo]

Prices will never come down, engineers will see to that!

I'm all for level playing fields and dont want to see depleted fields however there are two manufacturers with Group N 4wd machinery against potentially six or seven with current or proposed S2000 cars. Surely the new class which is supposed to be the new top level should have the advantage as it's the WRC replacement class and Group n stays as the PWRC formula...

S2000 is not going to be WRC replacement class, new "WRC" will be based on S2000 class regulations but most likely it will have 1.6 turbo engine.

[sal]

S2000 is not going to be WRC replacement class, new "WRC" will be based on S2000 class regulations but most likely it will have 1.6 turbo engine.

Thats what I meant, honest! The point I was trying to make that there has to be a clear difference between the classes unless it's going to be one class system in which case there is no problem with handicapping/parity.

[OldF]

The weight / power ratio for a S2000 is 1200 kg / 280 hp = 4,29 kg / hp. Power figures of N4s I’ve seen have been between 275 hp – 290 hp. The min. weight for a N4 is 1350 kg, so the weight / power ratio is between 4,66 kg / hp – 4,91 kg / hp. With a 1 mm increase of the restrictor’s diameter, the area increases by about 6%, which means about 6% more power. A 6% increase would mean power between 292 hp – 307 hp and kg / hp ratios of 4,39 kg / hp – 4,63 kg / hp. A N4 would still have to carry excessive “load” of about 50 – 120 kg.

If I could decide I would give N4 the same freedom as S2000 regulations regarding the suspension, brakes etc. (engine and transmission = N4, the rest = S2000) and give the class a new name, for example R4. This would of course add costs to the N4 but IMO it’s better to make the N4 more expensive because it’s difficult to make S2000 cheaper when about 95% of the parts are competition parts and only 5% from the original road car (In N4 it’s about the opposite, 95% standard and 5% competition parts). N4 as it is today should be “reserved” for privateers.

I also agree what urabus-denoS2000 said that it would be quite weird if you can by the same performance for 1/3 – 1/2 of the price of a S2000.

[ZequeArgentina]

This is what I posted in November 2008:
(PWRC2009 thread)


Brakes and weight is main problem for group N cars (specially in tarmac).
But a 34 mm restrictor is a very easy way to get them gain performance.
Unfortunately, I agree with you, S2000 while still more unreliable are faster way faster.
Pitty as group N cars, were the only real link betwen rally and road cars!

I wanted a 34 mm restrictor, but OK 33 is good.
S2000 will be musch faster anyhow, but with less advantage.
The main problem is running "normal N4" and S2000 in same class and same championship (PWRC).
that will not be the problem next year............or yes???????
Will there be PWRC championship next year? only with N4? another cup for S2000? It is getting a complete mess.

[Barreis]

Must say that I watched shakedown for one rally and saw more then 20 passes of s2000 cars and it's more atractive then WRC machinery for me.. :)

[Gard]

Must say that I watched shakedown for one rally and saw more then 20 passes of s2000 cars and it's more atractive then WRC machinery for me.. :)

Must have been downhill or something ;)

[Barreis]

It doesn't metter.. But when driver is going to the corner on limiter in 3th gear and is on limiter whole corner that's what I liked very much.. :)

[urabus-denoS2000]

I watched 4 days of non stop S2000 rallying in recent Croatia rally so this is my opinion:

S2000 is very attractive in fast,twisty corners because the cars tend to gently slide while they are OK at hairpins.

Generally they are attractive at fast sections and OK at slow sections

[Donney]

Which is more than can be said of WRC's.

[Helstar]

I was at Targa Florio and all S2000 were great even in uphills :P also uphill hairpins ... yes, you need great drivers for that but we have plenty here =)

[StevieWonder]

Which is more than can be said of WRC's.

especially in the catalunyan round of the calender.
sorry donney, but in my opinion that rally is no more interesting.
roads are to wide and so the wrc are driving through the stages like on a railway - no sliding, no action.

they should try to go to the north of barcelona to have more narrow and twisty tarmac roads.

[Josti]

Which is more than can be said of WRC's.

In form of watching rallycars, I still prefer the WRC's at his moment. In my experience, S2000's are mostly (and pretty much only) spectaculair when driven on the limit, like I saw with Loix and Vouilloz at the Condroz Rally last year, but there's certaintly potential.

Lately, their's been a flood of (recent) WRC's entering the Dutch rounds and it's just watertoothing to see and hear those cars. Therefore, I hope WRC's won't get banned in national competitions at least (which already happened in some country's).

But if we're talking WRC, nowadays it's a bland championship and if we want more manufacterers joining, S2000-like cars are defenitly the way to go.

[Mirek]

That's true. Even a mediocre driver is able to make a good show with WRC although when talking about tarmac the most efficient way to drive is not very spectacular and therefore slower drivers are often more spectacular than those fast ones.

You're also right that S2000 is nice to watch only with very good driver and while pushed hard. It's not easy car to drive and requires very agresive style otherwise it's just a misery both for driver and spectators.

[RS]

]You're also right that S2000 is nice to watch only with very good driver and while pushed hard. It's not easy car to drive and requires very agresive style otherwise it's just a misery both for driver and spectators.

And that has to be a good thing. It brings the good drivers to the fore and forces them to be driven with aggression.

This is what worries me about the proposed new WRCar rules. In theory the extra power and torque coupled with simpler S2000 transmission should make more sliding, but if the power is there to pull them out of trouble and the torque comes as strong and low as a current World Rally Car then they might not have to be driven as aggressively at all.

[Mirek]

I still hope for no restrictor in new cars and some other way to keep power within some safe limit. In that case new cars should have good and quite loud sound and also higher rpm than current WRC.

[grugsticles]

As much as I dont agree with it, I can see the FIA deciding on a 1.6 Turbo powered S2000 format. It will then be left up to the teams to counter act potential breakages from excess torque.

If I had my way, we should just switch to Group A regulations and be done with it. It worked back then, why not now?

[DonJippo]

Rotation system is gone http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/76272 until we see yet another brain fart from FIA in coming 10 years...

[AndyRAC]

As much as I dont agree with it, I can see the FIA deciding on a 1.6 Turbo powered S2000 format. It will then be left up to the teams to counter act potential breakages from excess torque.

If I had my way, we should just switch to Group A regulations and be done with it. It worked back then, why not now?

Why isn't Diesel being discussed? Didn't VW enquire about a Diesel Scirrocco?
The WRC needs Manufacturers like VW - with their connections and prestige.

[Mirek]

Please, no diesel. Cars without sound are not safe when spectators are able to reach the road unlike on circuits...

[Micke_VOC]

PG Andersson will drive the Midnattssolsrallyt 11-14/7 ( Midnightsun rally)
a very big historic rally in sweden. PG will drive a Ford Escort BDA

Other interesting entrants:
Björn Waldegard, Porsche 911
Stig Blomqvist, Ford Escort RS 1800
Leif Asterhag, Toyota Celica
Gert Blomquist, Peugeot 504 Coupé V6
Erik "Eken Johansson, Audi Quattro
Mats Thorzelius, Opel Ascona A
Billy Johansson, Mazda RX3
Kim Sevius, Opel Ascona
Jan Sellholm, Opel Ascona

[OldF]

]I still hope for no restrictor in new cars and some other way to keep power within some safe limit. In that case new cars should have good and quite loud sound and also higher rpm than current WRC.

I also hope there wont be a restrictor but instead a boost limit to limit the power.

But, there could be a way to go around this “high torque on low revs” effect (http://www.rallycars.com/Cars/turbo_restrictors.html ). By the regulations (http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/2589A7BA2955E0A2C12574FF0051D9F4/$FILE/255%20(2009)-15112008.pdf (http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/2589A7BA2955E0A2C12574FF0051D9F4/$FILE/255%20%282009%29-15112008.pdf), article 5.1.8.3 at beginning of page 22) the restrictor has to be at a max. 50 mm distance from the compressor blades and it’s this that causes a concentrated airflow to the center of the turbocharger's compressor wheel, which in turns causes the “high torque on low revs” effect. By placing the restrictor more far away from the turbo’s compressor wheels, the incoming air has time to expand and not causing this “high torque on low revs” effect. I don’t know if this is the right conclusion but if it is, the torque would be more level at a broader rev band, which would mean increasing power when revs increases.

