[WRC] News & rumours (part II)

[EightGear]

I read somewhere that in Italy, WRC will be shown on RAI Sports. To me that has always seemed like a big channel (any Italian to confirm or deny?).

[Tom206wrc]

Harsh word from Yve Matton on Thierry's exit from Citroen:
Google'i tõlge (http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=et&ie=UTF-8&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rallye-magazin.de%2Frallyes%2Fwm%2Fnachrichten%2Fnews-detail%2Fd%2F2012%2F12%2F20%2Floeb-mehr-zu-tun-als-je-zuvor%2Findex.html)


So it was not Citroën being late in decision on program for Neuville which was the reason of Thierry's choice :confused:

[oyunbozan]

So it was not Citroën being late in decision on program for Neuville which was the reason of Thierry's choice :confused:

i am pretty sure Matton did not take Neuville situation seriously. Now he is frustrated.
"I will not train again young drivers, which is too expensive..." words that a wise man would not use. First Ogier, now Neuville. He is failing them not the other way.

[makinen_fan]

Story is in wrc.com as well
World Rally Championship - News - Big boost for WRC TV (http://www.wrc.com/news/big-boost-for-wrc-tv/?fid=18124)

I hoped for some live action as well but seems no at the moment

[tommeke_B]

So it was not Citroën being late in decision on program for Neuville which was the reason of Thierry's choice :confused:
I believe Citroën had plenty of time to do something. For Neuville, if you have no promise of more than 5 events on paper, the choice is easy... In an interview with autonews magazine Yves Matton said that they will not take a junior driver in 2013, but that, if they need a driver, they will look at the best one available, and if that is Thierry, that is Thierry... :)

Remember that media often twists words a bit, to create the story they want...

[Franky]

Story is in wrc.com as well
World Rally Championship - News - Big boost for WRC TV (http://www.wrc.com/news/big-boost-for-wrc-tv/?fid=18124)

I hoped for some live action as well but seems no at the moment

Read that article and a huge 'What?' reaction was the result, maybe it's because English isn't my native language. But here's why such reaction


It plans to introduce a number of technological highlights into its WRC production, including the use of on-board cameras and camera-equipped helicopters.

Introduce onboard cameras and camera helicopters?

[spiderem]

IMO, Neuville should give a very big cuddle to Nasser, as he didn't show anything this season that would make any body to invest in him next season, especially a full program (good for us though, more driver, more spectacle).
I know it was his first season in WRC... but getting a full program next year, it is a big gift. Hope he will be smart and start to finish rallies.
Regarding citroen, it looks like they don't want to do much without loeb... Hope Hirvonen and Sordo will still have full support next season from the team, and that they not start to put ressource on the wtcc and leave the wrc program as it is...

[oyunbozan]

Read that article and a huge 'What?' reaction was the result, maybe it's because English isn't my native language. But here's why such reaction



Introduce onboard cameras and camera helicopters?

"what?!" +1
all in all i want is them to upload more and more incars to youtube channel. only eurosport can come over global live coverage imo.

[Mirek]

IMO, Neuville should give a very big cuddle to Nasser, as he didn't show anything this season that would make any body to invest in him next season, especially a full program (good for us though, more driver, more spectacle).
I know it was his first season in WRC... but getting a full program next year, it is a big gift. Hope he will be smart and start to finish rallies.

How many drivers managed to win 11 stages in their first season???

[ChristianArp]

IMO, Neuville should give a very big cuddle to Nasser, as he didn't show anything this season that would make any body to invest in him next season, especially a full program (good for us though, more driver, more spectacle).
I know it was his first season in WRC... but getting a full program next year, it is a big gift. Hope he will be smart and start to finish rallies.

So none of the following would qualify as investable traits?:
- Showed major and consistent pace in very similar type of car to WRC.
- Won stages in his first year, and showed glimpses of what is already known, ie. his potential.
- Was thrown in at the deep end. The guy is a tarmac born-and-bred driver, and is now expected to seamlessly jump onto gravel just because the championship is heavier on that surface?
- Is still a young guy, and vastly less experienced than the guys he is being compared to.

I don't normally defend or attack people, but having seen Thierry in person at Condroz in the 207 where he had an almighty battle against Freddy in a Fabia, I will for him.
Yes, he can't stand still in his development and expect to stay in the championship, but realistically he probably won't do that - let him have a chance instead of just slamming him immediately.

Besides, wouldn't it be a no-brainer decision for anyone to go for the full season offer over a 'half season, we'll see as we go along'-deal? I commend him for taking the best available deal FOR HIM.

[SubaruNorway]

Not sure Citroen should be so upset about it, just look at it as a free development year if he should return...

[Motorsportfun]

Story is in wrc.com as well
World Rally Championship - News - Big boost for WRC TV (http://www.wrc.com/news/big-boost-for-wrc-tv/?fid=18124)

I hoped for some live action as well but seems no at the moment

Behind them there's Infront Sports & Media, one of the main assets the WRC could agree. They have a great clients portfolio, as they manage UEFA/IAAF events, but also football leagues like French Ligue1 and Italian Serie A. It's great news, for sure!

Now we can hope for a wider distribution and sell of the TV rights to free-to-air channels...

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Not sure Citroen should be so upset about it
Personally, I don't think they have any right to be upset about it. A driver has the right to make a decision about his future that he feels is the best for him. If Neuville's contract with Citroen had expired and he accepted a deal with Ford because he felt that was the best place for him to be, then Citroen have nothing to complain about. If they lost a driver that they wanted to hold onto, then perhaps they should have tried a little harder to keep him.

[spiderem]

ogier?

[spiderem]

How many drivers managed to win 11 stages in their first season???
ogier?

[Frostmourne]

Citroen has no reason to get upset at Neuville. I think it was easy choice for him. And Citroen also ranting about Ogier, well, if Citroen did not deny Ogier a fair chance into the drivers championship, he will not leave Citroen. But as we all know, all citroen team backing up Loeb, he is the 1st driver, he is the one who have to win. And I am semi happy because of Loeb's semi retirement. But still, I think there will be some dramas in the events he will take part in.

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Citroen has no reason to get upset at Neuville. I think it was easy choice for him. And Citroen also ranting about Ogier, well, if Citroen did not deny Ogier a fair chance into the drivers championship, he will not leave Citroen. But as we all know, all citroen team backing up Loeb, he is the 1st driver, he is the one who have to win. And I am semi happy because of Loeb's semi retirement. But still, I think there will be some dramas in the events he will take part in.
As I was saying the other day, I think Yves Matton is too conservative in his driver choices. He seems to be quite content letting drivers get their feet wet driving for other manufacturers before poaching them away. But conversely, he seems to get quite upset when one of those other manufacturers does to Citroen what he is more than willing to do to them, and steal their talent away. It's as if Matton seems to think he should have the first pick of the driver market, and that everyone else needs to wait their turn and sign up whoever is left over.

If that is indeed Matton's attitude toward it all, then I find it rather disgusting. Citroen's success might make driving for them an appealing prospect for any up-and-coming driver, but that does not give the team rights that the others do not. If he really wants to foster some loyalty, then perhaps he and Citroen should consider supporting privateer teams a bit more. I cannot help but notice that for all their success and the car's strengths, relatively few drivers choose to use a DS3 - particularly in comparison to Ford. In fact, the only three privateer teams using DS3s that I can think of in recent years were Van Merksteijn Motorsport, ICE-1 Racing and Petter Solberg WRT. Two of those have been shut down, and the Van Merksteijns have been rather quiet. If Citroen were willing to invest in younger talent, they would be rewarded in kind. A part of me believes they have already missed the boat in this regard, because once Loeb retires for good, the gap to the rest of the field is going to rapidly shrink. Mikko Hirvonen is likely to be the 2013 World Champion, but once Volkswagen have a year's experience under their belts, it's going to be a much tighter fight. Supporting privateers like Neuville and Ostberg would pay dividends later on, but Citroen's hubris will come back to haunt them sooner, rather than later.

[Mintexmemory]

Read that article and a huge 'What?' reaction was the result, maybe it's because English isn't my native language. But here's why such reaction



Introduce onboard cameras and camera helicopters?

I think the problem with this statement (which some 'no-nothing' at WRC's webmaster has clearly lifted direct from the Swiss Company's press release) is that it was probably written by someone who's first language isn't English and that the word which has come out as 'introduce' may well be a 'Googlish' error.
BTW - Anyone else think Loeb's Citroen PA (in the accompanying picture on WRC.Com) is the very definition of 'caisses couilles'

[makinen_fan]

I think the problem with this statement (which some 'no-nothing' at WRC's webmaster has clearly lifted direct from the Swiss Company's press release) is that it was probably written by someone who's first language isn't English and that the word which has come out as 'introduce' may well be a 'Googlish' error.
BTW - Anyone else think Loeb's Citroen PA (in the accompanying picture on WRC.Com) is the very definition of 'caisses couilles'

Has anyone seen the press releas directly from HBS or Red Bull Media? I have searched for them to see directly what is said but could not find any.

