[WRC] News & rumours (part II)

[mousti]

I thought Mixed surface wasn't allowed anymore by Fia. Mixed surface like in Spain with 1 leg in gravel 2 legs on asphalt. Stagel like Argentina with some asphalt in it were still allowed??

[grugsticles]

So, if Petter -> Ford, Mikko -> Citreon, Ogier -> VW...

Leob... 9th straight drivers title?

[mousti]

Loeb has signed for 2 years because he knows he'll be a ten time WRC champion :D a nice number to retire ^^

[Zeakiwi]

So, if Petter -> Ford, Mikko -> Citreon, Ogier -> VW...

Leob... 9th straight drivers title?

Did Gronholm ever get round to buying Seb Loeb another mountain bike ?

[HarriK]

2 days Pirelli Shoot is over in UK. Rumours tell that Jukka Korhonen win "reaction part" of the shoot out. They also used Fabia R2 in that competition. Same car is used in next year Pirelly Star Driver season.
Winner of this year competition will be announced in Saturday. And only winner of the whole competition, not the single part's winners.

[Viking]

At least one Norwegian has an contract with M-Sport in 2012 :)

Glory for Røkland as Norwegian wins the 2011 FST International Shootout (http://www.m-sport.co.uk/index.php/news/887-glory-for-rokland-as-norwegian-wins-the-2011-fst-international-shootout)

[GigiGalliNo1]

What championship is the Pirelli comp done in?

[HarriK]

British Rally championship.

[spiderem]

Did Gronholm ever get round to buying Seb Loeb another mountain bike ?

It was a motocross accident and not a mountain bike...

[spiderem]

So if I summarize :
Loeb - Hirvonen : Citroen WRT
Solberg P - Odsterg : Ford Norwegian army
Latvala - Tanak : Ford WRT
Ogier - Mikkelsen : VW WRT

will VW make a big surprise and start running in 2012 in some rally, to have a car ready to challenge for world title (driver and manuf) for 2013?

Ogier is starving for victory, i don't really see him playing with S2000 all next year...

[RS]

Tanak is obviously very talented but could he really score more points that Petter in his first full season in a WRCar? Surely would make more sense to have Petter in the main team and Tanak in the B-Team for year one?

[spiderem]

I was just reading the post before and the name of tanak was mentioned few times.
I think it's far too early and too risky for ford to have tanak as a factory driver... he showed good pace in gb for sure, but follow the entire season, with asphalt rally... not sure ford will get manufacture crown ever again!
Peter seems to be a very nice guy, and he still has the pace, but he starts to be old, and I guess big boss of ford want to see the future in their recruitment / investment...
would be nice for odstberg though to have a mentor, as I think he could be a reliable fast factory driver in 2013...
Still the big questions, what ogier will do next year???

[bluuford]

I thought Mixed surface wasn't allowed anymore by Fia. Mixed surface like in Spain with 1 leg in gravel 2 legs on asphalt. Stagel like Argentina with some asphalt in it were still allowed??

Mixed surface on asphalt rally is not allowed in the middle of the day. Tyre manufacturer asked not to put gravel sections in the middle of the pure tarmac sections. Due to safety reasons and asphalt tyre durability on gravel (like it was in France).
Asphalt sections in gravel rallyes are still allowed.

[focus206]

WRC doesn't need to be anything just because ERC or IRC is different. That is irrelevant. WRC must be what is worth its title.

WRC doesn't need more gravel than asphalt just to be different from ERC and IRC, but because that format, according to me, would be perfect for WRC. That's why I don't want too many asphalt events, expecially all in a row.
I'd like to see IRC and ERC with more gravel also. But I don't know what other rallyfans think about this.

[Rallyper]

So if I summarize :
Loeb - Hirvonen : Citroen WRT
Solberg P - Odsterg : Ford Norwegian army
Latvala - Tanak : Ford WRT
Ogier - Mikkelsen : VW WRT

will VW make a big surprise and start running in 2012 in some rally, to have a car ready to challenge for world title (driver and manuf) for 2013?

Ogier is starving for victory, i don't really see him playing with S2000 all next year...

Why not a couple of swedes instead of Tanak. If the money is there for let´s say PG or Flodin(?) or why not Sandell - how should MW react on that?

[Mirek]

Why not a couple of swedes instead of Tanak.

Why yes?

[bluuford]

You know that Malcolm wants only those guys to drive his car who speak fluently Finnish or whose language sounds a bit like Finnish language (like Estonian language);-P It has been the case since 2006 already!

[Mintexmemory]

Why not a couple of swedes instead of Tanak. If the money is there for let´s say PG or Flodin(?) or why not Sandell - how should MW react on that?

Pleasant chaps all of them, but having seen all of them and Ott at first hand I have to say he is already faster than them (PWRC last year v Flodin. S2000 v Sandell and WRC v PG) and capable of better results already. He can only get better, only someone with more cash can hold him back, and not for very long I expect.

[RS]

You know that Malcolm wants only those guys to drive his car who speak fluently Finnish or whose language sounds a bit like Finnish language (like Estonian language);-P It has been the case since 2006 already!

Yes, Malcolm does have a bit of a Finn-Fetish even if the "if you want to win you need a Finn" phrase is looking a little out of date these days.

Having said that I really hope Hanninen gets a chance somewhere, and soon. For me he has more potential than Hirvonen and he did beat Tanak to the sWRC title this year.

[Bobcat]

So Tanak won’t be a factory driver next year.

[pettersolberg29]

Andreas Mikkelsen has all but signed for VW according to his team manager. He will compete the IRC and whole SWRC next year, as well as start the testing of the PoloWRC and potentially then becoming an official VW driver in 2013.

Petter is also set to sign for Ford, but not as an official driver but instead to partner Ostberg and Henning in a 2nd team. This leaves a big gap for Ogier or Tanak to fill at Ford. The same article suggests Petter has signed for VW in 2013 but has no plans for 2012 yet.

www.vg.no/sport/motor/artikkel.php?artid=10031715 - Translator (http://www.microsofttranslator.com/BV.aspx?ref=IE8Activity&a=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vg.no%2Fsport%2Fmotor%2Fartikke l.php%3Fartid%3D10031715)

[bretddog]

Article says Mikkelsen's contract is signed. Further it says they expect to run the Polo R WRC in some rallies in 2012, but these plans are not complete and not been signed.

