[WRC] News & rumours (part II) [Archive] - Page 6

Ghostwalker

20th January 2009, 12:39

dont know if this is the appropiate thread for this news but anyway both Marcus Grönholm and Mattias Ekström will be on the starting line for this years edition of Vasaloppet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasaloppet) a 90km long ski race with around 15'000 participants on the start line every year.

A.F.F.

20th January 2009, 13:00

If they wear a helmet is quite approriate post :up:

Raini

20th January 2009, 15:00

FabiaFan

21st January 2009, 09:16

Official: Skoda does not think of entering WRC with a S2000+, at least not in the next 2-3 years.

MJW

21st January 2009, 09:39

Official: Skoda does not think of entering WRC with a S2000+, at least not in the next 2-3 years.
Leaving the path clear for VW to enter wrc, whilst Skoda stick with S2000 and IRC?

FabiaFan

21st January 2009, 09:44

Leaving the path clear for VW to enter wrc, whilst Skoda stick with S2000 and IRC? It looks like that...

swordsman

21st January 2009, 09:48

Official: Skoda does not think of entering WRC with a S2000+, at least not in the next 2-3 years.

Source?

curry

21st January 2009, 13:45

Leaving the path clear for VW to enter wrc, whilst Skoda stick with S2000 and IRC?

I think VW have a few problems to deal with first

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-business/global-slump-hits-bmw-volkswagen-20090121-7mi0.html

Roy

21st January 2009, 15:19

I think VW have a few problems to deal with first

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-business/global-slump-hits-bmw-volkswagen-20090121-7mi0.html

Every car maker have to deal with that... I don't see a problem for VW to step in WRC now.
The France government puts 5/6 billions in car industry.

Translation from Dutch to English:
http://translate.google.be/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.elsevier.nl%2Fweb%2F1 0220445%2FNieuws%2FEconomie%2FFransen-willen-met-miljarden-auto-industrie-redden.htm&sl=nl&tl=en&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

curry

21st January 2009, 23:31

If I was a betting man I would say that VW will continue with the Dakar next year after winning it for the first time this year. They put a lot of money, time and effort in to winning the Dakar and as such I don' think they will walk away from it just yet. So as a result I can't see them doing both the WRC and Dakar whilst the world economy is in meltdown.
I reckon they will observe next year’s 'unknown' WRC and see how it goes. If the economy rebounds and the WRC is popular with the public then I reckon VW will look at entering in 2011.

I honestly hope I am wrong and they enter next year, but personally I just can't see it.

MJW

21st January 2009, 23:48

I reckon they will observe next year’s 'unknown' WRC and see how it goes. If the economy rebounds and the WRC is popular with the public then I reckon VW will look at entering in 2011.
.

After reading the thread on today's Eurosport Monte I wonder if wrc will be popular agaain. It is possible that the wrc will never recover, and that IRC will (for a few years) become the pinnacle, so its a brave manufacturere who says, to hell with the downturn lets invest in a new formula S2K+ in the hope that is is well supported, and well promoted.

MJW

22nd January 2009, 00:11

AndyRAC

22nd January 2009, 00:28

When a manufacturer (wanting to sell cars to the public) considers the best way of acheiving this does he opt for WRC, IRC, DTM, LeMans, even F1, or sponsor football, tennis, yachting etc. Many competing influences, especially in the current economic uncertainties facing all car manufacturers would you rush in to WRC (2010) as the first choice in spending your marketing / sales budgets?

In a word, NO!! Seriously, why would you? What are you going to get out of it? How many countries are going to televise it on an Normal/Terrestrial channel? Look, the IRC has made a promising start, but, remember it's basically on Satellite TV, how many of Joe Public will have seen it? And that is the problem with Rallying. There are far more more 'media friendly' sports out there to use.

FabiaFan

22nd January 2009, 00:38

Source?
Mr. Hrabanek

Barreis

22nd January 2009, 18:03

Lancer '05 WRC's are on sale on 180 000 GBP/each..

Brother John

22nd January 2009, 19:49

Lancer '05 WRC's are on sale on 180 000 GBP/each..

Who want to buy now still ancient wrc cars? :dozey:

Simmi

22nd January 2009, 21:08

Lancer '05 WRC's are on sale on 180 000 GBP/each..

For sale four years too late unfortunately.

bluuford

23rd January 2009, 12:51

If anyone is interested:
http://www.arcticrally.fi/tulokset.html

Raikkonen is doing superb in his Fiat S2000 car. Top 20 times are not easy in Finland.

FabiaFan

23rd January 2009, 14:52

If anyone is interested:
http://www.arcticrally.fi/tulokset.html

Raikkonen is doing superb in his Fiat S2000 car. Top 20 times are not easy in Finland.
Well, but with such car ... against N4s...

A.F.F.

23rd January 2009, 15:16

Well, but with such car ... against N4s...

There are miiliions of guys who couldn't keep up with them with WRCs. Räikkönen is doing really well considering he is competing first time against guys whop have been there annually.

bluuford

23rd January 2009, 15:19

Well, but with such car ... against N4s...

On pure snow there is not much difference. Remember last year in Sweden when Sandell was fighting for the third with his 207 S2000. And usually 207 is faster than Fiat. And those were Raikkonens first ever stages with such a rallycar

cali

23rd January 2009, 19:30

Räikkonen is doing great, considering his lack of rallying experience. Fantastic drive from him. it is not easy to drive with pacenotes first time...

Allyc85

23rd January 2009, 19:38

lol yea, hes not exaclty the best at being told what to do either! Impressive performance so far :)

RJL25

24th January 2009, 00:26

with Kimi though, it won't be too long before he loses interest and decides he would rather stumble around drunk on his yacht...

alexlake

24th January 2009, 12:25

lol yea, hes not exaclty the best at being told what to do either! Impressive performance so far :)

this is so true, I love Kimi becasue of the way he is, his swagger etc. ok, he will never be classed as one of the greats, but hell the guy is living the dream!, good luck to him :D

DonJippo

24th January 2009, 12:27

with Kimi though, it won't be too long before he loses interest and decides he would rather stumble around drunk on his yacht...

Nothing wrong in that especially if you have your own yacht :up:

alexlake

24th January 2009, 12:32

classic kimi I love this guy, tell it as it is. Sorry if you have all seen this before
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=4HHUkHbgAtM

Barreis

24th January 2009, 18:29

Good for sport!

Miika

26th January 2009, 11:54

According to MTV3 J-M Latvala has been in a fairly serious road accident on a public road after some testing he was doing in Ireland. A car approaching from the opposite direction steered into J-M´s lane and J-M barely got out of it´s way - the other car hit J-M´s car to the side and rolled while Latvala´s car went off road. Not a good start to the season:
http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/ralli/uutiset.shtml/arkistot/ralli/2009/01/787988

jbmarcus21

26th January 2009, 13:11

Latvala swith that sponsor to Talvivaara in place of Outo Kumpo ...

Really true the press conference tomorrow in Oslo ??.. Maybe Ramsport ? .. They are again focus.. And Outo Kompo is left ?

Viking

26th January 2009, 14:06

Latvala swith that sponsor to Talvivaara in place of Outo Kumpo ...

Really true the press conference tomorrow in Oslo ??.. Maybe Ramsport ? .. They are again focus.. And Outo Kompo is left ?

There is a press conference, this is concerning Rally Norway opening show in Oslo.
There will also be presented a wrc team, my best guess is that this is the official presentation of Adapta wrc with maybe some new stickers on the car.
Also heard a rumour that there could be another S14 in Rally Norway, so maybe two cars in Adapta-team in RN?.

swordsman

26th January 2009, 14:26

There is a press conference, this is concerning Rally Norway opening show in Oslo.
There will also be presented a wrc team, my best guess is that this is the official presentation of Adapta wrc with maybe some new stickers on the car.
Also heard a rumour that there could be another S14 in Rally Norway, so maybe two cars in Adapta-team in RN?.

I guess so. Up-hotted version of Adapta press conference and I guess also a second driver. Not much more, I'm afraid.

Iskald

26th January 2009, 15:35

I guess so. Up-hotted version of Adapta press conference and I guess also a second driver. Not much more, I'm afraid.

Qualified guess, the second driver for RN will be Anders Grøndal...

swordsman

26th January 2009, 16:04

Qualified guess, the second driver for RN will be Anders Grøndal...

Yep, that was my bid too actually. He is totally recovered after his surgery or whatever it was, isn't he?

jbmarcus21

26th January 2009, 18:18

ok thanks ;) ... i had many hopes for another big Driver :)

but not..

Sulland

26th January 2009, 18:37

I'l put in a unqualified guess on Wilks or PG !