[bluuford]

Has anyone seen the press releas directly from HBS or Red Bull Media? I have searched for them to see directly what is said but could not find any.
you mean this? HBS: HBS APPOINTED TV PRODUCTION PARTNER OF WORLD RALLY CHAMPIONSHIP FOR 2013 (http://www.hbs.tv/news-archive/news/article/hbs-appointed-as-tv-production-partner-of-world-rally-championship-for-2013.html)
It is a very big company and you cannot expect that their PR writer does know much about WRC. Important point is the fact that they have found a big company who does have many abilities to sell the product. many possibilities for cross marketig etc. As we learned from their PR the filming is still done by professionals.

[Kielder]

Italian team Top Run will participate with an Impreza WRX STI Sedan driven by Argentinian Marcos Ligato in Portugal 2013. The same car will be used by Johan Heloïse, from Martinique, for running the Italian Championship.

http://i48.tinypic.com/314ynud.jpg

[Franky]

Lovely looking creature

[vino_93]

Nice to see this car in Europe !
Will Heloise run some ERC races (Ypres, ...) ?

[MTA]

Ramona Karlsson will run a WRC car in the Swedish Championship 2013.
Is not clear what brand of the car in the article but more information will be coming.

Historiska rallyduon klar för värstingklassen - Sport | SVT.se (http://www.svt.se/sport/historiska-rallyduon-klar-for-varstingklassen)

[tolis]

Ramona Karlsson will run a WRC car in the Swedish Championship 2013.
Is not clear what brand of the car in the article but more information will be coming.

Historiska rallyduon klar för värstingklassen - Sport | SVT.se (http://www.svt.se/sport/historiska-rallyduon-klar-for-varstingklassen)
Thanks for the news! Will she do any WRC rally?

[MTA]

From the article:
Is this a step toward running the worst class in the World Cup series in the future?

It's completely different money there, and a very big step to take. But it's a dream I have. And I have managed to realize this dream of driving WRC car. So you never know, says Ramona Karlsson.



So not to start with anyway.
Will see if I can find out which car brand that she will run.

[dupanton]

Nice to see this car in Europe !
Will Heloise run some ERC races (Ypres, ...) ?

He did Ypres this year...

[Mirek]

He did several IRC events in 2011 and 2012 but he suffered some injury last year which prevented him taking part in more rounds (for example he was on Barum entry list but didn't start).

[MTA]

Ramona will drive a Fabia WRC.

[SubaruNorway]

Ramona will drive a Fabia WRC.

The one EVEN rally has?

Does anyone know if they sorted out the rear end with too short travel on the new sedan Impreza?

[BleAivano]

Ramona Karlsson will run a WRC car in the Swedish Championship 2013.
Is not clear what brand of the car in the article but more information will be coming.

Historiska rallyduon klar för värstingklassen - Sport | SVT.se (http://www.svt.se/sport/historiska-rallyduon-klar-for-varstingklassen)

full pressrelease: PRESS: Ramona och Miriam kör WRC 2013 « Ramona Rallying (http://www.ramonarallying.com/2012/12/21/ramona-och-miriam-kor-wrc2013/)

[TyPat107]

Does anyone know if they sorted out the rear end with too short travel on the new sedan Impreza?

Beyond the r4 kit that has the weld-in towers for longer struts?

[Rallyper]

Ramona will drive a Fabia WRC.

The fabia Mikkelsen drove in his latest performance with that car.

[Barreis]

Why is Ramona in WRC section?!

[Rallyper]

Why is Ramona in WRC section?!

Correct. It should be in natoinal section - but maybe some interest for everone. I don´t know...

[jbmarcus21]

#WRC #ERC #FFSA 2013 calendar Calendrier Rallyes 2013 (http://planetemarcus.com/calendrier-rallyes-2013/)

[A.F.F.]

Italian team Top Run will participate with an Impreza WRX STI Sedan driven by Argentinian Marcos Ligato in Portugal 2013. The same car will be used by Johan Heloïse, from Martinique, for running the Italian Championship.

http://i48.tinypic.com/314ynud.jpg

That is some beautiful piece of machinery there :up:

[Andre Oliveira]

A proper Scooby

[vino_93]

He did Ypres this year...
I know, it's why I ask if he'll do again ERC events in 2013 :p

[SubaruNorway]

Henning will do a full season in a Go Fast Mini according to this, not confirmed.
Hennings kontrakt er i boks - Motorposten (http://www.motorposten.no/rykteborsen/hennings-kontrakt-er-i-boks/)

[MartijnS]

Let's hope the GoFast project won't be only 1 rally again!

[tommeke_B]

Wasn't it 2 rallies? Anyway, GoFast WentFast... :p

[SubaruNorway]

MC,Finnskogen and Sweden actually. Hopefully i will be able to use this video title again :) He was talking about a 3 year deal with a team, we will see!
Henning Solberg living up to his sponsor "Go Fast" - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NtOrkw6MgHk)

[Mirek]

The fabia Mikkelsen drove in his latest performance with that car.

Good luck to her. This car is one of very few proper cars (ex-CRT Kopecký). These were by far the best Fabias WRC ever built. But of course there's a question in which condition it is now.

[MTA]

I think it is the car that appears in this tweet http://twitter.com/PontusTidemand/status/281870265800093697 Is it the same car as PG drove in Rally Norway, and Sandell have run into some Swedish competitions? If I was right, there were two fabia WRC in Norway?

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Good luck to her. This car is one of very few proper cars (ex-CRT Kopecký). These were by far the best Fabias WRC ever built. But of course there's a question in which condition it is now.
Perhaps the more challenging question is what condition the car will be in after she's done with it.

[Prisoner Monkeys]

perhaps he and Citroen should consider supporting privateer teams a bit more. I cannot help but notice that for all their success and the car's strengths, relatively few drivers choose to use a DS3 - particularly in comparison to Ford.

[...]

If Citroen were willing to invest in younger talent, they would be rewarded in kind. A part of me believes they have already missed the boat in this regard, because once Loeb retires for good, the gap to the rest of the field is going to rapidly shrink.
Well, I got my wish ... partially:

World Rally Championship - News - Citroen aims for the top with new class (http://www.wrc.com/news/citroen-aims-for-the-top-with-new-class/?fid=18128)

I'd still like to see mroe Citroen privateer teams in the WRC itself, though.

[GigiGalliNo1]

So.... Junior WRC is only with Ford Fiesta R2... and Citroen have their own class?

[Prisoner Monkeys]

No, Citroen are running a young driver programme within the WRC-3. Other drivers can enter the category, but they're trying to encourage drivers to campaign with the DS3 by offering them half a season in the WRC-2 with support for using the Citroen. On a certain level, they probably are trying to get ahead of the curve established by Ford when they established the Academ/J-WRC. But the WRC-3 isn't exclusive to Citroen.

[Mirek]

I think it is the car that appears in this tweet Twitter / PontusTidemand: Today we had the annual ... (http://twitter.com/PontusTidemand/status/281870265800093697) Is it the same car as PG drove in Rally Norway, and Sandell have run into some Swedish competitions? If I was right, there were two fabia WRC in Norway?

Few years back Bernhard Kongsrud bought two Fabias from CRT Kopecký but later one was stolen (at least that is what I heard). The other one was sold to Erik Veiby and that's the one we are speaking about.

[Juha_Koo]

Finnish company Filmworks is going to be the technical partner of the promotor and will therefore supply the TV-technology for the WRC. Especially mentioned is a new HD onboard camera system and "new tricks" which they will test out during the season...

Google-kääntäjä (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=fi&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mtv3.fi%2Furheilu%2Fralli%2Fuut iset.shtml%2F2012%2F12%2F1679893%2Fred-bull-luottaa-suomalaisosaamiseen)

As an onboard-lover, I hope these words are not empty. They should take a look how e.g. Mediasport.cz handles the production of really beautiful and well made onboards.

[tommeke_B]

Citroën World Rally Team 2012 (19 allée des Marronniers Film) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7pQqbROTf4) Great movie about Citroën Racing... I hope they make subtitles for it for people who don't understand French :)

[oyunbozan]

Citroën World Rally Team 2012 (19 allée des Marronniers Film) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7pQqbROTf4) Great movie about Citroën Racing... I hope they make subtitles for it for people who don't understand French :)

they never put subtitles at citroen WRT or best of rally live videos. freaking nationalists, the worst character of french.

[stefanvv]

they never put subtitles at citroen WRT or best of rally live videos. freaking nationalists, the worst character of french.