[Mirek]

Thanks.

It looks like group N will use 33 mm restrictor since 2010.

[raybak]

Toyota may have homologation for their Australian S2000 on Tuesday. Will keep you all posted.

Ray

[alleskids]

Matti Rantanen will drive a second Ford Focus with the Munchi's team in Finland. It has been a while since he drove a Ford, so he wil do a 100 km test before the rally.

[OldF]

An interview with Simon Long about the future of WRC.

http://www.nesteoilrallyfinland.fi/en/23142.html

[anesa]

Yesterday I saw an article on the French newspaper les Dernieres Nouvelles d'Alsace about Alsace's candidacy to the WRC in 2010, that the deadline for the candidacy was June 30, and that they thought it would be good that a WRC event would be held in Sebastien Loeb's native territory.

Today, this article disappeared from the web and I'm wondering whether because the newspaper just deletes news (but they have older news on their website) or because it was a mistake or because it was not supposed to be public. Does anyone know anything about this? Thanks in advance.

[alleskids]

The FFSA will choose in october which of the 4 candidate rallies will host the 2010 WRC round. A rally in the regions Alsace Lorraine, Burgundy and Franche-Comté du Limousin, and the Tour of Corsica

http://www.autohebdo.fr/rallye/wrc/article-26-1-1082/060709-la-ffsa-doit-choisir-le-rallye-de-france-2010

[anesa]

The FFSA will choose in october which of the 4 candidate rallies will host the 2010 WRC round. A rally in the regions Alsace Lorraine, Burgundy and Franche-Comté du Limousin, and the Tour of Corsica

http://www.autohebdo.fr/rallye/wrc/article-26-1-1082/060709-la-ffsa-doit-choisir-le-rallye-de-france-2010

Yeah I saw that. Maybe the article was withdrawn because it appeared before the FFSA made an official announcement, maybe not, who knows. Thanks for the link.

[lcd]

Toyota may have homologation for their Australian S2000 on Tuesday. Will keep you all posted.

Ray

...Any latest news..?

[Psycho!]

I have read some rumours on the Net that Sordo mIght go to Ford next year??Is it true or he just a journalist's thought??

[noel157]

I have read some rumours on the Net that Sordo mIght go to Ford next year??Is it true or he just a journalist's thought??

And if (and it's a big if) who would replace him?

[Koppomsbo]

I have read some rumours on the Net that Sordo mIght go to Ford next year??Is it true or he just a journalist's thought??

Source?

[Buzz Lightyear]

Source?

It was in a Spanish Paper last week. It said that Ford met with Sordo in Poland.

[Koppomsbo]

well, as said earlier. IF it happends, would be nice to see but who will replace him in Citroen? Ogier?

[Zes]

Spanish papers seems to be very creative with rumours. Look at those Alonso to Ferrrari/Honda/redbull/whatever in the past.

Anyway, Sordo must feel some pressure, because Citroen certainly has some plans for Ogier. So he could have offered himself to Ford. Then it's another thing, if Ford has any use for him.

[MJW]

News in Autosport magazine in UK today about a growing and edging to bitter dispute betwwen the FIA and the WRC manufacturers over the 1.6T engine. Citroen have said they will not develop a new 1.6T engine for 2011 wrc unless there is commitment from others, (and the story names VW & FIAT) to commit to joining the wrc and also build the new engined cars by 2011. If there is no firm commitment from these manufacturers Citroen and Ford have agreed to delay the new engines for another year, and if I read it correctly WILL stay in wrc but with S2000 n/a engined cars. Morrie Chandler lost patience with ' these two teams who dont know what they want - they change their minds on a daily basis or if it rains' he said. Ford on the other hand beleive that 1.6T is the best for the future but have agreed with Citroen. It seems to me that the mess is getting bigger. If have sympathy with Citroen and Ford, as potentially they could invest a significant financial resource to designing and building a new type engine, whilst the other manufacturers could potentailly stay in IRC and use what they have, without spening the money. Citroen & Ford could be on the verge of wasting big money if no other manufacturer joins. I just wonder if this ever gets sorted..........

[fastboy]

In this weeks motorsport news it reports that prodrive will be back with a manufacture for the 2011 season.Dave Richards say's they are in talks with 3 manufactures.But he has all ready set a team of 6 to design ,under the new regulations.They have been doing it for the last 6 months and are 50% in to the design.Richard's claims computer aided desighn technology would make it easy for prodrives concept to be adapted to any make of car.

Sounds interesting especially with 3 manufactures showing interest,lets hope it comes to fruitrition.

[Buzz Lightyear]

In this weeks motorsport news it reports that prodrive will be back with a manufacture for the 2011 season.Dave Richards say's they are in talks with 3 manufactures.But he has all ready set a team of 6 to design ,under the new regulations.They have been doing it for the last 6 months and are 50% in to the design.Richard's claims computer aided desighn technology would make it easy for prodrives concept to be adapted to any make of car.

Sounds interesting especially with 3 manufactures showing interest,lets hope it comes to fruitrition.

yawn.

prodrive have lost a lot of street cred, not being able to get the s14 sorted, and the failed Prodrive F1 project.

[Barreis]

But they have Aston Martin (whole brand, with some other investors)..

[karo]

yawn.

prodrive have lost a lot of street cred, not being able to get the s14 sorted, and the failed Prodrive F1 project.

Thnx God that the N2009 is better in PWC than a Evo X!!!!!!!!!!

[COD]

News in Autosport magazine in UK today about a growing and edging to bitter dispute betwwen the FIA and the WRC manufacturers over the 1.6T engine. Citroen have said they will not develop a new 1.6T engine for 2011 wrc unless there is commitment from others, (and the story names VW & FIAT) to commit to joining the wrc and also build the new engined cars by 2011. If there is no firm commitment from these manufacturers Citroen and Ford have agreed to delay the new engines for another year, and if I read it correctly WILL stay in wrc but with S2000 n/a engined cars. Morrie Chandler lost patience with ' these two teams who dont know what they want - they change their minds on a daily basis or if it rains' he said. Ford on the other hand beleive that 1.6T is the best for the future but have agreed with Citroen. It seems to me that the mess is getting bigger. If have sympathy with Citroen and Ford, as potentially they could invest a significant financial resource to designing and building a new type engine, whilst the other manufacturers could potentailly stay in IRC and use what they have, without spening the money. Citroen & Ford could be on the verge of wasting big money if no other manufacturer joins. I just wonder if this ever gets sorted..........

Well as I said before, I don't understand why develop a new engine, when they have many manufacturers with the n/a 2l engine allready. So they shot themselves in the leg again... So typical.

[Barreis]

It's policy of manufacturers that 2 litre engine has more co2 to the atmosphere so they're becomin' history.. They want to promote new 1.6 turbo engines with lower co2.. But chasses must be identical like S2000 (only other engine)..

[MJW]

It's policy of manufacturers that 2 litre engine has more co2 to the atmosphere so they're becomin' history.. They want to promote new 1.6 turbo engines with lower co2.. But chasses must be identical like S2000 (only other engine)..
I am in agreement with using 1.6T not 2 litre engines, its definately the right way to go. But this is going to take time, I would prefer it if (for competition's sake) the current WRC cars stopped on 31/12/09 and for 2010 and 2011 we had S2000 with the new 1.6T engines coming in from Jan 2012.
The way things could develop now is that the current 2 teams could soon be pushing for the status quo with wrc cars to continue. That will just kill it off and IRC becomes the premier series.

[Barreis]

I agree.. There's more than 100 S2000 cars outside in private hands and "drivers without money" can try now with big boys!!! :)

[alleskids]

Sebastien Loeb is seriously aplying for the F1 seat inthe Toro Rosso Team, as a replacement for Sebastien Bourdais, who is strongly rumoured to be out of the team after the German GP this weekend. However Citroen Racing teamboss Olivier Quesnel is not amused of letting him go during this season, which is very understandable :) . But Loeb is getting bored of WRC and is looking for new/real excitement

[Buzz Lightyear]

Sebastien Loeb is seriously aplying for the F1 seat inthe Toro Rosso Team, as a replacement for Sebastien Bourdais, who is strongly rumoured to be out of the team after the German GP this weekend. However Citroen Racing teamboss Olivier Quesnel is not amused of letting him go during this season, which is very understandable :) . But Loeb is getting bored of WRC and is looking for new/real excitement

I heard this on TV this morning of Loeb's desire, but where do you hear from Quesnel?