JFL

26th January 2009, 18:48

I guess it's a young guy with no FIA seeding. ;)

Viking

27th January 2009, 13:48

Yes, it was Adapta-Subaru Norway-Prodrive, with drivers Østberg and Grøndal in Rally Norway.

alleskids

27th January 2009, 16:34

Were can we find more news about Adapt Subaru ? Will they become a MT2, or just a one man team with some teammates in a number of rallies?

jbmarcus21

27th January 2009, 21:33

After announces Adapta and Petter now... the entry list 09 is now complete !
http://planetemarcus.free.fr/team09.htm

VFTS

27th January 2009, 21:56

After announces Adapta and Petter now... the entry list 09 is now complete !
http://planetemarcus.free.fr/team09.htm

Mads in ADAPTA will compete in 8 rounds I think(not 5)

bluuford

27th January 2009, 22:17

Well, I found that one Estonian site is organizing WRC team manager game again:-)

http://www.sportmanager.ee/default.php?page=1&c=0

Very nice!

jbmarcus21

27th January 2009, 22:24

Mads in ADAPTA will compete in 8 rounds I think(not 5)

sure ??.. In beginning yes it was 8 rounds, but it seems his program has changed since few months, and 5 now .. but i am not sure, if somebody can confirm 5 or 8 ? Thanks ;)

swordsman

27th January 2009, 23:23

sure ??.. In beginning yes it was 8 rounds, but it seems his program has changed since few months, and 5 now .. but i am not sure, if somebody can confirm 5 or 8 ? Thanks ;)

I think it was full seasons from the beginning and then went down to 8.

StevieWonder

28th January 2009, 10:33

official statement:

The Adapta World Rally Team is going all out to achieve results in Rally Norway. Mads Østberg is double national rally champion and has proved himself in several individual WRC rounds. Anders Grøndal has finished third in the Norwegian rally championship the last two years and is hungry for this new opportunity.

”It’s almost unbelievable. I’m as excited as a child! It’s going to be fantastic to drive a car that is on the same performance level as the very best. Now it’s up to me to grab the chance I’ve been offered, “ said Grøndal who comes from Drammen. He has not even tested the new car yet but hopes to get 100km behind the wheel in advance of Rally Norway.

Anders Grøndal’s co-driver Maria Andersson is just as enthusiastic, and intends to keep Grøndal in check. ”Obviously this is a rare opportunity for a 24 year-old so my job will be partly to keep him sensible, especially on the first day of Rally Norway. As long as we get through Friday’s Leg 1 all in one piece, we can put the foot down a bit more,” she says and adds that her personal goal is to be the best Swedish finisher in Rally Norway.

wrc_flipper

29th January 2009, 11:49

Daniel

29th January 2009, 11:55

Daniel

29th January 2009, 11:57

Confirmed. No need for anyone to go and post their own link to it from their site ;)

http://wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id=3693&desc=New%20WRC%20promoter%20announced

wrc_flipper

29th January 2009, 12:09

Confirmed. No need for anyone to go and post their own link to it from their site ;)

http://wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id=3693&desc=New%20WRC%20promoter%20announced

and why not? - be a bit narrow minded it we all took our news from one source, especially when wrc.com it run by ISC! ;)

Daniel

29th January 2009, 12:11

and why not? - be a bit narrow minded it we all took our news from one source, especially when wrc.com it run by ISC! ;)
Because the news is confirmed on the WRC site. What else is there to say about it? What would another site add? A slight rewording of the same thing perhaps? Maybe some promotion of your site? :D Seriously, add something and your site becomes something useful and not the slower than the big sites reguritation fest that it currently is :)

AndyRAC

29th January 2009, 12:13

The governing body of world motorsport, the FIA, has signed a long term agreement with North One Television and its subsidiary International Sportsworld Communicators (ISC) to promote the World Rally Championship.

Details on www.rallybuzz.com (http://www.rallybuzz.com) soon!

Oh dear, that means not to promote it. Saying that - there isn't much to promote. Where Eurosport Events one of the competitors?
I may be harsh, but they've hardly covered themselves in glory up to now - no matter how they may protest. If they want to promote it properly - eapecially here in UK - it needs to be on terrestrial TV (ITV, BBC2), not a repeat channel, even if it means paying the channel concerned.

wrc_flipper

29th January 2009, 12:19

Because the news is confirmed on the WRC site. What else is there to say about it? What would another site add? A slight rewording of the same thing perhaps? Maybe some promotion of your site? :D

Also confirmed via a FIA press releases this morning. And you can't beat a bit of free publicity :)

Daniel

29th January 2009, 12:19

Oh dear, that means not to promote it. Saying that - there isn't much to promote. Where Eurosport Events one of the competitors?
I may be harsh, but they've hardly covered themselves in glory up to now - no matter how they may protest. If they want to promote it properly - eapecially here in UK - it needs to be on terrestrial TV (ITV, BBC2), not a repeat channel, even if it means paying the channel concerned.

Rather. But the ISC will want to make a lot of money out of the WRC before spending money on making the coverage. They don't realise that it's a catch 22 situation and they have to spend money to make money rather than make money to spend money :mark: But whatever, wtf? wth? The WRC is officially boned unless the ISC miraculously do a U-turn and fire Paul King and the rest of the crew.

Daniel

29th January 2009, 12:20

And you can't beat a bit of free publicity :)

You can when it's against forum rules :)

wrc_flipper

29th January 2009, 12:24

You can when it's against forum rules :)

sorry, should of added "in my opinion" :cool:

AndyRAC

29th January 2009, 12:30

Rather. But the ISC will want to make a lot of money out of the WRC before spending money on making the coverage. They don't realise that it's a catch 22 situation and they have to spend money to make money rather than make money to spend money :mark: But whatever, wtf? wth? The WRC is officially boned unless the ISC miraculously do a U-turn and fire Paul King and the rest of the crew.

How do you make money out of a 'dead-duck' Championship? Are we missing something? Even more bizarre, Stobart are actually happy at the coverage they get out of being in the WRC.

Daniel

29th January 2009, 12:33

How do you make money out of a 'dead-duck' Championship? Are we missing something? Even more bizarre, Stobart are actually happy at the coverage they get out of being in the WRC.

Rather. Well perhaps it wouldn't be so dead if the ISC had given us proper coverage. I think the WRC could have survived crap regs or crap coverage but not both.

wrc_flipper

29th January 2009, 12:35

How do you make money out of a 'dead-duck' Championship? Are we missing something? Even more bizarre, Stobart are actually happy at the coverage they get out of being in the WRC.

Stobart should be happy with the coverage, on Dave they get an hour plus of adverts every week with the Mathew Wilson show - sorry WRC access all areas.

Daniel

29th January 2009, 12:37

Stobart should be happy with the coverage, on Dave they get an hour plus of adverts every week with the Mathew Wilson show - sorry WRC access all areas.

Hey hey I'll not hear you talking badly of Mattie. He's not slow! He just has a 5 year plan. If the ISC runs the WRC into the ground and everyone goes to the IRC he just might pull his plan off too! :D

wrc_flipper

29th January 2009, 12:46

Hey hey I'll not hear you talking badly of Mattie. He's not slow! He just has a 5 year plan. If the ISC runs the WRC into the ground and everyone goes to the IRC he just might pull his plan off too! :D

Nothing against Mathew - very nice guy. If my dad had been a owner of a wrc team then I quite sure I would have followed my his footsteps as well.
But I'm just a humble engineer. :)

Daniel

29th January 2009, 12:51

Nothing against Mathew - very nice guy. If my dad had been a owner of a wrc team then I quite sure I would have followed my his footsteps as well.
But I'm just a humble engineer. :)

I would have done much the same, BUT on the condition that I was presented accurately and not as Britain's next hope as a WRC champion which is what Dave tries to present Matty as :mark:

A.F.F.

29th January 2009, 12:54

If my dad owned a WRC team, I would have chosen to play violin. With a five year program.

DonJippo

29th January 2009, 13:27

If my dad owned a WRC team, I would have chosen to play violin. With a five year program.

And you would suck in that too...like in skiing for example... :p

J.Lindstroem

29th January 2009, 13:34

And you would suck in that too...like in skiing for example... :p

Guys! Remember that no matter what you do, the most important thing always is to be out there and have fun. :)

Daniel

29th January 2009, 13:35

Guys! Remember that no matter what you do, the most important thing always is to be out there and have fun. :)
That's losertalk :p No wonder why the Finns whoop your butt at rallying :p

J.Lindstroem

29th January 2009, 13:37

That's losertalk :p No wonder why the Finns whoop your butt at rallying :p

It's Wilson-talk :D

A.F.F.