How do they want to sell more cars all over the world then :confused:

[rallyfiend]

"what?!" +1
all in all i want is them to upload more and more incars to youtube channel. only eurosport can come over global live coverage imo.

Have you seen the shoddy coverage Eurosport is providing for it's own ERC series?!

WRC can't do any worse than that.

NOS was able to provide a Live coverage from all events in 2011 for the Power Stage, Eurosport has never been able to do more than about 3 or 4 a year.

I'd be happy if Red Bull gets it back to where it was with NOS in 2011.

[dimviii]

Brynildsen livery for Sweden
https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/385623_10151221436543952_1562652325_n.jpg

[oyunbozan]

Have you seen the shoddy coverage Eurosport is providing for it's own ERC series?!

WRC can't do any worse than that.

NOS was able to provide a Live coverage from all events in 2011 for the Power Stage, Eurosport has never been able to do more than about 3 or 4 a year.

I'd be happy if Red Bull gets it back to where it was with NOS in 2011.

ES broadcasted live onboards. that is good enough for me.

[stefanvv]

ES broadcasted live onboards. that is good enough for me.

So does Canal+ in Rally France.

[gtimad73]

I have to agree. Like I've said before at there best they are very very good. but the norm is in my eye no better than what NOS put out. There Coverage of there own championship last year i think wasn't the best. Not on at the times stated and on very late. Im I hoping this year we can have good online updates with some good coverage on free to view tv. thats key for me. Then maybe paid online coverage of stages would be good .

[gtimad73]

Have you seen the shoddy coverage Eurosport is providing for it's own ERC series?!

WRC can't do any worse than that.

NOS was able to provide a Live coverage from all events in 2011 for the Power Stage, Eurosport has never been able to do more than about 3 or 4 a year.

I'd be happy if Red Bull gets it back to where it was with NOS in 2011.

I have to agree. Like I've said before at there best they are very very good. but the norm is in my eye no better than what NOS put out. There Coverage of there own championship last year i think wasn't the best. Not on at the times stated and on very late. I'm hoping this year we can have good online updates with some good coverage on free to view tv. thats key for me. Then maybe paid online coverage of stages would be good .

[oyunbozan]

So does Canal+ in Rally France.

what is channel+? never heard of it.. oh canal+ oh french national channel. very nice.. i hope a french broadcaster becomes the promoter of WRC in the future. %50 of WRC videos in you tube are spoken in french already. then we all going to have to learn french, problem solved.
i dont want to continue this, off topic. i liked NOS as much, but they are gone.

[mousti]

Mentos Ascania back in WRC.. Autosport (http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=cs&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=cs&tl=en&twu=1&u=http://www.autosport.cz/clanek.php%3Fcl%3D14714&usg=ALkJrhgbSARVVgIVmLuGD5-mq2_K7uY4Ug)

[Frostmourne]

A question, are those Minis belong to Prodrive? or they been rent/bought from Mini/BMW? In either cases, I am happy to see more teams are getting Mini to compete with!

[oyunbozan]

A question, are those Minis belong to Prodrive? or they been rent/bought from Mini/BMW? In either cases, I am happy to see more teams are getting Mini to compete with!

if you are asking about minis run at middle-east, they are probably TOK Sport, bought from prodrive.

[Frostmourne]

Thanks for the info oyunbozan, but I was refering to the Mini for Mentos Ascania team, the link from mousti's reply :)

[GigiGalliNo1]

The Mini.s that Motorsport Italia have were built by Prodrive but sold to them.

Prodrive has their own MINI.s as well.

Just like PH Motosport own Citroen DS's but Citroen built them

[GigiGalliNo1]

Post deleted

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Please stop me if this is (another) stupid question, but I need a quick answer - is the RRC considered a separate class of car, like Super 2000 and Group N?

[TyPat107]

Please stop me if this is (another) stupid question, but I need a quick answer - is the RRC considered a separate class of car, like Super 2000 and Group N?

Kimda confused on that myself. Weren't rrc intended to replace s2000 overtime but now we will have r5 for that? Is that my understanding? But for the time being rrc, r5, and s2000 will all be competitive together but with no new homologations, s2000 will eventually fade out.

[Prisoner Monkeys]

That's what my confusion stems from. As far as I'm aware, "RRC" is now only used by Ford as a designation for a Fiesta model that is a "step down" from the WRC.

The reason why I'm asking is becuse I'm finding contradictory sources on the internet about Mentos Ascania Racing. Some say they will use a Mini S2000, and others say they will use a Mini RRC.

[TyPat107]

Mini only offer the wrc or the "super production" which is their rrc/s2000 equivalent. Too many stupid names

[Prisoner Monkeys]

They could call it the Susan if that makes them happy - I'm just wondering which class it falls into.

[Mirek]

Any S2000 car without WRC package is class 2 be it S2000 2.0NA or S2000 1.6T.

[oyunbozan]

s2000: N/A aspirated 2.0L like fabia, 207, punto
RRC: turbo 1.6L WRC engine with 30mm restrictor (33mm for WRC) mini JCW S2000, fiesta RRC, DS3 RRC
R5: turbo 1.6L engine. not with huge budged/expert needs to run engine compared WRC but similar output to RRC. only 208 R5 so far.

those are competing in same class. RRC and S2000 are supposed to fade out (i think not so soon)

[Prisoner Monkeys]

So, RRC is not a stand-alone class of car (like Group N), then?

[ChristianArp]

They could call it the Susan if that makes them happy - I'm just wondering which class it falls into.

The class they run in is S2000T - which is in reality 1.6 turbos, as you would know.
RRC, SP etc. are all just names that the manufacturers use to designate the cars.

In regards to the Mentos boys, I dont think that there is an actual difference between what people call Mini RRC an Mini S2000, but I'm not completely sure on that one, hope for Mirek or PLuto to see these posts later on.. ;)

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Right, thank you.

Now I just need to verify the reliability of these Mentos Ascania sources.

[rage82]

The class they run in is S2000T - which is in reality 1.6 turbos, as you would know.
RRC, SP etc. are all just names that the manufacturers use to designate the cars.

In regards to the Mentos boys, I dont think that there is an actual difference between what people call Mini RRC an Mini S2000, but I'm not completely sure on that one, hope for Mirek or PLuto to see these posts later on.. ;)

There's no difference between Mini s2000 and Mini SP - they have only 1.6 turbo engine car without WRC kit

[Frostmourne]

All these classifications and regulations and car classes is so confusing. And Wikipedia's articles not helping at all as alot of them are outdated and unorganized. So basically we have 2 valid classes now for all fia championships, wrc class and group r. Old classes like super 2000 and group n are gone?

[Prisoner Monkeys]

My understanding is that Super 2000 and Group N will eventually be discontinued, and Group R will take over from it. Every new car that gets homologated will be classified under Group R regulations.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Susan

LoL~! :D

[SubaruNorway]

All these classifications and regulations and car classes is so confusing. And Wikipedia's articles not helping at all as alot of them are outdated and unorganized. So basically we have 2 valid classes now for all fia championships, wrc class and group r. Old classes like super 2000 and group n are gone?

WRC=WRC
WRC2=S2000,S2000T,R4,N4,R5
WRC3=R1,R2,R3,R3T,R3D

Might have forgotten something but that's the basics of it.

[Mirek]

All these classifications and regulations and car classes is so confusing. And Wikipedia's articles not helping at all as alot of them are outdated and unorganized. So basically we have 2 valid classes now for all fia championships, wrc class and group r. Old classes like super 2000 and group n are gone?

I will try to explain :)

There used to be the old system of gr.A5-8/N1-4 cars with classes based on cylinder capacity (multiplied by turbo coefficient), later gr.R system was introduced where to make it more confusing the letter stands for engine capacity and number for level of tuning (i.e. R2B -> R2 level of tuning and B engine - under 1600 ccm NA). Besides that they created plenty of cars standing aside of these classes like new and old WRC, S1600, S2000 or wide Kit Cars. That together created a big mess.

Till few years back they used old A/N system and put those other cars somewhere where it looks like suitable for them (S2000 to N4 although it has nothing to do with gr.N, S1600 to A6 etc.). As a result it was even bigger mess (how to explain a newcomer that pure special with engine under 2000 ccm is placed among almost stock cars with engine up to 3500 ccm...).

So they introduced the class WRC-1....10 system where they put all existing cars into some classes based on their performance. I think it was made quite logical but it was still only a step. Now some of these classes are deleted as proven useless (class 1 for example).

Next step is to close all old gr.A/N homologations and also some of those others. That is planned for 2015. After 2015 only gr.R cars, S2000 and WRC 1.6T are allowed in FIA events. All old gr.A/N cars, S1600, Kit Cars etc. are after this date useless for FIA events. If I understand right it is planned also to stop the current R4 experiment and make new R4 same with old N4 (only rename N4 to R4). In my understanding since that time we will have WRC-R5-RGT-R4-R3-R2-R1 classes.