[White Sauron]

I heard this on TV this morning of Loeb's desire, but where do you hear from Quesnel?

Here you go my friend: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/76853

[Andrey]

Evgeny Novikov confirmed today, that he will start in Spain and Wales with Citroen Junior Team.

[jbmarcus21]

Next year, FIA has to choose between 4 places to organize the Rally of France WRC on 2010
- The Tour of Corsica
- Limousin
- Alsace Vosges
- Bourgogne

This weekend, it took place the International Rally of Bourgogne, and if the Bourgogne is chosen by FIA, the rally will take place in this region on these special stages..

Here is my video of the rally : http://planetemarcus.free.fr/ribcc09.htm

[Hartusvuori]

Kimi Räikkönen to became a full time rally driver?

Finnish newspaper Ilta-Sanomat reports today that Kimi's career in F1 will end to this season (http://www.iltasanomat.fi/urheilu/uutinen.asp?id=1710325) - replacement being Alonso - even if he's having a deal with Ferrari for the next season. That deal will keep him away from any other F1 seat, so gossip is that he could be concentrating more on rallying. Anonymous friend of Kimi's comments that "rallyig is the only thing he is talking about nowadays".

Even if I haven't followed any GP for last ten years I wouldn't mind having Kimi in WRC or IRC. Being as enigmatic (or dumb) as he is, it'd give more interest and also he have proven to have speed on rally car as well. I for one will stay at SS2 (just to make it sure) of NORF for so long that I'll see his white Fiat go by.

[Miika]

I wouldn´t mind seeing Kimi making the switch to rallying fulltime, he seems genuinely excited about the sport and has the kind of crazy attitude that you don´t see too often these days in rallying. Of course it´s still only guessing what level he can reach and will he really be any good, but I´d love to see him give it a go.

[AndyRAC]

Kimi Räikkönen to became a full time rally driver?

Finnish newspaper Ilta-Sanomat reports today that Kimi's career in F1 will end to this season (http://www.iltasanomat.fi/urheilu/uutinen.asp?id=1710325) - replacement being Alonso - even if he's having a deal with Ferrari for the next season. That deal will keep him away from any other F1 seat, so gossip is that he could be concentrating more on rallying. Anonymous friend of Kimi's comments that "rallyig is the only thing he is talking about nowadays".

Even if I haven't followed any GP for last ten years I wouldn't mind having Kimi in WRC or IRC. Being as enigmatic (or dumb) as he is, it'd give more interest and also he have proven to have speed on rally car as well. I for one will stay at SS2 (just to make it sure) of NORF for so long that I'll see his white Fiat go by.

It sort of makes sense - there are rumours that Alonso is starting a Pro-Cycling team with sponsorship from Santander - which makes sense if they are meant to switch to Ferrari.

[MJW]

Kimi Räikkönen to became a full time rally driver?

Finnish newspaper Ilta-Sanomat reports today that Kimi's career in F1 will end to this season (http://www.iltasanomat.fi/urheilu/uutinen.asp?id=1710325) - replacement being Alonso - even if he's having a deal with Ferrari for the next season. That deal will keep him away from any other F1 seat, so gossip is that he could be concentrating more on rallying. Anonymous friend of Kimi's comments that "rallyig is the only thing he is talking about nowadays".

Even if I haven't followed any GP for last ten years I wouldn't mind having Kimi in WRC or IRC. Being as enigmatic (or dumb) as he is, it'd give more interest and also he have proven to have speed on rally car as well. I for one will stay at SS2 (just to make it sure) of NORF for so long that I'll see his white Fiat go by.

Well, I wonder if he goes to IRC with FIAT? - Should be a bit of a blow for WRC if Kimi is the 'star driver' of IRC.

[Hartusvuori]

Well, I wonder if he goes to IRC with FIAT? - Should be a bit of a blow for WRC if Kimi is the 'star driver' of IRC.

I pointed out IRC only because I'd like to see Kimi in international rallies, not only in occasional national events.

[bowler]

Next year, FIA has to choose between 4 places to organize the Rally of France WRC on 2010
- The Tour of Corsica
- Limousin
- Alsace Vosges
- Bourgogne

This weekend, it took place the International Rally of Bourgogne, and if the Bourgogne is chosen by FIA, the rally will take place in this region on these special stages..

Here is my video of the rally : http://planetemarcus.free.fr/ribcc09.htm

The FIA does not choose.
The FFSA will choose, and will discuss with ISC.
The FIA has only to confirm that correct arrangements are in place for the chosen place

[jbmarcus21]

yes yes true, i made a mistake with the word ;) .. FFSA is right ;)

[OldF]

By http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=fi&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mtv3.fi%2Furheilu%2Fralli%2Fuut iset.shtml%2Farkistot%2Fralli%2F2009%2F07%2F923087&sl=fi&tl=en&history_state0= Ford continues in WRC for 2010 and 2011 and the drivers are Mikko and JML.

[alleskids]

Ford announces the long term deal, and JML and MH were present. It does not say that they keep both drivers until 2011, atleast not in the translation.

[OldF]

Ford announces the long term deal, and JML and MH were present. It does not say that they keep both drivers until 2011, atleast not in the translation.

But this one says. http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=fi&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mtv3.fi%2Furheilu%2Fralli%2Fuut iset.shtml%2Farkistot%2Fralli%2F2009%2F07%2F923097&sl=fi&tl=en&history_state0=

[alexlake]

I wouldn´t mind seeing Kimi making the switch to rallying fulltime, he seems genuinely excited about the sport and has the kind of crazy attitude that you don´t see too often these days in rallying. Of course it´s still only guessing what level he can reach and will he really be any good, but I´d love to see him give it a go.

Love to see Kimi in WRC, I love the guys arrogance, and the general `I don`t give a s**t attitude. Just good to have some exciting drivers in wrc that go against the system, its all a bit too formal :D

But, as massas future is in big doubt now, will the ferrari team let him go?

[N.O.T]

Love to see Kimi in WRC, I love the guys arrogance, and the general `I don`t give a s**t attitude. Just good to have some exciting drivers in wrc that go against the system, its all a bit too formal :D


stay in F1....its good for you and good for us.....

[OldF]

Citroen will also continue. http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=fi&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mtv3.fi%2Furheilu%2Fralli%2Fuut iset.shtml%2Farkistot%2Fralli%2F2009%2F07%2F923133&sl=fi&tl=en&history_state0=

[Woodeye]

stay in F1....its good for you and good for us.....

And you should stay in the sheep shed. That would be for the rest of us.

[StevieWonder]

according this article: http://www.rallye-magazin.de/top/topnews/d16/d/2009/07/29/mikkelsen-im-opel-corsa-s2000/index.html

Mikkelsen competing at Barum Czech Rally Zlin with Corsa S2000 !

[RS]

according this article: http://www.rallye-magazin.de/top/topnews/d16/d/2009/07/29/mikkelsen-im-opel-corsa-s2000/index.html

Mikkelsen competing at Barum Czech Rally Zlin with Corsa S2000 !

That's right, and Novikov with a Fabia.

[Mirek]

according this article: http://www.rallye-magazin.de/top/topnews/d16/d/2009/07/29/mikkelsen-im-opel-corsa-s2000/index.html

Mikkelsen competing at Barum Czech Rally Zlin with Corsa S2000 !

Follow Barum rally tread ;)

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=132218&page=6

[Sulland]

Read somewhere that R Kubica had bought a Skoda rally car, can anyone confirm ?

If yes what kind of car ?

[MJW]

I think its a Fabia WRC. (for fun and testing)

[Mirek]

Yes, that was a rumour some time a go (it should have come from Motorsport Kopecký). However it wasn't confirmed by him.

[White Sauron]

Novikov's gonna change co-driver for Spain and further... from Dale to... Stephan Prevot...

[Xsara Fan]

Novikov's gonna change co-driver for Spain and further... from Dale to... Stephan Prevot...

For the moment nothing is decided.

[DonJippo]

For the moment nothing is decided.

I think Dale has decided ...