29th January 2009, 14:51

I'm going to do everything with a five-year plan from now on.

cali

29th January 2009, 15:08

I'm going to do everything with a five-year plan from now on.
Actually Wilson did not invent this "five year plan" thing. He has taken over this from communists, cause soviet-regime had "five year plans". I guess we can call Wilson communist now :D

Daniel

29th January 2009, 15:09

Actually Wilson did not invent this "five year plan" thing. He has taken over this from communists, cause soviet-regime had "five year plans". I guess we can call Wilson communist now :D

I pointed out that Stalin had 5 year plans before too :D

MikeD

29th January 2009, 15:27

Actually Wilson did not invent this "five year plan" thing. He has taken over this from communists, cause soviet-regime had "five year plans". I guess we can call Wilson communist now :D

We know he doesn't like competition (Trying to orchestra every result), so communist does fit Mr. Wilson :D

Buzz Lightyear

29th January 2009, 15:28

I'm going to do everything with a five-year plan from now on.

including taking a dump?!

Viking

29th January 2009, 15:42

If my dad owned a WRC team, I would have chosen to play violin. With a five year program.

I am sure that would upset someone on the world violin forum :p

A.F.F.

29th January 2009, 17:33

including taking a dump?!

I will reply something witty... within five years.

Daniel

29th January 2009, 17:37

I will reply something witty... within five years.

Not one step backwards commisar AFF!!!!!!!

Rallyper

30th January 2009, 16:23

What crap your´e talking on this topic! Where is the gossip and rumours? Yuo behave like small girls in your comments.

Daniel

30th January 2009, 16:24

What crap your´e talking on this topic! Where is the gossip and rumours? Yuo behave like small girls in your comments.
We're just having a joke dude.......

Rallyper

30th January 2009, 16:44

We're just having a joke dude.......
well, well :dozey:

OldF

30th January 2009, 18:33

Today in a Finnish newspaper “Helsingin Sanomat” Jarmo Mahonen, who’s a member of the rally commission, tells that Russia and Indonesia won’t be in the calendar 2010. “We have already informed them that they don’t have enough evidence that they can organise a WRC rally in 2010.” The story continues telling that the promoter has been selected and Mahonen says “We will discuss the calendar at the end of February”.

Who will / should have the two missing rallies from the calendar or is there only 10 rounds in 2010?

alexlake

30th January 2009, 19:45

I'm going to do everything with a five-year plan from now on.

what happens when Wilson gets to the end of the 5 year plan and is still crud?. Cause it will happen. :confused:

AndyRAC

30th January 2009, 19:48

what happens when Wilson gets to the end of the 5 year plan and is still crud?. Cause it will happen. :confused:

I think you'll be all surprised - he's been sandbagging - next year he'll blow everybody into the weeds.......... ;)

jens

31st January 2009, 12:13

Simple: after 2010 Matthew will get another five-year plan. :s mokin:

Buzz Lightyear

31st January 2009, 12:30

Tomi

31st January 2009, 13:04

Simple: after 2010 Matthew will get another five-year plan. :s mokin:

And after 3 more plans, he might be on same level as henning :)

Tomi

31st January 2009, 13:05

Tomi

31st January 2009, 13:07

Who will / should have the two missing rallies from the calendar or is there only 10 rounds in 2010?

Finland and GB. ;)

Daniel

31st January 2009, 18:52

Finland and GB. ;)
1 vote for Finland and another for a proper Rally Australia in Perth :)

Finni

31st January 2009, 19:31

And after 3 more plans, he might be on same level as henning :)

You are way too optimistic. :)

Barreis

31st January 2009, 21:09

So 185k euro's for what?
Last year '05 Focus was about 85k GBP for one WRC event (Ramsport)..

Tomi

31st January 2009, 21:45

You are way too optimistic. :)

Maybe, I was quite sceptic about the whole thing right from beginning, i dont belive that if someone gets everything too easy right from the start will become much of a driver.

StevieWonder

1st February 2009, 12:02

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2009/01/31/petters-schlachtplan-2009/index.html

according this article petter is planning the whole season with his Xsara.

main points:
- his Xsara is one of the latest built
- active diffs !
- no chance to buy an actual C4 (spionage)
- petter wants to have control overall, so he didn´t want to join stobart
- plans to sell the Xsara for rallycross after season
- henning
- at petter´s tests the Xsara was faster than focus on snow
- comment of henning on oncoming norway rally: "petter fast than me ? forget it !"

FabiaFan

1st February 2009, 12:22

- his Xsara is one of the latest built
How is it compared to what has the OMV team got? Their results were poor on any surface...

- at petter´s tests the Xsara was faster than focus on snow
- comment of henning on oncoming norway rally: "petter fast than me ? forget it !" Does that mean:"I'm quicker than Petter even if I'm driving a slower car!" ?!?

MHjerpe

2nd February 2009, 15:10

Al-Attiyah negotiating with Skoda - may bring Tina Thörner back into the WRC ?? @ http://www.maxattack.net/ hope it's true...

Mirek

2nd February 2009, 15:18

It is true, but no cars available...

Xsara Fan

2nd February 2009, 21:10

Evgeniy Novikov`s programme for 2009:

- 13-15.02 / WRC / Rally Norway
- 13-15.03 / WRC / Cyprus Rally
- 27-29.03 / Cze / Valasska Rally*
- 2-5.04 / WRC / Vodafone Rally de Portugal
- 17-19.04 / Cze / Mogul Sumava Rally
- 22-24.05 / WRC / Rally d'Italia Sardegna
- 12-14.06 / WRC / Acropolis Rally of Greece
- 26-28.06 / WRC / Rally Poland
- 21-23.08 / Cze / Barum Rally
- 18-20.09 / Cze / Pribram Rally
- 2-4.10 / WRC / Movistar RACC Rallye de Espana
- 16-18.10 / Cze / Bohemia Rally*
- 23-25.10 / WRC / Wales Rally GB

* - Valasska Rally and Bohemia Rally can be deleted from the programme.

Mirek

2nd February 2009, 21:21

I would drive Bohemia instead of Příbram or Šumava. Bohemia is much better rally :)

urabus-denoS2000

2nd February 2009, 22:38

Yes,Bohemia has much better stages and a lot more tradition!

Xsara Fan

2nd February 2009, 22:50

]I would drive Bohemia instead of Příbram or Šumava. Bohemia is much better rally :)

But the date of this rally too close to Wales GB...

Mirek

2nd February 2009, 23:40

Yes, I know but as Urabus said, Bohemia has the best stages in Czech Republic. I don't say that Příbram is bad but it has only one realy nice stage, the rest is not very interesting, short and with many chicanes.

Šumava has some good stages but bad organisation and usualy stupid harmonogram (for example You go 60 km because of 1 km long stupid city stage in Plzeň and than 60 km back).

The best rallys here are Barum, Bohemia and Český Krumlov which however colides with WRC :(

Woodeye

4th February 2009, 09:41

Mitsubishi out from Dakar/endurance.

http://media.mitsubishi-motors.com/pressrelease/e/motorsports/detail1892.html

Another casualty of economic downturn.

Brother John

4th February 2009, 10:04

Mitsubishi out from Dakar/endurance.

http://media.mitsubishi-motors.com/pressrelease/e/motorsports/detail1892.html

Another casualty of economic downturn.

Who is next in wrc? Ford and Citroën maybe? :p :
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2009/02/03/konfusion-bei-den-herstellern/index.html

AndyRAC

4th February 2009, 10:07

Who is next in wrc? Ford and Citroën maybe? :p :
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2009/02/03/konfusion-bei-den-herstellern/index.html

If it wasn't for Abu Dhabi, BP, Castrol - then Ford would be gone. Not sure about Citroen - not sure what they get out of it - they don't make a Performance C4, do they?

Barreis

4th February 2009, 10:10

Gard

4th February 2009, 10:17

Buzz Lightyear

4th February 2009, 11:52

Mitsubishi Dakar program ended. Volkswagen will likely not conintue competiting against themselves, paving way for WRC.

Barreis

4th February 2009, 13:54

Mr Chandler's speech was I think in Autosport magazine.. Some kit on bolt..

Mirek

4th February 2009, 13:57

That word "some" is very much important...

bluuford

4th February 2009, 15:07

Mr Chandler's speech was I think in Autosport magazine.. Some kit on bolt..

Some bold kid?:-P

alleskids

4th February 2009, 16:40

Now we know why Mitsubishi trough in their new Racing Lancer so soon. Normally they do the Citroen way: test the car for a year or longer before they make their competition debut. Now they huried up the debut and losdt 3 out of 4 cars deu technical errors.
When VW pulls out also, Dakar and other rally raids will again be for privateers. Gordon can now realisticly see the winners trophy in his arms next year.

