[WRC] News & rumours (part II)

[skarderud]

You won't get cheap cars under current homologation rules when only original parts are allowed. Sure plenty of companies all over the world are able to sell S2000 driveshaft for less than 2000 Euro...

If the only reason the cars/parts are insane expensive is to please the manu, then the wrc is dead. I cant se a crisis if the two-2- manus left, if we get 4-5 brands and 10 teams instead. Why not? Everything is better than todays, atleast last years, situation. Its a joke to call it anything with world. Much better with "amateurs" with real chances to win in a real and open championchip!

[tfp]

If the only reason the cars/parts are insane expensive is to please the manu, then the wrc is dead. I cant se a crisis if the two-2- manus left, if we get 4-5 brands and 10 teams instead. Why not? Everything is better than todays, atleast last years, situation. Its a joke to call it anything with world. Much better with "amateurs" with real chances to win in a real and open championchip!

I never even thought of that, if the last two manufacturers left then more than likely the drivers would stay as their own privateers and its a level playing field! I always thought Ford saved the championship at the beginning of this season simply by deciding to stay and compete, but maybe thats not the case!

[janvanvurpa]

I might be wrong but I think a full Group 4 Ford Escort RS cost about £30k in 1975 (so £120k in 2012?), plus you could get a lot of the work done by a range of preparation companies to get this cheaper.....

WT

That was paying people to do it... There was no rule saying you couldn't just grab the Atlas out of a Capri and chop it shorten it zap it together and have a home made Atlas axle for 50 squids...

Inflation was bad, exchange rates skew the picture but there is nothing in the world that justifies $3000 for 2 CV joints and a hunk of steel in the back of a car for a half shaft except gross cynical greed...

Bugger i have to go straighten a 50mm Bilstein insert for a friend in New England, cause we can't merely buy new.

[oyunbozan]

The real thing: Skoda Citigo Rally revealed at Worthersee | News | Auto Express (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/283474/skoda_citigo_rally.html)

I would prefer an 'F3' too but maybe VAG don't want Skoda's rally car to be the same size as the Polo?


guys that is a showcar. r1, r2, r3, r4 does not get body extentions. only s2000 and wrc does.

[tfp]

Did i hear thiscorrect, rally in the south if france, a car came off one of the stages and kiled and injured annumber of spectators? God I hope this isnt true

[Hartusvuori]

Did i hear thiscorrect, rally in the south if france, a car came off one of the stages and kiled and injured annumber of spectators? God I hope this isnt true

BBC News - Rally car hits crowd in south of France, killing two (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-18132389)

Already discussed on the other topics.

[tfp]

BBC News - Rally car hits crowd in south of France, killing two (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-18132389)

Already discussed on the other topics.

:( :( :( RIP to the lost ones :(

[tommeke_B]

Maybe I missed that part, but does anyone know when the calendar for next year will be published? It's usually published around mid-april I think?

[rallyfiend]

Maybe I missed that part, but does anyone know when the calendar for next year will be published? It's usually published around mid-april I think?

Was supposed to be discussed in recent Rally COmmission meeting but Autosport said is was delayed until June World Motor Sport Council meeting. Along with the promoter issue I beleive.

[Hartusvuori]

One of the true rallying legends, 1983 World Champion, eighteen-time WRC event winner and a seven-time 1000 Lakes winner, a Flying Finn, Hannu Mikkola will celebrate his 70th birthday tomorrow the May 24th. Congratulations!

[rallye-vid]

Räikkönen want to drive in Finland

[A FONDO]

I also want to drive there

[rp]

Jari Ketomaa will not compete in Greece (he is not on the entry list either just like we noticed), but he decided to skip the event and compete New Zealand instead. Despite the fact he was testing in Greece (probably the same Autotek´s Fiesta which one Spyros Pavlides is driving in Greece).

Very good decision, beacause now he must be ready for Finland to make the big attack. The roads in New Zealand are very similar to Finland without the big jumps, but the speed is high...

[Barreis]

Lotus Formula 1 team denies Kimi Raikkonen permission to contest Rally Finland - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/99822)

[AMSS]

Jari Ketomaa will not compete in Greece (he is not on the entry list either just like we noticed), but he decided to skip the event and compete New Zealand instead. Despite the fact he was testing in Greece (probably the same Autotek´s Fiesta which one Spyros Pavlides is driving in Greece).

Very good decision, beacause now he must be ready for Finland to make the big attack. The roads in New Zealand are very similar to Finland without the big jumps, but the speed is high...

Just a small correction(not that it matters), Jari tests on monday after rally greece (if the car is in shape as it will be ran in Rally Greece)..

[tfp]

Wasnt wilson supposed to compete in greece? Where is he? I await the sarcastic remarks...

[focus206]

Wasnt wilson supposed to compete in greece? Where is he? I await the sarcastic remarks...

No, I heard he should be back in New Zealand...

[tfp]

No, I heard he should be back in New Zealand...

Thanks for the info:-) this makes me worry though, a driver who wasnt the fastest anyway spends a lot of time out of the car... Also I hope he doesnt get bogged down with sponsor issues like Henning, I hope he is back soon aswel!

[Plan9]

What happened to old GO-FAST anyway? I can't believe they didn't jump ship after Sweden

[Hartusvuori]

I think we won't see any difference in Matthew's performance, was it for half a season break or not. Err.... so don't worry.

[sete]

good morning
nobre stop in the stage ss10

[tfp]

I think we won't see any difference in Matthew's performance, was it for half a season break or not. Err.... so don't worry.

:D


What happened to old GO-FAST anyway? I can't believe they didn't jump ship after Sweden

Theyve buggered off! :mad: At least now I know not to buy any cans of go fast energy drink in the future!

[Red bull]

Petter Solberg misses out after crash at WRC Acropolis Rally | The Sun |Sport|Motorsport (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/motorsport/4342516/Petter-Solberg-misses-out-after-crash-at-WRC-Acropolis-Rally.html)

[Barreis]

Nice page.
Motorsport.com | Racing News, Race Results - F1, NASCAR, IndyCar and more (http://www.motorsport.com/)

[Allyc85]

According to a story on Planetmarcus.com's FB page Lancia will be in the WRC from 2014!

Bienvenue sur Facebook. Connectez-vous, inscrivez-vous ou découvrez*! (http://www.facebook.com/#!/PLANETEMARCUS)

[makinen_fan]

another sad news from wrc. i hope this is not the start of brands leaving the sport due to its bad state

Nokia beendet WM-Sponsoring*:: rallye-magazin.de (http://www.rallye-magazin.de/rallyes/wm/nachrichten/news-detail/d/2012/05/28/nokia-beendet-wm-sponsoring/index.html)

[Red bull]

According to a story on Planetmarcus.com's FB page Lancia will be in the WRC from 2014!

Bienvenue sur Facebook. Connectez-vous, inscrivez-vous ou découvrez*! (http://www.facebook.com/#!/PLANETEMARCUS)
Mikki Biasion has also heard about Lancia come back for 2014 with the new Ypsilon

[Red bull]

LOOKS VERY SMALL 2012 Lancia Ypsilon Review - Official photos, features, specs, pricing | Auto Spectator: New car reviews, pics, info & specs (http://www.autospectator.com/cars/models/2012-lancia-ypsilon-review-official-photos-features-specs-pricing)

[Mirek]

Current rules say the car must be at least 3,9 meters long so there must be some special homologation model (if it's all true) like it was with Peugeot 206 WRC or Fabia WRC.

[JAM]

Since the "babycars" or the "go-to-shopping" cars started to be the base to World Rally Cars, things never be so good as before.

The low class cars are being the base to all the WR Cars.

[Mirek]

All of the current WRC cars are in production basis reasonably bigger than Peugeot 206 used to be so it's not really a new thing (stock length 3,83). Moreover in history there were cars bellow 4 meters also quite common (205 T16 or Delta S4 for example). Only this Lancia if it will be used is so small . Otherwise they are all around 4 meters long.

[lancisti]

this Twitter Biasion is a fake

[Bartolbia84]

The news of the return of the wrc LANCIA and Biasion and a huge lie ... and the sameBiasion was to deny everything!

[Red bull]

http://www.worldrallyblog.com/2012/05/29/wrc-news/biasion-denies-announcing-lancias-return/

[AndyRAC]

If Fiat and/or Lancia return I'll eat my wooly hat.......

[Francis44]

There is an interesting article on AUTOhebdo stating that the FIA is not happy with some aspects of the GB and Sardinia round of the calendar.

Perhaps this may suggest some changes in the calendar. Link here: AUTOhebdo SPORT. Los rallyes de Gran Bretaña y Cerdeña en el punto de mira de la FIA (http://www.autohebdosport.es/rallyes/wrc/los-rallyes-de-gran-bretana-y-cerdena-en-el-punto-de-mira-de-la-fia) .

They also say the Portugal round should head to the North, back to the old stages.

[AndyRAC]

Yes, it was in GPWeek as well.....

GP Week : Issue 155, Page 1 (http://mag.gpweek.com/#folio=14)

[Maxi]

Nokia exits WRC

iRally | The free independent Rally App for the iPhone, iPad and Android (http://www.irallylive.com/ir_news.htm?00001052&11)

[pantealex]

Nokia exits WRC

iRally | The free independent Rally App for the iPhone, iPad and Android (http://www.irallylive.com/ir_news.htm?00001052&11)
Nokia had 1 year deal which starts Greece 2011. They don´t want new deal.

[General Prim]

AutoHebdo Sport copied it from GP Week....as they in fact say

[RS]

Nokia had 1 year deal which starts Greece 2011. They don´t want new deal.

Because of no promoter? FIA really need to get their act together now...

ITV4 are still interested in showing WRC, but they want to be paid £100,000 for the rest of the season to screen it.

[AndyRAC]

Because of no promoter? FIA really need to get their act together now...

ITV4 are still interested in showing WRC, but they want to be paid £100,000 for the rest of the season to screen it.

Hmm, most successful sports are paid by the TV companies..... WRC has to pay to put it on TV......

However, I hope something can be sorted, the sooner the better.

[rallyfiend]

WRC loses Nokia's multi-million pound deal - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100005)

Potential for the FIA to continue to be the promoter of the WRC like they are now.

With the loss of Nokia, their ability doesn't seem to be up to much. Future not looking so rosy.

[Barreis]

Mouton&co. should give their chairs.

[I am evil Homer]

Most effective approach is take it in-house at the FIA and control it centrally. Then any new contract for supporting sponsors, timing systems etc is directly with the FIA.

This BS needs to stop before they completely destroy this sport.

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

Does anyone know, is nokia wrc app working in future?

[Fly_Half]

There's also a story doing the rounds that Hyundai are returning to the WRC:

Hyundai will VW angreifen*:: rallye-magazin.de (http://www.rallye-magazin.de/rallyes/wm/nachrichten/news-detail/d/2012/05/30/hyundai-greift-vw-an/index.html)

I should add I have no idea whether there is any truth in this, but it does seem more believable than the Lancia rumours...