[Xsara Fan]

I think Dale has decided ...

No. AFAIK it`s E-ART decision.

[tmx]

Novikov's gonna change co-driver for Spain and further... from Dale to... Stephan Prevot... Prevot seems to be expert with hot headed drivers.

[SubaruNorway]

I think Novikov is the only driver in the WRC i would never go in a car with :p
Prevot must be getting big bucks if so...

[JRodrigues]

I think Novikov is the only driver in the WRC i would never go in a car with :p
Prevot must be getting big bucks if so...

Stephane proved he could tame Atkinson, let's hope he'll do the same with Novikov.

[pucky54]

They are starting at Barum Rally together for the first time?

[Xsara Fan]

They are starting at Barum Rally together for the first time?

Yes.

[cut the b.s.]

I think Novikov is the only driver in the WRC i would never go in a car with :p
Prevot must be getting big bucks if so...

He is young and a bit raw at the moment, but the codriving hasn't been flawless either, Poland was a very late note that put them out

[COD]

No. AFAIK it`s E-ART decision.

From what I heard, it was Dale who had enough....

[Pinto]

the nav ill allways get shafted in these cirumstances anyway

[DonJippo]

From what I heard, it was Dale who had enough....

Same here and I heard it allready on Saturday during the event...

[Helstar]

I think Novikov is the only driver in the WRC i would never go in a car with :p

I would never go with Rautenoob ... ^^

[macksrallye]

I don't know about Prevot. In his last season with Duval he couldn't control him & the event before he joined Chris was when he had that monumental accident in (Portugal or Argentina, I think Portugal but not 100%) so mabye Chris scared himself enough (I know he scared Glenn Macneall) to make him back-off and build up again.

As far as I can tell Dale walked away:
http://www.rallysportmag.com.au/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4005&Itemid=2

Who knows, maybe we'll see Chris & Dale in a Corolla (Aurius) S2000 in Australia?

[Buzz Lightyear]

Who knows, maybe we'll see Chris & Dale in a Corolla (Aurius) S2000 in Australia?

The most 'crashingest' driver of modern wrc, with someone who has recently been known for calling some late notes............ cant wait!!!

[SubaruNorway]

I posted "Lets see if Prevot can tame him" on Dale's FB and he deleted me, oops!

[Pinto]

now that was a bit stupid what did you expect him to do shake your hand

[bennizw]

Nice one Tor!

[SubaruNorway]

now that was a bit stupid what did you expect him to do shake your hand

Uhm not really. We all make mistakes right! :arrows:

http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id=5782&desc=Novikov and Moscatt to part company

[JRodrigues]

I don't know about Prevot. In his last season with Duval he couldn't control him & the event before he joined Chris was when he had that monumental accident in (Portugal or Argentina, I think Portugal but not 100%) so mabye Chris scared himself enough (I know he scared Glenn Macneall) to make him back-off and build up again.

As far as I can tell Dale walked away:
http://www.rallysportmag.com.au/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4005&Itemid=2

Who knows, maybe we'll see Chris & Dale in a Corolla (Aurius) S2000 in Australia?

Stephane had a monumental crash with Atkinson?? The only one I remember was in Ireland this year.. The 2007 Portuguese crash of Atkinson was with McNeall in their last rally together.

[Hartusvuori]

Stephane had a monumental crash with Atkinson?? The only one I remember was in Ireland this year.. The 2007 Portuguese crash of Atkinson was with McNeall in their last rally together.

Atkinson's crash in last year's Wales could be labelled "monumental". It just somehow went unnoticed (maybe due to lack of proper video material?).

YouTube: Incar and some (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NczzMB0p2Zg) + the carcass (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kwnI62sFq8)

[alleskids]

Citroen is seriously thinking of beduting the DS3 S2000 in the high profiled IRC 2010 Rallye Monte Carlo. So the FIA want to have the Rally Argentina in the same weekend of januari.
Firstly because it is summer in january in Argentina,
Secondly, Citroen en Loeb cannot compete in IRC the same weekend

[COD]

Citroen is seriously thinking of beduting the DS3 S2000 in the high profiled IRC 2010 Rallye Monte Carlo. So the FIA want to have the Rally Argentina in the same weekend of januari.
Firstly because it is summer in january in Argentina,
Secondly, Citroen en Loeb cannot compete in IRC the same weekend

My info is that Citroen is not making a S2000 car for 2010

[alleskids]

Citroen has postphonned the devellopment of the 2.0 l concept?

[Sulland]

Citroen has postphonned the devellopment of the 2.0 l concept?


So they leave the S2000 scene to Peugeot then i guess !

[alleskids]

It would make sence IF the S2000 was abonded bij Citroen and they only concetrate on the new WRC class. And leave the comstum thing of a S2000 to Peugeot. The article about Monte Calro and Citroen came from French media, they must have insiders

[COD]

Why would they make a S2000 for 2010, if 2011 the cars will be S1600T?

[Mirek]

The article about Monte Calro and Citroen came from French media, they must have insiders

The article was from Auto Hebdo. That is not very trustfull media...

[Hartusvuori]

On the entry list to next IRC round in Czech (http://www.barum.rally.cz/2009/pdf/entries_2009.pdf) (pdf) Dale Moscatt is listed as Evgeny Novikov's co-driver. Is this factual information or old information? And the said entry list is also rather interesting with many a good name. It should be a good round.

After Barum rally every Citroen junior has competed in a S2000 car, Ogier with good success. It'd be interesting to see how works drivers would do if they'd try the current S2000s.

[Mirek]

As far as I know there will be Prévot with Novikov on Barum.

[pucky54]

I think they sent the entry in before they split, so Moscatt is still on the list

[WRCfan]

Rally New Zealand is being moved back to Auckland where it had originally been held for many years. Hamilton lost rights to the rally after sponsorship could not be secured. 2010 will see a return to the roads at the top of the north island of New Zealand we are so used to seeing.

[AndyRAC]

Rally New Zealand is being moved back to Auckland where it had originally been held for many years. Hamilton lost rights to the rally after sponsorship could not be secured. 2010 will see a return to the roads at the top of the north island of New Zealand we are so used to seeing.

What about the Motu Road stage??

[WRCfan]

The Motu stages may return although I am unsure how far south of Auckland they will travel. The Motu is around Rotorua if I am not mistaken, which is about 2.5 hours south of Auckland which will be rally HQ.

Would love to see the Motu come back! One of our most fierce stages in NZ.

[Maui J.]

The start of the Motu is around 350 km from Auckland, around 4 hour & 30 minute drive (Thanks Google Maps). Somehow I can't see it happening.

[AndyRAC]

The start of the Motu is around 350 km from Auckland, around 4 hour & 30 minute drive (Thanks Google Maps). Somehow I can't see it happening.

But aren't overnight halts away from the host town now allowed?

[alleskids]

Sebastien Loeb has offered his part time service to US F1, He wants to do Grand Prix in between the rallies with them. I don't tjhink it is a workabole situation for the team nor Loeb. He should go cicuit racing fulltime, and leave the rallysport were he won everything there is to win.

[Mirek]

Burcu Cetinkaya was testing BRR Fabia S2000: http://www.brr.at/rtc-brr/1552

[CABAIO E'LONA]

]Burcu Cetinkaya was testing BRR Fabia S2000: http://www.brr.at/rtc-brr/1552

I love her..

[RS]

Toni Gardemeister is driving IRC Asturias next weekend in the Opel Corsa S2000. Will be nice to see Toni in action, but I don't expect much in the way of results. Mikkelsen was about 2s/km off the pace in Barum.

[alexlake]

I love her..

dam! just checked her out. Good looking lass that can drive a rally car :D :D

[Mirek]

Eyvind Brynilden will use Fabia S2000 in Rally Larvik and Walles Rally GB.

[CABAIO E'LONA]

]Eyvind Brynilden will use Fabia S2000 in Rally Larvik and Walles Rally GB.

wich team? MRT?

[JHvP]

wich team? MRT?

Rene Georges

[VFTS]

He will use the Fabia in two norwegian events in september, Rally Larvik(tarmac) and Rally Hedemarken(gravel). And also in Wales Rally in november.

Its the Rene Georges Team.