It was already explained here but maybe just for clarification once again. RRC, SPC or whatever are only marketing names of M-Sport, Citroën or Prodrive. None of these is a class name. It is similar like when You take for example Mégane RS. It's N4 class car and the letters RS are used only as marketing (name stands for Renault Sport). In the rules it's all S2000. Till 1.1.2010 S2000 could have been homologated with 2.0NA engine, later only with 1.6T engine. Even WRC car is still S2000 homologation. The WRC package is only an extension pack to the S2000 homologation and there is no new homoogation number given.

[Mirek]

WRC=WRC
WRC2=S2000,S2000T,R4,N4,R5
WRC3=R1,R2,R3,R3T,R3D

Might have forgotten something but that's the basics of it.

That is valid only for WRC championship while he asked for all FIA championships ;)

[Frostmourne]

Thank you all guys. Each one of you has answered few things in my mind.

[Bartolbia84]

al ketbi at the start of the rally of montecarlo with Skoda s2000, but his program did not include 10 races on a Fiesta RCC?

[Mirek]

Last two years Al Ketbi worked with JM Racing. This team will have another car in Monte Carlo for Tomáš Kostka. I guess it was much cheaper for everybody to run two cars of one team instead of bringing another team.

[EightGear]

Since the Loeb thread is closed (!?) I guess this is the best place to post this.

Anyway, Loeb is 10th on the list of European sportspersons of the year. (Yes, sportsperson and not sportsman because Dutch swimmer Ranomi Kromowidjojo in 8th is the only woman on the list.)

Sebastian Vettel is first on the list...

[AndyRAC]

What did Vettel do to come first? Absolute joke......similar to Autosports Top50 drivers of the Year; I don't think Loeb has ever come 1st.

[Franky]

What did Vettel do to come first?

I guess there's only one answer, he is driving in the Formula 1.

[Mintexmemory]

And there is a lot of cycling jelousy inEurope that a Brit is the world's best cyclist JY

[AndyRAC]

And there is a lot of cycling jelousy inEurope that a Brit is the world's best cyclist JY

Hmm, I think Bertie the Accountant may disagree with that... ;)

[Prisoner Monkeys]

I guess there's only one answer, he is driving in the Formula 1.
Apparently, being Formula 1 World Champion is enough to automatically qualify as driver of the year. Never mind that there were others out there who arguably achieved more - for example, Fernando Alonso finished second in a car that was one of the worst Ferrari have built in recent memory - or that Vettel's accomplishment is marred by the way the Red Bull RB8 was subject to no less than five technical challenges throughout the season and only passed them because they'd slipped through loopholes in the rulebook. If you ask me, Vettel isn't just undeserving of the title of "Driver of the Year", but undeserving of the World Championship.

Just for once I'd like to see a rally driver actually place well on that list. I'm hoping that 2013 will be the year that it happens, with people rushing to fill the vaccuum that will be creates by Loeb's semi-retirement. It's unfortunate that this is what it will take for a rally driver to stand out, considering that Loeb is probably the greatest driver rallying has ever seen. But no, he's not in Formula 1, so his achievements don't count.

[EightGear]

I was actually surprised to see a rally driver in thr top 10.

[dimviii]

Evgeny Novikov lieu le DMACK pneus WRC 2013 - Motor Racing et (http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=2&hl=fr&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=es&tl=fr&u=http://www.motoryracing.com/wrc/noticias/evgeny-novikov-realizara-wrc-2013-gomas-dmack/%253Futm_source%253Dtwitterfeed%2526utm_medium%253 Dtwitter%26usg%3DALkJrhhdPEJSKEpyyF7fMiMyMEvmV8BwU Q&usg=ALkJrhhbtYvyNs_-1NamVAsZjid4T9ZYHQ)

[alleskids]

.. Ostberg on Michelin and Novikov on D-Macks in the Qatar M-Sport WRT?

[dimviii]

.. Ostberg on Michelin and Novikov on D-Macks in the Qatar M-Sport WRT?

hard year for Novikov..

[tommeke_B]

Mostly hard... to understand! He has the opportunity to drive in best possible conditions, but chooses for DMack... I think it's clear enough already that with those tyres you will eventually lose some time everywhere?

[Roy]

.. Ostberg on Michelin and Novikov on D-Macks in the Qatar M-Sport WRT?

Yes, good question. Is it possible two drivers with different tyre brands in one team? I don't think so.
Or will M-sport choose for DMACK? Oh, I hope not!!!!

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Maybe he doesn't have a choice - DMACK could be part of the sponsorship package he brings to the team.

[alleskids]

Mostly hard... to understand! He has the opportunity to drive in best possible conditions, but chooses for DMack... I think it's clear enough already that with those tyres you will eventually lose some time everywhere?

maybe he had little choise, as the second Ford driver has to bring budget? Petter Solberg had to bring 2 miljion euro to have a seat with M-Sport.I thing Qatar only pays for Ostberg, Al Attiyah and Neuville

[tommeke_B]

Regarding the programmes he did previous years ('09, '11 and '12) I doubt he needs money from DMack...

[MJW]

maybe he had little choise, as the second Ford driver has to bring budget? Petter Solberg had to bring 2 miljion euro to have a seat with M-Sport.I thing Qatar only pays for Ostberg, Al Attiyah and Neuville

Slight correction Qatar pays for Nasser and Neuville. My info is that Mads buget comes from a Swedish owned computer company :-) formely known as NDS.

[alleskids]

then Novikov likes to gamble on D-Mack for making a (positive) difference. He had his best WRC results (podiums) on D-Mack

[alleskids]

Slight correction Qatar pays for Nasser and Neuville.

Ostberg brings his own budget? If Qatar does not pay for Qatar M-Sport WRT, then why be the title sponsor?

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Because al'Attiyah is driving for Qatar M-Sport and Neuville is driving for Qatar WRT. They get title sponsorship of two teams, with minimal outlay.

[Rallyper]

May I ask - when will D-MAck become equal with Michelin regarding performance of the tyres? Will they ever? Or have they already become equal?

Maybe that´s what the guys already know?

Let´s wait and see, before making judgements. The times that have been is just nothing until we know the status of todays development.

Am I wrong?

[tommeke_B]

then Novikov likes to gamble on D-Mack for making a (positive) difference. He had his best WRC results (podiums) on D-Mack
I thought Novikov did only Spain on D-Mack? Novikov has been on podium 2x in WRC, that was in Portugal and Sardinia this year. On Sardinia he was on Michelin, 100% sure. I think Portugal too?

[dimviii]

May I ask - when will D-MAck become equal with Michelin regarding performance of the tyres? Will they ever? Or have they already become equal?

Maybe that´s what the guys already know?

Let´s wait and see, before making judgements. The times that have been is just nothing until we know the status of todays development.

Am I wrong?

dmack at 2 years to become equal with michelin? No way.

[tommeke_B]

May I ask - when will D-MAck become equal with Michelin regarding performance of the tyres? Will they ever? Or have they already become equal?

Maybe that´s what the guys already know?

Let´s wait and see, before making judgements. The times that have been is just nothing until we know the status of todays development.

Am I wrong?

Don't underestimate Michelin... D-Mack tyres cost only half of what Michelins costs, so it would not be reasonable to expect the same quality. In Belgium, Viaene-S12 WRC tested them in the beginning of the year, but after the test he never used them again, so I guess the difference in costs is not worth the difference in performance? And that is for national level. Not talking about a WRC-event with loops of over 80km with same tyres.

[MikeD]

I have just asked a very reliable source regarding Novikov on DMACK tyres and that French site must have got it wrong. Novikov will be on Michelin in all of 2013.

[MikeD]

Because al'Attiyah is driving for Qatar M-Sport and Neuville is driving for Qatar WRT. They get title sponsorship of two teams, with minimal outlay.

That's not what I hear. Østberg and Novikov will be under the "Qatar M-Sport WRT" banner and Neuville, Hänninen and Al-Attiyah will be under the "Qatar WRT" banner

[Roy]

Regarding the programmes he did previous years ('09, '11 and '12) I doubt he needs money from DMack...
Last year he was sponsored by dmack. We see him maybe one rally on Dmack tyres, like last year.

[Mirek]

I have just asked a very reliable source regarding Novikov on DMACK tyres and that French site must have got it wrong. Novikov will be on Michelin in all of 2013.

Novikov on Michelin was confirmed here several times by Xsara Fan - member of Novikov's team.

[tommeke_B]

Last year he was sponsored by dmack. We see him maybe one rally on Dmack tyres, like last year.
They are/were tyre supplier for D-Mack in Russia, that doesn't mean Novikov his WRC-project was completely sponsored by it? ;)

[MikeD]

Novikov on Michelin was confirmed here several times by Xsara Fan - member of Novikov's team.