[rallye-vid]

And here: WRC Einstieg 2013: Hyundai kehrt in den Rallye-Sport zurück - AUTO MOTOR UND SPORT (http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/rallye/wrc-einstieg-2013-hyundai-kehrt-in-den-rallye-sport-zurueck-4983285.html)

[kober]

There's also a story doing the rounds that Hyundai are returning to the WRCGreat news! Hopefully they'll stay for a little bit longer this time. And finally they'll make it to the podium ;)

[Hartusvuori]

The year in the headline is next year. Forum members that go from rally to rally, how many Huyndai people have you seen in the service area in the rallies this year? Do they have any driver to do recce-only on this years rounds? Those were first two questions.

[DonJippo]

The year in the headline is next year. Forum members that go from rally to rally, how many Huyndai people have you seen in the service area in the rallies this year? Do they have any driver to do recce-only on this years rounds? Those were first two questions.

Well they might be there but wearing Ford clothing at the moment...who knows what Ford will do and if they pull out what MSport may do ;)

[rallyfiend]

Well they might be there but wearing Ford clothing at the moment...who knows what Ford will do and if they pull out what MSport may do ;)

Exactly. The wolf in sheep's clothing.

Why reinvent the wheel!

[6789]

Ford should be there until 2013 hopefully Ford extends World Rally Championship participation with new two-year agreement with M-Sport (http://www.m-sport.co.uk/index.php/news/899-ford-extends-world-rally-championship-participation-with-new-two-year-agreement-with-m-sport-)

[rallyfiend]

Ford should be there until 2013 hopefully Ford extends World Rally Championship participation with new two-year agreement with M-Sport (http://www.m-sport.co.uk/index.php/news/899-ford-extends-world-rally-championship-participation-with-new-two-year-agreement-with-m-sport-)

Wonder if there are any performance related criteria that would allow Ford to leave early? Wins this year have been a little tough to get....

Having said that, surely if anyone wanted to realistically join next year, they'd be having to make a fairly concerted effort by now. I can't see anything before 2014.

Any more on the potential Toyota entry, or the new S2000 Yaris out of Cologne?

[6789]

Wonder if there are any performance related criteria that would allow Ford to leave early? Wins this year have been a little tough to get....

Having said that, surely if anyone wanted to realistically join next year, they'd be having to make a fairly concerted effort by now. I can't see anything before 2014.

Any more on the potential Toyota entry, or the new S2000 Yaris out of Cologne?

Yeah I'm sure Malcolm would be worried - if I remember correctly, Malcolm has said that they need to get one of the Championships over the two year deal.

[mrakili]

Hello!

I`ve been reading this forum for quite a long time, and I finnaly registered. I am excited about the news od hyundai entering the wrc. For all, who follow what is going on with mini: will mini have a factory team next year or is this story over? With Mini, VW, Ford, Citroen and Hyundai it would be a great WRC next year, if we look back what was happening last few years.

Thanks for answers!

[skarderud]

maybe it's a link between prodrive-huyndai? the mini projekt is, well, not hot, and prodrive own's the technical base of the car, don't they?

[Barreis]

Everything for money.

[AndyRAC]

Event organisers threaten to walk away from the World Rally Championship - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100020)

More WRC crisis......unbelievable.

[RS]

"MAXRALLY sources report a varied response to the FIA’s expressions of interest document which was revealed in February. It is believed there has not been the level of response which the FIA had hoped for, with serious offers likely to cost the FIA between €3m and €7m. It remains a possibility that the FIA will take the promotion on itself – although there are questions being raised over the potential for a governing body to promote its own series."

MaxRally | News | Next month pivotal for WRC (http://www.maxrally.com/news/entry/next_month_pivotal_for_wrc/)

[Allyc85]

Event organisers threaten to walk away from the World Rally Championship - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100020)

More WRC crisis......unbelievable.

un-****ing-believable!! How the hell can the FIA put organisers in such a situation with the sport as it is? Serioulsy what the hell are they on in Paris?!

I can only think its their way of losing a few events so they can add their new ones, such as Brazil.

[Carlo]

Event organisers threaten to walk away from the World Rally Championship - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100020)

More WRC crisis......unbelievable.

So what is wrong with the event organisers providing their own tracking system

What is wrong with the host country TV services providing the footage for international distribution

[A FONDO]

So what is wrong with the event organisers providing their own tracking system

What is wrong with the host country TV services providing the footage for international distribution

The same what its wrong with competitors providing their own fuel and tyre$$$$

[rallyfiend]

So what is wrong with the event organisers providing their own tracking system

What is wrong with the host country TV services providing the footage for international distribution

I guess it's all a matter of consistency.

don't get me wrong, this is turning in to a total shambles, but without a consistent timing and tracking solution, then things like live timing for web sites or apps I guess would not be possible.

And the potential for international distribution of TV would disappear because what TV station would pay money for content that is delivered in a different way with a different provider for each event.

It's all has the potential for the destruction of the series as it is now known.

[tfp]

Event organisers threaten to walk away from the World Rally Championship - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100020)

More WRC crisis......unbelievable.

Not more bad news.

Which events were they referring to?

This is silly, the event organisers having to pay out even more money for this. Whats worse is the FIA dont seem to be very open to negotiations, they dont seem to give a toss.

Any news about next years rally GB? I guess this news and the move from Wales is all linked? I thought Mouton and co wanted to move the event to bring RAC type of stages back, I diddnt realise they were thinking of moving through no choice of their own!

[MR666]

Mikko Hirvonen in big testing accident (http://www.speedcafe.com/2012/06/01/mikko-hirvonen-in-big-testing-accident/)

Mikko Hirvonen in big testing accident

Friday 1st June, 2012[/*:m:3im9l4x4]
Author: SpeedCafe ©[/*:m:3im9l4x4]
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[/*:m:3im9l4x4]
http://media.speedcafe.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/Mikko-head-testing-crash-344x224.jpgMikko Hirvonen has walked away from a big testing crash

Citroen factory driver Mikko Hirvonen and co-driver Jarmo Lehtinen have been involved in a high-speed rally testing accident in Italy.
The crash was caught on video with eyewitnesses just metres away from the DS3 WRC when it clipped a bank and rolled into a surrounding paddock in Tuscany.
Hirvoenen, who sits second in the championship behind team-mate Sebastien Loeb, was taken to hospital along with Lehtinen for tests but both have been given the all-clear.
The test was part of preparations for the upcoming Rally New Zealand and occurred just after lunch. Due to restrictions on testing for the long-haul rallies, only a pre-event shakedown is permitted on events such as New Zealand and Argentina.
“Mikko rolled a lot of times, the accident was high-speed,” said a Citroen spokesperson.
“The most important thing is that Mikko and Jarmo are both OK. They are back at the hotel tonight. The test is finished.”
Loeb completed his one-day test yesterday.
Rally New Zealand gets underway from Auckland on 21 June.


Crash Hirvonen test Asciano Toscana 2012.mov - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77PGt07BiK8&feature=player_embedded)

[Maxi]

glad they are okay!!

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

That cameraman followed up nicely....well done considering the load of **** in his draws. Glad everyone is okey, that had bad news written all over it.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Hyundaiii... Hyundai back to WRC in 2013 | SpecialStage (http://www.specialstage.com/2012/05/31/hyundai-back-to-wrc-in-2013/)

[Plan9]

I wonder if Kenneth Eriksson and Alister McRae will be involved in the development of this car? ;)

[Carlo]

The same what its wrong with competitors providing their own fuel and tyre$$$$

By that I take it that you mean that it would be less expensive. A privateeer could save in well in excess of NZ$1000 by providing his own tyres and fuel for Rally NZ even if they were paying retail prices.

Tracking is not as expensive as you think, all organisers in NZ provide it as part of their their own mandatory requirements and it is easy to take a feed off it. If Kiwi's can do surely the remainder of the "Advanced" world can

[Brother John]

Event organisers threaten to walk away from the World Rally Championship - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100020)

More WRC crisis......unbelievable.

Almost no one believed what was already discussed that there are problems in the WRC.
http://www.motorsportforums.com/wrc/149147-how-do-you-see-future-rally.html

[tfp]

Event organisers threaten to walk away from the World Rally Championship - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100020)

This is the News & rumours (part II) (http://www.motorsportforums.com/wrc/128975-news-rumours-part-ii.html) section ;)

I'm keeping an eye on irally, theyre usually the first to report on things like this.

[amilk]

Almost no one believed what was already discussed that there are problems in the WRC.
http://www.motorsportforums.com/wrc/149147-how-do-you-see-future-rally.html

Don't be naiv - some media news part of the negotiation which is starting now between FIA and organisers. News are coming from Hunday Toyota so manufacturers are interested, still more candidate to run WRC round than free places - they have to sort out the television issue. In end 80's when there was Lancia and half Toyota, the WRC was not in better shape. There are up and downs always. We are turning to the up.

[T.Maanteiden kuningas]

I wonder if Kenneth Eriksson and Alister McRae will be involved in the development of this car? ;)


Maybe they have to make just one call to Laukaa.

[Juha_Koo]

This just in: Juha Salo will compete San Marino rally and NORF with S2000! :up: Car TBA.

[rp]

Juha Salo will drive Super 2000 car in Rally Finland and he will aim for the SWRC points. The car will be published 15th June, but it will be works team. It must be Proton, because the NORF is in their program and there is no sense to send Alister McRae to compete in Finland...

[Red bull]

DENIS GIRAUDET FOR SAFARI RALLY WRC navigator to read notes for Manvir (http://flatoutaction.com/index.php/our-news/379-wrc-navigator-to-read-notes-for-manvir)

[Red bull]

No comments from Hyundai Hyundai yet tocomment on WRC rumours

[Red bull]

Hyundai yet tocomment on WRC rumours http://irallylive.com/ir_news.htm?00001064 (http://t.co/pDFsUbtm)

[Red bull]

French rallymagazine speak about possible retirement's Loeb in the end of 2012 AUTOhebdo.fr (http://www.autohebdo.fr/)

[AndyRAC]

French rallymagazine speak about possible retirement's Loeb in the end of 2012 AUTOhebdo.fr (http://www.autohebdo.fr/)

Wouldn't surprise me - he has his own team to run, and drive for...and very probably finds Sportscars more interesting than Rallycars.

[Rallyper]

Wouldn't surprise me - he has his own team to run, and drive for...and very probably finds Sportscars more interesting than Rallycars.

And don´t have to test his skills against Ogier in competable Polo WRC....?

The best rallydriver ever should do good to retire on top. And the excitement of WRC should start to rise, after that.