[bt52b]

Watch out for the FIA Tech' Commission meeting on Sept 9th. Hopefully the WRC/S2000 mess will be sorted. [source gpweek]

[Barreis]

Mr Chandler doesn't know what he's talkin' and doesn't have autority.. None of current works teams (Citroen, Ford) will be in S2000 cup..

[smokin'joe]

Mr Chandler doesn't know what he's talkin' and doesn't have autority.. neither current works teams (Citroen, Ford) will be in S2000 cup..yes, you're probably quite right. Morrie wouldn't know a thing about rallying, and hasn't any influence at FIA.
corrected above as maybe S2000 cup dosn't need them, or they are already involved with another part of their group IE Peugeot.

[Barreis]

Don't be too sarcastic.. If he and his crew are better WRC would be in much better situation then now..

[COD]

Mr Chandler doesn't know what he's talkin' and doesn't have autority.. None of current works teams (Citroen, Ford) will be in S2000 cup..

You are missinformed, Ford will for sure be in S2000 cup, said so in the launch of Fiesta S2000

[tmx]

yes, you're probably quite right. Morrie wouldn't know a thing about rallying, and hasn't any influence at FIA.
corrected above as maybe S2000 cup dosn't need them, or they are already involved with another part of their group IE Peugeot.

I don't know how much influences Morrie Chandler has at the FIA, but he's probably quite wrong about Chandler not knowing anything about rallying.

[ProRally]

Any news on the protest Prodrive lodged for Nasser's exclusion in Acropolis 2009 ?

[Mirek]

Jani Paasonen should start in some Romanian championship rally in October.

[A.F.F.]

]Jani Paasonen should start in some Romanian championship rally in October.

Do you know with what car?

[Barreis]

I don't know how much influences Morrie Chandler has at the FIA, but he's probably quite wrong about Chandler not knowing anything about rallying.

If Mr Chandler wouldn't know anything about WRC sport he probably wouldn't be at the place he's.. Mr Chandler said: Future of rallyin' is S2000.. Few months after is 1.6T.. Now we know that none of this works four drivers will be in S2000 cup.. Citroen and Ford can do whatever they want to do..

[Mirek]

Do you know with what car?

No

[noel157]

Any news on the protest Prodrive lodged for Nasser's exclusion in Acropolis 2009 ?

Think the case has been put back to 1st week in October.

[bowler]

Mr Chandler doesn't know what he's talkin' and doesn't have autority.. None of current works teams (Citroen, Ford) will be in S2000 cup..

You are not well informed.

Mr Chandler is both well informed and in a high position in the FIA.

He has been a competitor, organiser, team owner, FIA representative. Few would have the same level of knowledge, expertise and ability.

Remember that all of the changes re engine sizes (S2000 to 1600) have been driven by the teams and the products that they sell.

You need to relate your interpretation to the time lines of the various announcements.

[smokin'joe]

If Mr Chandler wouldn't know anything about WRC sport he probably wouldn't be at the place he's.. Mr Chandler said: Future of rallyin' is S2000.. Few months after is 1.6T.. Now we know that none of this works four drivers will be in S2000 cup.. Citroen and Ford can do whatever they want to do..compared the manufacturers already commited to S2000, why should the FIA bow down to Ford and Citroen?? PSA have a car already and so does Ford. the sport is going through a torrid time at the moment, and i suspect the indecision is caused by manufacturers not knowing what they want from the sport???

[Barreis]

Our WRC sport is in big trouble.. Italy has more paid drivers than the whole WRC.. And Mr Chandler knows all that ('cos he was competitor, team owner, etc.).. Maybe he learnt well also: GIVEEEE MEEE ALLLL YOUUUU GOTTTT.. So ok: do what you want to do.. At least we have two works teams..

[AndyRAC]

Our WRC sport is in big trouble.. Italy has more paid drivers than the whole WRC.. And Mr Chandler knows all that ('cos he was competitor, team owner, etc.).. Maybe he learnt well also: GIVEEEE MEEE ALLLL YOUUUU GOTTTT.. So ok: do what you want to do.. At least we have two works teams..

I'm not sure how much longer the WRC can survive with just the same 2 teams. I really do wonder what they get out of it. We keep hearing 'rumours' about new Manufacturers, so far nothing.......I'm not sure I'd want join with Ford/ Citroen having too big a say in the future direction of the sport.

[Daniel]

I'm not sure how much longer the WRC can survive with just the same 2 teams. I really do wonder what they get out of it. We keep hearing 'rumours' about new Manufacturers, so far nothing.......I'm not sure I'd want join with Ford/ Citroen having too big a say in the future direction of the sport.
As always I think the WRC needs to die so it can be rebuilt from the ground up. We need new rallies, new technical specs and new sporting regs and everything which has been suggested sofar is just a bandaid on a wound wish is spewing blood.

[Barreis]

For the start bring back MC rally, San Remo and Safari rally and it will be much more dust about WRC sport.. If season starts in MC it will be much more publicity around the world..

[pucky54]

Rally MC organsiers don't wanna go back to WRC. They prefer IRC

[Karbonyl]

Bcs they are very clever :D

[Barreis]

No 1 000 000 US$ entry fee to FIA..

[Tomi]

Rally MC organsiers don't wanna go back to WRC. They prefer IRC

Yes, lets hope they stay out, and corsica comes in as the french wrc round.

[ProRally]

Think the case has been put back to 1st week in October.

Just before Rally Catalunya then ? Curious what the verdict will be.... :D

[Mirek]

Yes, lets hope they stay out, and corsica comes in as the french wrc round.

Corse will be out from WRC also. Probably Rally Region de Limousin instead...

[bluuford]

As always I think the WRC needs to die so it can be rebuilt from the ground up. We need new rallies, new technical specs and new sporting regs and everything which has been suggested sofar is just a bandaid on a wound wish is spewing blood.

Somewhere in November or December in last year I proposed that it would be awesome if there will be 0 manufacturers in 2009. Then you were not agree. Seems that now you have changed your mind a little bit and reached to the same conclusion as me :-) Clean sheet for everybody !
tabularasa !

[Tom206wrc]

]Burcu Cetinkaya was testing BRR Fabia S2000: http://www.brr.at/rtc-brr/1552



When does she test/drive a 207(she also drove a Grande Punto on an italian rally after all) ??? :p :

[Daniel]

Somewhere in November or December in last year I proposed that it would be awesome if there will be 0 manufacturers in 2009. Then you were not agree. Seems that now you have changed your mind a little bit and reached to the same conclusion as me :-) Clean sheet for everybody !
tabularasa !
Me? I've been saying the WRC needs to die for years. You must be thinking of someone else :)

Here is one example

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums//showpost.php?p=470568&postcount=17

[Barreis]

The winning formula shouldn't be changed.. Perfect WRC years mean: MC, San Remo and Safari rally + 3 nominated drivers (2 best take points for manufacturers)..

[Brother John]

The winning formula shouldn't be changed.. Perfect WRC years mean: MC, San Remo and Safari rally + 3 nominated drivers (2 best take points for manufacturers)..

MC, San Remo and Safari rally to be not suitable for modern rally cars , also Greece and still a couple others. :confused:

[J.Lindstroem]

MC, San Remo and Safari rally to be not suitable for modern rally cars , also Greece and still a couple others. :confused:

Why is not San Remo suitable for modern cars?

[Daniel]

MC, San Remo and Safari rally to be not suitable for modern rally cars , also Greece and still a couple others. :confused:
Perhaps it's the other way around? The cars should be suitable for the events they run on.

[Tom206wrc]

Exciting news to see Andreas Mikkelsen also on C4 WRC in Catalunya :eek:

[teufel]

Exciting news to see Andreas Mikkelsen also on C4 WRC in Catalunya :eek:

he won't start according to forumers in the catalunya thread...

[Helstar]

Why is not San Remo suitable for modern cars?
And MC as well http://img.freeforumzone.it/upload/459333_pensa.gif

[Tom206wrc]

I've read that :mark:

[J.Lindstroem]

And MC as well http://img.freeforumzone.it/upload/459333_pensa.gif

It would be really nice to see the C4 and the Focus on the Kenyan roads as well but thats maybe not suitable.. why i don't know but i suppose thats how it is.. or?