Psycho!

4th February 2009, 16:57

alleskids

4th February 2009, 17:14

RalliArt France, whichs forms the basis team of Mitsubishi's Dakar involvement, will continue as privat team. Just like X-Raid does with BMW's aprovement and some help. So Marcus could rent a Racing Lancer from the team. The other competitve choose is to rent a car with X-Raid. The third Hummer of Robby Gordons team will already be driven bij Eliseo Salazar. So that hot seat is already taken.

COD

5th February 2009, 11:59

Don't regret too much on this boys who are complaining too much..
Let's see that there's soo much S2000 manufacturers right now and as M. Chandler said: "Rent this turbo kit on Your S2000 and drive WRC event.."

I would like very much to hear how they think this is technically possible wothout changing parts inside the engine and drive train.

ProRally

5th February 2009, 12:16

I would like very much to hear how they think this is technically possible wothout changing parts inside the engine and drive train.

True COD, how does the 'standard gearbox' (Sadev or Xtrac) will handle the increase of power, what about the driveshafts...

So basicly you need a S2000+ which includes, gearbox, driveshafts, diffs, turbo kit, and for sure some more bits and pieces.

not going to be simple

Buzz Lightyear

5th February 2009, 12:34

I would like very much to hear how they think this is technically possible wothout changing parts inside the engine and drive train.

I think Mosley has, on purpose, set them an impossible task, and in this new age of cost cutting will simply go S2000, no kit.

alleskids

5th February 2009, 18:17

Citroen Sport will be renamed Citroen Racing. In Cyprus the new new will be official, also they will have a new logo.

wrc_flipper

5th February 2009, 20:35

morganmilan

5th February 2009, 22:33

Petter Solberg and co driver Phil Mills will present the new Petter Solberg World Rally Team on Friday, 6. February. The press-conference will take place in the middle of Petters hometown, Spydeberg, at 1100 – 1200.
And the car will be Citroen Xsara WRC for the whole season? That sounds so unbelievable but... :confused:

Halvis

5th February 2009, 22:44

And the car will be Citroen Xsara WRC for the whole season? That sounds so unbelievable but... :confused:

Noone knows that, the only that (officially) is certain is that he will rally it in Rally Norway. I guess the performance will decide?

morganmilan

5th February 2009, 23:21

Noone knows that, the only that (officially) is certain is that he will rally it in Rally Norway. I guess the performance will decide?
Ok, maybe Sweden would be a very appropiate rally for him to make a good result with the Xsara but, what in other rallyes? If it´s so difficult to get a quicker C4, why don´t try a Focus (almost the only option for privateers)? Or better an S2000 and run the IRC (probably would be champion)? :D

MJW

5th February 2009, 23:29

Easier to get a paid drive in IRC 2010 if wrc delay the re-invention of the tech specs again and allow WRC to be a Focus 1 make series, (for 2nd place)

VFTS

5th February 2009, 23:57

[quote="morganmilan"]Ok, maybe Sweden would be a very appropiate rally for him to make a good result with the Xsara but, what in other rallyes?

Sweden.....??? I think you mean Norway.

DonJippo

6th February 2009, 09:23

Easier to get a paid drive in IRC 2010

Is it really, how many of the drivers are paid now in IRC?

MJW

6th February 2009, 09:43

I guess that depends on why you are but the bigger teams FIAT e.g. if they are put off joing wrc 2010, would pay a retainer for certain drivers, Bosse, Petter.......

swordsman

6th February 2009, 09:45

Is it really, how many of the drivers are paid now in IRC?

I think that Super2000+ may rise the quality and number of competitors in the WRC, but I'm not so sure it will increase the number of paid drivers. It seems more and more like a trend that brands get into the WRC in cooperation with companies like Prodrive, MML or others and expecting drivers to pay a part of the sum it costs. I guess S2000 will make that even more common, as there with cost cuts will be a little easier for a privateer to afford their drive. It will be a thinner line between grp n and the top class

Barreis

6th February 2009, 10:58

I think that Super2000+ may rise the quality and number of competitors in the WRC, but I'm not so sure it will increase the number of paid drivers. It seems more and more like a trend that brands get into the WRC in cooperation with companies like Prodrive, MML or others and expecting drivers to pay a part of the sum it costs. I guess S2000 will make that even more common, as there with cost cuts will be a little easier for a privateer to afford their drive. It will be a thinner line between grp n and the top class

I agree.. Maybe Kopecky, Hanninen, Basso and other IRC drivers are paid.. So why not in WRC the same? I think problem is in certain gentleman as Mr. Richards and Mr. Wilson - GIVEE MEE ALLL YOUU GOTTT. One of them is out of business..

Mirek

6th February 2009, 12:45

Is it really, how many of the drivers are paid now in IRC?

Kopecký, Hänninen, Basso, Alén for sure, Vouilloz and Loix probably too. From those who don't do all season Rossetti and Sarrazin too. Of course they may be more...

Wim_Impreza

6th February 2009, 12:51

Yes, Loix and Vouilloz are paid too.

6th February 2009, 19:58

I think that Super2000+ may rise the quality and number of competitors in the WRC, but I'm not so sure it will increase the number of paid drivers. It seems more and more like a trend that brands get into the WRC in cooperation with companies like Prodrive, MML or others and expecting drivers to pay a part of the sum it costs. I guess S2000 will make that even more common, as there with cost cuts will be a little easier for a privateer to afford their drive. It will be a thinner line between grp n and the top class

I would have thought that if there are more works teams, then drivers will be more in demand and the top teams will be willing to pay more to get the best ones. Supply and demand.

Barreis

16th February 2009, 19:10

P.Solberg in Cyprus.. Anymore news?

Sulland

16th February 2009, 20:44

Look in that teams thread !

Xsara Fan

16th February 2009, 21:40

I`ve heard rumors that Urmo Aava has big problems with his sponsors. And that his participation in WRC`09 is in trouble...
Does anyone know more info?

Mirek

16th February 2009, 21:55

I think that it was already discussed here during Ireland. He was told to have budget for only two rallys in that time...

Xsara Fan

16th February 2009, 21:56

]I think that it was already discussed here during Ireland. He was told to have budget for only two rallys in that time...

Ok. Two rallys finished. What now?

Mirek

16th February 2009, 22:00

Maybe Jaanus or some other Estonian member knows more ;)

Buzz Lightyear

16th February 2009, 22:07

I`ve heard rumors that Urmo Aava has big problems with his sponsors. And that his participation in WRC`09 is in trouble...
Does anyone know more info?

I dont think he has much support from Estonia tourist board this year. Stobarts only put up a small percentage, so I dont expect to see him in Cyprus. Catwees only seems to have a fleeting mention, on what is otherwise a Stobart car. Plus his showing in Norway was well below par.

bluuford

16th February 2009, 22:27

]Maybe Jaanus or some other Estonian member knows more ;)

Last time he said that he continues contract discussion at the end of February. So, it seems that Cyprus looks to be not in his list. And Catwees by the way is Honda dealer in Estonia (They have one Ford Transit in their used cars list as well);-).
And yes, snow has been his weakest surface for years..

His main sponsor told today that he is fed up with all kind of economical problems and he waits another Friday evening to relax and forget everything.

Things does not look good for him at the moment.

bluuford

17th February 2009, 00:48

Just read from the newspaper that according to his 8 rally plan, next rally is Portugal (he is going to skip Cyprus for sure). But there is not enough money for Portugal yet.

Brother John

17th February 2009, 07:42

Who is the next to leave?
After a couple rallies there still remain only 2 Citroën and 2 Ford!
Wake up guys, wrc is dead.

Barreis

17th February 2009, 08:11

It's not dead.. There are plenty of guys who can pay for a rent.. Aava had one Focus WRC years ago and to buy a car like this You must be a rich man..

Brother John

17th February 2009, 09:04

It's not dead.. There are plenty of guys who can pay for a rent.. Aava had one Focus WRC years ago and to buy a car like this You must be a rich man..

I mean, it not only concerns the sport, don´t you see what´s going on there in the world at the moment? The recession and crisis is just starting at the moment. Sport and culture become very soon also victims!

Xsara Fan

18th February 2009, 15:19

Two main sponsors of Urmo Aava programme stop their rally activities. As I understand it`s Kalev & Catwees. Poor Urmo...

PLuto

18th February 2009, 17:50

Two main sponsors of Urmo Aava programme stop their rally activities. As I understand it`s Kalev & Catwees. Poor Urmo...

That should be tragic for him, because these was the main sponsors of him for whole career.