I just responded to the link of the french site that claimed that Novikov would be on DMACK's in all of 2013, so I checked up with a source that denied it. That was all :)

[Kielder]

Even worse, "Motor y Racing" is a Spanish site. You can delete it as a source.

[Rallyper]

Don't underestimate Michelin... D-Mack tyres cost only half of what Michelins costs, so it would not be reasonable to expect the same quality. In Belgium, Viaene-S12 WRC tested them in the beginning of the year, but after the test he never used them again, so I guess the difference in costs is not worth the difference in performance? And that is for national level. Not talking about a WRC-event with loops of over 80km with same tyres.

I have nothing against your quote in any way, but - what says D-Mack don´t develop all the time? We don´t know yet where they stand. But for the time being I´m happy Novikov and co are on Michelins, that´s for sure.

And price doesn´t tell all the story about quality. Michelin put their prices regarding no competition. Knowing the price just to make a tyre Michelin earning big money on being alone without competition in WRC. Of course we have Pirelli but let´s say they work out prices together...?

[aykutbilir]

D-Mack is a chinese brand but motorsport office is at UK. And development is too as i know. 2011 season at TRC (Turkish Rally Champ) some crews try D-MACK Gravel versions at Lancer Evo's. As they told they have zero grip after Michelin and Pirelli. Of course they have very different compounds for WRC. And yes they are cheaper and they are getting R&D.

Michelin is a huge histroy of motorsport so they have great knowledge.

Beside D-MACK had sponsored to Czech Prokop too at some rallies 2012 season (Like Argentine.)

[Mirek]

D-Mack = Dick Cormack - former Pirelli manager
Jonathan Fowler - technical director - another former Pirelli manager

I would say it's British brand which has it's production facilities in China.

[MikeD]

D-Mack is a chinese brand but motorsport office is at UK. And development is too as i know. 2011 season at TRC (Turkish Rally Champ) some crews try D-MACK Gravel versions at Lancer Evo's. As they told they have zero grip after Michelin and Pirelli. Of course they have very different compounds for WRC. And yes they are cheaper and they are getting R&D.

Michelin is a huge histroy of motorsport so they have great knowledge.

Beside D-MACK had sponsored to Czech Prokop too at some rallies 2012 season (Like Argentine.)

Just to make sure we have the DMACK history correct:

2011 - O.Tänak - Rally GB - Team: M-Sport - Result: 6th

2012 - R.Triviño - Rally Mexico - Team: M-Sport - Result: 10th

2012 - M.Prokop - Rally Argentina - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 4th

2012 - M.Prokop - Rally Spain - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 13th

2012 - J.Ketomaa - Rally Sweden - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: DNF

2012 - J.Ketomaa - Rally New Zealand - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 11th

2012 - J.Ketomaa - Rally Finland - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 8th

2012 - E.Novikov - Rally Spain - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 10th

PS: Ketomaa did rally Portugal with DMACK livery, but ran on Michelin tyres (This was a comparison test DMACK wished for)

PPS: This info is double-checked and confirmed by Autotek Motorsport

[Xsara Fan]

I just responded to the link of the french site that claimed that Novikov would be on DMACK's in all of 2013, so I checked up with a source that denied it. That was all :)

In 2013 Novikov will start in 'factory' Qatar M-Sport Team with Michelin tyres. His start in Spain with DMACK was one and only thing :)

[Barreis]

Sebastien Loeb has expressed interest in taking on the Dakar Rally - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/104944)

[grugsticles]

Sebastien Loeb has expressed interest in taking on the Dakar Rally - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/104944)

If you were a betting man, I think there would be good odds for him to win on first attempt.

[alleskids]

If you were a betting man, I think there would be good odds for him to win on first attempt.

he will strugle a lot in the sanddunes, El Dakar = reading the nature, the sand dunes, which takes time, and an experienced navigator (other then Daniel Elena). the god news for Loeb is the link with Abu Dhabi. maybe Al Qassimi can teach Loeb the tricks

[Barreis]

Dani Sordo says he is hungrier than ever ahead of Citroen return - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/104953)

[rallyfiend]

Dani Sordo says he is hungrier than ever ahead of Citroen return - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/104953)

He'd need to be.

Otherwise he's pretty much done.....

[Franky]

Didn't some news outlet publish something along the lines that he will retire if he doesn't win?

[A.F.F.]

If Loeb and Hirvonen are nominated for team points, then Sordo is allowed to win, right?

[stefanvv]

May be not on every Rally :confused:

[MikeD]

If Loeb and Hirvonen are nominated for team points, then Sordo is allowed to win, right?

Refering to Monte only? - then yes I guess he's alloved to win Monte, but I expect Citroën will do all they can to make Loeb win that one. I think Sordo has to win both Rally Germany and Rally Spain, otherwise he's done in the WRC.

[stefanvv]

What wins are we talking about. We don't know how fast VW will be yet :D

[Barreis]

Not na easy job, Ogier will be there also.

[Roy]

If Loeb and Hirvonen are nominated for team points, then Sordo is allowed to win, right?

Not if he is nominated for the 'B' Team of Citroen. He can score points for that team in MC.

[GigiGalliNo1]

So after retiring, Sainz didn't do well at the Dakar? I think it will be the same with Loeb. You can't say he won't win! If Nasser did it Loeb CAN win the Dakar as Sainz did! How old was he? You're talking nonsense if you think Loeb can't win Dakar ;)

[adr17]

2012 - E.Novikov - Rally Spain - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 10th

incorrect ,team was m-sport , just worked in front of autotek truck so next to prokop so it looked better

car was worked on by msport mechanics and same car he been using since mexico

and before you argue i was one of the mechanics and i work for m-sport




Just to make sure we have the DMACK history correct:

2011 - O.Tänak - Rally GB - Team: M-Sport - Result: 6th

2012 - R.Triviño - Rally Mexico - Team: M-Sport - Result: 10th

2012 - M.Prokop - Rally Argentina - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 4th

2012 - M.Prokop - Rally Spain - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 13th

2012 - J.Ketomaa - Rally Sweden - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: DNF

2012 - J.Ketomaa - Rally New Zealand - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 11th

2012 - J.Ketomaa - Rally Finland - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 8th

2012 - E.Novikov - Rally Spain - Team: Autotek Motorsport - Result: 10th

PS: Ketomaa did rally Portugal with DMACK livery, but ran on Michelin tyres (This was a comparison test DMACK wished for)

PPS: This info is double-checked and confirmed by Autotek Motorsport

[alleskids]

So after retiring, Sainz didn't do well at the Dakar? I think it will be the same with Loeb. You can't say he won't win! If Nasser did it Loeb CAN win the Dakar as Sainz did! How old was he? You're talking nonsense if you think Loeb can't win Dakar ;)

sure Loeb has what it takes to win Dakar, but he needs more then "just"" 9 WRC titles and 76 WRC wins. Dakar is not an extra large WRC rally. Dakar is just as difference from WRC as WTCC is, or Formula 1, especially the modern WRC rallies, which are more becoming sprints events.
you are taking nonsense if you think Loeb can win Dakar at first attempt

[GigiGalliNo1]

How many WRC titles did Sainz have? How many WRC wins did Sainz get?

What number attempt what Sainz at when he won the Dakar?

[oyunbozan]

can löeb win a GT race in his first season : yes
can loeb win a F1 race in his first season : yes
can loeb win stages/days in his first dakar: yes

championship? no.

[Prisoner Monkeys]

can loeb win a F1 race in his first season : yes
No, he couldn't.

He flirted with the idea of doing a race with Scuderia Toro Rosso - Abu Dhabi, I think - back in 2009. The idea got some support, but the FIA shot it down because he hadn't met the criteria for a Superlicence. So he went off a did some testing with a GP2 team to try and show that he could at least handle an open-wheel racing car, and maybe change the FIA's mind. The team wasn't the best (although GP2 cars are identical, a good team plays a big part in a driver's success), but Loeb ultimately proved to be slower than Vladimir Arabadzhiev, who was notorious for being two seconds per lap slower than the front-runners.

The idea of Loeb racing in Formula 1 was then quietly dropped.

[6789]

I'm pretty sure it took Sainz 3 or 4 goes before he won Dakar. I think it's unrealistic to suggest Loeb would win Dakar on his first attempt. Dakar is more than outright pace. That's my opinion anyway

[MJW]

Ari Vatanen managed to win Dakar on his first attempt, and went on to win several more Dakar's.

[stefanvv]

Sainz & Vatanen did it with factory team. Loeb will drive private car if he does Dakar.

[alleskids]

Ari Vatanen managed to win Dakar on his first attempt, and went on to win several more Dakar's.

with a Peugeot 205 T16 Grand Raid that was far ahead of everything that had ever driven in the Dakar rally

[dupanton]

Dakar is a bit of a lottery... "Everyone" can win it, first, 2nd or 30th attempt.
With an experienced co driver next to him, he certainly has a chance, even on his first attempt!