[Rallyper]

Pleasant chaps all of them, but having seen all of them and Ott at first hand I have to say he is already faster than them (PWRC last year v Flodin. S2000 v Sandell and WRC v PG) and capable of better results already. He can only get better, only someone with more cash can hold him back, and not for very long I expect.

Maybe you´re right about Tanak is faster. But having said that after maybe one time competition compared (you could give me a hint which rallies?) you have to deal with other skills needed. For example experience. I think Tanak should be given time to get used to the WRC car, maybe in a second team at Ford.

But of course he will be cheap. But even more cheaper for MW will be a driver who pays him a lot of money for 2nd seat in factory team.

[alleskids]

So far, as the rumours and facts are gathered together we have in WRC 2012:
TOTAL CITROEN WRT: Loeb / Hirvonen
BP FORD WRT : Latvala / Tanak (?)
? MINI : Sordo / Meeke
VW testing: Ogier / Mikkelsen / ? Hanninen - ? Neuville

Custumers Citroen
BARWA : Al Attiyah (offficial as third works car)
VAN MERKSTEIJN: Peter jr / Peter sn on selected rounds
ALM RUSSIA : Novitsky (or in Ford)

Customers Ford
FERM : Dennis Kuipers / Rene Kuipers on selected rounds
FORD TEAM NORWAY ARMY: P Solberg / H Solberg / Ostberg
JIPOCAR : Prokop
MONSTER : Block (on selected rounds, 6?)

SWRC 2012:
Sebastien Ogier (Skoda)
Andreas Mikkelsen (Skoda)
Craig Breen (Ford)

[Viking]

Article says Mikkelsen's contract is signed. Further it says they expect to run the Polo R WRC in some rallies in 2012, but these plans are not complete and not been signed.

In fact it says that he has signed for Volkswagen Group United Kingdom, as i understand driving an Skoda in IRC and SWRC...

[GigiGalliNo1]

So the verdict is on Mikkelssen?

[Micke_VOC]

18 drivers have been chosen for the 2012 FIA Institute Young Driver Excellence Academy.
A couple rallydrivers among them.
Craig Breen, 21, Ireland
Brendan Reeves, 23, Australia
Pontus Tidemand, 20, Sweden
Timo van der Marel, 22, Holland
Sepp Wiegand, 20, Germany

18.11.2011 | Drivers Chosen for 2012 FIA Institute Academy (http://www.fiainstitute.com/news/Pages/article-99999999.aspx)

[MJW]

[quote="alleskids"]
Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone.

[focus206]

Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone.

I think "army" is metaphorical, to say there could be 3 Norwegian drivers in one team :D

[focus206]

So far, as the rumours and facts are gathered together we have in WRC 2012:
TOTAL CITROEN WRT: Loeb / Hirvonen
BP FORD WRT : Latvala / Tanak (?)
? MINI : Sordo / Meeke
VW testing: Ogier / Mikkelsen / ? Hanninen - ? Neuville

Custumers Citroen
BARWA : Al Attiyah (offficial as third works car)
VAN MERKSTEIJN: Peter jr / Peter sn on selected rounds
ALM RUSSIA : Novitsky (or in Ford)

Customers Ford
FERM : Dennis Kuipers / Rene Kuipers on selected rounds
FORD TEAM NORWAY ARMY: P Solberg / H Solberg / Ostberg
JIPOCAR : Prokop
MONSTER : Block (on selected rounds, 6?)

SWRC 2012:
Sebastien Ogier (Skoda)
Andreas Mikkelsen (Skoda)
Craig Breen (Ford)

I think Ketomaa should have a 6 event program with a private Fiesta...

[pettersolberg29]

SWRC 2012:
Sebastien Ogier (Skoda)
Andreas Mikkelsen (Skoda)
Craig Breen (Ford)

There is absolutely no chance that Ogier will only do the SWRC in 2012. If need be he'd have a customer Ford - with his current improving trajectory he cannot afford a year out to let Mikko and JML get comfy before Loeb retires.

[Viking]

I think "army" is metaphorical, to say there could be 3 Norwegian drivers in one team :D

That was what i was thinking also.. but there could be something cooking...

Photos de Anders Grøndal | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150961805395235&set=t.1457298186&type=1&theater)

[alleskids]

Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone.

some one reported that the Norwegian army wanted to sponor Team Solberg. but maybe it was a inside Norwegian joke :LOL:

[pettersolberg29]

As far as I know the 'army' isn't a metaphorical thing - there are actually talks between Henning, Mads and the Norwegian Army (which Petter is also probably involved in now too). What these talks are about is anybody's guess - maybe its simply about the Solberg Extreme Motorshow??

[Mirek]

Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone.

I think that in Netherlands Eric Bolhaar is sponsored by Dutch army.

[MartijnS]

True, the Ministry of Defence has a budget in order to get publicity and aiming on getting new people in the army :) They do it by sponsoring the rallyteam.

[skarderud]

its two possibilities: last year solberg brothers had a "tank race" at solberg extreme show.
the other is a sponsorshipdeal with the army, the army uses the boys and cars in promo, advertising, shows and so on. different athletes in norway has deals with the army, but they normal have a background in the army.

[wildsir]

There is absolutely no chance that Ogier will only do the SWRC in 2012. If need be he'd have a customer Ford - with his current improving trajectory he cannot afford a year out to let Mikko and JML get comfy before Loeb retires.
the money he would be getting from VW, he could pay for the season himself.

[Juha_Koo]

True, the Ministry of Defence has a budget in order to get publicity and aiming on getting new people in the army :) They do it by sponsoring the rallyteam.

Interesting... :) I've thought many times to ask about the car because I always wondered is the driver a civil servant or something in the government. Mystery solved.