[Red bull]

Malcolm Wilson:we will support petter Malcolm Wilson: (http://www.rallymagazin.ro/malcolm-wilson-%E2%80%9Dil-vom-sprijini-pe-petter-daca-o-sa-fie-nevoie%E2%80%9D-56429.html)

[Red bull]

WRC'stop drivers will change the rules regarding tires http://www.rallymagazin.ro/pilotii-de-top-din-wrc-vor-o-schimbare-a-regulamentului-in-ceea-ce-priveste-pneurile-56432.html

[Red bull]

WRC'stop drivers will change the rules regarding tires Pilo (http://www.rallymagazin.ro/pilotii-de-top-din-wrc-vor-o-schimbare-a-regulamentului-in-ceea-ce-priveste-pneurile-56432.html)

[Red bull]

French organisers reject FIA WRC contract iRally | The free independent Rally App for the iPhone, iPad and Android (http://irallylive.com/ir_news.htm?00001065)

[N.O.T]

French rallymagazine speak about possible retirement's Loeb in the end of 2012 AUTOhebdo.fr (http://www.autohebdo.fr/)

It is going to be a shame ...we need someone to beat Loeb and then retire...we a need a passing of the torch not a garbage picker champion after Loeb.

[amilk]

It is going to be a shame ...we need someone to beat Loeb and then retire...we a need a passing of the torch not a garbage picker champion after Loeb.

If in Loeb still have some "fighting spirit" he wait for Ogier in 2013 to finish their open affair from last year

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[Rallyper]

French organisers reject FIA WRC contract iRally | The free independent Rally App for the iPhone, iPad and Android (http://irallylive.com/ir_news.htm?00001065)

So what are the other organizers expecting to do? NORF, Sweden, GB? Is it time to sack FIA and start an undependent WRC, regarding what rall2000 said on other topic?

[N.O.T]

but i thought the FIA were just there to govern the sport...not earn anything from it...like in F1..they do not earn anything from it...right ???

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

[Barreis]

WRC leaders should go after all this blow.

[Jordib]

WRC leaders should go after all this blow.

+1

[GigiGalliNo1]

Ughhhhh FIA a joke

[sollitt]

Is it time to sack FIA and start an undependent WRC, regarding what rall2000 said on other topic?I wouldn't be relying too much on rally2000's testimony to form opinion. It's very easy to claim to be an employee with the inside gen and slag off at all & sundry whilst hiding behind a nom de plume on the interweb. None of what he's written is new and the strong likelihood is that any information he has regarding new bidders is 3rd hand at best. People who've lost their livelihood always look for someone to blame and the FIA are trending highly at the moment.

[rallyfiend]

I wouldn't be relying too much on rally2000's testimony to form opinion. It's very easy to claim to be an employee with the inside gen and slag off at all & sundry whilst hiding behind a nom de plume on the interweb. None of what he's written is new and the strong likelihood is that any information he has regarding new bidders is 3rd hand at best. People who've lost their livelihood always look for someone to blame and the FIA are trending highly at the moment.

I agree, there was no major revelations there in that post by supposed former employee.

In fact, how much of it wasn't known?

[Rallyper]

I wouldn't be relying too much on rally2000's testimony to form opinion. It's very easy to claim to be an employee with the inside gen and slag off at all & sundry whilst hiding behind a nom de plume on the interweb. None of what he's written is new and the strong likelihood is that any information he has regarding new bidders is 3rd hand at best. People who've lost their livelihood always look for someone to blame and the FIA are trending highly at the moment.

My reply was on the fact FIA wants to make even more money on WRC organizers who´s struggling with budgets, jepardizing the whole series, while they sold F1 to a private person now being a billiardere on the sport. What´s logic in that?

[tfp]

It is going to be a shame ...we need someone to beat Loeb and then retire...we a need a passing of the torch not a garbage picker champion after Loeb.

Imagine if loeb retires at the end of the season, and ogier wins next season! His championship will always be considered a farce, even though we all know he is much better than that.

[N.O.T]

IF Ogier is the next to win the championship after Loeb retires i think the poor finish fans are going to have a nervous breakdown and nuke the whole europe.... and given the fact that 20.000 of them managed to kick the butt of 1.5 million of the best soldiers in the wolrd a few years back i think we are going to be in deep trouble.

[GigiGalliNo1]

I agree, there was no major revelations there in that post by supposed former employee.

In fact, how much of it wasn't known?

This goes with the Prodrive employee who's joined and commented in the forum as well?

Why do people complain that when someone from a team is in here they're Not real. And then winge that there are no official people in this forum... odd isn't it?

[A FONDO]

Even if they're real they're useless. Or you want to say you like this behaviour "I know it but I won't tell you"? For me it's retarded and annoying. If somebody wants to say something, let's do it in Antony Warmbold's way.

[Red bull]

WRC events facing Friday deadline if they want to be part of the 2013 calendar - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100162?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter)

[Gregor-y]

IF Ogier is the next to win the championship after Loeb retires i think the poor finish fans are going to have a nervous breakdown and nuke the whole europe.... and given the fact that 20.000 of them managed to kick the butt of 1.5 million of the best soldiers in the wolrd a few years back i think we are going to be in deep trouble.
I'm not too worried because:
A) Finland was on defense
B) The Red Army of 1940 wasn't as good as the foreign-equipped Red Army of 1945 or even the motivated Red Army of 1920 that couldn't conquer Poland
C) By the end Finland lost to Russia two times in the same war. Not even Italy managed to do that.

That said you can't deny the country produces some excellent drivers and looks like a great place to live.

[N.O.T]

I'm not too worried because:
A) Finland was on defense
B) The Red Army of 1940 wasn't as good as the foreign-equipped Red Army of 1945 or even the motivated Red Army of 1920 that couldn't conquer Poland
C) By the end Finland lost to Russia two times in the same war. Not even Italy managed to do that.

That said you can't deny the country produces some excellent drivers and looks like a great place to live.

ok lets stop the political talk now..it was a joke.

[Red bull]

Dan (http://insiderally.com/2012/06/07/dans-wrc-blog-long-live-the-wrc/)

[Red bull]

dan (http://insiderally.com/2012/06/07/dans-wrc-blog-long-live-the-wrc/)
f.i.a under fire

[Rallyper]

Even if they're real they're useless. Or you want to say you like this behaviour "I know it but I won't tell you"? For me it's retarded and annoying. If somebody wants to say something, let's do it in Antony Warmbold's way.

Slowson/ Tell me what´s different with the Warmbold way. Isn´t he an insider as the others? Please, be real in your comments.

[Rallyper]

The main difference is that Warmbold has nothing to lose. Other people with inside info often have a job to lose if they talk too much, and that's why 99,9% of those people is not to be found on this forum.

So when they participate on this forum, should we believe in them or just ignore? I prefere the first.

[N.O.T]

you should stop confusing and start distinguishing between the words "insight" and "point of view" ...

[Rallyper]

That's the 0,1% who can't resist to comment on all the critics on here, not always a smart decision.

0,1%? You know all participants on this forum and can judge all relevance in all comments? I don´t think so. Unless you are God.

My comments was because you very much simplifying certain comments and raise others.

[GigiGalliNo1]

So people here want an insight but cannot be happy with what information they are given. I just don't understand. Appreciate that someone or people come here and read the forums, read what members write, read what the fans really have to say. There are more people then you think who come and read the threads but don't necessarily interact with fans! The ones who do are the good guys who want to give us a bit more info. But then again, they can always hide behind their keyboards and NO one will know who they are! Oh hello! :)

[Tomi]

Other people with inside info often have a job to lose if they talk too much, and that's why 99,9% of those people is not to be found on this forum.

One reason might be that why they are not here is because they have a life

[N.O.T]

The main reason is simple... and of course i am the only smart person to notice it... no need to be upset... every mind has its limits.

When you are doing something for a living you prefer to spend your free time away from it since it already is a big part of your daily life... if a subject is part of every moment in your 24 hour plan you end up in a mental house...which is a nice place to be for a day or two but then it might be frustrating...

For the majority of us this place is the way to relax... we do not lose anything from the sport and we do not gain either... we make comments and argue over other peoples activities and it is a way to relax from our daily jobs/studies/problems... some take things a bit more seriously and get a bit upset but for that the answer lies in the first sentence of this post.

And again you should notice that most people who are inside the sport and post here they do not offer an insight... they offer their personal point of view on things..and this is hardly an insight.

[Motorsportfun]

Become a journalist, ask a question to Petter Solberg!

The Italian "Rally Emotion (http://wwwrallyemotion.it)" magazine will interview the Norwegian also with your questions!

Be part of it, it's easy: write your question to the Ford driver on www.facebook.com/RallyEmotion (http://www.facebook.com/RallyEmotion) and the Editors will ask Petter the most interesting ones during a special interview which will be published on next month's magazine out on newsagents!

WRC / Petter Solberg lo intervistate voi! (http://www.rallyemotion.it/3318_wrc-petter-solberg-lo-intervistate-voi/)
Rally Emotion | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/RallyEmotion/)

[Red bull]

World Rally Championship rounds fail to sign FIA contract over 2013 - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100269?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

[Rallyper]

World Rally Championship rounds fail to sign FIA contract over 2013 - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100269?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

I think the WRC-commission should resign. Maybe also Mr Todt. He doesn´t seem to have the abiltiy to have management over WRC...

[Barreis]

WRC commission sucks.

[BDunnell]

I think the WRC-commission should resign. Maybe also Mr Todt. He doesn´t seem to have the abiltiy to have management over WRC...

I don't understand Todt. Of course, I was delighted that his approach was so different from that of his predecessor — the lack of constant outbursts over any motorsport matter under the sun, his quieter 'behind-the-scenes' approach, his definite enthusiasm for the WRC in its more traditional form, and so on. But the fact remains that one can only judge from results, and the WRC has gone further downhill under his stewardship of the FIA. It's a real shame, and I don't know what to make of it.

[AndyRAC]

It's strange - I do wonder what is going on. When elected, Jean Todt made it clear rescuing the WRC was a primary concern. We know he's keen for it to return to it's 'Endurance roots' - whereas the current Manufacturers want to keep the status quo.
Forgive me, but is it possible he's trying to run it down and start again with his 'blueprint'. And does he have other Manufacturers lined up?? It just seems almost bizarre the way the WRC is being run/ or not being run.

However, JT has resurrected a World Championship for Sportscars - so I still think he's in credit, but that's no use to what remains of the WRC fans.

[MJW]

First we had DR now a banker from Finland, (Mahonen) and I did say banker :-)

[BDunnell]

Forgive me, but is it possible he's trying to run it down and start again with his 'blueprint'.

Well, it might be, if we're into such theories. The trouble is that if it does get run completely down, what will there be to pick up in terms of public and media interest in the sport? Its profile will be shot to bits.

[DonJippo]

First we had DR now a banker from Finland, (Mahonen) and I did say banker :-)

Wonder why NORF did not sign this contract if this was Mahonen's idea ...

[N.O.T]

One of the problems of the FIA WRC commisions is that all the failures of the sport want to be in them because they never managed to do anything substantial while they were competing...

and usually failures fail at everything they do...

some times nature saves the sport from these people like a few years back... but most of the time they survive and destroy the sport...

If WRC wants a future it needs to leave the FIA.

[N.O.T]

Your theory is not correct, they don't fail in failing...