[Prisoner Monkeys]

I found this article on WRC.com a bit of fun:

World Rally Championship - News - Features - Top 10 toughest stages in the world (http://www.wrc.com/news/features/top-10-toughest-stages-in-the-world/?fid=18155)

Though I can't say I agree with all of the choices.

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Ouni is Ouni.........go there and HANAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.......1993 Giraudet like it :D

[Mintexmemory]

I found this article on WRC.com a bit of fun:

World Rally Championship - News - Features - Top 10 toughest stages in the world (http://www.wrc.com/news/features/top-10-toughest-stages-in-the-world/?fid=18155)

Though I can't say I agree with all of the choices.
Likewise, St Gwynno is insignificant compared to any of the long Kielder stages or the full Dalby stage. It's not even the most difficult in Wales!!
As for Panzerplatte * rolls eyes * Spare me! I was very disappointed by the stage difficulty in general and the Gina 'hop' (not really a jump) in particular

[AndyRAC]

Likewise, St Gwynno is insignificant compared to any of the long Kielder stages or the full Dalby stage. It's not even the most difficult in Wales!!
As for Panzerplatte * rolls eyes * Spare me! I was very disappointed by the stage difficulty in general and the Gina 'hop' (not really a jump) in particular

St Gwynno...who picked that one? What about the 35m+ of Pundershaw..?? And what about Jutbo in Sweden?

[tolis]

It seems Elfyn Evans chose a Ford Fiesta S200 for his Academy crown : World Rally Championship - News - The WRC in 2013: 10 reasons to get excited (http://www.wrc.com/news/the-wrc-in-2013-10-reasons-to-get-excited/?fid=18161)

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Likewise, St Gwynno is insignificant compared to any of the long Kielder stages or the full Dalby stage. It's not even the most difficult in Wales!!
As for Panzerplatte * rolls eyes * Spare me! I was very disappointed by the stage difficulty in general and the Gina 'hop' (not really a jump) in particular
Like I said, I can't agree with all of the choices. I mean, they picked Bunnings outside Perth - why not Wellington Dam, which was a forty-five kilometre labyrinth of junctions and hairpins? Or Harvey Weir, which was a high-speed stage run late in the afternoon so that the sun was always in the drivers' eyes and cast funny shadows that made it difficult to spot braking points.

[Sulland]

It seems Elfyn Evans chose a Ford Fiesta S200 for his Academy crown : World Rally Championship - News - The WRC in 2013: 10 reasons to get excited (http://www.wrc.com/news/the-wrc-in-2013-10-reasons-to-get-excited/?fid=18161)

Would not be surprised if Wilson use him to test out the new R5 in WRC in 13.

[Fly_Half]

St Gwynno is no longer in use anyway, it's now a mountain biking complex. I'd probably put the 'proper' Resolfen stage before that in any case when it was run at it's full length. Always a car breaker.

[AndyRAC]

St Gwynno is no longer in use anyway, it's now a mountain biking complex. I'd probably put the 'proper' Resolfen stage before that in any case when it was run at it's full length. Always a car breaker.

As are many stages. If they don't get used for Rallying, they soon become turned into MTB complexes. Use them, or lose them. I worry about the Clocaenog stages; used once a year. No longer used for the now defunct Astra Stages, and Vauxhall Rally of Wales - and apart from last year, no longer included in the UK round of the WRC.

As for Resolfen, remember 1997? For the final day: St Gwynno, Rhondda, Rheola, Resolfen(the full fat version), Rheola2, Margam & Cheltenham....

[Prisoner Monkeys]

I'd probably put the 'proper' Resolfen stage before that in any case when it was run at it's full length. Always a car breaker.
You could probably fill a list of the ten toughest stages in the world with ten stages in Wales ...

[Mirek]

Ten most difficult stages in the world. Ten best movies of all times. Ten best war commanders of history. Ten most beautiful castles in the world. Ten most killing kinds of food. Ten blabla. Isn't all look same? These articles are in 99% meaningless and their only reason of existence is that someone needed to publish some article but didn't know about what/or was too lazy.

[Rallyper]

As are many stages. If they don't get used for Rallying, they soon become turned into MTB complexes. Use them, or lose them. I worry about the Clocaenog stages; used once a year. No longer used for the now defunct Astra Stages, and Vauxhall Rally of Wales - and apart from last year, no longer included in the UK round of the WRC.

As for Resolfen, remember 1997? For the final day: St Gwynno, Rhondda, Rheola, Resolfen(the full fat version), Rheola2, Margam & Cheltenham....

Just for the protocoll; I was at the stage finish at Resolfen in 1997...

[tommeke_B]

Al Rajhi his program: http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/268696_465355050192600_761891893_n.jpg

[Mintexmemory]

Ten most difficult stages in the world. Ten best movies of all times. Ten best war commanders of history. Ten most beautiful castles in the world. Ten most killing kinds of food. Ten blabla. Isn't all look same? These articles are in 99% meaningless and their only reason of existence is that someone needed to publish some article but didn't know about what/or was too lazy.

Pulp Fiction
Blade Runner
Casablanca
Field of Dreams
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid
The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
La Dolce Vita
Jean de Florette
Shawshank Redemption
Seven Samurai

Alexander
Ghengis Khan
Charlemagne
Edward III
Saladin
Hanibal
Marlborough
Wellington
Napoleon
Sherman

Castles have to be fortified and not just ornamental palaces, this counts out most chateau and schloss.

Krak de Chevaliers
Himeji
Malbork
Windsor
Castel de Monte
Spis
Mehrangarh
Carcassonne
Hohensalzburg
Warwick
Food and Blabla aren't my thing - But for any afficianado of a subject the '10 best' is always a useful route to encourage debate and explore opinions - isn't that why we are on a forum in the first place? ;)

However if anyone want's to take this on let's set up a thread in chit chat :)

[Rallying UK]

Interesting stuff from Juho Hänninen on his decision to join M-Sport:

Hnninen: koda mi nabdla smlouvu (http://www.rally-mania.cz/news.php?id=14032)

[Barreis]

M-sport should hire Juha Kankunen. Every rally he would be in top 10, and fans would enjoy sport again.

[ProRally]

Al Rajhi his program: http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/268696_465355050192600_761891893_n.jpg

It is nice to have HUGE bank account, and only use the interest which you get on your interest :D :D
Good for Yazeed !!!!

[dupanton]

M-sport should hire Juha Kankunen. Every rally he would be in top 10, and fans would enjoy sport again.

Eeuuhhhh... NO!

[Fly_Half]

As for Resolfen, remember 1997? For the final day: St Gwynno, Rhondda, Rheola, Resolfen(the full fat version), Rheola2, Margam & Cheltenham....

I was 13, so not really ;) But that line-up of stages is brutal for one day! The equivalent stage mileage for two days by current standards...

[Francis44]

That list is quite old, Sporttv showed the highlights when the production was still under North One Sport, after that they stopped showing WRC and I dont think they will show it anytime soon. I think Motors will show it again this year.

[Francis44]

Wrong thread sorry.

[Frostmourne]

It is nice to have HUGE bank account, and only use the interest which you get on your interest :D :D
Good for Yazeed !!!!

Al-Rajihi Family is really wealthy. Hopefully Yazeed will be a good talent and a rising star in WRC. I only wish if he would drive Mini instead of ford lol.

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Hopefully Yazeed will be a good talent and a rising star in WRC.
Al-Rahji does seem to be a fairly decent driver. I like the way he's taking the time to work his way through the junior categories, rather than spending big and jumping straight into WRC-spec machinery. I don't think he's a playboy who fancies himself as a racing driver.

[Gregor-y]

You never know, he could be both.

[jbmarcus21]

Sordo testing Monte Carlo with DS3 WRC
Sordo prépare le Rallye Wrc Monte-Carlo 2013 (http://planetemarcus.com/sordo-prepare-le-rallye-wrc-monte-carlo-2013/)

[skarderud]

Rumours that Petter is going to european rallycross, teaming up with fellow norwegian Andreas bakkerud in supercars.

[Allyc85]

Rumours that Petter is going to european rallycross, teaming up with fellow norwegian Andreas bakkerud in supercars.

Sounds good to me :)

[jbmarcus21]

Neuville with his M-Sport clothes 2013
Neuville avec ses nouvelles couleurs M-Sport ! (http://planetemarcus.com/neuville-avec-ses-nouvelles-couleurs-m-sport/)

VW Team .. truck & team line up
Volkswagen Motorsport et ses pilotes (http://planetemarcus.com/volkswagen-motorsport-et-ses-pilotes/)

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Neuville with his M-Sport clothes 2013
Neuville avec ses nouvelles couleurs M-Sport ! (http://planetemarcus.com/neuville-avec-ses-nouvelles-couleurs-m-sport/)
Interesting - despite being a Qatar-backed team, the clothes are blue and white. There's no sign of the shads of pink that have featured on previous Qatar WRT cars.