[GigiGalliNo1]

http://m.nrk.no/m/sport/artikkel.jsp?art_id=17882184&a=1.7882184&f=/sport/motorsport/rally-vm/&h=www.nrk.no

[pettersolberg29]

the money he would be getting from VW, he could pay for the season himself.

True, but I don't know how happy VW would be with that arrangement as Ogier would form a bond with Ford, then leap straight to VW. I see Ogier going to Ford for good, then JML leaving in 2013 to join VW with Mikkelsen.

[Bobcat]

BP FORD WRT : Latvala / Tanak (?)I can predict that Tanak won’t be a Ford factory driver next year.

[wildsir]

Will Latvala?

[Allyc85]

Will Latvala?

Yes he had said he is committed to m-sport. I guess after all the cars he damaged there could be some loyalty/faith to be paid back ;)

I also dont think Tanak will be in a factory Ford next year. Id say there is more chance of it being Petter Solberg or Ostberg if im honest.

[Coach 2]

Latvala has a contract for 2012.
But what will happen if Ford doesn't support M-Sport in 2012.

Money talks, or is going to speak.
Ogier? Probably not. Then who.

[Allyc85]

Sorry I should have said that according to Motorsport News that JML has said he will stick with M-sport, even if Ford do pull their funding :)

[Jeppe]

Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone.

And in TopFuel and NASCAR there is one veeery big one in U.S called ´U.S. Army Racing´ team Army Racing | GoArmy.com (http://www.goarmy.com/army-racing.html)

[Bobcat]

Will Latvala?Let's hope Ford continues. ;)

[Coach 2]

Same here, what I meant to say, Latvala is certain he has a contract for 2012.
But what will happen to seat No. 2

[driveace]

So that looks like Andreas has a deal with VW and the Polo

[tfp]

So that looks like Andreas has a deal with VW and the Polo

Ogier and mikkelson? What about hanninen?

[Wasted Talent]

I can predict that Tanak won’t be a Ford factory driver next year.

x2

WT

[Coach 2]

Do not be too sure.

[Nornbugger]

Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone.


they hope to attack the stages :D

[noel157]

Only problem-if the car goes off the stage into the bushes nobody will find the car................. :)

[6789]

So that looks like Andreas has a deal with VW and the Polo

iRally says Andreas will do IRC, SWRC and some Polo testing. They also mention that he could do some events in a Polo!

[noel157]

iRally says Andreas will do IRC, SWRC and some Polo testing. They also mention that he could do some events in a Polo!

Mikkelsen blir VM-fører - VG Nett om Motorsport (http://www.vg.no/sport/motor/artikkel.php?artid=10031715)

[noel157]

I can predict that Tanak won’t be a Ford factory driver next year.

True.

[sollitt]

Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone. I seem to recall that in the 70's the British Army had a team running in local rallying, perhaps BRC, with Morris/Austin 1800's ... Land Crabs as they were affectionately called.

[noel157]

I seem to recall that in the 70's the British Army had a team running in local rallying, perhaps BRC, with Morris/Austin 1800's ... Land Crabs as they were affectionately called.

Nothing wrong with your memory:

http://i628.photobucket.com/albums/uu1/cherrypickerpao/SKFStages.jpg

[Andre Oliveira]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-74XhqvGQKp8/TsZxLxOtRFI/AAAAAAAACM8/21TCSkXYYv0/s1600/390.jpg

Honda Jazz S2000 for Australian Championship... Possible Honda enter in WRC???

http://rally-mania.blogspot.com/2011/11/honda-desenvolve-o-jazz-para-ralis.html

[noel157]

No 4WD I presume? Looks good.

[Andre Oliveira]

S2000 is 4WD

[noel157]

But the car is only 2WD. There is a G2 section (2WD) in the Aus Rally Championship.

[grugsticles]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-74XhqvGQKp8/TsZxLxOtRFI/AAAAAAAACM8/21TCSkXYYv0/s1600/390.jpg

Honda Jazz S2000 for Australian Championship... Possible Honda enter in WRC???

Rally Mania: Honda desenvolve o Jazz para ralis! (http://rally-mania.blogspot.com/2011/11/honda-desenvolve-o-jazz-para-ralis.html)

I find that strange. I was under the impression that the ARC was heading towards a FWD 1600 format.

[Andre Oliveira]

The Fastest Jazz In The World? (http://www.rally.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1382:the-fastest-jazz-in-the-world)

So, S2000 2WD??? Very strange...

[noel157]

Could be the start of something big?

[Plan9]

Can someone help me here as I can't understand how an army can sponsor a rally team? I also understand that in US rallying the Air Force sponsors someone.

How does the oil company from a socialist republic sponsor and F1 team?

On the 2012 driver line up:
VW should have at least 5 drivers: Mikkelsen, hanninen, German, Customer, a solberg seems unlikely at this stage. Who will be number 1 here?
Mini will have customers as well- no idea how many

[spiderem]

So any news on Ford next year?
They bought a brand new huge head quarters in the middle of the season, they sure want to use it again next year!!!

[AP-Racing]

Kaur

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/317188_2133047451946_1418833293_31753831_163014791 1_n.jpg

[mousti]

S2000 is not possible because it's death. There can't be a new S2000 model homologated since begin of spring this year.

[rp]

S2000 is not possible because it's death. There can't be a new S2000 model homologated since begin of spring this year.

It is not yet! There is some much S2000 cars available that the competition is very good if the fast drivers can get the budget and compete in the SWRC or in the IRC.

Still couple of years left, but of course it will have an effect on the S2000, when the new models are banned...

[Mirek]

S2000 is not possible because it's death. There can't be a new S2000 model homologated since begin of spring this year.

What did You reply to? :)

Anyway there will be new upgrades for Fabia S2000 in January. I heard about reasonably better engine (still 2.0) and several other changes.

[HaCo]

Well in Australia they are going there own way, 2WD only allowed, no FIA homologation needed.

There have been great projects in Australia in the past 5 years: the Ford FIesta S2000, the Toyota Corolla and Auris and Honda has been commited before with Guy Wilks entering an R3 Civic.