Viking

19th February 2009, 10:30

Is this a problem for Conrad, problem for Citroen or no problem what so ever?

http://www.zimbabwewatch.org/News/2009/EU-adds-36-businesses-and-27-people-to-sanctions-list

tmx

20th February 2009, 03:05

If Citroen is happy with the money, then no problem.

jonkka

20th February 2009, 06:20

Is this a problem for Conrad, problem for Citroen or no problem what so ever?

Certainly not a problem for Citroen (except in ethical sense if they choose to care), possibly a problem for Conrad but quite likely it'll be no problem at all.

6thgear

20th February 2009, 09:37

Aava has never been a rich man and this Focus WRC he drove years ago belonged to Toomas Kitsing (Märtin`s co-driver before Park).
Urmo has always been good in finding money (even in the most hopeless situations), therefore I believe we will see more more to come from him.
According to estonian newspapers he needs to find 0,8 mln. EUR to continue (Stobart itself finds/funds 1 mln. EUR). Compared with last years astronomical 1,9 mln. EUR it sounds like a better deal, although I can`t even imagine any possible sponsor in Estonia willing to burn all that money for keeping our driver in the big picture. So we will just wait and see...

Mirek

20th February 2009, 12:52

If Citroen is happy with the money, then no problem.

No, because Citroën has large connections to French government which as You know is one of the most important forces in European Union and therefore one of initiators of those sanctions....

alleskids

21st February 2009, 11:53

Van Merksteijn has decreased it's rally plans. The original plan was to become an MT2 with 8 rallies. But due to the economical crisies and the new love of Peter senior, the rally raids, Van Merksteijn Motorsport will do only Portugal and Finland for sure, and maybe will add 2 other WRc rallies. They will also do the Dutch rally championship.
Peter senior is planning on doing 3 rally raids. He is discussing those plans at the moment with Sven Quandt of X-Raid.

alleskids

21st February 2009, 12:07

I read that the FIA WRC commision has decided that (MT and) MT2 no longer have to participate with 2 cars to score points, but they can settle with entering 1 car for the manufacturer championship. Only thngs is they need to have permission from Ford and Citroen. So Munchi's Ford can enter and score points with their only car for Frederico Vilagra and Adapta WRT for Mads Ostberg. And ofcourse Petter Solberg World Rally Team. Suddenly their are 7 MT instead of only 4.
It is perfect timed for Munch's, as their program just strats in Portugal. Ostberg has to add a rally to be entered for the minimum 8 rounds.

Barreis

21st February 2009, 21:00

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/73369

Lousada

21st February 2009, 22:30

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/73369

That's a whole lot of words to say absolutely nothing :\

AndyRAC

22nd February 2009, 00:02

That's a whole lot of words to say absolutely nothing :\

Exactly, so what was the outcome of this meeting. What is the way forward for this struggling sport? Nothing except it was a good meeting............

Well how about getting the sporting side sorted before trying to make money. That's why the sport is in the mess it is in now - they made all these changes to make it popular and make money - er, didn't work. Go back to about 10-15 years - that's more how the WRC should be. This isn't F1....

Bazza2541

22nd February 2009, 00:52

Go back to about 10-15 years - that's more how the WRC should be. This isn't F1....

I totally agree. Rally is a marathon not a sprint, bring back the four day events.

Rally_Rocks

22nd February 2009, 07:22

Exactly, so what was the outcome of this meeting. What is the way forward for this struggling sport? Nothing except it was a good meeting............

Well how about getting the sporting side sorted before trying to make money. That's why the sport is in the mess it is in now - they made all these changes to make it popular and make money - er, didn't work. Go back to about 10-15 years - that's more how the WRC should be. This isn't F1....

You remind me of the grumpy old man who used to work with me. Never an original thought in his head or a positive word from his mouth. Been there thirty years "been there, seen that, done that, it failed, so let's not bother!"
I didn't really like him much either.

Making a success of something like this is very rarely about reinventing the wheel. It's about looking around you and taking elements of best practice from other areas, then taking the assets you have and working with them.

The past failures in our sport have generally not been practical failures but political ones. We have the basis for a fabulous sport and if as suggested there is a desire go work together to take it forward, then surely this can only be good news. Add to this togetherness ISC's stated desire to invest heavily in the product and we truly have a bright future ahead.

Still, there was always be the grumpy old synic in the corner looking for everyone to fail. Sad really.

bluuford

22nd February 2009, 10:25

You remind me of the grumpy old man who used to work with me. Never an original thought in his head or a positive word from his mouth. Been there thirty years "been there, seen that, done that, it failed, so let's not bother!"
I didn't really like him much either.

Making a success of something like this is very rarely about reinventing the wheel. It's about looking around you and taking elements of best practice from other areas, then taking the assets you have and working with them.

The past failures in our sport have generally not been practical failures but political ones. We have the basis for a fabulous sport and if as suggested there is a desire go work together to take it forward, then surely this can only be good news. Add to this togetherness ISC's stated desire to invest heavily in the product and we truly have a bright future ahead.

Still, there was always be the grumpy old synic in the corner looking for everyone to fail. Sad really.

You know sometimes when I am reading AndyRac comments I think that you are actually my wife with secret name:-P
Be more positive! Look out from the window. Sun is shining! or.. It is raining so nicely! .. or clouds are so beautiful today!

AndyRAC

22nd February 2009, 15:10

Look, I'll be positive if there's a reason to be. This is/was a fantastic sport - and can still be, but only if the right decisions are made. What was wrong with the sport before all these changes were made? The people in charge weren't making enough money - so they decided to change the sport to make money. Look were we are now. That's the reason why I'm grumpy about the WRC, however I'm positive about the IRC - which isn't perfect either, but has more positives than negatives.

Barreis

22nd February 2009, 16:13

Any kind of progres for our sport we like is good..

Rally Power

22nd February 2009, 17:03

You remind me of the grumpy old man who used to work with me (...)

You’re not being fair to Andy…
Even Guy Frequélin, that hardly could be seen as a "grumpy old cynic", has his doubts about the FIA rally governance:
"Vous avez vu le plateau de ces Boucles ? Incroyable ! Je pense qu'en voyant une telle chose, la FIA devrait comprendre qu'elle n'a pas fait évoluer ses réglementations dans le bon sens ces dernières années... Sincèrement, ce samedi, je pense qu'il y aura plus à voir lors des Legend Boucles de Spa qu'au Rallye de Norvège !" http://www.speedactiontv.be/Guy_Frequelin__Mieux_vaut_etre_a_Spa_quen_Norvege_-2021-3.aspx

PS: maybe the lack of conclusions of this seminar is due to the proximity of next WMSC…

Sulland

22nd February 2009, 17:38

And for us that have a slight challenge with french:
http://translate.google.be/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&tl=en&u=http://www.speedactiontv.be/Guy_Frequelin__Mieux_vaut_etre_a_Spa_quen_Norvege_-2021-3.aspx
:p

AndyRAC

22nd February 2009, 17:42

MJW

22nd February 2009, 17:42

I think Andy is correct to say his opinion, and I'm sure he longs for a return to spectacular rallying with multiple teams and the best drivers who get paid to drive for factory teams. Whats wrong with that?
But there are many different factions that have made the current wrc into the state it is, ISC with their pathetic style of filming and commentary, the teams who all wanted the rally around the service park format of 3 stages double ran each day, (dont forget its the teams who wanted that) the corporate entertainment service park mimicing the F1 paddock, (another teams wish) FIA for adding 2 long haul events Mexico and Japan when budgets were tight and resulted in Skoda, Mitsubishi and Peugeot departing. FIA for encouraging new events who paid big money and put on good events which lead to Ireland opening 09 season whilst Monte was in IRC. Crazy high admission charges to spectate on stages in some countries, establishment of barriers to keep the real fans away when the corporate guests get wined and dined in service. and finally the engineers (bless them) who have made cars so technologically perfectly able to defy the laws of physics but made them look boring. It could get better, but rallying need sto get back to basics.

urabus-denoS2000

24th February 2009, 15:43

New racer from M-Sport!

Fiesta R2 comes in July

http://rally.avtomanija.com/fotoz/Novice/2009/februar/2422009112232_D07055475/title_s.jpg

http://rally.avtomanija.com/default.asp?rb=2&id=1103

Mirek

24th February 2009, 15:52

Good news :)

urabus-denoS2000

24th February 2009, 15:55

It says that it will have a 1,6 l Ti-VCT engine and 5-speed Sadev gearbox.

Testing starts at the end of March.

Great news!

tolis

24th February 2009, 16:03

And Victor Henriksson is the man who will test the car.