For the rest you see it too much black/white I think. ;)

when you see things black and white is easier to distinguish the bad from the good...

[BDunnell]

when you see things black and white is easier to distinguish the bad from the good...

Seeing things in black and white is not, despite what you might think, a good character trait. 'Bad' and 'good' are very simplistic concepts.

[N.O.T]

Seeing things in black and white is not, despite what you might think, a good character trait. 'Bad' and 'good' are very simplistic concepts.

it makes decisions easier though...

[Barreis]

When someone makes business with loses, must go and WRC leadership didn't do good this year.

[BDunnell]

it makes decisions easier though...

But it might not make them good.

[BDunnell]

When someone makes business with loses, must go and WRC leadership didn't do good this year.

No, they mustn't automatically 'go'. But big changes need to happen. I wonder whether they are hoping the arrival of VW will spur a rise in interest.

[Rallyper]

No, they mustn't automatically 'go'. But big changes need to happen. I wonder whether they are hoping the arrival of VW will spur a rise in interest.

You are dividing words. NOT is right. This hasbeen gone so long that everyone can see with their own eyes that FIA has failed ten times around.

[darkstar]

manfred stohl will start in new zealand with a fiesta wrc.

[Andre Oliveira]

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577598_10151048560388083_600587255_n.jpg

[Maxi]

looks like Photoshop to me

[sollitt]

One of the problems of the FIA WRC commisions is that all the failures of the sport want to be in them because they never managed to do anything substantial while they were competing...

and usually failures fail at everything they do...

some times nature saves the sport from these people like a few years back... but most of the time they survive and destroy the sport...

If WRC wants a future it needs to leave the FIA. I wonder N.O.T whether you can update us please with the names of the WRC Commission members and their achievements, or failings, in motorsport and other endeavours. Ought to be interesting.

Your last comment of the post is particularly insightful given that we have enjoyed 33 years of what we know as the WRC, all under FIA control.

Oh and, whilst like you I prefer to see official confirmation from the factories involved rather than speculate on rumour, we can look forward to 2013 with Citroen, Ford, VW, part time Mini, a very heavily rumoured Hyundai, and some hints of a Toyota return and/or a Proton step up sometime in the future to keep us hopeful. Dreadful people that FIA.

[rp]

Juha Salo will drive Super 2000 car in Rally Finland and he will aim for the SWRC points. The car will be published 15th June, but it will be works team. It must be Proton, because the NORF is in their program and there is no sense to send Alister McRae to compete in Finland...

My guess was right! Salo was already testing...

Proton S2000 Test - Sweet Lamb [HD] - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RphJ2WA75Ps&list=UU-U4hTfCxOlFYur7sGm72WA&index=1&feature=plcp)

[N.O.T]

I wonder N.O.T whether you can update us please with the names of the WRC Commission members and their achievements, or failings, in motorsport and other endeavours. Ought to be interesting.

Your last comment of the post is particularly insightful given that we have enjoyed 33 years of what we know as the WRC, all under FIA control.

Oh and, whilst like you I prefer to see official confirmation from the factories involved rather than speculate on rumour, we can look forward to 2013 with Citroen, Ford, VW, part time Mini, a very heavily rumoured Hyundai, and some hints of a Toyota return and/or a Proton step up sometime in the future to keep us hopeful. Dreadful people that FIA.

let me reverse the question and ask you to enlighten me on the successes the WRC commision members had in the sport...

As for the entries of all the rumoured and other manufacturers if there is no exposure i can see them turns like Seat/Hyundai/Suzuki very very soon....

Car manufacturers are not entering the sport because they are romantic gilrs who like sunsets...they enter the sport because the want to make money out of it by using it as advertising... now would you prepare a commercial if you were usure if it is going to be broadcasted in 100 or 10 million people ??? and would you be ready to dedicate to the product whithout being sure if it is going to get maximum exposure ??

[Red bull]

Citroen are posting lots of photos on facebook from 2007 onwards,is it a sign of saying goodbye paving way for Peugeot entrance?
http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577598_10151048560388083_600587255_n.jpg

[rallyfan2000]

I am a former employee of North One Television and spent the last 2 years working on the WRC for the production arm for the company. I haven't read through all the posts on here so I can't say if what I will say will be news to any of you but I thought it best to put across the point of view of someone from the inside and give everyone a better understanding of exactly what happened near the end.

Firstly, around September time, we were told by the powers that be at North One that Roman Antanov had decided he could provide WRC coverage, worldwide, cheaper and more efficient using his own employees. This meant the whole TUPE ordeal started with his company CSI and all was planning to go ahead up until November when he was arrested/made insolvent and the deal was off, with the rights to the rally then to be decided by the FIA. Firstly they were encouraging new bids from anyone that could pick up the pieces and carry on the progress already made, there were 2 parties interested, the first pulled out 5 days before Christmas as the FIA had not responded to any communication from this party and got fed up of being messed around. The second was from a Middle Eastern party and just as everything looked to be in place, just after new year, the FIA decided that they wanted North One Sport/Television to have nothing to do with it anymore as they had become tired of being 'messed about' and with 'nothing stable in place'.

From the inside, I can tell you for a fact that had the FIA decided to go with one of these new bids for global broadcast and promotion, the WRC would be in a much better place than it is now. It was thrown on Eurosport late in the day and they didn't have the resources or funding to take on such a job and since then it has become a complete joke with Nokia backing out last week, it is moving backwards at a rapid pace. Firstly, nobody wants to sponsor an event/manufacturer that isn't being promoted/broadcast on a global scale so eventually more and more sponsors will drop out and because of this, none of the teams will have the funding to race in as many events each year, slowly dropping out. Mini is a prime example of this, Prodrive pretty much jumped straight off the sinking ship one it had been announced.

North One Sport were actually doing an incredible job maintaing the rally as it was, the FIA like to criticise their work as it wasn't making as much money as they would have liked and the WRC will always play second fiddle to F1. WRC doesn't recieve as much coverage not because North One Sport/FIA weren't pushing it in the right directions but simply because it isn't sexy enough like the F1. In my honest opinion, the FIA are entirely to blame for this and only now are they starting to realise what a huge mistake it was to end North One Sport's involvement with the WRC in the way that they did.

The 2 years I spent working on the WRC were the best years I've enjoyed as a professional and I know that nothing will rival it. I hope one day to get back into the same line of work and rejoin the incredible family that is the WRC.

If anyone has any questions that they think I might be able to answer, please don't hesitate to ask and I will try to answer as best I can.

[N.O.T]

I am a former employee of North One Television and spent the last 2 years working on the WRC for the production arm for the company. I haven't read through all the posts on here so I can't say if what I will say will be news to any of you but I thought it best to put across the point of view of someone from the inside and give everyone a better understanding of exactly what happened near the end.

Firstly, around September time, we were told by the powers that be at North One that Roman Antanov had decided he could provide WRC coverage, worldwide, cheaper and more efficient using his own employees. This meant the whole TUPE ordeal started with his company CSI and all was planning to go ahead up until November when he was arrested/made insolvent and the deal was off, with the rights to the rally then to be decided by the FIA. Firstly they were encouraging new bids from anyone that could pick up the pieces and carry on the progress already made, there were 2 parties interested, the first pulled out 5 days before Christmas as the FIA had not responded to any communication from this party and got fed up of being messed around. The second was from a Middle Eastern party and just as everything looked to be in place, just after new year, the FIA decided that they wanted North One Sport/Television to have nothing to do with it anymore as they had become tired of being 'messed about' and with 'nothing stable in place'.

From the inside, I can tell you for a fact that had the FIA decided to go with one of these new bids for global broadcast and promotion, the WRC would be in a much better place than it is now. It was thrown on Eurosport late in the day and they didn't have the resources or funding to take on such a job and since then it has become a complete joke with Nokia backing out last week, it is moving backwards at a rapid pace. Firstly, nobody wants to sponsor an event/manufacturer that isn't being promoted/broadcast on a global scale so eventually more and more sponsors will drop out and because of this, none of the teams will have the funding to race in as many events each year, slowly dropping out. Mini is a prime example of this, Prodrive pretty much jumped straight off the sinking ship one it had been announced.

North One Sport were actually doing an incredible job maintaing the rally as it was, the FIA like to criticise their work as it wasn't making as much money as they would have liked and the WRC will always play second fiddle to F1. WRC doesn't recieve as much coverage not because North One Sport/FIA weren't pushing it in the right directions but simply because it isn't sexy enough like the F1. In my honest opinion, the FIA are entirely to blame for this and only now are they starting to realise what a huge mistake it was to end North One Sport's involvement with the WRC in the way that they did.

The 2 years I spent working on the WRC were the best years I've enjoyed as a professional and I know that nothing will rival it. I hope one day to get back into the same line of work and rejoin the incredible family that is the WRC.

If anyone has any questions that they think I might be able to answer, please don't hesitate to ask and I will try to answer as best I can.

ok thank you...we will get back to you.

[rallyfan2000]

Just a question about the reports on tv themselves. Why were the onboards on tv always like minutes long, with a relatively bad camera angle (where you could often only see the first 15m of road, or opposite, no road at all), and often exactly the most boring stage-parts? Any reason why they couldn't/didn't want to place the camera in a better position, or was there nobody who cared? Not critisizing your collegues work etc, just a question... ;)


The cameras on the cars themselves were very cheap as they could easily be sacrificed if the car were to roll and the camera break. Most of the top drivers had 2 cameras that would cut between every 2 minutes, so you have a shot from the front wing of the car and then a shot from the roof/bonnet/grill. I think it was about as good as they were going to get. In terms of why certain footage was chosen to be part of the show, the onboards were usually synced with camera positions on the stage, or interesting points, maybe a particular section where a certain driver was fast or where they had lost time. There was also the telemetery option where we demonstrated how much quicker someone was than someone else over a certain section, using WRC stage simulator etc. We did only have split times to go on most of the time so it ws a case of trying to find out why a driver was slow in a certain section. For example, there was some really good audio from Greece last year when Petter got stuck in the dust on an night stage and there was a huge row between Chris Patterson and himself.

I can't tell you how much I've seen on onboards that havent been shown. Jari-Matti getting out of his car between stages in NZ 2 years ago to have a pi$$ whilst the cameras were still rolling. Various photogrpahers and animals being hit but not being able to show them.

[Red bull]

Citroen are posting lots of photos on facebook from 2007 onwards,is it a sign of saying goodbye paving way for Peugeot entrance?
http://www.worldrallyblog.com/2012/03/05/thoughts/will-peugeot-take-over-wrc-programme-from-citroen/

[dimviii]

The cameras on the cars themselves were very cheap as they could easily be sacrificed if the car were to roll and the camera break. Most of the top drivers had 2 cameras that would cut between every 2 minutes, so you have a shot from the front wing of the car and then a shot from the roof/bonnet/grill. I think it was about as good as they were going to get. In terms of why certain footage was chosen to be part of the show, the onboards were usually synced with camera positions on the stage, or interesting points, maybe a particular section where a certain driver was fast or where they had lost time. There was also the telemetery option where we demonstrated how much quicker someone was than someone else over a certain section, using WRC stage simulator etc. We did only have split times to go on most of the time so it ws a case of trying to find out why a driver was slow in a certain section. For example, there was some really good audio from Greece last year when Petter got stuck in the dust on an night stage and there was a huge row between Chris Patterson and himself.