If more projects like this will appear, it will be great, it's only Nov so still a lot is possible. If I have understood right, anyone can build something 2WD and run it, this is the first example.

http://www.rally.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1382:the-fastest-jazz-in-the-world
http://www.rally.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1383:honda-ups-its-commitment-to-the-bosch-arc-with-to-car-jazz-team-for-season-2012&catid=1:latest-news&Itemid=53

The G2 regulations can be found here http://www.rally.com.au/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=86&Itemid=100

[Mirek]

Honda did last two seasons with official entry too (driver was Eli Ewans) ;)

[mousti]

What did You reply to? :)

Anyway there will be new upgrades for Fabia S2000 in January. I heard about reasonably better engine (still 2.0) and several other changes.
Replied to the member who said they're maybe making a new Honda S2000 version.

[Mirek]

Aha, somehow I missed previous page :D

Yes, this car is 2WD Kit Car with engine from Civic R3 I think.

[pucky54]

Almost like an old Formula 2 Kit Car :)

[6789]

For front wheel drive they sound pretty good and the Honda Civic Type R in the ARC this year was actually pretty fast!

[HaCo]

Also look at allowed engine capacity and minimum weight:
Capacity FWD RWD
Up to 1000cc 760kg 720kg
1001cc to 1150cc 830kg 790kg
1151cc to 1400cc 880kg 840kg
1401cc to 1800cc 970kg 920kg
1801cc to 2000cc 1050kg 1000kg
2001cc to 2500cc 1120kg 1080kg
2501cc to 3000cc 1170kg 1140kg
3001cc to 3500cc 1260kg 1230kg
3501cc to 4000cc 1320kg 1310kg
4001cc to 4500cc 1400kg 1400kg
4501cc to 5100cc 1500kg 1500kg
Over 5100cc 1590kg 1590kg

I hope we will see some GT's too there!

You are also allowed to make a Subaru and Mitsu, or original S2000 cars RWD or FWD. Don't know how realistic it is to make a Mitsu RWD, but maybe it would look good! :D

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Is Tanak gonna be the new Ford driver with JML in 2012 ?

He's driving the other Fiesta WRC in the Rallye Du Var ...

[dimviii]

Is Tanak gonna be the new Ford driver with JML in 2012 ?

He'a driving the other Fiesta WRC in the Rallye Du Var ...

i d say he has the most possibilities till now imho

[Francis44]

If Ford is commiting themselves to the championship for 2 or 3 years more Tanak is a wise choice, if not, then Im not sure.

[mousti]

Al Attiyah's contract with Qatar Sponsoring for Citroen will be for minimal 3 years long.

[noel157]

Citroen or PH Sport will run the cars?
Nasser will do Dakar and Olympics in 2012.

[pettersolberg29]

I'm not sure if this was already known, but Petter will definitely not be with Citroen again in 2012.

[Francis44]

I'm not sure if this was already known, but Petter will definitely not be with Citroen again in 2012.

So if we see Petter Solberg again next year he will be in a Ford, question is if as a costumer or an official driver.

[spiderem]

Red Bull is going to support VW,
Qatar will be the next big sponsor for Citroen, Qatar Cirtroen WRT, with a 3rd driver like al khassimi with ford in the past, Nasser...
Nasser has told french journalist that it was signed, but citroen hasn't confirmed yet.
Like usual, Nasser is talking maybe a bit too early... Remember at the beginning of the season, he said that he had signed to be a VW factory driver in WRC in the future seasons!
Hope Petter will find a decent budget to run properly in 2012, he definitely still has the pace...

[Plan9]

I'm not sure if this was already known, but Petter will definitely not be with Citroen again in 2012.
Why? if he doesn't get VW there is not really any other options are there? the customer fords are terrible by comparison to DS3

[noel157]

Why? if he doesn't get VW there is not really any other options are there? the customer fords are terrible by comparison to DS3

He may have no choice?

[noel157]

Anybody Estonian members heard any rumours about Markko Martin driving next year? Doing 10 WRC rounds in a Fiesta. Typical end of season story perhaps.
Perhaps he's being mixed up with his protege Tanak.

[pettersolberg29]

Why? if he doesn't get VW there is not really any other options are there? the customer fords are terrible by comparison to DS3

Not necessarily a customer for another manufacturer though.

[spiderem]

I hope one of the manufacturers will produce a road version of their WRC car...
- 35/45 k€
- 4wd
- 250/300 CV
- And an awesome look!

The focus rs mk2 showed the way, but a bit too civilized for me.
Maybe less power but lighter (no back seat like the megane r26r) and a sequential gear box...

I guess i am just dreaming about my dream car!

[AndyRAC]

Not going to happen - too expensive to produce, and don't sell enough. That was why the WRC-formula came in, instead of the old GpA Homologation specials. I too would love to see them; I remember all the Ford Escort/Sierra RS Cosworths, Lancia Delta Integrales, Toyota Celica GT4's, Nissan Sunny GTi-R, etc

[Barreis]

1 million clicks on this thread!

[Donalduck]

I hope one of the manufacturers will produce a road version of their WRC car...
- 35/45 k€
- 4wd
- 250/300 CV
- And an awesome look!

The focus rs mk2 showed the way, but a bit too civilized for me.
Maybe less power but lighter (no back seat like the megane r26r) and a sequential gear box...

I guess i am just dreaming about my dream car!

Volkswagen does have a Golf R, 4 wheel driven almost 300 hp. i will not be surprised if they com with an Polo R 4wheel drive instead.

[Plan9]

Red Bull is going to support VW,
Qatar will be the next big sponsor for Citroen, Qatar Cirtroen WRT, with a 3rd driver like al khassimi with ford in the past, Nasser...
Nasser has told french journalist that it was signed, but citroen hasn't confirmed yet.
Like usual, Nasser is talking maybe a bit too early... Remember at the beginning of the season, he said that he had signed to be a VW factory driver in WRC in the future seasons!
Hope Petter will find a decent budget to run properly in 2012, he definitely still has the pace...

Can you confirm this about Red Bull??