Glee

27th February 2009, 07:16

Henning Solberg is going to run his rallycross car in he Super-G ski hills near Lillehammer next weekend. It looks like he is atempting to drive uphill as fast as the skiers goes downhill...

http://www.motorsport.no/wip4/detail.epl?id=417181

Google translation:

Running a car in the downward course
As the end of the world cup'en in Kvitfjell will rally driving Henning Solberg attempt to set world record in Kvitfjell with a car.
Henning Solberg will run in downhill downward course in Kvitfjell under World in alpine.

- Should I? Ask Henning Solberg us.

You know nothing about it?

- Yes, I know I should run rallycross car, but do not know if I should run up and down. I am doing just as I told these days I, Henning laughs.

World record attempt will take place Sunday 8 March after completion of the Super-G ski.
- “I take the challenge regardless of what it is, "said Henning.

Are you not at risk?
- No.

It's Leif Nilsen in “Gatebil” witch is organising the world record attempt, and he is very secretive about what the plans are.

- I will not say much about this, but it is quite clear that the downward defiance will be used. So it may be up to the imagination. Up or down, or a giant jump. It is none who have done this before, laughing Leif.

It is not the first time Henning Solberg adopt olympia plant from the Olympics in Lillehammer. Rally driver has been tested bob-path by Hunderfossen in TopGear.

Psycho!

27th February 2009, 13:47

According to the Greek site rally.gr Morris Chandler says that the engines of the top category won't be supercharged till 2013!!!!!! :eek: Do you know anything more special about that???

MJW

27th February 2009, 14:13

This was in last weeks meeting and wont be ratified until March World Council meeting, but it says S2000 with a kit of aero parts but no turbo will be the future of wrc cars until 2013 when the engines are likely to change to 1600 turbo charged engines. This is more keeping the trend for smaller but turbo charged engines in mainstream cars. Also heared that VW are lobbying for this 1600T to be a diesel.

Sulland

27th February 2009, 17:07

New racer from M-Sport!

Fiesta R2 comes in July

http://rally.avtomanija.com/fotoz/Novice/2009/februar/2422009112232_D07055475/title_s.jpg

http://rally.avtomanija.com/default.asp?rb=2&id=1103

Then the S2000 (R4) is not far behind !

urabus-denoS2000

27th February 2009, 17:12

Hopefully

PLuto

28th February 2009, 00:25

Ford is working on S2000 for a long time, first outing will be this autumn/winter.

Saabaru

28th February 2009, 05:04

ste898

28th February 2009, 09:34

QUOTE=urabus-denoS2000;593779]New racer from M-Sport!

Fiesta R2 comes in July

http://rally.avtomanija.com/fotoz/Novice/2009/februar/2422009112232_D07055475/title_s.jpg

http://rally.avtomanija.com/default.asp?rb=2&id=1103[/QUOTE]

Not really a great lot of interest in that car its only 1600cc.....I'm waiting for the S2000 which should have been out testing now, Ford are way behind in S2000

Mirek

28th February 2009, 11:51

Saabaru: I hope for no restrictor but limited boost which is must cheaper solution...

grugsticles

28th February 2009, 14:49

]Saabaru: I hope for no restrictor but limited boost which is must cheaper solution...
While I agree with the point of coming up with a cheaper idea to limit horsepower, limiting boost levels is not the answer as different engine designs respond differently to differnt forced induction pressures.

Ghostwalker

28th February 2009, 17:37

Marcus Grönholm and Mattias Ekström will (as mentioned before) participate in tomorrows Vasaloppet (http://svt.se/vasaloppet).

An interview with Mattias can be found here:
http://svt.se/svt/jsp/Crosslink.jsp?d=82978&a=1455724&lid=puff_1455754&lpos=rubrik

you can also follow their progress at

http://www.resultat.vasaloppet.se/vasaresult/do/se/result/search

enter Mattias' or Marcus' startnumber where it says "Startnummer" and click "sök".
Mattias nr: 15494
Marcus nr: 11510

the race starts at 08.00 CET.

OldF

28th February 2009, 18:57

While I agree with the point of coming up with a cheaper idea to limit horsepower, limiting boost levels is not the answer as different engine designs respond differently to differnt forced induction pressures.

In what way different engine designs? Bore/stroke ratio, valve lift, camshaft timings?

jbmarcus21

28th February 2009, 20:30

Ghostwalker

28th February 2009, 23:15

Are you sure for Marcus participation ??.. Because friday he was sick.. And number 11510 i found Persson, Andreas & Söderqvist, Gisela
???

i didnt know he was sick so i am not sure about his participation. i tried to look up his name again but the system didnt find it so possibly he has withdrawn since i look earlier today.

grugsticles

1st March 2009, 11:38

In what way different engine designs? Bore/stroke ratio, valve lift, camshaft timings?
Yeah all that along with actual block designs - ie. in-line 4 vs flat four for example, or if its closed/semi-closed/open/sleeved deck etc.

OldF

1st March 2009, 12:34

Yeah all that along with actual block designs - ie. in-line 4 vs flat four for example, or if its closed/semi-closed/open/sleeved deck etc.

Thanks. I know what a sleeved is but if you could please yet explain what closed/semi-closed/open means. Whit a flat four I assume you mean a boxer engine.

dimviii

1st March 2009, 22:41

.Yoy can also find open/semi closed deck engine blocks and at 4 in line engines.
ie evo9 is a closed deck.
evo x is a semiclosed deck
sti spec c is semiclosed too.
closed or semiclosed decks have more strength than open deck blocks.
very important for high boost turbocharged engines with als systems.

Click here as it is explained from some subaru guys..
http://images.google.gr/imgres?imgurl=http://forums.trinituner.com/upload/bl.JPG&imgrefurl=http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php%3Fp%3D23782070&usg=__B9Hk_vON-qjizRDGwcSTGUnPQM0=&h=329&w=550&sz=27&hl=el&start=13&tbnid=KtVNEuqs1GZYDM:&tbnh=80&tbnw=133&prev=/images%3Fq%3DSEMICLOSED%2BDECK%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Del %26sa%3DG

janvanvurpa

1st March 2009, 23:49

Thanks. I know what a sleeved is but if you could please yet explain what closed/semi-closed/open means. Whit a flat four I assume you mean a boxer engine.

Hej Old Finn, open deck is when there is more or less 360 degrees of water surrounding the cylinder like many die cast blocks and for example the early Ford V4 used in the great mighty Saab 96 up to maybe mid 1968.
Subaru seems to have borrowed a lot of dimesions from the V4, made the block out of recycled pistons, and copied the dumb idea of "Open deck".
http://legacycentral.org/images/members/justin/open_deck.jpg

They did at some point have "closed deck" or material attaching the cylinder to the rest of the block at some earlier point>

http://legacycentral.org/images/members/justin/closed_deck.jpg

Subaru clearly got lost in their thinking, and went the opposite direction than the Ford V4 which started open deck then went closed, and after that Trollhättan trolls made some fairly OK power out of the thing.

Subaru has clearly lost their way.

grugsticles

2nd March 2009, 08:46

Hej Old Finn, open deck is when there is more or less 360 degrees of water surrounding the cylinder like many die cast blocks and for example the early Ford V4 used in the great mighty Saab 96 up to maybe mid 1968.
Subaru seems to have borrowed a lot of dimesions from the V4, made the block out of recycled pistons, and copied the dumb idea of "Open deck".
http://legacycentral.org/images/members/justin/open_deck.jpg

They did at some point have "closed deck" or material attaching the cylinder to the rest of the block at some earlier point>

http://legacycentral.org/images/members/justin/closed_deck.jpg

Subaru clearly got lost in their thinking, and went the opposite direction than the Ford V4 which started open deck then went closed, and after that Trollhättan trolls made some fairly OK power out of the thing.

Subaru has clearly lost their way.
Thanks for helping with the explanation.

Subaru did use closes deck blocks for the early Liberty/Legacy's (ie. 89 to 93) and some early classic WRX's, but then moved to open deck.
Since then modern WRX's and STi's tend to use semi-closed deck (basically an open deck with rods welded into placed around the cylinder sleeve to stop it from moving at high RPM and loads). You can get quite good performance from a semi-closed deck block. 300+kw at the wheels with the right supporting mods is quite common.

Im not sure what Subaru WRC's use but I certainly wouldnt say they have lost their way in terms of engine design. Then again, Im a Subaru fan:P

tolis

3rd March 2009, 20:33

A rumour in Greece says that Aris Vovos will contest this year's Acropolis with an EVO 9 from Ralliart Italy. He wanted to take part with a C4 WRC, but due to economic crisis, he changed his mind.

muscrae

4th March 2009, 04:44

Interesting :)

Elena: “When I am not next to him, Sebastian does not win!"

http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id=4088&desc=Loeb%20finishes%20second%20in%20Monaco%20quad %20race

OldF

5th March 2009, 21:36

Thanks for helping with the explanation.