I can't tell you how much I've seen on onboards that havent been shown. Jari-Matti getting out of his car between stages in NZ 2 years ago to have a pi$$ whilst the cameras were still rolling. Various photogrpahers and animals being hit but not being able to show them.

you didn t answer the question.But ok...

[sollitt]

let me reverse the question and ask you to enlighten me on the successes the WRC commision members had in the sport... Sorry N.O.T .... you were the person who made the disparaging remarks. It is entirely your responsibility to validate them with facts. Time to put up or shut up.

[N.O.T]

Well simple enough...

Mouton was a nobody and was there because she was a woman and she did everything with a car from the space age for the time.

Jean todt was a nobody co-driver and then a sell out to F1...

ok now ?

Have you seen any person with even a remote success story in the WRC to be part of the committee ??

Every nobody who never achieved anything in the sport despite their efforts tried to be famous once more by being part in the WRC committee...

But unfortunately once you are an underachiever in your 30s and 40s whch are your most creative years, you are not going to be anything more than that in your 60s apart from an uglier underachiever.

[amilk]

Well simple enough...

Mouton was a nobody and was there because she was a woman and she did everything with a car from the space age for the time.

Jean todt was a nobody co-driver and then a sell out to F1...

ok now ?

Have you seen any person with even a remote success story in the WRC to be part of the committee ??

Every nobody who never achieved anything in the sport despite their efforts tried to be famous once more by being part in the WRC committee...

But unfortunately once you are an underachiever in your 30s and 40s whch are your most creative years, you are not going to be anything more than that in your 60s apart from an uglier underachiever.

no problem if WRC committe without world champions , the sport doesn't need rally heroes at managing level...but more peoples who understand the sport, and have business/ managing skills
NOS administration is vis major from FIA point of view - they can not do miracles in 4 months
Nokia left the WRC - not supprising as they close factories and lay off more thousands people, nothing to do with the level of WRC
The bad thing is that FIA already starting to increase the next year fees and try to collect the money from organisers. This create the feeling that they are pessimistic that in short term (for 2013) a promoter and global sponsor will step and we can reach at least the former NOS level (which can not be the final target). It's too early to do that.

[amilk]

If anyone has any questions that they think I might be able to answer, please don't hesitate to ask and I will try to answer as best I can.

My question still the same as was in other thread. What could have been done better or on other way by NOS in the past?

[sollitt]

Have you seen any person with even a remote success story in the WRC to be part of the committee ?? So you've changed the angle now? Earlier you were suggesting that nobody on any Commission had achieved success in any endeavour ... now it's just WRC? Original argument not holding water? Neither will this one.

All your post really does is to reinforce what a horrible little tosser you really are and how little you know about anything of which you write.

[Gregor-y]

What about Todt's development of the 205 for Peugeot before selling out to F1? If you want to call the Audi a spaceship of the time you can't dismiss the guy who supervised the development of a trans-dimensional warp.

Come to think of it, Dave Richards was a pretty successful co-driver, wasn't he? Maybe he should be in charge. ;)

[N.O.T]

So you've changed the angle now? Earlier you were suggesting that nobody on any Commission had achieved success in any endeavour ... now it's just WRC? Original argument not holding water? Neither will this one.

All your post really does is to reinforce what a horrible little tosser you really are and how little you know about anything of which you write.

Since i am posting in the WRC section, and since the discussion was about the WRC TV rights i was reffering to the WRC committee from the start...not committees in general...i do not care about other sports that much.

so can you please note a member of the WRC committee that had success in the sport or was something more than mediocrity at best ??

All these middle aged underachievers with wasted lives just want to prove themselves from a different post since they failed at anything they did... so at their end of their careers i doubt they will offer something more than failures...

Successful drivers/team managers ects took all the satisfaction at being the best in their field... they have nothing to prove anymore (which is a pity since they could really help the sport)

Little sick dogs who failed at what they tried in their youth want to revenge the sport and battle with their inferiority complexes all the time... but the results are always the same...once a loser, always one.

[N.O.T]

successful co-driver

Successful co-driver !!! LOL !!!

Co-drivers are good guys but they do nothing special, it is quite easy to find a good co-driver in contrast to a good driver...

[rallyfiend]

Since i am posting in the WRC section, and since the discussion was about the WRC TV rights i was reffering to the WRC committee from the start...not committees in general...i do not care about other sports that much.

so can you please note a member of the WRC committee that had success in the sport or was something more than mediocrity at best ??

All these middle aged underachievers with wasted lives just want to prove themselves from a different post since they failed at anything they did... so at their end of their careers i doubt they will offer something more than failures...

Successful drivers/team managers ects took all the satisfaction at being the best in their field... they have nothing to prove anymore (which is a pity since they could really help the sport)

Little sick dogs who failed at what they tried in their youth want to revenge the sport and battle with their inferiority complexes all the time... but the results are always the same...once a loser, always one.

You seem keen to 'reverse questions', so here's one for you.

How many members of the current WRC Commission can you name?

You've mentioned Todt - well, he's not a member. You mentioned MM, well done to you.

How many can you come up with?

[Josti]

Well simple enough...

Mouton was a nobody and was there because she was a woman and she did everything with a car from the space age for the time.

Jean todt was a nobody co-driver and then a sell out to F1...

ok now ?


Mouton, apart from being an iconic driver from rallying's hayday, she has a width experience on organisational level from her ROC years, let alone her inside knowledge of WRC.

Todt was actually a strong personality in his co-driver years, hence his many partnerships with a variety of succesful drivers. After that, he was the mastermind of the 205 T16 project. This pretty much helped Peugeot from going bankrupt.

These assumptions of yours are anything but objective, it's sounds like you just don't like them.

[tfp]

Well simple enough...

Mouton was a nobody and was there because she was a woman and she did everything with a car from the space age for the time.

Jean todt was a nobody co-driver and then a sell out to F1...

.

I reckon the most successful female rally driver ever and anyone else who can finish second in the championship(admittedly with the best car) is not a nobody.

I agree with your comments on the fat one.

[BDunnell]

Your last comment of the post is particularly insightful given that we have enjoyed 33 years of what we know as the WRC, all under FIA control.

I don't disagree with your view, but do you have a similarly positive view of Fidel Castro merely on the grounds that he was in power for a long time?

On another matter, we seem to have gone from a situation where there was too much moderation of the rally forum to one where a member calls another a 'horrible little ******' without sanction, and said other member fills the thread with the usual nonsense, again without action being taken.

[N.O.T]

You seem keen to 'reverse questions', so here's one for you.

How many members of the current WRC Commission can you name?

You've mentioned Todt - well, he's not a member. You mentioned MM, well done to you.

How many can you come up with?

The important ones are the FIA head which is Todt and Mouton who is part of the WRC commision...by heart i cannot name any others... does it matter ??? whoever they are they are definately not doing their job properly...

a few weeks back they said that TV deal was under imminent announcement...then they asked from the organisers to cover the fee...

[N.O.T]

it's sounds like you just don't like them.

Of course i do not like them... do you ??

[sollitt]

BDunnell, no I don't have a view on Castro. The comment was reactionary to a suggestion "the WRC has no future" despite it's resilience throughout the ebbs and flows of the past 33 years. No wider political inference was implied.

I agree with your comments re moderators. To be honest, a certain 'awakening' was the motivation behind my descriptive. That and the fact that I couldn't think of a more accurate one.

By the way, thanks for your comments on the other thread. I've simply lacked the time to give adequate thought to a reply as yet, but will do so.

[rallyfiend]

The important ones are the FIA head which is Todt and Mouton who is part of the WRC commision...by heart i cannot name any others... does it matter ??? whoever they are they are definately not doing their job properly...

a few weeks back they said that TV deal was under imminent announcement...then they asked from the organisers to cover the fee...

So, in other words, you are just a person who has no idea what he is talking about in any way, shape or form, but feels that everyone else in the world is entitled to your opinion.

[ShiftingGears]

Well simple enough...

Mouton was a nobody and was there because she was a woman and she did everything with a car from the space age for the time.

Jean todt was a nobody co-driver and then a sell out to F1...

ok now ?

Have you seen any person with even a remote success story in the WRC to be part of the committee ??

Every nobody who never achieved anything in the sport despite their efforts tried to be famous once more by being part in the WRC committee...


You're coming across as a rabid lunatic. I find it difficult to imagine you are truly that ignorant to the point that you do not acknowledge Todt's successes as Director of Peugeot sport.


But unfortunately once you are an underachiever in your 30s and 40s whch are your most creative years, you are not going to be anything more than that in your 60s apart from an uglier underachiever.

I can only assume you are speaking from experience.

[N.O.T]

The power of mediocre people united can achieve some great things and event shadow those with a voice of reason...

have a nice day and continue beliving that the reason WRC was on the decline all these years was because of Loeb...the fat midget needs your support...it was under his management that the WRC is without a promoter after its start...and do not expect any serious manufacturer to commit and waste their money without any serious TV deal...

as for his peugeot days... indeed was a very successful team manager... after all being a puppet is a very difficult job.

[AndyRAC]

Whether you like Todt or not, you can't dispute his success. Turned around the fortunes of Peugeot-Talbot as it was known; winning WRC, WSC and Le Mans. Then went to Ferrari who were a shambles...and turned them into a winning machine, by hiring Brawn/Byrne/Schumacher...
I haven't been overly impressed by his handling of the current mess, but hope he has something which he is keeping quiet. Which is one concern, the FiA have been very quiet, hence nobody seems to know what is going on.

[Red bull]

No new WRC events for 2013 season - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100334?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

[tfp]

No new WRC events for 2013 season - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100334?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

I wonder which three events have signed up?

[Rallyper]

Whether you like Todt or not, you can't dispute his success. Turned around the fortunes of Peugeot-Talbot as it was known; winning WRC, WSC and Le Mans. Then went to Ferrari who were a shambles...and turned them into a winning machine, by hiring Brawn/Byrne/Schumacher...
I haven't been overly impressed by his handling of the current mess, but hope he has something which he is keeping quiet. Which is one concern, the FiA have been very quiet, hence nobody seems to know what is going on.

On topic again; WRC commission; have they achieved any success? Have they done progress to the WRC? No,no, no!

I understand why N.O.T. says like he does, maybe in his own way of doing it, but still...

[Barreis]

World Rally Championship - News - Atkinson targets summer WRC runs (http://www.wrc.com/news/atkinson-targets-summer-wrc-runs/?fid=16857)

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Once again, the FIA have come off pretty badly in all of this. And I think what has hurt them - as usual - is a lack of transparecny.