[spiderem]

Can you confirm this about Red Bull??

Well I can't confirm anything! but red bull has been with VW in rally raid for a long time now, and I don't think they will support 2 major teams in WRC... Knowing that citroen will probably do only 2 more seasons, i think red bull will look at something more permanent... And austrians are much more linked with germans than french!

[spiderem]

Volkswagen does have a Golf R, 4 wheel driven almost 300 hp. i will not be surprised if they com with an Polo R 4wheel drive instead.

Yep but the golf r is for bank people that have no taste in car. It's a good car, but its origin has nothing to do with rallying... it's more circuit.
Would be nice if they come up with a polo r which has some "similarity" with the polo wrc

Because I agree, there are some small car with lots of power and fun to drive : RS3 / M1 etc...
But what would be nice is a road version of a wrc!!! with no backseat so it will be only your best friend or your girlfriend, no bull**** at the back hahaha!

[6789]

Volkswagen does have a Golf R, 4 wheel driven almost 300 hp. i will not be surprised if they com with an Polo R 4wheel drive instead.

My Dads got a Golf Mk6 R, they're an amazing car. I would buy a Polo R ic they bring one out. It's always nice to have a 'road version' of the WRC car

[HarriK]

Jukka Korhonen won Pirelli Shoot Out in UK!

[Allar]

Anybody Estonian members heard any rumours about Markko Martin driving next year? Doing 10 WRC rounds in a Fiesta. Typical end of season story perhaps.
Perhaps he's being mixed up with his protege Tanak.
Where did u hear this? Märtin wont do WRC events, maybe Rally Estonia but thats all.

[mousti]

The Golf R is already being used as Recce car for VW Motorsport

[cali]

Where did u hear this? Märtin wont do WRC events, maybe Rally Estonia but thats all.
Ever heard about sarcasm and twisted humour?

[noel157]

Sarcasm and twisted humour? Uncalled for. I read it on another forum, French or Italian, problem is I can't find it. If I do I shall post a link.
As I hinted, I didn't think there was any truth in it.

[cali]

Yeah, I may have got it wrong but it's still quite twisted humour when people are talking about Markko doing 10 rounds next year

[bluuford]

Yeah, I may have got it wrong but it's still quite twisted humour when people are talking about Markko doing 10 rounds next year

get used to it. These stories are going to circulate as long as Markko is at least 85 years old.

[jbmarcus21]

planetemarcus.com version 2012 is now out !! New logo, new colors, and new update about WRC 2012 season
www.planetemarcus.com (http://www.planetemarcus.com)

enjoy ;)

[N.O.T]

planetemarcus.com version 2012 is now out !! New logo, new colors, and new update about WRC 2012 season
www.planetemarcus.com (http://www.planetemarcus.com)

enjoy ;)

great :) excellent job...i hope we are going to get those very nice google maps this year as well :D

[Plan9]

Well I can't confirm anything! but red bull has been with VW in rally raid for a long time now, and I don't think they will support 2 major teams in WRC... Knowing that citroen will probably do only 2 more seasons, i think red bull will look at something more permanent... And austrians are much more linked with germans than french!

Funny, the Mini drivers are both endorsed by Red Bull. I see the dakar angel for VW and it seems tangible. BMW/Mini does not have that relationship.

To change tack, I am so excited about Mini and VW (2 of my fav companies). I will be glad not to see only red and occasionally blue on the podium.

Of most interest to me is whether or not Haninnen will become a Hirvonen if VW favors their younger drivers (Mikkelsen etc).

[jbmarcus21]

great :) excellent job...i hope we are going to get those very nice google maps this year as well :D

yes ;)

[Mirek]

Funny, the Mini drivers are both endorsed by Red Bull. I see the dakar angel for VW and it seems tangible. BMW/Mini does not have that relationship.

RedBull already support VAG in rallying through Škoda in SWRC.

[spiderem]

Planetemarcus (great site by the way) : Loeb will earn 10m euro / year and Hirvonen 3m euro / year.
I am really curious to know how much Elena gets???
Because he is neighbour with loeb in switzerland and trust me, this place is not cheap! (shumacher is a neighbour as well...)

[Koppomsbo]

Planetemarcus (great site by the way) : Loeb will earn 10m euro / year and Hirvonen 3m euro / year.
I am really curious to know how much Elena gets???
Because he is neighbour with loeb in switzerland and trust me, this place is not cheap! (shumacher is a neighbour as well...)

Dont know what kind of agreement Loeb/Elena has, but in some cases its the driver who pays the codriver.

By the way, where does Loeb and elena live?

[RS]

RedBull already support VAG in rallying through Škoda in SWRC.

VW Fabias have also been carrying "wings for life" logos which is a Red Bull charity.

[vkangas]

Dont know what kind of agreement Loeb/Elena has, but in some cases its the driver who pays the codriver.

By the way, where does Loeb and elena live?
It's usually so that a driver has contract with team and co-driver is working for the driver. When a driver pays his co-driver's salary a common deal is about 10-30 percent of driver's salary. Higher salary in general meaning lower percentage.

[Juha_Koo]

Don't forget that Elena also has his own company All Sports Management.

[spiderem]

Dont know what kind of agreement Loeb/Elena has, but in some cases its the driver who pays the codriver.

By the way, where does Loeb and elena live?

They live in switzerland next to Morges in a small village. If you read his autobiography i think it's written... Can't remember now.

[spiderem]

It's usually so that a driver has contract with team and co-driver is working for the driver. When a driver pays his co-driver's salary a common deal is about 10-30 percent of driver's salary. Higher salary in general meaning lower percentage.

So if elena gets 30% of loeb's wages, that means he earns as much as Hirvonen? lol.

[6789]

I think Elena is underpaid if its between 10% and 30%!

[mousti]

that's between 1 million and 3 million! That's not underpaid. In fighting it's the same trainer gets 30 % but mostly if they get at the top and they 300k bucks a fight or even more then it gets a bit lesser.

[BleAivano]

Dont know what kind of agreement Loeb/Elena has, but in some cases its the driver who pays the codriver.