Subaru did use closes deck blocks for the early Liberty/Legacy's (ie. 89 to 93) and some early classic WRX's, but then moved to open deck.
Since then modern WRX's and STi's tend to use semi-closed deck (basically an open deck with rods welded into placed around the cylinder sleeve to stop it from moving at high RPM and loads). You can get quite good performance from a semi-closed deck block. 300+kw at the wheels with the right supporting mods is quite common.

Im not sure what Subaru WRC's use but I certainly wouldnt say they have lost their way in terms of engine design. Then again, Im a Subaru fan:P

Thanks a lot grugsticles, janvanvurpa and dimviii

alleskids

7th March 2009, 20:39

Volkswagens WRC plans are on hold. They (first) gonna defend their victory in the 2010 Dakar rally. Despite the hugh losses, the investment for the Dakar are worth it, because the publicity of their victory were hugh al over the world. But the WRC budget has to be given to the rally raid program. VW will probarly maintain their crew, so Carlos Sainz will have a second change to take the Dakar rally.

Sulland

7th March 2009, 20:54

Yes saw that VW will defend the Dakar title, so Polo with SA and RGRS will still be the top VW rally car !

urabus-denoS2000

8th March 2009, 19:58

I hear the skiing race in Norway was cancelled because of bad weather,does this mean that the Henning vs. skier duel won't happen?

SubaruNorway

9th March 2009, 18:07

I hear the skiing race in Norway was cancelled because of bad weather,does this mean that the Henning vs. skier duel won't happen?

Yeah i was up there and it was very fogy and lots of loose snow in the hill so it didn't happen unfortunetly. Not sure if it will be done later on.

Micke_VOC

11th March 2009, 11:45

Anyone have any news about Guy Wilks ?

11th March 2009, 15:48

Anyone have any news about Guy Wilks ?

MEM are trying to get the fundinng for him to run some events in the IRC.

noel157

11th March 2009, 18:23

MEM are trying to get the fundinng for him to run some events in the IRC.

What about his own money raising scheme that he started? Subaru only? WRC only?

OldF

11th March 2009, 20:40

This is already one-week-old news from www.mtv3.fi/ralli (http://www.mtv3.fi/ralli).

Jarmo Mahonen, member of the rally commission:

It seems that the manufacturers want a winter series.

Google translated: http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=_t&hl=fi&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mtv3.fi%2Furheilu%2Fralli%2Fuut iset.shtml%2Farkistot%2Fralli%2F2009%2F03%2F830938&sl=fi&tl=en&history_state0

Barreis

12th March 2009, 17:44

Does anybody know what is all about?
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2009/03/12/solberg-hofft-auf-werkscockpit/index.html

wwbroe

12th March 2009, 18:21

Does anybody know what is all about?
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2009/03/12/solberg-hofft-auf-werkscockpit/index.html

Nothing new, it says that Solberg is hoping to get a works drive for next season, but he isn't talking about any brand. ;)

sindroms

13th March 2009, 13:38

Anyone have any news about Guy Wilks ?

Quoting Valdis Spredzis (one of 'MML Sports' owners) - "Evo X will drive in England in April and tests are going to do Lasse Lampi and Guy Wilks. In May (16.05.-17.05.) in "Rally Talsi" (Latvia) Guy Wilks will drive Lancer Evo X prepared by MML Sports"

Viridian Black

13th March 2009, 17:22

i heard in motorsports news that Guy Wilks is testing with the Proton s2000 and trying to get a drive in the irc with them.

Mirek

13th March 2009, 17:30

IRC Acores is a week before Talsi, no problem in my opinion ;)

Motorsportfun

14th March 2009, 20:00

It looks like the JORDAN Rally will be out in 2010. Anybody has confirmations about this rumours? I've just heared about RUSSIA and INDONESIA for logistic probs...

Camelopard

17th March 2009, 03:47

It looks like the JORDAN Rally will be out in 2010. ...

Hmmmm, any more info, I've already booked my tickets!

(well not really, but I was intending to go to this one then go up north to Turkey 2 weeks later....)

wrc_flipper

17th March 2009, 09:25

It looks like the JORDAN Rally will be out in 2010. Anybody has confirmations about this rumours? I've just heared about RUSSIA and INDONESIA for logistic probs...

Wow lack of teams / crews now lack of events!

Xsara Fan

17th March 2009, 11:16

It looks like the JORDAN Rally will be out in 2010. Anybody has confirmations about this rumours? I've just heared about RUSSIA and INDONESIA for logistic probs...

The reason of the changing 'Rally Russia' for other rally is not a 'logistic probs'. Funny - here in Russia nobody knows the reason! FIA guys said in Novorossiisk in 2008: "Great rally". And at the start of the 2009 same guys told in interview`s: "Russia is not ready"...

OK, now good luck for WRC in Russia :(

morganmilan

17th March 2009, 16:42

A.F.F.

17th March 2009, 16:47

Sometimes there where a rumour that WRC cars next year will be somehow downgraded to match the S2000.

Gard

17th March 2009, 19:21

Sometimes there where a rumour that WRC cars next year will be somehow downgraded to match the S2000.

They could let the WRC cars use the same restrictor as the s2000 ;) Wouldn't help the s2000 cars much thow

Mirek

17th March 2009, 19:29

Definitely as no WRC would reach finish from reliability reasons :D

tmx

17th March 2009, 23:21

Sorry if my question is obvious, but I´m totally confused. Fia council has stated today that actual WRC cars and S2000b cars will be nominated to score manufacturer points at 2010 WRC. So, they´re absolutely different cars and their max speed, power, etc are different too...how could they compete? :confused: :confused:

I was wondering the same, in that case if the S2000 is not developed to be faster than the current WRC yet, for 2010 Citroen and Ford will stick with their WRC car. I wonder if any other S2000 manufacturer even wants to join WRC for full season in 2010.

Camelopard

18th March 2009, 00:39

cannyboy

18th March 2009, 00:43

How about putting seb in an S2000 car, and everyone else in wrc's.
Seb would prob still win, but you'd have a better championship
:)

Maybe this is the fia's cunning plan

RallyPT

18th March 2009, 01:36

How about putting seb in an S2000 car, and everyone else in wrc's.
Seb would prob still win, but you'd have a better championship
:)

Maybe this is the fia's cunning plan

That would be a great ideia!! For sure, the solution for the missing competition... :D

morganmilan

18th March 2009, 11:18

I was wondering the same, in that case if the S2000 is not developed to be faster than the current WRC yet, for 2010 Citroen and Ford will stick with their WRC car. I wonder if any other S2000 manufacturer even wants to join WRC for full season in 2010.
That´s just the problem. Which would be the interest of a WRC when your S2000 car can´t be in the pace as WRcars? Again Skoda,Peugeot, Abarth, etc at IRC and Ford and Citroen at WRC next year? Anything else of the same story? :eek:

Englandsfahrer

18th March 2009, 14:32

J.Lindstroem

18th March 2009, 14:39

http://www.crash.net/World+Rally/News/144150/1/fia_confirms_non-turbo_future_for_wrc.html

So, finally we know: it's a normal s2000 + aerokit for 2011/2012.
Clearly they want as many manufacturers to join as possible, since not a lot of them seems likely to develop a turbokit for their current s2000 cars. At least that means there will be plenty of manufacturers to choose from. And finally well get some great sounding cars back in the forrest. At gallis crest this year the only car I could hear way before the jump was the skoda.

Still, this might spell the end of Loeb. Will the urge to compete against a strong field overcome his obvious hatred for N/A 4x4's?

Me, I don't mind. The skoda sounds like nothing else, this side of a escort bda! It's the most glorious sounding rallycar in at least a decade. And I like the way they have to really attack all the time to make it go fast.

Good news, good news indeed!

So how many manufacturers makes s2000 cars today?

Abarth
Skoda
Peugeot
Proton/MG
Toyota
Lada

Also Ford and Citroen is supposed to make S2000 cars for manufactor championship.

I suppose we won't see Peugeot 207 and Fabia in S2000Wrc as a registred manufactor but we may see a lot of privateers driving those cars.

Does anyone know if VW is interested in developing a S2000 car? I mean if Skoda is not interested VW should be interested in having somebody representing the VW Group in a manufactor team!

Psycho!

18th March 2009, 14:48

Still, this might spell the end of Loeb
During the pre-rally press conference he said that he had no problem with S2000.... ;)

A.F.F.

18th March 2009, 15:31

Proton/MG

Aren't those two separate manufacturers?