If I was running the WRC commission, I would probably only offer the existing events a one-year contract. But I'd also be up-front about why I was doing it. The WRC is in a difficult situation right now, and it needs stability. I would offer a one-year contract on the basis that a new promoter would have to be found, with the promise of a lengthier contract at the end of 2013 if the teams and events were happy with the new promoter.

[BDunnell]

Once again, the FIA have come off pretty badly in all of this. And I think what has hurt them - as usual - is a lack of transparecny.

As an enthusiast, I don't care about transparency so long as the end result is something I want to see. At the moment, there's no way I'd say that about the WRC.

[AndyRAC]

As an enthusiast, I don't care about transparency so long as the end result is something I want to see. At the moment, there's no way I'd say that about the WRC.


I think there's a lot of people like you. I'm still followiing it, but I'm finding it hard to find real enthusiasm for it. Other Motorsport series are on the way up and are looking to make progress. WRC seems completely out of touch.

[rallye-vid]

Rally France 2012 live on Sport+ Rajd Francji na ?ywo - Rallyonline.pl - rajdy samochodowe! (http://rallyonline.pl/index.php?1&modex=pnews&&s=36970)

[GigiGalliNo1]

I think there's a lot of people like you. I'm still followiing it, but I'm finding it hard to find real enthusiasm for it. Other Motorsport series are on the way up and are looking to make progress. WRC seems completely out of touch.

I agree but disagree. I love this sport with a passion! I don't follow another sport. Rally is me. I talk rally and people know I love it. But last 2 years.... depending on what's going on... I sometimes get bored... but there have been some challenges in the rallies with Loeb and other drivers... I'm following but then I don't have it in me to follow. It's hard but I love Rally!

[Red bull]

PASTRANA CHALLENGES LOEB TO X-GAMES Pastrana Invites Loeb to Compete in X-Games Rally Cross -- Red Bull USA - Sports Entertainment News Teams Athletes Videos -- Red Bull (http://www.redbullusa.com/cs/Satellite/en_US/Video/pastrana-invites-loeb-to-x-games-021243222198736)

[Francis44]

PASTRANA CHALLENGES LOEB TO X-GAMES Pastrana Invites Loeb to Compete in X-Games Rally Cross -- Red Bull USA - Sports Entertainment News Teams Athletes Videos -- Red Bull (http://www.redbullusa.com/cs/Satellite/en_US/Video/pastrana-invites-loeb-to-x-games-021243222198736)

I dont think Loeb is going to take the challenge LOL. Plus dosen't this event colide with Rally Finland?!

[Franky]

I dont think Loeb is going to take the challenge LOL. Plus dosen't this event colide with Rally Finland?!

Nope, the rally cross-thingy takes place on the 1st July.

And Loeb isn't the best in rally cross, at least he doesn't have any titles in that sport.

[Gregor-y]

Colin McRae managed to get some publicity and cash from appearing in the XGames though I doubt Loeb would play the fool the way Colin did, nor may he need the publicity. If it's all through Red Bull, though, I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand.

[janvanvurpa]

PASTRANA CHALLENGES LOEB TO X-GAMES Pastrana Invites Loeb to Compete in X-Games Rally Cross -- Red Bull USA - Sports Entertainment News Teams Athletes Videos -- Red Bull (http://www.redbullusa.com/cs/Satellite/en_US/Video/pastrana-invites-loeb-to-x-games-021243222198736)


Funny boy now becomes a clown...

The boy should stop smoking that stuff.

Loeb should challenge Pastrami to finish in the top half of the field in a WRC rally---

[N.O.T]

PASTRANA CHALLENGES LOEB TO X-GAMES Pastrana Invites Loeb to Compete in X-Games Rally Cross -- Red Bull USA - Sports Entertainment News Teams Athletes Videos -- Red Bull (http://www.redbullusa.com/cs/Satellite/en_US/Video/pastrana-invites-loeb-to-x-games-021243222198736)

Since when does that brain damaged underaged boy has the right to challenge Loeb ??

Pastrana is not even worthy to shine Loebs shoes...

he should stick to those motocross jumping to entertain the retarded uneducated 15 year old american kids...

[N.O.T]

Nope, the rally cross-thingy takes place on the 1st July.

And Loeb isn't the best in rally cross, at least he doesn't have any titles in that sport.

Gronholm disagrees with you...

[Red bull]

http://www.citroen-wrc.com/en/2012/news/wrc-news/2978/sebastien-loeb-looks-xl-la/

[Red bull]

http://www.citroen-wrc.com/en/2012/news/wrc-news/2978/sebastien-loeb-looks-xl-la/
loeb takes the challenge.

[Nornbugger]

Since when does that brain damaged underaged boy has the right to challenge Loeb ??

Pastrana is not even worthy to shine Loebs shoes...

he should stick to those motocross jumping to entertain the retarded uneducated 15 year old american kids...


Travis Pastrana is hyping his event, its what Americans do, and it works for them in their own country. Since when do you havve the right to call Mr Pastrana brain damaged etc? You are the most prolific troll I have ever came across on the forums I use and if anyone ever says things like this about you you cry to the mods and report the posts. If you cant take it dont give it kid

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

Travis Pastrana is hyping his event, its what Americans do, and it works for them in their own country. Since when do you havve the right to call Mr Pastrana brain damaged etc? You are the most prolific troll I have ever came across on the forums I use and if anyone ever says things like this about you you cry to the mods and report the posts. If you cant take it dont give it kid

This. It's just hype, and its not just for XGames. He's trying to get a big name over in the states so that more American eyes begin to look at this wonderful sport, whether it be rallycross or stage. They see they cars, they go to youtube, fans are born. How exactly is that a bad thing? USA is a HUGE untapped market for this sport, and people outside the states just hate; ironically calling American's arrogant, stupid.... blah blah blah. Look in a ****ing mirror.

Also, TP is FAR from brain damaged. He has a super high IQ, graduated from HS at 16, WHILE making millions throwing his bike around as one of the elite MX riders in the world. The kid is always smiles and hasn't had to hold a real job in his life. He's the greatest spokesman a sponsor could ask for.

Is loeb a better driver? NO ****. Is TP a bad driver? Drink a glass of objectivity and get back to us.

TP wakes up in the morning and pisses excellence.

[Franky]

He has a super high IQ, graduated from HS at 16...

Quite useless info actually. First because IQ tests really don't show how smart someone is. Secondly, education systems differ in countries.

But this is getting Offtopic.

[jbmarcus21]

http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/7033/22489310151019922805733.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/109/22489310151019922805733.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

[AndyRAC]

Much rather have seen Loeb out this weekend at Le Mans, than doing X-Games.....

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

Quite useless info actually. First because IQ tests really don't show how smart someone is. Secondly, education systems differ in countries.

But this is getting Offtopic.
Agreed but I wasn't referring to IQ within the context of a quantitative test, but simply making a point that he is quite intelligent. And attacking someones intelligence with blatant prejudices, primarily based on ignorant perceptions of their culture/country, is bigotry at its finest. Always find it ironic when someone slams an individuals intelligence, bit of a paradox.

Looking forward to seeing Loeb at X. Loeb, Marcus, Tanner will be great. It will definitely get many people in the States to take notice and begin following rally, at least in some form.

Edit: Also, all of you know you're going to watch it, lol. ^_^

[Formaldehyde]

First of all I'm neither European nor American, so you could say that I'm unbiased.

Now, why do you guys resent the GRC so much? Why is "European Rallycross = good; American Rallycross = bad"? Most of the accusations towards the GRC seem to be directed at the lack of talent of the drivers in the GRC. Who exactly are the European Rallycross Master Legend Champions? You accuse Travis Pastrana of "hyping" the series AS IF that's a bad thing. Newsflash: hype is what draws public interest to the sport. It's what attracts sponsors, teams and drivers. If the whole body of FIA managed to create half the hype that Pastrana manages to create for the GRC, then maybe the WRC wouldn't be slowly fading into insignificance... isn't the lack of adequate promotion what you guys are ALWAYS complaining about anyway? I find it refreshing to see the Americans actually putting in some effort to make their series successful. It's more than we can say about FIA towards the WRC.

I am truly laughing my ass off at the comments such as "Loeb would never play the fool like McRae did". Who's the fool now? Gronholm seems to recognize the potential in the series, and now apparently so does Loeb. I personally will be counting the days until I can see Gronholm and Loeb going head to head again. And I will be rooting for Gronholm :)

You guys sound like a bunch of old ladies who are way past their prime and never managed to find a man to love, and who are now all bitter and resentful towards younger women who are falling in love for the first time. Give me a ****ing break.

[janvanvurpa]

This. It's just hype, and its not just for XGames. He's trying to get a big name over in the states so that more American eyes begin to look at this wonderful sport, whether it be rallycross or stage. They see they cars, they go to youtube, fans are born. How exactly is that a bad thing? USA is a HUGE untapped market for this sport, and people outside the states just hate; ironically calling American's arrogant, stupid.... blah blah blah. Look in a ****ing mirror.

Also, TP is FAR from brain damaged. He has a super high IQ, graduated from HS at 16, WHILE making millions throwing his bike around as one of the elite MX riders in the world. The kid is always smiles and hasn't had to hold a real job in his life. He's the greatest spokesman a sponsor could ask for.

Is loeb a better driver? NO ****. Is TP a bad driver? Drink a glass of objectivity and get back to us.

TP wakes up in the morning and pisses excellence.

No Gherid, NOT this. Those eyes are just looking a whatever spectacle that is placed in front of them., then zap the channel changer and surf more Made-for-TV crap, maybe Cops or American Idle (MY spelling)...As "promotion" became touted by newcomber/parasites in the sport here, events and participation has halved and costs gone up 300 to 400%....so all those supposed "new eyes" have not brought any tangible benefits to anybody I know in the sport.

And hate to break you heart but maybe American fans aren't stupid, but most "fans" I talk to are borderline delusional since they knowledge comes 100% from the Inter-web in a phenomenon called the Blind leading the Blind mixed with "one upping" bragging and exaggerating what "I seen on ..." to out hype your buddies, and that done the way it is done---is, if not arrogant, then it is an awfully amazing simulacrum of arrogance.. IE Clearly aggressively saying "_____________ (fill in blank: Block/Pastrami/Richard is right up there with the absolute top WRC drivers!!! America, Fawk yeah WAAAAAA!!!"

Graduating High School requires mainly the ability to wipe ones chins without too much outside assistance...Graduating early means maybe only sleeping in 1/2 your classes. I graduated a full year early in Seatttle in 1970 when the standards were not yet then watered down to the point that writing your name in all capital block letters is a passing grade.
And I slept in 1/4 of my classes.

Finally he was not anywhere near "one of the elite MX drivers in the world", He was flamed out probably before 20, and could not get a ride---too much spliff and too much "EXtreme" stunts ****ery.

When it was announced he was to be "Subaru Rally Team America Factory Driver" coming from professional moto-cross background my self, I expected him to "wheelie away from the other rich guys with one or maybe 2 seasons experience", and wanted to root for him.. What he did was shockingly disappointing..