By the way, where does Loeb and elena live?

near Lusanne, Switzerland according to:

Site officiel de Sébastien Loeb - Sébastien (http://www.sebastienloeb.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=20&Itemid=35)

[TMorel]

mousti,
but in boxing the trainer doesn't have to do a few rounds taking the odd jab if his boxer fails to defend, in rallying if Seb throws it into the scenary then he's throwing Daniel too! I think he deserves his percentage !

[mousti]

I don't say he deserves it but 3 million is too less?? A trainer makes the fighter, do you think that GSP would be the champion without his trainer? A trainer in fighting is a lot worth, they take punches too in sparring.

[mm1]

Why are you discusing 3 mil`s or % if you don`t know how much Elena is earning, these are just speculation.

[N.O.T]

since when co-drivers are trainers ????

[mousti]

It's a comparison both are kinda the right hand of the peformer

[N.O.T]

It's a comparison both are kinda the right hand of the peformer

LOL....

the co-driver is about the 10-20% of the speed....nothing more.

[Nornbugger]

I think Elena is underpaid if its between 10% and 30%!

Loeb would be more likely to be WRC champ without Elena that the other way round, I have huge respect for codrivers, but when Petter Solberg changed codrivers it didnt slow him on the stages

[Juha_Koo]

LOL....

the co-driver is about the 10-20% of the speed....nothing more.

LOL x 1000, I haven't laughed this hard in months! :D

[White Sauron]

LOL x 1000, I haven't laughed this hard in months! :D

He has a point though, but there's one condition.
When a driver goes "by ears" (virtually by his co-driver's reading notes), he needs to completely trust him, and thus the co-driver's contribution is very high (at least 50% of total driver-co-driver crew work). You know the saying: when the driver makes a mistake, the crew loses seconds, when the co-driver makes a mistake, the crew loses minutes and hours.
BUT When a driver knows that the co-driver is bad / the intercom is broken / smth happened, he needs to drive "by eyes", and in that case the difference is, as NOT said, 10-20%, sometimes even less. A good example of that - Gronholm's stage victories in Finland after back problems for Timo.

[N.O.T]

many people cry because they suffer from the co-driver cry-baby syndrome...for example mr Nicky Grist and others...

the fact is a good co-driver is far easier to find than a good driver, and a good driver can progress even with a bad co-driver not the other way around.

you can cry or laugh all you want but facts are facts...sorry.

[DIMI44]

.................................................. .................................................. ........................

the fact is a good co-driver is far easier to find than a good driver, and a good driver can progress even with a bad co-driver not the other way around.

you can cry or laugh all you want but facts are facts...sorry.

Give us some examples,please.....

[N.O.T]

there are various examples of drivers changing co-drivers and the speed remains the same....Kannkunen,makinen,galli,sainz and numerous more...ects

In other words the co-driver must be really bad to show any impact on the drivers speed....no driver can win a rally without a co-driver but as i said its very very easy to find a good co-driver.

[N.O.T]

duval and novikov are also good examples since changing of co-drivers didn't change much...so its the driver that makes the difference not the co-driver.

[White Sauron]

duval and novikov are also good examples since changing of co-drivers didn't change much...so its the driver that makes the difference not the co-driver.

In case of Novikov it's a bit different. He's performed together with best Russian co-drivers, one of the best Asia-Pacific co-drivers and two of the best co-drivers in the world, but every time he's made a mistake he blamed his co-driver!! So where's he now? Ah, yeah, still there, down the results' table...))

[Barreis]

He paid so much for thin results.

[dimviii]

In case of Novikov it's a bit different. He's performed together with best Russian co-drivers, one of the best Asia-Pacific co-drivers and two of the best co-drivers in the world, but every time he's made a mistake he blamed his co-driver!! So where's he now? Ah, yeah, still there, down the results' table...))

Even with a good or bad co driver Novikov has same pace/exits.That told you NOT

[tfp]

LOL....

the co-driver is about the 10-20% of the speed....nothing more.

Lol, wrong again....

To set competitive stage times(on gravel) the drivers set their cars up for corners that they havent even seen yet....How much confidence would a driver have to do this with no co-driver? Not a lot.
On tarmac, they need to know distances(amongst others) etc to find optimal braking points, turning in points, how long the corner is so they know when they can exit at full speed...Once again, how much would a driver commit to a corner that he cant see without a co-driver reading notes?
Circuit racing drivers dont need this, they practice the track so many times they know where all of the correct braking points are, exit speeds etc etc. Unfortunately, in rallying you do not get that privilage.

[Juha_Koo]

he needs to drive "by eyes", and in that case the difference is, as NOT said, 10-20%, sometimes even less. A good example of that - Gronholm's stage victories in Finland after back problems for Timo.

Totally dependable from the rally and conditions. In Jordan, night stages, foggy conditions, etc. time losses would be bigger than 10-20%.

Marcus' fastest time in Vellipohja was because of rigorous video playback of the stage, it was the only new stage in NORF 2005 and Marcus and Timo had watched it from the video dozens of times. Also the codriver's role outside stages shouldn't be forgotten. Maybe you can tell me N.O.T why there's a problematic shortage of codrivers in Finland if the reality is how you say it is... Good codriver is essential for good results, it isn't coincedence that the same guys seem to have many jobs (=drivers).

[Hartusvuori]

duval and novikov are also good examples since changing of co-drivers didn't change much...so its the driver that makes the difference not the co-driver.

Changing the co-driver doesn't mean anything to what is co-driver role's input to the speed of rally crews.

[Tomi]

there are various examples of drivers changing co-drivers and the speed remains the same....Kannkunen,makinen,galli,sainz and numerous more...ects

I agree with N.O.T. on this one, sometimes a change of co-driver gives the driver new motivation and its in that way good.
In general I think that in the beginning of drivers carreer its good if they can put someone experiensed co-driver, the same way like when Harjanne was with Tommi in early days.
When J-M started his carreer in UK, Pentti once asked who I would put sitting with him, after a short thinking, I said Jakke Honkanen, the only reason was that he was good, experiensed and that he has the drivers respect too.