[L5->R5/CR]

It would be really nice to see the C4 and the Focus on the Kenyan roads as well but thats maybe not suitable.. why i don't know but i suppose thats how it is.. or?


Put the event on the calendar and the teams will find a way to make the cars suitable...

[Tomi]

Keep on guys with the creative dreaming, Safari will not come back, atleast not in the way its known.

[wrc_flipper]

Keep on guys with the creative dreaming, Safari will not come back, atleast not in the way its known.

IRC done it earlier in the year - and few teams took part due to the security issues, plus most of the press pack went to the wrc event at the same weekend.

[Tomi]

IRC done it earlier in the year - and few teams took part due to the security issues, plus most of the press pack went to the wrc event at the same weekend.

Are you sure, maybe its not the traditional Safari, but some rally they call Safari.

[wrc_flipper]

Are you sure, maybe its not the traditional Safari, but some rally they call Safari.

Well not the same as the classic event, but called Safari in Kenya on grave have a look at the site...
http://www.ircseries.com/html/Calendar.asp#Event03

Not sure about how it went, just that top teams didn't go and very little press releases from teams came in that weekend fro the IRC.

[Barreis]

Brother John was just jokin'..

[DonJippo]

Well not the same as the classic event, but called Safari in Kenya on grave have a look at the site...

This one is just a normal special stage rally, to call it Safari does not mean it is the Safari rally.

[Tomi]

Well not the same as the classic event, but called Safari in Kenya on grave have a look at the site...
http://www.ircseries.com/html/Calendar.asp#Event03

The Polish round was very good, proper rally roads and many spectators, why not call it Safari and drive it every year.

[RS]

The Polish round was very good, proper rally roads and many spectators, why not call it Safari and drive it every year.

You mean the Czech round, but yes, 265,000 spectators apparently.

[Barreis]

Safari in IRC is nothing compared with what it was in WRC..

[urabus-denoS2000]

The Polish round was very good, proper rally roads and many spectators, why not call it Safari and drive it every year.

Yes I agree,in WRC I would say the Estonian round of 1000 rivers with all those jumps was great,lots of spectators ;)

[Mirek]

Gigi Galli should drive zero car (Evo VIII) in Freistadt PSD Shotout :)

[jparker]

About an hour ago FIA has decided to incude Rally Bulgaria in next year WRC calendar.

[MJW]

About an hour ago FIA has decided to incude Rally Bulgaria in next year WRC calendar.
Just as well that Argentina is a round of IRC then (as that was teh reserve event)

[Francis44]

About an hour ago FIA has decided to incude Rally Bulgaria in next year WRC calendar.

Is Rally de Portugal confirmed fo 2010??!!

[jparker]

Is Rally de Portugal confirmed fo 2010??!!

Sorry, I don't have that info yet. I guess we have to wait till tomorrow.

[Juha_Koo]

About an hour ago FIA has decided to incude Rally Bulgaria in next year WRC calendar.

Is it going to be the same rally as this year? The tarmac one?

I have nothing against Bulgaria (it's pretty damn beautiful place what I know) but I'm thinking is the decision right. From what I've seen the onboards, the stages are pretty fast and somewhat "dirty" tarmac. This combined to some comments said after Guglielmini's tragic death about the nature of the stages makes me think are they suitable for WRC cars. Call me a too-safety-conserned-rally-fan if you want... :rolleyes:

I just made some "investigation" regarding the average speed in tarmac rallies driven in the WRC during last few years and then compared them to ERC Rally Bulgaria's average speed. Due to the fact that Rally Bulgaria was cut short because of the fatal accident, I did my best trying to compare a single leg results from the WRC so that the comparisons could be called atleast "a some comparison".

In Monte Carlo the leg average speeds were from the mid-90s to somewhere around 115kph. In Germany they have been from 90kph to a bit over a hundred. In Spain they've been around 105kph.

ERC Rally Bulgaria leg one had an average speed of 104,1 kph with Super 2000 cars (obviously). On gravel the difference between WRC's and a S2000's average speeds is somewhere from four to ten kph (Athanassoulas in Greece/Hänninen in Finland, from the overall results). Dunno about tarmac though.

On the paper the rally doesn't look ultra-fast compared to other WRC tarmac events, but there's always the "room-for-errors" factor involved too...

[Francis44]

The problem with Rally Bulgaria may be the safety of the spectators, because we have seen that WRC cars can resist from pretty strong impacts!!!!

[Francis44]

Is Rally de Portugal confirmed fo 2010??!!

Oh ok thanks, i asked because from the possible calendar for next year, Rally de Portugal is listed for 30 May. And that's not a good date for our country.

The date we had this year was good because people and kidas were in vacation. In may most of the people are working!!!!

[jparker]

Is it going to be the same rally as this year? The tarmac one?

I have nothing against Bulgaria (it's pretty damn beautiful place what I know) but I'm thinking is the decision right. From what I've seen the onboards, the stages are pretty fast and somewhat "dirty" tarmac. This combined to some comments said after Guglielmini's tragic death about the nature of the stages makes me think are they suitable for WRC cars. Call me a too-safety-conserned-rally-fan if you want... :rolleyes:

I just made some "investigation" regarding the average speed in tarmac rallies driven in the WRC during last few years and then compared them to ERC Rally Bulgaria's average speed. Due to the fact that Rally Bulgaria was cut short because of the fatal accident, I did my best trying to compare a single leg results from the WRC so that the comparisons could be called atleast "a some comparison".

In Monte Carlo the leg average speeds were from the mid-90s to somewhere around 115kph. In Germany they have been from 90kph to a bit over a hundred. In Spain they've been around 105kph.

ERC Rally Bulgaria leg one had an average speed of 104,1 kph with Super 2000 cars (obviously). On gravel the difference between WRC's and a S2000's average speeds is somewhere from four to ten kph (Athanassoulas in Greece/Hänninen in Finland, from the overall results). Dunno about tarmac though.

On the paper the rally doesn't look ultra-fast compared to other WRC tarmac events, but there's always the "room-for-errors" factor involved too...

Yes, it will be the same rally as the ERC, but some stages may change. There are plenty of mountain roads in that area. I'm not sure, but FIA has limit about the top average speed, so I guess the rally has to comply with this.
Yes, the rally as it is is very fast. Even worst, there are some very slow sections which means the fast sections are really fast, but as I said, that may change.

[jparker]

The problem with Rally Bulgaria may be the safety of the spectators, because we have seen that WRC cars can resist from pretty strong impacts!!!!
Yes, that's quite right. That's why this year event tested something new, designated spectators areas. I know many don't like this, but it will be strictly enforced. We, the Bulgarians, are very undisciplined people and the organizers clearly understand the risk with spectators.

[PLuto]

Good idea, they are still doing everything for killing WRC. And this is another step...

[COD]

Max has guaranteed another vote for Todt...

[Barreis]

Where're the Finns last few days?

[CABAIO E'LONA]

No Rally Argentina 2010?

bad decicion of WRC

the fans of Argentina, Chile, Brasil, Uruguay, Paraguay, Bolivia and Peru,
were mobilized by the rally in Cordoba for by twenty-nine years... I hope we can get something like Bulgaria ... :(

[PLuto]

Cabaio, welcome in more interesting championship, than is WRC :)

[tolis]

So Acropolis maybe in IRC next year...

[Mirek]

Cabaio, welcome in more interesting championship, than is WRC :)

We'll see how unteresting for the crews will be to go on the other side of the globe. For most privateers it's impossible to have their car for several weeks on the ship. IRC is interesting only in Europe where there are many privateers.

[Barreis]

5 years ago it was about 10000 GBP to flight a car from GB to Australia..

[Buzz Lightyear]

No Rally Argentina 2010?

bad decicion of WRC

the fans of Argentina, Chile, Brasil, Uruguay, Paraguay, Bolivia and Peru,
were mobilized by the rally in Cordoba for by twenty-nine years... I hope we can get something like Bulgaria ... :(

IRC?

[Helstar]

Sad for Argentina, nothing against Bulgaria (although I confess I don't like the idea of another tarmac rally in the calender, just put two snow rallies then, if you want some variety !), but Argentina is better from every point of views (very particular stages, amazing crowd - millions of people !).