Sure he's pleasant, friendly and seems happy, same with Ben Klock, but if you want to see how well they both drive and how they finish when there's 50-80 guys with somewhat comparable equipment go waste a ton of time looking the the Memorial Colin McRae Stages...To say their driving was appalling would win me this weeks Understatement of the Week Award and their stage time in the high 50s to mid 60s out of a clubbie field of 110 or so gives proof of what their driving is like---when there are dozens in similar spec cars..

I don't think it is anybody's place to lecture others about objectivity when there is a clear record, and an embarrassing one at that.

[Prisoner Monkeys]

As an enthusiast, I don't care about transparency so long as the end result is something I want to see. At the moment, there's no way I'd say that about the WRC.
I was thinking more transparency with the event organisers than with the public. From the sounds of things, the FIA only offered everyone a one-year contract - but they didn't say *why* they were only offering one year. I suspect that the plan is to get the organisational structure in place for 2013, assess it throughout the season, and then if everone is happy with it, they cans tart talking about more-permanent arrangements for 2014. But it would appear that the FIA is keeping that to themselves, which has hurt them.

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

"snip"...As "promotion" became touted by newcomber/parasites in the sport here, events and participation has halved and costs gone up 300 to 400%....so all those supposed "new eyes" have not brought any tangible benefits to anybody I know in the sport.

And hate to break you heart but maybe American fans aren't stupid, but most "fans" I talk to are borderline delusional since they knowledge comes 100% from the Inter-web in a phenomenon called the Blind leading the Blind mixed with "one upping" bragging and exaggerating what "I seen on ..." to out hype your buddies, and that done the way it is done---is, if not arrogant, then it is an awfully amazing simulacrum of arrogance.. IE Clearly aggressively saying "_____________ (fill in blank: Block/Pastrami/Richard is right up there with the absolute top WRC drivers!!! America, Fawk yeah WAAAAAA!!!""snip"

Points well taken. My sentiments regarding HS education were weak. I simply have a problem with blatant personal attacks towards individuals based, seemingly, on nothing more than the soil they live on. Especially when said individuals are obviously quite competent and do indeed seem to be good people, doing good things.

Highlighted is something I've been wrestling with, regarding my perceptions of successful promotion. If well financed newcomers enter - promoters, sponsors and drivers - and such influx is said to be parasitic to the sport, wilting the grassroots and stunting accessibility, how does one correct that, while still providing growth? Honestly, I would like to know, because I don't, haha. I'm fairly new to rally, having only been introduced as a spectator since....2003, I think? I find it hard to believe that funding and pushing a brand with charismatic overtones will be a bad thing. You say that the typical American - and really, is it just American’s? - will flip through channels with overwhelming attention span, but is that really true?

The "flat biller" "EXTREME YO!!" argument is brought up a lot, with the entertainment/rock star approach and how it's a detriment to the sport/brand in the long run. But really, is it a detriment, and is the promotion in America really that heavy handed? There will always be the demographic “mark.” Perhaps they're just the ones we hear, because those who actually care are quietly amused by what they see and pursue it with legitimate interest; eventually volunteering, educating themselves, participating or otherwise supporting events. Perhaps, in the long run, it’s a case of diminishing returns, concerning growth; I really don’t know. I digress, it’s late and my dyslexia is kicking in.

I agree concerning TP, he’s been underwhelming at times, but for me more so in the sense of not sticking to something. He seems to show phenomenal potential with almost anything he does, it’s stupid. But he never really just sticks with one thing – except FMX – to be great at. Though, when your life is basically a video game you have that luxury, heh. The only thing he’s been consistent with is doing what he wants, which is usually stupid, entertaining **** that makes people cheer and earns him millions…can’t hate a man for that.

FWIW, TP is a big reason why I began following the Rally America series, thus wrc, thus erc, thus grc; I saw him race at Washougal when he was 15 and kept an eye on him. So, at least to a degree, long term fans and supporters can be had through the action sports/sponsored onslaught. I still think; put their faces on TV, up against the “real speed” and legitimate fans will get it.

And yeh, sorry for digressing. No cookie for me....and I love cookies.....

[michpetter]

So Loeb in a factory built car will be challenging guys in privately run cars.
Why isn't he using already existing Citroen rallycross cars?

[Juha_Koo]

Now it's officially confirmed. Juha Salo will drive Proton S2000 in NORF and additionally also in Wales Rally GB (and before NORF also San Marino IRC). Salo saying that he will only drive for the victory and feels that he has all the possibilities to do so. Mellors has given instructions not to try too hard but to take advantage of the vast experience and be in the podium battle.

http://saloracing.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/12Proton1.jpg

[N.O.T]

So Loeb in a factory built car will be challenging guys in privately run cars.
Why isn't he using already existing Citroen rallycross cars?

because then you would not have anything to cry about....

and were would be the fun in that ???

[rallyfiend]

So Loeb in a factory built car will be challenging guys in privately run cars.
Why isn't he using already existing Citroen rallycross cars?

Who said it was a factory built car?

It is built by Hansen. You know, the guys who make the privately run rallycross cars.....

[Juha_Koo]

Now it's officially confirmed. Juha Salo will drive Proton S2000 in NORF and additionally also in Wales Rally GB (and before NORF also San Marino IRC). Salo saying that he will only drive for the victory and feels that he has all the possibilities to do so. Mellors has given instructions not to try too hard but to take advantage of the vast experience and be in the podium battle.


Whoops, sorry - small correction. IRC San Marino is a seperate issue from this Proton project. San Marino is a prize from Pirelli due to winning FRC last season. Car isn't 100% sure yet, most propably Ford though.

[dimviii]

But after all, Loeb isn't doing anything bad with it I think?


not at all tommeke imho.There is red bull beside this,Loeb maximum 1 year more,after circuit with his team which is backed up by red bull playstation,will you say no to your personal patron?Only a stupid would say no.

[michpetter]

Who said it was a factory built car?

It is built by Hansen. You know, the guys who make the privately run rallycross cars.....


http://www.citroen-wrc.com/en/2012/news/wrc-news/2978/sebastien-loeb-looks-xl-la/
"To maximise its chances of winning, Citroën Racing has developed a very special DS3 called XL, as in X Games and Loeb! Based on a car built by Hansen Motorsport, the seven-time World Rally Championship-winning team has introduced a healthy dose of Créative Technologie by making a series of modifications."

So can we except this car for customers??

[rallyfiend]

"To maximise its chances of winning, Citroën Racing has developed a very special DS3 called XL, as in X Games and Loeb! Based on a car built by Hansen Motorsport, the seven-time World Rally Championship-winning team has introduced a healthy dose of Créative Technologie by making a series of modifications."

So can we except this car for customers??

The number 1 modification no doubt being the addition of the Number 1 driver.

[rallyfiend]

From the WMSC today:

- Same 13 events in 2013 as this year save for Australia instead of NZ
- holding statement on the future Promoter.

Still all very lacking in real direction from the supposed governing body.

[N.O.T]

So can we except this car for customers??

No

[EightGear]

From the FIA press release:

"Following the call for Expression of Interest launched earlier this year to promote the WRC, and the assessment of the numerous bids received, a shortlist of candidates has been established. Final discussions with those candidates are currently being conducted with a view to establishing the best possible platform for the promotion of the FIA World Rally Championship. A final recommendation will be presented to the World Motor Sport Council in September at the latest."

World Motor Sport Council (http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/pressreleases/wmsc/2012/Pages/WorldMotorSportCouncil.aspx)


Finally something positive.

[N.O.T]

3 months to evaluate the proposals... they are going (hopefully) to have a tv deal for the last 4 events of the season...

once a nobody always a nobody... i would not be surprised if the next member of the WRC commission is Wilson JR.

[EightGear]

I already considered this season 'lost.' I'd rather see the FIA making a good decision about it so we can start 2013 from scratch with a proper promotor.

[Gregor-y]

No Gherid, NOT this. Those eyes are just looking a whatever spectacle that is placed in front of them., then zap the channel changer and surf more Made-for-TV crap, maybe Cops or American Idle (MY spelling)...As "promotion" became touted by newcomber/parasites in the sport here, events and participation has halved and costs gone up 300 to 400%....so all those supposed "new eyes" have not brought any tangible benefits to anybody I know in the sport.
I hear this from a number of old campaigners in the US, and like rally in the US twenty years ago, it's all about them and only them. Which considering the lack of publicity and spectators used to be true. A lot of the cost for events can be traced to insurance and regulations that affect even dirt-circle racers today. No motorsport is cheap - at least how I define cheap - except maybe TSD and drag racing (legal or not), and then it's your own fault if you spend too much or make the wrong bet.

Talk to event organizers at the local level, hotel and businesses owners, and (dare I say it) Rally America staff (who are also campaigners that used to crash around alone in the woods) and you'll hear a different story. There are a lot more people at rallies these days, which results in more business, and more interest by local government to host events despite the protests of the odd postal delivery driver or recluse living in the wilderness. This is needed because many parks are beginning to restrict access based on the damage rallies cause to roads as well as various environmental concerns with emissions and spills. Getting several municipalities to close roads, detail extra police and emergency staff requires a significant economic argument that a handful of drivers and their support crews alone can't make.

Granted there can still be problems such as when Rally America ended their season early cutting well established events out of the calendar and resulting in Colorado being cancelled and other long-running rallies not being part of the championship. I'm not saying it's perfect or that the current level of interest will last forever. But for now rally is much bigger than it was and it's been good for a lot of people.

I just realized when I say twenty years ago I probably should be saying thirty. I'm getting older myself.

[Allyc85]

I already considered this season 'lost.' I'd rather see the FIA making a good decision about it so we can start 2013 from scratch with a proper promotor.

While agree they have to find the right person, they need to give the teams and events time to be able to sell themselves to potential investors before the next season.

[Lousada]

"To maximise its chances of winning, Citroën Racing has developed a very special DS3 called XL, as in X Games and Loeb! Based on a car built by Hansen Motorsport, the seven-time World Rally Championship-winning team has introduced a healthy dose of Créative Technologie by making a series of modifications."

So can we except this car for customers??


“This is a wonderful thing for us to be doing,” said team boss Kenneth Hansen. “Citroën Racing asked us to do the car and run it for Sebastien at the X Games. I had thought that there was nothing for us in America this year but this chance is fantastic. It’s been a lot of work because the time schedule for getting a car their meant that we had to send the car that Timur has raced and at the same time start to build up a new car so that Timur can continue to race and do the events in Norway and Sweden, we are nearly finished that now so everything looks good
Sebastien Loeb in X Games Rallycross | RallycrossWorld.com (http://www.rallycrossworld.com/2012/06/15/sebastien-loeb-in-x-games-rallycross/)

[rallyfiend]

3 months to evaluate the proposals... they are going (hopefully) to have a tv deal for the last 4 events of the season...

once a nobody always a nobody... i would not be surprised if the next member of the WRC commission is Wilson JR.