[Rallyper]

Interesting - despite being a Qatar-backed team, the clothes are blue and white. There's no sign of the shads of pink that have featured on previous Qatar WRT cars.

Looks like MW want to maintain his connections to Ford in best way. Maybe Ford is backing more than we know...?

[jbmarcus21]

Thierry Neuville testing at Cumbria (M-Sport) Ford Fiesta Wrc [PHOTOS] Neuville avec ses nouvelles couleurs M-Sport ! (http://planetemarcus.com/neuville-avec-ses-nouvelles-couleurs-m-sport/)

[Mintexmemory]

Thierry Neuville testing at Cumbria (M-Sport) Ford Fiesta Wrc [PHOTOS] Neuville avec ses nouvelles couleurs M-Sport ! (http://planetemarcus.com/neuville-avec-ses-nouvelles-couleurs-m-sport/)

OK that explains why '5-year' was in a rally car yesterday (see Testing thread). In the M-Sport forest Matthew is the bogey time to provide a comparison with TN's performance

[dupanton]

OK that explains why '5-year' was in a rally car yesterday (see Testing thread). In the M-Sport forest Matthew is the bogey time to provide a comparison with TN's performance

He is not a reference... Or does Neuville have to be at least 5s/km faster? :D

[Mintexmemory]

He is not a reference... Or does Neuville have to be at least 5s/km faster? :D

Control your patriotism / scepticism or any other 'ism' for a moment. Matthew may have failed to set the WRC world alight but in Greystoke Forest 'he da man'!

Given that the stage length is less than 8 mile Neuville would be expected to be faster by about 10 seconds on his first post-recce run ;)

[dupanton]

Control your patriotism / scepticism or any other 'ism' for a moment. Matthew may have failed to set the WRC world alight but in Greystoke Forest 'he da man'!

Given that the stage length is less than 8 mile Neuville would be expected to be faster by about 10 seconds on his first post-recce run ;)

I will answer with an asm: sarcasm :) Off course He wouldn't be 5s/km faster. But it would be more useful if he would have Ostberg as a reference ;)

[raybak]

Looks like MW want to maintain his connections to Ford in best way. Maybe Ford is backing more than we know...?

Maybe as Ford have done in other motorsport in the past, they are still backing them but are not a manufacturer team so they don't have to pay the exorbitant FIA costs. Drivers Championship still does mean something to Ford's marketing.

Ford are seen to be doing the right thing in stepping away from full on funding in the eyes of shareholders, general public and employees.

I wreckon give it 18 months and they will be back as a manufacturer team.

Ray

[ChristianArp]

Maybe as Ford have done in other motorsport in the past, they are still backing them but are not a manufacturer team so they don't have to pay the exorbitant FIA costs. Drivers Championship still does mean something to Ford's marketing.

Ford are seen to be doing the right thing in stepping away from full on funding in the eyes of shareholders, general public and employees.

I wreckon give it 18 months and they will be back as a manufacturer team.

Ray

Removing the last sentence, I read more or less that exact statement from Gerard Quinn (I believe it was him) in one of the latest Racecar Engineering magazines..
He said that although they werent directly funding the team, they would still do their utmost to help M-Sport in whatever way they could - the difference being that it was no longer funding, but just other things they could help out with.

[rallyfiend]

Removing the last sentence, I read more or less that exact statement from Gerard Quinn (I believe it was him) in one of the latest Racecar Engineering magazines..
He said that although they werent directly funding the team, they would still do their utmost to help M-Sport in whatever way they could - the difference being that it was no longer funding, but just other things they could help out with.

Ford (or someone) must still be paying the FIA fees though.

You can only have registered teams (such as Qatar WRT and Qatar M-Sport WRT are) if they are competing in cars from a registered manufacturer.

[pantealex]

Ford (or someone) must still be paying the FIA fees though.

You can only have registered teams (such as Qatar WRT and Qatar M-Sport WRT are) if they are competing in cars from a registered manufacturer.

With that logic MINI (or someone) has paid also, because we have Lotos Team WRC with MINI (M/T entry)

[alleskids]

Lotos Team WRC is M2, and does not need to have Mini involved.......?

[rallyfiend]

Lotos Team WRC is M2, and does not need to have Mini involved.......?

Under the WRC Regulations as they stand you do.

A WRC Team:
7.3.1 Undertakes to take part in a minimum of 7 nominated rallies including two outside Europe with
one, two or more World Rally cars of the same make.
7.3.2 Will be eligible to score Manufacturer’s points only if cars of the same homologation are used as
those of a Manufacturer under Art. 7.2 or as a new Manufacturer under Art. 4.1.2.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Perhaps with the sponsorship for Mentos it pays the entry fee...
Same with Qatar.. They pay M-Sport the sponsorship, M-Sport then use some of the money to pay entry.

Don't people know this? Then M-Sport has money to pay employees, and Malcolm wage and development of car and travel costs etc

[Frostmourne]

Lotos Team paid 21K Euros to be registered as a Team and score points for manufacturers championship, while Ford main team (Mads and Novikov I think) is a Manufacturer team, paying 300k euros.

[alleskids]

Under the WRC Regulations as they stand you do.

A WRC Team:
7.3.1 Undertakes to take part in a minimum of 7 nominated rallies including two outside Europe with
one, two or more World Rally cars of the same make.
7.3.2 Will be eligible to score Manufacturer’s points only if cars of the same homologation are used as
those of a Manufacturer under Art. 7.2 or as a new Manufacturer under Art. 4.1.2.

I read it as: M2 team can score points with an WRCar homologated for WRC. the Mini is stil an homologated WRCar. A M2 team can also use a S2000 of Skoda or Peugeot if they wish, right?

[EightGear]

Under the WRC Regulations as they stand you do.

A WRC Team:
7.3.1 Undertakes to take part in a minimum of 7 nominated rallies including two outside Europe with
one, two or more World Rally cars of the same make.
7.3.2 Will be eligible to score Manufacturer’s points only if cars of the same homologation are used as
those of a Manufacturer under Art. 7.2 or as a new Manufacturer under Art. 4.1.2.

Wasn't that the reason why BMW supported Motorsport Italia last year, so the homologotion etc. is done now?

[Frostmourne]

Wasn't that the reason why BMW supported Motorsport Italia last year, so the homologotion etc. is done now?

Yes. The car is homologated and can be used by private teams.

[rallyfiend]

Yes. The car is homologated and can be used by private teams.

There's a difference between the car being eligible to be used, and compete, versus being used to score points in a registered team.

[Frostmourne]

I read it as: M2 team can score points with an WRCar homologated for WRC. the Mini is stil an homologated WRCar. A M2 team can also use a S2000 of Skoda or Peugeot if they wish, right?

Skoda S2000 and Peugot are not homologated under WRC rules!

[Frostmourne]

Under the WRC Regulations as they stand you do.

A WRC Team:
7.3.1 Undertakes to take part in a minimum of 7 nominated rallies including two outside Europe with
one, two or more World Rally cars of the same make.
7.3.2 Will be eligible to score Manufacturer’s points only if cars of the same homologation are used as
those of a Manufacturer under Art. 7.2 or as a new Manufacturer under Art. 4.1.2.

Those rules are old, now for 2013, you only need one rally outside Europe.

[MikeD]

I read it as: M2 team can score points with an WRCar homologated for WRC. the Mini is stil an homologated WRCar. A M2 team can also use a S2000 of Skoda or Peugeot if they wish, right?

The MINI JCW Super Production can score points as an M2 Team. Oliveira did that in the first 2 rounds in 2011.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Whats happened to JML since going to VW ??? :eek:

New Mr Hollywood :confused:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A_7P-JeCYAESX6M.jpg

[Frostmourne]

There's a difference between the car being eligible to be used, and compete, versus being used to score points in a registered team.

Which is....?

[Bartolbia84]

It is known a racing program Kosciuszko and team Lotos?
And Guerra is han news?

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

Whats happened to JML since going to VW ??? :eek:

New Mr Hollywood :confused:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A_7P-JeCYAESX6M.jpg

http://blu.stb.s-msn.com/i/F0/14B0E892C2CD617DDD5AE9C1C91578.jpg

[alleskids]

Whats happened to JML since going to VW ??? :eek:

New Mr Hollywood :confused:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A_7P-JeCYAESX6M.jpg
]http://blu.stb.s-msn.com/i/F0/14B0E892C2CD617DDD5AE9C1C91578.jpg


Jari-Mary Latvala
Mary à tout prix (1998) - IMDb (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0129387/)

[A FONDO]

:rotflmao:

[Barreis]

He was always a girl. :P

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

man's gotta do what man's gotta do :D HANA JARTSA HANA........GO Jari-Matti GO

[Andre Oliveira]

Sorry? Latvala have big balls! He is rally man.