[N.O.T]

Well although argentina was a great event as far as stages go...i am happy to that that this disgracefull organisational joke is out... firetrucks on rally cars. rocks through the windows of cars, logs to block the road., cancellations of stages and even whole days....bye bye have fun.

[AndyRAC]

Sad for Argentina, nothing against Bulgaria (although I confess I don't like the idea of another tarmac rally in the calender, just put two snow rallies then, if you want some variety !), but Argentina is better from every point of views (very particular stages, amazing crowd - millions of people !).

Another Tarmac Rally?? There are only 2 this year, it's meant to be a fair mix between surfaces, not a bias in favour of one over another, even allowing for the fact Tarmac is normally quite boring.

[RS]

Another Tarmac Rally?? There are only 2 this year, it's meant to be a fair mix between surfaces, not a bias in favour of one over another, even allowing for the fact Tarmac is normally quite boring.

Too right Andy, current mix in WRC is a bit of a joke.

[alleskids]

Is Rally de Portugal confirmed fo 2010??!!

...Although the events are now certain, the date of Rally Bulgaria remains to be finalised. Currently it is scheduled to finish on 11 July, but a move one week earlier or later seems likely to prevent a clash with the FIFA World Cup Final which takes place on the same day.

Next year's WRC calendar (with Sunday finish dates)
1. Sweden: 14/02/10
2. Mexico: 07/03/10
3. Jordan: 04/04/10
4. Turkey: 18/04/10
5. New Zealand: 09/05/10
6. Portugal: 30/05/10
7. Bulgaria*: 11/07/10
8. Finland: 01/08/10
9. Germany: 22/08/10
10. Japan: 12/09/10
11. France: 03/10/10
12. Spain: 24/10/10
13. GB: 14/11/10

*date to be confirmed

[alleskids]

Another Tarmac Rally?? There are only 2 this year, it's meant to be a fair mix between surfaces, not a bias in favour of one over another, even allowing for the fact Tarmac is normally quite boring.

With Bulgaria on tarmac, the 2010 claandre wil have 4 tarmac rounds out of 13 : Bulgaria, Germany, France and Spain. Or do Spain and France have plans for a mixed event?

[MJW]

With Bulgaria on tarmac, the 2010 claandre wil have 4 tarmac rounds out of 13 : Bulgaria, Germany, France and Spain. Or do Spain and France have plans for a mixed event?
Heared Spain could be mixed surfaces in 2010

[Shadoh]

It's 100% sure that France will be only tarmac.

And Catalunya is not likely to have gravel stages...

[Helstar]

Another Tarmac Rally?? There are only 2 this year, it's meant to be a fair mix between surfaces, not a bias in favour of one over another, even allowing for the fact Tarmac is normally quite boring.
Tarmac is becoming too dangerous, it's not even spectacular to spectate live/watch in tv for now and there's a Citroen/Loeb domination xD !

This year was good with only 2 events, but next year with 4 ... omg ... at least bring some mixed events, I agree. More Cyprus-kinda ^^;

[Ucci]

Tarmac is becoming too dangerous, it's not even spectacular to spectate live/watch in tv for now and there's a Citroen/Loeb domination xD !

This year was good with only 2 events, but next year with 4 ... omg ... at least bring some mixed events, I agree. More Cyprus-kinda ^^;

No, no, no and again no-tarmac events must exist !! To be a world champion you must drive (and win!!) also some tarmac events!! Otherwise you are yust a gravel champion-at the highest level of rallying this is unacceptable for me!
Again-true world champion must have on his account wins on gravel, snow and tarmac !!
Safety must provide organizers, drivers and their teams must ensure that they are competitive on any surface.

[macksrallye]

Yet up until this current generation of drivers (Hirvonen, Loeb, Solberg etc) each & every world champion was supported by team-mates on the events in which they struggled. Toivonen was different but unfortunately he never won a World Championship.

[sal]

Hirvonen will debut the Fiesta S2000 at the IRC Scotland running as course car.

[cali]

Yet up until this current generation of drivers (Hirvonen, Loeb, Solberg etc) each & every world champion was supported by team-mates on the events in which they struggled. Toivonen was different but unfortunately he never won a World Championship.
Please count Loeb out - he has won on every surface.

[Helstar]

No, no, no and again no-tarmac events must exist !! To be a world champion you must drive (and win!!) also some tarmac events!!
I don't know, I prefer gravel/snow when I look at the concept of 'rally'.
Tarmac has became like circuit racing since years... cars on trail, dangerous, and boring to watch (WRC mainly).

This year we had only 2 tarmac in WRC :p perfect number !

[pettersolberg29]

I agree Helstar - if it were up to me we'd have one semi-tarmac e.g. Monte Carlo or Ireland, one tarmac e.g. Tour de Corse, one/two snow and the rest various gravels.

[Tom206wrc]

I'm sure Argentinians won't regret their rally is IRC instead of WRC next year when they see in live the event :rolleyes:

[Shadoh]

Please don't make the confusion. Tarmac has become boring in WRC because now the stages follow large highways... This would be much different if we'd get back to narrow roads (as the new IRC montecarlo...).

To Helstar :
The concept of 'rally' is different in every country I guess...

For example in the USA it is more a dirt and extreme concept, as you might have seen the last XGames in Los Angeles.
As WRC is basically a world championship, this would be better to gather all kinds of these concept, and thus, every kind of surfaces...

What about quarters ? 1/4 tarmac, 1/4 snow, 1/4 dirt, 1/4 gravel ?

[Juha_Koo]

Please don't make the confusion. Tarmac has become boring in WRC because now the stages follow large highways... This would be much different if we'd get back to narrow roads (as the new IRC montecarlo...).


Tarmac boring? Ehh... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6E7kpk4V7qg

If that's boring, then I'll suggest a visit to a doctor. :D The only boooooring tarmac rally IMHO is this upcoming highway rally of Spain...


For example in the USA it is more a dirt and extreme concept, as you might have seen the last XGames in Los Angeles.
As WRC is basically a world championship, this would be better to gather all kinds of these concept, and thus, every kind of surfaces...


This just might happen. Simon Long has told that possibly WRC could make an entrance to United States with X-Games style. I'm not so enthusiastic about it though... But I'll guess that would appeal to I-want-to-see-something-extreme type Americans.



What about quarters ? 1/4 tarmac, 1/4 snow, 1/4 dirt, 1/4 gravel ?

EDIT.Whoopsie, I understood that one completely wrong. My bad. Not such a bad idea at all... Although I prefer gravel and snow, but some "special" tarmac ones are must too. :)

[Barreis]

Duval is terminatin'..

[Helstar]

Tarmac boring? Ehh... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6E7kpk4V7qg
If that's boring, then I'll suggest a visit to a doctor. :D The only boooooring tarmac rally IMHO is this upcoming highway rally of Spain...

Spain is the most boring rally for sure :\
Seeing Duval onboard you understand that Germany is really dangerous ... infact Galli had his worst accident there (and it wasn't even his fault).
Also I don't see all this "spectacle", I mean, do we really want to compare it to this one ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdL93smEMvo&fmt18 THIS is rallying ... throwing the car sideways, jumping dozens of mts, lots of work with the wheel (Gigi style), and so on !

[ShiftingGears]

I don't find tarmac boring. I find events that don't utilise the best roads available boring. See Tour de Corse of late, for instance.

[Lousada]

I find all those mediterreanian gravel rallies more boring then tarmac.

[CABAIO E'LONA]

I'm sure Argentinians won't regret their rally is IRC instead of WRC next year when they see in live the event :rolleyes:

I hope to come at least ten s2000 ...

[alleskids]

Petter Solberg is entered for the Citroen Junior team for the Rally GB, alongside Sebastien Ogier. Is he entering with is ow team under the Junior banner or will his car be prepared/controled by Citroen?

[Maui J.]

Petter Solberg is entered for the Citroen Junior team for the Rally GB, alongside Sebastien Ogier. Is he entering with is ow team under the Junior banner or will his car be prepared/controled by Citroen?

Citroen's plans to take points off Ford I'm guessing. It could all turn to custard and he could take points off Citroen 'senior' team. Interesting move.

[Barreis]

Some Finns retired from the forum?

[alleskids]

Citroen's plans to take points off Ford I'm guessing. It could all turn to custard and he could take points off Citroen 'senior' team. Interesting move.