The expression of interest process was designed to find someone to take over for 2013 - nothing to do with this year.

The FIA were going to deal with 2012 in terms of TV, and paying for the timing and tracking etc.

[Maxi]

video of Loeb accepting the challenge
Rally Car Introduction - Sébastien Loeb X-Games 2012 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0hkRY4K54w&feature=g-u-u)

[N.O.T]

the video proves that the whole thing was staged long before the challenge was issued....

well done red bull

[Doon]

Who cares if it was staged? Loeb is just going to show the people of the USA that he is amazing, he should have worldwide recognition for his achievements! The GRC is pretty boring, but with Gronholm hammering everyone, it shows the level that WRC drivers are at. It will probably be a battle between Loeb and Gronholm......and as rally fans who doesn't want to see that!?!! It's all a bit of fun for them both really, but Citroen need a decent car because from what i've seen in Rallycross there are massive differences in the cars. Are the rules fairly relaxed?

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

Well, it will be following the typical rally cross format, as the x games is acting as a round for the GRC, if I'm not mistaken. The car should be great coming from Hansen. Excited that the US audience is getting some loeb exposure. Should be an entertaining event, if anything.

[Franky]

the video proves that the whole thing was staged long before the challenge was issued....

well done red bull

It's PR, where everything is staged.

[Red bull]

"GarethRoberts, 24 years old codriver of Craig Breen, has died after suffering majorinjuries during the accident at SS 8."

[GigiGalliNo1]

On the stage... this is horrible...

[6789]

Very sad news. Hope Craig is ok.

[Maui J.]

Terrible news. Condolences to family, friends and fellow competitors.

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

What?!....horrible.....damn.....

He, his family and loved ones will be in my prayers.

[Allyc85]

Very sad news. Hope Craig is ok.

He is reported to be unhurt.

Craig Breen's co-driver Gareth Roberts dies in Targa Florio crash - IRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100411)

[bassist]

Another RIP in the world of Rallying over the past weeks! Such a sad loss , Condolences to his family, freinds and the Rallying Community, especially Craig.

[A FONDO]

Just six days ago Kilian Duffy was literally an inch away from the same. Something must finally be done from FIA. Its not so difficult to reinforce the cockpit with light and thin penetration-proof material. Neither so expensive, todays rally cars prices are speculative anyway.

[Mirek]

Just six days ago Kilian Duffy was literally an inch away from the same. Something must finally be done from FIA. Its not so difficult to reinforce the cockpit with light and thin penetration-proof material. Neither so expensive, todays rally cars prices are speculative anyway.

Sorry there is no material on Earth which can resist that without being several hundred kilograms heavy. The problem is outdated construction of some railguards (especially ending) and their age/maintenance. But to change millions of kilometers of them all over the world is just impossible...

[Barreis]

What about carbon?

[Mirek]

What about carbon?

Unfortunately an S2000 car at 100 km/h has 3x more kinetic energy than an armor piercing 30 mm round from BMP-2 or almost 7x more kinetic energy than a round from Apache helicopter cannon. Few millimeters of carbon is like a paper for a railguard penetrating by the sharp end. I saw even a V8 engine block penetrated by them.

The only solution is changing railguards to newer types with easy deforming soft ends or with ends going to the ground.

[Rallyper]

The only solution is to stop rallystages with those guards on them. Very simple.

[N.O.T]

The only solution is to stop rallystages with those guards on them. Very simple.

I think more fatal accidents come from trees....shall we ban those as well...

the simpliest solution is to accept that Rallying is a dangerous sport....

[janvanvurpa]

It's PR, where everything is staged.


As is everything else in the eX Gamez.

Too bad about the simplistic, boring, venue---driving in a parking lot basically.

[janvanvurpa]

Sorry there is no material on Earth which can resist that without being several hundred kilograms heavy. The problem is outdated construction of some railguards (especially ending) and their age/maintenance. But to change millions of kilometers of them all over the world is just impossible...


Sorry but isn't one thing screamingly evident in so many fatal crashes?

It SEEMS they all on asfalto...

And I worry people getting killed on asfalto will lead to problems for everybody including us here who only do gravel.

[bluuford]

The only solution is to stop rallystages with those guards on them. Very simple.

That is nearly impossible. I have seen the solution that such rail guard endings are isolated by using hayballs. Only on the most dangerous places (e.g. outside the corners). It is the cheapest solution and absorbs and bounches the car away very effectively. But does add some cost to the rally organization indeed.

[bretddog]

Unfortunately an S2000 car at 100 km/h has 3x more kinetic energy than an armor piercing 30 mm round from BMP-2 or almost 7x more kinetic energy than a round from Apache helicopter cannon. Few millimeters of carbon is like a paper for a railguard penetrating by the sharp end. I saw even a V8 engine block penetrated by them.
Sad news...

I wouldn't say the kinetic energy of the car is relevant. The force you need to overturn is that required to buckle or better divert the railguard. I would think it's possible to accommodate reasonable protection for limited areas like wheel arches without adding hundreds of kg.

[Rallyper]

I think more fatal accidents come from trees....shall we ban those as well...

the simpliest solution is to accept that Rallying is a dangerous sport....

I don´t think your comment is relevant. Trees you can be seen and judge where they are more easy. Those fences can turn up where you don´t wait to see them. They can also be hided in grass and be missjudged by the driver not being at the place you put your car. I think these two accidents tells the seroius matter it is with those guards or fences...

But still as you say rallying is a dangerous sport.

[Mirek]

Sad news...

I wouldn't say the kinetic energy of the car is relevant. The force you need to overturn is that required to buckle or better divert the railguard. I would think it's possible to accommodate reasonable protection for limited areas like wheel arches without adding hundreds of kg.

Try to think about it more. How would You like to do that in reality? I saw an X5 BMW penetrated all along it's length through V8 cylinder block. You would need something like a snow-plough to make the car safe against such penetration. Here the problem unfortunately is in the type of rails, very little can be done with cars. Maybe they will add some anti-penetration kevlar layers on the motor wall in the future but the real income will be more or less only psychological I'm afraid.

[N.O.T]

I don´t think your comment is relevant. Trees you can be seen and judge where they are more easy. Those fences can turn up where you don´t wait to see them. They can also be hided in grass and be missjudged by the driver not being at the place you put your car. I think these two accidents tells the seroius matter it is with those guards or fences...

But still as you say rallying is a dangerous sport.

to ban a stage because of a dangerous componet i think it is not right....because there is not a single safe stage in the world if you go by this logic.

Maybe a solution would be the organisers to spot those unecessary hazards and fix them before the stage is run...

but then again at such speeds there are very few things that are not dangerous...so the solution is to make the cars as safe as possible and then count on luck... we had 2 serious accidents in a 3 year span with those guard rails... now count how many accidents with serious injuries we had due to Concrete walls, trees in that time ects and you can see my point.

A tragedy like this, especially when a person at the peak of his youth is involved, cannot be expreesed by any words invented by men so far...

[Plan9]

RIP Gareth. I wonder if Craig will withdraw from motorsport as a result.

[Rallyper]

to ban a stage because of a dangerous componet i think it is not right....because there is not a single safe stage in the world if you go by this logic.

Maybe a solution would be the organisers to spot those unecessary hazards and fix them before the stage is run...

but then again at such speeds there are very few things that are not dangerous...so the solution is to make the cars as safe as possible and then count on luck... we had 2 serious accidents in a 3 year span with those guard rails... now count how many accidents with serious injuries we had due to Concrete walls, trees in that time ects and you can see my point.

A tragedy like this, especially when a person at the peak of his youth is involved, cannot be expreesed by any words invented by men so far...

It´s still a huge hazard having iron bars alongside the road pointing in the direction against running cars in height just where drivers are placed. I didn´t say or mean ban the whole stages, just places or parts of stages that having such fences. Myabe the amount of possible stages will decrease but in order to put safety first it would be a good way to handle safety in especially tarmac rallies.

[whosyo]

R.I.P Gareth...

I think there's no obvious solution like this
Rally is one of the most dangerous class of motorsport and, these things are happened some times..

[N.O.T]

It´s still a huge hazard having iron bars alongside the road pointing in the direction against running cars in height just where drivers are placed. I didn´t say or mean ban the whole stages, just places or parts of stages that having such fences. Myabe the amount of possible stages will decrease but in order to put safety first it would be a good way to handle safety in especially tarmac rallies.

why you consider a guard rail more dangerous than those trees in rallies on the outside of 6th gear bends ??

If you put safety first you cannot have any kind of motorsport.

[Allar]

It´s still a huge hazard having iron bars alongside the road pointing in the direction against running cars in height just where drivers are placed. I didn´t say or mean ban the whole stages, just places or parts of stages that having such fences. Myabe the amount of possible stages will decrease but in order to put safety first it would be a good way to handle safety in especially tarmac rallies.
Those rails are there to make road safer, but as i know there aint a thing that cant kill u if u are just unlucky. But yes those old guard rails look dangerus when the ends are not burried.

[Rallyper]

why you consider a guard rail more dangerous than those trees in rallies on the outside of 6th gear bends ??

If you put safety first you cannot have any kind of motorsport.

But I´m not measuring different hazards. Only saying my opinion on those guard rails. I think rallying is not "one of the most dangerous motorsports". Rallying is relativily unharmful compared to many other motorsports.

[N.O.T]

But I´m not measuring different hazards. Only saying my opinion on those guard rails. I think rallying is not "one of the most dangerous motorsports". Rallying is relativily unharmful compared to many other motorsports.

rallying not dangerous compared to other motorsports ??

Only Bike road racing is more dangerous...

[GigiGalliNo1]

You risk your life everyday whether be walking to work, or driving to the shop. You risk it during your work and in the shower. Things like this happen and you can't stop it. Safety first yes, but you can't make everything safe. If you were in a Bubble, well it could get poked by something sharp! I send my regards to Craig and Gareth's family and friends. I don't think Craig should stop. I know it would be difficult to go on... but I think he should. But then again I'm not in the situation to know physiologically how someone is like Markko Martin was and now in this case Craig.

[Rallyper]

rallying not dangerous compared to other motorsports ??

Only Bike road racing is more dangerous...

Sorry, don´t agree at all. Speaking of drivers. For the public maybe more dangerous... But still... Don´t know which rallies you attend, but please look at all crashvideos for example from Finland.. Many trees there are.

[GigiGalliNo1]

So, log off all the trees next to the roads, then get rid of the stumps. Easy and Safe.


You can't make ANY sport SAFE!

[Barreis]

F1 is very good at the moment about safety.

[Rallyper]

So, log off all the trees next to the roads, then get rid of the stumps. Easy and Safe.


You can't make ANY sport SAFE!

But never stop making it safer.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Yes, true Rallyper

[Franky]

You can't make ANY sport SAFE!

Correction, you can't make life safe.

[rallye-vid]

Stupid EU discuss about how yellow the bananas or how green the cucumber have to be, but doesn't seem to be interested in safe roads. Well done!