[N.O.T]

Lol, wrong again....

To set competitive stage times(on gravel) the drivers set their cars up for corners that they havent even seen yet....How much confidence would a driver have to do this with no co-driver? Not a lot.
On tarmac, they need to know distances(amongst others) etc to find optimal braking points, turning in points, how long the corner is so they know when they can exit at full speed...Once again, how much would a driver commit to a corner that he cant see without a co-driver reading notes?
Circuit racing drivers dont need this, they practice the track so many times they know where all of the correct braking points are, exit speeds etc etc. Unfortunately, in rallying you do not get that privilage.

i do not expect much from you...but i will reply

THE DRIVER MAKES THE NOTES NOT THE CO DRIVER...THE DRIVER TRUSTS HIS NOTES THAT THE CO DRIVER JUST READS....

[N.O.T]

maybe my english are deteriorating as time passes and i cannot express myself properly, because the assumptions you make out of the things i post are astonishing.....

what i am saying in simple words is that...

The co-driver doesn't make a lot of difference in a drivers speed and results...he is easily replaceable thus the payroll is so little....

Can you name a good driver who got lost due to a bad co-driver ?? or a bad driver who improved because of a co-driver ???

if you have problems understanding what i am saying there are very few things that can be done....

[Pinto]

dont know much about NOT and your indept rally knowlodge or your experience of competing in rallys or not but all i know is that your putting together a poor point ,all i know from my own expereince in both sides of the car a good codriver does matter,and i could be all night listing off cases of this.

[tfp]

i do not expect much from you...but i will reply

THE DRIVER MAKES THE NOTES NOT THE CO DRIVER...THE DRIVER TRUSTS HIS NOTES THAT THE CO DRIVER JUST READS....

:laugh:

Yes...I know!

Ok, so co-drivers may be relatively easily replaced, (when Phil mills quit, how many co drivers will have been lining up to drive alongside Petter?) at top level. The point I'm trying to make is that they are far more important than what you think. I'm pretty sure there would be a lot more accidents without co drivers!

[sollitt]

A good co-driver is far more than just a note reader. A good co-driver is a manager, a steading influence, a motivator. Someone who keeps you on the pace but also in-check when necessary. They are a coach, trainer, mentor.
They also ought be proficient in all aspects of the rules and an effective communicator.
All this and deliver the notes precisely and exactly on cue.
A good co-driver can both win you and lose you the event. A mediocre co-driver can only lose it for you.
Don't underestimate the value of a top co-driver.

I seem to recall that when Luis Moya threw in the towel he commented that his share of Sainz's reduced 500K (Euro) retainer was 150K which was not sufficient to justify risking his neck and spending 10 months away from home, family etc..., a sentiment I would agree with. This would confirm the 30% theory for the top guys.

[TyPat107]

NOT how many co-drvers have you had?

[N.O.T]

Don't underestimate the value of a top co-driver.


i do not underestimate them...i just say that a good co-driver is far easier to find than a good driver and also that his contribution to the speed of the driver is around 20%...thus the difference in salaries.

Use your head (not pointing towards you just a general remark) we live in a world driven by money...if the co-drivers contributed more than this 20% i am sure they would get paid more, they just get what they deserve...

[N.O.T]

NOT how many co-drvers have you had?

1.276

[GigiGalliNo1]

Nasser confirms Citroen 3rd driver deal.

Nasser Al-Attiyah en WRC en 2012 - RTBF Moteurs (http://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/detail_nasser-al-attiyah-en-wrc-en-2012?id=7092523)

When one has money! I say, good luck to him! It's great news!

[Hartusvuori]

Nasser confirms Citroen 3rd driver deal.

Nasser Al-Attiyah en WRC en 2012 - RTBF Moteurs (http://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/detail_nasser-al-attiyah-en-wrc-en-2012?id=7092523)

When one has money! I say, good luck to him! It's great news!

That news piece dates to November 17th. Citroen quickly denied that there is any agreement. We'll wait and see.

[Tomi]

:laugh:

Ok, so co-drivers may be relatively easily replaced, (when Phil mills quit, how many co drivers will have been lining up to drive alongside Petter?) at top level.

There can be other reasons why Petter has problems to find co-drivers, why dont you ask the same Phil Mills how much he did earn the last year he was co-driving Petter, there might be your answer.

[Rally_Rocks]

Hi there,

It’s been a little while since i came on here, but i came across this on Facebook and wondered if any of you guys know anything about it? Seems to have some interesting info!

Service Park Snoop | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Service-Park-Snoop/317139258302745)

[noel157]

Hi there,

It’s been a little while since i came on here, but i came across this on Facebook and wondered if any of you guys know anything about it? Seems to have some interesting info!

Service Park Snoop | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Service-Park-Snoop/317139258302745)

The guy reads this forum, everything there was on here first. So nothing very interesting.

[N.O.T]

Hi there,

It’s been a little while since i came on here, but i came across this on Facebook and wondered if any of you guys know anything about it? Seems to have some interesting info!

Service Park Snoop | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Service-Park-Snoop/317139258302745)

very very interesting an amazing source for last years news.... he forgot to mention the sink of titanic though.

This forum is the best source of info....the power all the members in here have cannot be matched by any gimmick individual....so nice try....but no soup for you.

[Viking]

:laugh:

Yes...I know!

Ok, so co-drivers may be relatively easily replaced, (when Phil mills quit, how many co drivers will have been lining up to drive alongside Petter?)

45 I heard, Petter tested 3 of them and chose Patterson.

[spiderem]

So any news on Ogier? and on Ford WRT?
it looks like my post about co-driver salary made some of you very passionate!
I personally think co-drivers don't get the status they should, but i also think it's a good thing for them as you need to keep focus for the all rally length, and not only during the stages... and some of them like to stay in the shadow so they perform well.
So respect to elena (even if i think he should shape up a bit to give loeb few extra seconds in speed ;) ) lethinen ingrassia antilla patersson etc...