[makinen_fan]

He was always a girl. :P

I think this is a BIG insult for one of the best rally drivers of modern era! After the Portugal crash, getting into the car and still taking those massive risks he takes needs BIG balls!!

[Mintexmemory]

I think this is a BIG insult for one of the best rally drivers of modern era! After the Portugal crash, getting into the car and still taking those massive risks he takes needs BIG balls!!

Calm yourself and ignore the ravings of 'dwellers in darkness' - JML is going to prove this year that no amount of 'image consultant' interference will diminish his will to win. Shame that Seb O has perfect hair!

[Barreis]

I think this is a BIG insult for one of the best rally drivers of modern era! After the Portugal crash, getting into the car and still taking those massive risks he takes needs BIG balls!!
It wasn't about his driving. It was about his mimics, speech, crying in Germany 2005 or 2006, etc.

[stefanvv]

It wasn't about his driving. It was about his mimics, speech, crying in Germany 2005 or 2006, etc.

There are lot of role models in F1 if you need ones.

[Kielder]

Ostberg will test next Friday, before starting recce on Saturday.

[tolis]

Yuriy Protasov revealed his programme: https://pri.dv4.com/general_pr/105/releases/pr005722.html

Monte Carlo, Sweden, Mexico, Argentina, Australia in a Subaru Impreza R4.

[dimviii]

Yuriy Protasov revealed his programme: https://pri.dv4.com/general_pr/105/releases/pr005722.html

Monte Carlo, Sweden, Mexico, Argentina, Australia in a Subaru Impreza R4.

strange programm with 3 far away rallies!

[Barreis]

Jari Ketomaa gets drive for snow WRC and ERC rallies - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/105008)

[Frostmourne]

A question guys, after re-reading the 2013 rules book for WRC, WRC teams can score manu points if the cars entered meet the homologation of those cars that are entered by teams registered as manufacturers, but there is no Mini Manufacturer team, so are we sure that Lotos is a WRC team and eligible to score points for manu points?

[rage82]

strange programm with 3 far away rallies!

Maybe he wants to gain some more experience from these events? Anyway it's strange to do these rallies as it's much more expensive.

[bluuford]

A question guys, after re-reading the 2013 rules book for WRC, WRC teams can score manu points if the cars entered meet the homologation of those cars that are entered by teams registered as manufacturers, but there is no Mini Manufacturer team, so are we sure that Lotos is a WRC team and eligible to score points for manu points?

Mini was conditionally registered in 2012 and the right to use Mini cars continues as long as their homologation lasts.. which is 5 or 6 years or somthing since the homologation.. or smt like that.

[tolis]

Maybe he wants to gain some more experience from these events? Anyway it's strange to do these rallies as it's much more expensive.
It's expensive, but Symtech pays for it. ;) So, he wants to benefit from his prize 100%! :)

[rallyfiend]

It's expensive, but Symtech pays for it. ;) So, he wants to benefit from his prize 100%! :)

By choosing the 'away' events he possibly maximises his chances as most other drivers will stay in Europe. He can maybe just cruise and get good points.

[Georgi]

Jari Ketomaa gets drive for snow WRC and ERC rallies - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/105008)

I'm happy for him.
He deserves a chance to shine and prove his talent.

[Barreis]

He needs full season. One or two rallies are not enough to prove the potential.

[Georgi]

If he make a good result on both of them ... this will help for further funding and more events :) I hope for this scenario.

[Mintexmemory]

Am I missing something or is he in a Fiesta RRC/S2000 for both events?

[EightGear]

RRC in Latvia, WRC in Sweden.

[bluuford]

Yuriy Protasov revealed his programme: https://pri.dv4.com/general_pr/105/releases/pr005722.html

Monte Carlo, Sweden, Mexico, Argentina, Australia in a Subaru Impreza R4.

Today I heard another crazy rumor that he has new co-driver for Monte. However, I do not know in which language the legend will be? Rumor tells that his co-driver will be Kuldar Sikk :-)

[Mintexmemory]

RRC in Latvia, WRC in Sweden.
What's your source, because it doesn't say that in the Autosport story.

[EightGear]

Julian Porter's Twitter account.

[Xsara Fan]

Today I heard another crazy rumor that he has new co-driver for Monte. However, I do not know in which language the legend will be? Rumor tells that his co-driver will be Kuldar Sikk :-)

If it`s true - legend could be in Russian! Cause both know this language :)

[Plan9]

I'm happy for him.
He deserves a chance to shine and prove his talent.

I hope so as I like this guy. After what I saw of him in NZ 2012 I was very, very disappointed. I don't think Dmack was to blame.

[Motorsportfun]

Qatar M-Sport World Rally Team livery will be revealed at Birmingham's Autosport Show on Thursday.

Here's a preview of the new logo.

http://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/524574_395012283925140_395234797_n.jpg

[ururu]

Brynildsen + Fiesta WRC = 7 WRC rallies in 2013

[Bartolbia84]

Brynildsen + Fiesta WRC = 7 WRC rallies in 2013

official??

[ururu]

+ dmack

[ururu]

official??
yes

[ururu]

Sweden, Argentina, England ,......others do not remember, sorry

[Barreis]

Jarkko Nikara back in Mini WRC for Sweden - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/105022)

[HarriK]

Kaj Lindström co-driving Ketomaa

http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=fi&ie=UTF-8&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ts.fi%2Fmoottoriurheilu%2Fralli %2F435247%2FLindstrom%2BKetomaan%2Bkartanlukijaksi %2Blumiralleihin

[Bartolbia84]

Sweden, Argentina, England ,......others do not remember, sorry

Thank's!! I hope to run in WRC Italia Sardegna

[pantealex]

Brynildsen + Fiesta WRC = 7 WRC rallies in 2013

Seems like Adapta is making entry for "Manu Teams" championship.

[Iskald]

Brynildsen + Fiesta WRC = 7 WRC rallies in 2013

Its definitely not official as nothing is confirmed in the media or anywhere else. But he posted a cryptic message yesterday on fb: "I`m back!". Nothing more, but of course it created a lot of curiousity.
It may be translated into something like this, but knowing Eyvind and his career quite well it still surprises me a lot that he has found the budget to do seven rounds in the short time since I spoke to him last time a month or so before christmas.

[ururu]

Thank's!! I hope to run in WRC Italia Sardegna I do not remember, maybe Deutschland, just wait a bit, as you know will tell ;)

[EightGear]

WRC2 for Brynildsen. First RRC Fiesta, then R5. D-Mack tyres. According to Julian Porter...

[makinen_fan]

WRC2 for Brynildsen. First RRC Fiesta, then R5. D-Mack tyres. According to Julian Porter...

Also official D-Mack press release: DMACK Tyres News (http://www.dmacktyres.com/motorsport-news#nws1143)

[mousti]

From Autotek?

[EightGear]

Also official D-Mack press release: DMACK Tyres News (http://www.dmacktyres.com/motorsport-news#nws1143)

Yes I saw it only after I posted it. ;)

So where did the Fiesta WRC 'confirmation' come from...?

[ururu]

Its definitely not official as nothing is confirmed in the media or anywhere else. But he posted a cryptic message yesterday on fb: "I`m back!". Nothing more, but of course it created a lot of curiousity.
It may be translated into something like this, but knowing Eyvind and his career quite well it still surprises me a lot that he has found the budget to do seven rounds in the short time since I spoke to him last time a month or so before christmas. Today I called him ;)

[makinen_fan]

From Autotek?

Yes according to PR relaease

[eib1]

Today I heard another crazy rumor that he has new co-driver for Monte. However, I do not know in which language the legend will be? Rumor tells that his co-driver will be Kuldar Sikk :-)

it`s confirmed now
http://www.microsofttranslator.com/BV.aspx?ref=IE8Activity&a=http%3A%2F%2Frally.ua%2Fnews%2Fwrc%2Fyuriy-protasov-menyaet-shturmana

[jbmarcus21]

Test Days Sordo
http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/7147/2856l.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/705/2856l.jpg/)

other photos => Sordo en Tests pour le Rallye Wrc Monte-Carlo 2013 ! (http://planetemarcus.com/sordo-test-monte-carlo-2013/)

[ururu]

Mads befor Sweden rallyfinnskog.no (http://www.rallyfinnskog.no/paameldte2/7)

[EightGear]

Kosciuszko will do all 13 rounds in the Lotos-Mini!

[Frostmourne]

Kosciuszko will do all 13 rounds in the Lotos-Mini!

Lucky, sad to see that budget and good sponsor for an avarege driver