Mirek

18th March 2009, 19:43

J.Lindstroem: MG S2000 is made by MSD like Opel Corsa S2000 (the team which built Hyundai Kit Cars and WRC for example). Proton is made by MEM which is completely different maker. They built cars for PWRC some years a go...

VW has S2000 and quite good one. It's Polo S2000 made by VW Sport RSA. It's further developed for tarmac in Belgium based team René Georges Rallysport and used in both national and international rallys. There is not much cars but more than MGs, Opels or Protons in the moment (and curently even more than Škoda).

On the other hand Lada and Dacia prototypes are dead.

TheFlyingTuga

19th March 2009, 00:03

]On the other hand Lada and Dacia prototypes are dead.

Mirek, I could be mistaken, but I think that the Lada 110 Vk S2000 was not a prototype! The car raced, even if, it never get some good results!

BTW, I see this one over the net! Fake image... but I want to read what's the article is about... and I can't :(

http://www.postimage.org/aV1UyFC0.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1UyFC0)

Mirek

19th March 2009, 00:35

Lada was only one prototype. It did just one Russian rally in late 2005 or 2006 (and IRC Rally Russia 07 as zero car) but never was homologated.

Fri

19th March 2009, 08:55

Toyota?

Motorsportfun

19th March 2009, 09:29

Mirek, I could be mistaken, but I think that the Lada 110 Vk S2000 was not a prototype! The car raced, even if, it never get some good results!

BTW, I see this one over the net! Fake image... but I want to read what's the article is about... and I can't :(

http://www.postimage.org/aV1UyFC0.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aV1UyFC0)

Hi, I work in that magazine. It explains that Renault is considering to develop his S2000 car from the Sandero, in place of the (ugly!) Logan, which was tested by Simon Jean-Joseph some years ago in various test sessions. :)

RallyPT

19th March 2009, 16:03

Here you have all S2000 cars made until now:
http://www.s2000rally.com/s2000-cars.php

Another thing, Sebastien Loeb said that he would have no problemes to run with S2000. You can verify it here:
http://www.crash.net/World+Rally/News/143934/1/loeb_important_thing_is_to_save_the_wrc.html

jbmarcus21

19th March 2009, 20:50

Marcus car delivery to Portugal 2009

http://planetemarcus.free.fr/saison2009.htm

;)

WRC1

19th March 2009, 21:53

Marcus car delivery to Portugal 2009

http://planetemarcus.free.fr/saison2009.htm

;)

sorry to say that, but this is one ugly livery....bosse deserve better!

jbmarcus21

19th March 2009, 22:17

yes hope more design

ste898

19th March 2009, 22:31

sorry to say that, but this is one ugly livery....bosse deserve better!

Yep very true.....probably the worst livery I have seen!!!

urabus-denoS2000

19th March 2009, 23:41

Pretty dissapointed in the livery

JFL

19th March 2009, 23:44

I thought Vodaphone was supposed to be on the car.. They usually have a pretty cool design..

AndyRAC

19th March 2009, 23:51

I thought Vodaphone was supposed to be on the car.. They usually have a pretty cool design..

So was I, I thought they were one of the parties behind his deal. Therefore I was expecting a Vodafone liveried Subaru - however not, a disappointing livery.

DonJippo

19th March 2009, 23:56

sorry to say that, but this is one ugly livery....bosse deserve better!

Well maybe this time Prodrive decided to concentrate to make the car better rather than designing a fancy livery...one can always hope...

JRodrigues

20th March 2009, 00:27

sorry to say that, but this is one ugly livery....bosse deserve better!

What did he deserve then?? This??

http://90right.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/gronholm-focus-07.jpg

The livery is supossed to show the sponsors. In this case, just one: Turismo de Portugal. And t does it perfectly.

RallyPT

20th March 2009, 00:30

Yeah, the car is not pretty, they could do better. I also thought that Vodafone would be the sponser, was suposed to be...
Let's hope that Markus will make a good rally, he will test the car during three days before the rally (1 in GB and 2 in Spain)...

DonJippo

20th March 2009, 00:43

1 in GB and 2 in Spain...

One in GB was yesterday two in Spain scheduled for next week I believe.

A.F.F.

20th March 2009, 06:14

The livery is supossed to show the sponsors. In this case, just one: Turismo de Portugal. And t does it perfectly.

:up:

Well said.

tmx

20th March 2009, 08:41

New Zealand Rally will not be held this year and is set to return early next year.

J.Lindstroem

20th March 2009, 12:59

The livery is supossed to show the sponsors. In this case, just one: Turismo de Portugal. And t does it perfectly.

The form, how the sponsor is showed, is also very important. It should be in "turismo de Portugal's" interest to make sure that their brand is exposed in a nice way that is attractive for the audiance. A statement like that indicates that you don't know much about marketing and advertising, but maybe you don't care about it either...

JRodrigues

20th March 2009, 13:02

The form, how the sponsor is showed, is also very important. It should be in "turismo de Portugal's" interest to make sure that their brand is exposed in a nice way that is attractive for the audiance. A statement like that indicates that you don't know much about marketing and advertising, but maybe you don't care about it either...

Actually, I do care, since I've made some liveries for rallying cars.

J.Lindstroem

20th March 2009, 13:06

Actually, I do care, since I've made some liveries for rallying cars.

Then i don't understand what you mean with stating that the liverys only function is to show the sponsors. Is it not important how the sponsors is showed also? As it is now, no one will notice the brand...

Koppomsbo

21st March 2009, 22:09

Probably "Turismo the portugal" or whatever gets what they pay for.... Small amount of money , small sticker... big amount of money... big sticker.

Myselt i think this Pordrive who wants Markus to go down there to whoop Petters ass....

JFL

21st March 2009, 22:27

The smaller the stickers, often people look more carefully what i says...Told to me by a guy who decorated our car....

Maui J.

22nd March 2009, 07:12

New Zealand Rally will not be held this year and is set to return early next year.

Rally NZ was never part of the WRC for 2009.
What you may have heard was that the organisers were planing an event this year using the name Rally NZ. It was for local entrants (and any internationals wanting to enter), just to keep the tradition of the event alive for this non-championship year.

The organisers have decided not to go ahead with the event, as it would put even more financial pressure on those already doing the national championship.

Sulland

22nd March 2009, 10:16

Hi, I work in that magazine. It explains that Renault is considering to develop his S2000 car from the Sandero, in place of the (ugly!) Logan, which was tested by Simon Jean-Joseph some years ago in various test sessions. :)

Is there an online version of this magazine ?

And is there some truth in this project, or is it a dream from the Dacia team ?
Last time with the Logan, they were told by Renault that doing rally in a car in this price segment would be sending the wrong signals. Hopefully Renault see the benefit this time. They do F1 and Dacia could do Rally !

Brother John

22nd March 2009, 15:24

I don´t care about collors and the livery, I´l hope it is a good car for a top driver. In blue it was almost always a sh!t car. :dozey:

bluuford

22nd March 2009, 22:40

I don´t care about collors and the livery, I´l hope it is a good car for a top driver. In blue it was almost always a sh!t car. :dozey:

That´s my man! I remember that couple of years ago my favorite livery in Estonian championship was one white Subaru without any advertising stickers. :-)

Motorsportfun

23rd March 2009, 00:24

Is there an online version of this magazine ?

And is there some truth in this project, or is it a dream from the Dacia team ?
Last time with the Logan, they were told by Renault that doing rally in a car in this price segment would be sending the wrong signals. Hopefully Renault see the benefit this time. They do F1 and Dacia could do Rally !

There is a preview of the print edition of the magazine (here you have our magazines previews http://www.sportautomoto.it/ ), but it was closed as a consequence of the world economic downturn IMO. :( Anyway, now there is SportAuto "alive".

For what concern the project, I know there were some discussions about it, but this economic dt probably slowed down all the things. If you think, Renault cut the budget also for F.1 and ING is pulling out from the end of this year... is a difficult situation for all the Renault group (well, for all the European manufacturers! :p :) .

As Raikkonen says: "Wait and see" :p :

Barreis

25th March 2009, 16:49

Does anybody know what is all about?
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2009/03/24/citroen-laesst-solberg-schmoren/index.html

Mirek

25th March 2009, 16:54

They say Petter wants mechanical differentials because Xsara is faster with them but that there are no mechanical diffs prepared for Xsara but for C4 only...

tmx

25th March 2009, 18:52

]They say Petter wants mechanical differentials because Xsara is faster with them but that there are no mechanical diffs prepared for Xsara but for C4 only...
In an interview Petter himself said that Loeb told him the mechanical diff is faster. Sounds about right, they would be reluctant to supply them to him anyway.