But will Petter have cart blanche (and so is running the car by his own team) or is he under guidence of Citroen (and the car is run and controled by Citroen Junior) ?

[noel157]

But will Petter have cart blanche (and so is running the car by his own team) or is he under guidence of Citroen (and the car is run and controled by Citroen Junior) ?

I suspect Petter will do as he is told on RGB if he is an official Citroen Junior driver. That's not to say at some stage he'll get a fastest stage or two just to let everybody know that he still has it. Play the game and he'll be a C4 for 2010.

[JFL]

That's not to say at some stage he'll get a fastest stage or two just to let everybody know that he still has it..
haha.. No way.. He's finnished!!.. ;)

[OldF]

Some Finns retired from the forum?

Are you jealous or something? At least it seems so by your stupid comments!!!

[Barreis]

He needed to prove himself that he's still really quick after problems in Finland.. That's why he took new car..

[Koppomsbo]

Isnt Ford planning something more to take points out of citroen?

[Barreis]

Only to take the money..

[muscrae]

Isnt Ford planning something more to take points out of citroen?

Duval for Spain, Martin for GB in a Focus would explode the battle ! :rolleyes:

[Psycho!]

Duval for Spain, Martin for GB in a Focus would explode the battle ! :rolleyes:
Pannizzi for Spain and Marcus for GB...Ok I will wake up now..... :D

[Psycho!]

Guys,there is a small interview of Mikko on MTV3 and after him Marcus says somerthing as well...Is it possible for a finnish member to help us with the translation??Thanks in advance!Here is the link:http://www.katsomo.fi/?progId=21231

[Juha_Koo]

Guys,there is a small interview of Mikko on MTV3 and after him Marcus says somerthing as well...Is it possible for a finnish member to help us with the translation??Thanks in advance!Here is the link:http://www.katsomo.fi/?progId=21231

Nothing special really, just normal discussion about last Finnish champion and how long pause there has been since the last time a Finn has won the championship and talks about how Mikko can really take the win this year if everything goes to plan. Hirvonen (according to always lovely Anette :D ) admits that he is going to Spain to fight for the second place.

Mikko is telling about the tarmac tests, once again Markko Märtin has been helping them and testing some new ideas presented by the engineers. Mikko says that the engineers have made a totally new approach to tarmac setups and that the results have been good.

Marcus just talks about how good position Mikko is in.

[Psycho!]

Thanks mate!!You're great!!!

[Francis44]

Armindo Araujo would like to make the jump to an S2000, he's studiyng the possibility but needs more money!!!!

[ProRally]

Armindo Araujo would like to make the jump to an S2000, he's studiyng the possibility but needs more money!!!!

Name me a driver who doesn't need more money :D :D :D

[A.F.F.]

Name me a driver who doesn't need more money :D :D :D

Jani Paasonen. He would drive for free just for the sake of driving.

[Tomi]

Name me a driver who doesn't need more money :D :D :D

I belive they have in hungary something called charity rally, its something where everyone who want get a rally car, also they dont have to invest in their driver carreer anything. ;)

[CABAIO E'LONA]

No rally Argentina 2010 - No Munchi´s Ford WRT in WRC... :(

[Camelopard]

No rally Argentina 2010 - No Munchi´s Ford WRT in WRC... :(

That will make Barreis happy...................................

[Barreis]

Never that way..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZ5p3kC1ksA

[Langdale Forest]

No Munchi´s Ford WRT in WRC... :(

Have Munchi's pulled out of the WRC compleatly?

[OldF]

IMO Argentina is one of the classic events that should be on the calendar every year.

[Tomi]

IMO Argentina is one of the classic events that should be on the calendar every year.

agree, classic and a drivers rally also.

[Helstar]

Shhhhh don't say these things loudly, there are people happy here to have another tarmac rally instead of Argentina ... :|

[Langdale Forest]

Argentina was always a better run event than Mexico.

[Wim_Impreza]

IMO Argentina is one of the classic events that should be on the calendar every year.

Agree. There is so much history written, people love rally there and the mountain stages are very nice to see.

Again a big mistake in WRC.

[WRCfan]

Fantastic rally, however the regular rock throwing at the cars is reason enough for it to be taken off the calendar. Dead drivers are not worth keeping a 'tradition' alive...

[Barreis]

Unfortunately spactators are not happy only with good driving or throwing snow or gravel (sometimes with wheelbarrow).. They found hard core entertainment: stones into the carglass..

[CABAIO E'LONA]

Fantastic rally, however the regular rock throwing at the cars is reason enough for it to be taken off the calendar. Dead drivers are not worth keeping a 'tradition' alive...

a million of fans staying in the mountains all the weekend is incredible more difficult to control than a few kangaroos... for example ...

...furthermore how you garantee that argentinians fans throw rocks to rally cars???
I'm sure that maybe something like that happened sometimes but I can tell you that the points that Fia put every year for the organization is MUCH higher than the most part of the calendar...

[Francis44]

I think Argentina is a great rally but it deserved to get caught out!!!!

I've seen many organisators using the rally's history and past for the continuation of it, but they dont really work and they dont care, so i think they deserved it and maybe next year they will think 2 times before screwing up!!!!

And dont give us that crap about "because its historic it must be on the calendar"....The decision off rotative rallys is one of the few things, if not the only thing, FIA has decided to do right in last 2 years. People bitched about it and now they have seen some amazing new rallyes!!!!

[Barreis]

I think F.Delacour had hard accident in Australia (2001 or 2002) after big stone hit windscreen..

[AndyRAC]

I think Argentina is a great rally but it deserved to get caught out!!!!

I've seen many organisators using the rally's history and past for the continuation of it, but they dont really work and they dont care, so i think they deserved it and maybe next year they will think 2 times before screwing up!!!!

And dont give us that crap about "because its historic it must be on the calendar"....The decision off rotative rallys is one of the few things, if not the only thing, FIA has decided to do right in last 2 years. People bitched about it and now they have seen some amazing new rallyes!!!!

What amazing new Rallies?? Apart from Poland which was good.

[Daniel]

I think F.Delacour had hard accident in Australia (2001 or 2002) after big stone hit windscreen..
Neither of Delecour's big crashes in Australia happened after rocks hit his windscreen.

[Francis44]

What amazing new Rallies?? Apart from Poland which was good.

Well good you haven't seen more than a new rally this year so dont go that way!!!!

[Barreis]

I saw different on onboard.. First bang on windscreen and after that big crash..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WezXQ9GhC4

Maybe some kangaroo was eating.. So piece of food went straight into the windscreen..

[OldF]

The decision off rotative rallys is one of the few things, if not the only thing, FIA has decided to do right in last 2 years.

Luckily the rotation is history.



People bitched about it and now they have seen some amazing new rallyes!!!!

Maybe a rally like Jordan where the only spectators where camels.

[kolvas]

I saw different on onboard.. First bang on windscreen and after that big crash..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WezXQ9GhC4

Maybe some kangaroo was eating.. So piece of food went straight into the windscreen..

That wasn´t a stone thrown from spectators that broke the windscreen, if you watch it again you can see that he hits something really hard in left front wheel and the impact is so hard that the windscreen broke

[Francis44]

Luckily the rotation is history.




Maybe a rally like Jordan where the only spectators where camels.

And because of that it was not a good rally??!!

Please dont tell me even before the rally started you didnt know that there was going to be no spectators, they made the rally for propagation of it's country, and they did it well. It's better to have no spectators than have them throwing rocks!!!!

[Juha_Koo]

I saw different on onboard.. First bang on windscreen and after that big crash..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WezXQ9GhC4


:D Yeah that was a rock for sure...NOT

In case you didn't know, the windscreen is attached to the car's chassis quite firmly. Actually (atleast in non-racing cars) the windscreen has a huge impact on the stiffness of the chassis (in the front sections). If I recall correctly, in some Pilkington's manual it said around 80 percent! :eek:

WRC cars take such a pounding nowdays that it's quite normal to see a crack of somesort in the windscreen. In that particular crash the first impact (with a tree stump or something like that) twisted the chassis so badly that the glass couldn't cope with the twist and cracked. Same thing with Mikko in 2008 Argentina, one rock hit so hard that the chassis bent to such extent that Mikko was unable to open his door and windscreen cracked.