[spiderem]

The Golf R is already being used as Recce car for VW Motorsport

Is it a simple golf r or has it got some rallying stuff, like roll cage and rally seats?
any pics? would like to see that.

[MartijnS]

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/297507_2382904025545_1639053355_32395714_156138244 9_n.jpg

[marcosg]

i do not underestimate them...i just say that a good co-driver is far easier to find than a good driver and also that his contribution to the speed of the driver is around 20%...thus the difference in salaries.


you are SO WRONG!!

it's as difficult to find good codrivers as drivers... and I can assure you that the contribution of the codriver (a good one) to the speed is sometimes greater than the driver...

The driver as to know how to drive well.. the codriver as to know that and manage all the other things that go with it...

[mousti]

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/297507_2382904025545_1639053355_32395714_156138244 9_n.jpg
It's from that pic that I also got it that they drive it :D . I only think that it has intercom, maybe seats don't think roll cage. Ruben Maes who does BHRC in Belgium also uses it as a recce instead of driving a old Porsche 911.

[N.O.T]

you are SO WRONG!!

it's as difficult to find good codrivers as drivers... and I can assure you that the contribution of the codriver (a good one) to the speed is sometimes greater than the driver...

The driver as to know how to drive well.. the codriver as to know that and manage all the other things that go with it...

another co-driver or co-drivers friend/relative with the crybaby syndrome...oh well....

[J.Lindstroem]

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/297507_2382904025545_1639053355_32395714_156138244 9_n.jpg

what is that??

[Mirek]

Lara Vanneste I guess :D

[Coach 2]

Regarding this discussion, I must say I completely agree with NOT But I will maybe change the claim from good to good enough.
It is much easier to find a good enough codriver than a good driver, if we are talking about what only concerns the notes, and how these will be presented by the codriver.
It is very difficult for a codriver to be better than the notes that are dictated by the driver.

[Barreis]

Good codriver is a person with great experience and profesionalism.

[Coach 2]

What is a good codriver for one driver, can not be good enough for another.
What constitutes a good or very good codriver, we can certainly discuss, but not decide

[marcosg]

another co-driver or co-drivers friend/relative with the crybaby syndrome...oh well....

yeah... I guess you're wright................

[mousti]

Peter Baert Belgian autosport reporter said on this twitter that Ford is more or less out of WRC next year !! :-/

He said also Mini has only budget for 6 events although on Autosport.cz it was said by Dr Holberg that 2012 is full program.

Pluto can u confirm that Mini is in for WRC 2012 for all rallies??? :)

[noel157]

Mini, at this stage, is in for 10 rounds. The long haul events may not be done. There might be a principal sponsor deal done shortly too.

[mousti]

Is that confirmed that 10 rounds, different stories circling around :-/ about the Sponsor I know they're searching and hopefully it getting worked out. But Ford seem very much in trouble!! Well Msport is..

[N.O.T]

Peter Baert Belgian autosport reporter said on this twitter that Ford is more or less out of WRC next year !! :-/

He said also Mini has only budget for 6 events although on Autosport.cz it was said by Dr Holberg that 2012 is full program.

Pluto can u confirm that Mini is in for WRC 2012 for all rallies??? :)

what happened to pitstop.tv ??

Peter Baert used to be one of the leading rally news journailist with lots of exclusives but for quite some time now (more than 5-6 years) he is nowhere to be found....

[mousti]

Kanaal 2 now 2be dropped the program (national tv so stupid) Now it's for more then a year back with some nice coverage of many autosport divisions it's only viewable on Telenet Digital TV.

He still has the pitstop.tv (http://www.pitstop.tv/) but not so many news on it. On his twitter @peterbaert he tweet some news out to the public :) .

It suprises me u know the guy :D . He's still the leading autosport news journalist for the Dutch talking people in europe :)

[N.O.T]

It suprises me u know the guy :D . He's still the leading autosport news journalist for the Dutch talking people in europe :)

i know him and his site for the amazing onboard videos he had waaaaaay back in the good old days...and he always was a good source for Euro rally info.

[Jr.]

Petter and Henning gear up for this weekends Solberg-show, with the Norwegian defence as a sponsor (forsvaret.no) .....


http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/375610_10150479386961013_565386012_10915933_133404 5139_n.jpg
http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/382198_10150479385991013_565386012_10915929_933122 604_n.jpg

[RS]

Peter Baert Belgian autosport reporter said on this twitter that Ford is more or less out of WRC next year !! :-/


I'm sure we should see some sort of semi-official M-Sport team at least?.. Like when Skoda pulled and the following year we had Red Bull Fabia WRCs (except hopefully better!)

It would seem like a great waste to can the Fiesta programme after only one year, it seemed to have reasonable potential even if the drivers couldn't bring home the silverwear this year. I'm sure Ogier-Latvala could have achieved better results.

The risk is if it is no longer a full works programme that they will fall even further behind on development.

[darkstar]

i´m 100% shure that m-sport will continue without ford´s support. they have no other choice, what should they do else? they have cars, they have parts, they have customers, they have wrc academy and all the other stuff like trucks, motorhome´s, mechanics etc. onlything they dont have is money probably. so it will be no payed drivers, only customers then. but they will have the top drivers anyhow. they also have no other choice, there are simply no other teams. i see ogier and latvala in ford´s for 2012 paying for theyre drive.

[noel157]

M-Sport will continue with Latvala next season.

[sete]

only with Latvala?
its confirmed or its your rumour?

[darkstar]

latvala at least said he will stick to m-sport even if ford pulls out. i think m-sport still likes also to support tänak somehow, at least it looks like that, because he also starts at du var with the m-sport team.

[dimviii]

they have cars, they have parts, they have customers, they have wrc academy and all the other stuff like trucks, motorhome´s, mechanics etc.
all these are M sport equipment,not Fords.
If Ford will not continue,probably Malcolm will continue to develop Fiesta.He is not going to loose 8 customers x 2.000.000 million each,and their parts-rebuilds,service etc.
He is not going to loose about 20-30 Fiestas s2000 are running worldwide,and their need about rebuilds/parts/accidents etc.
Malcolm is earning more than anybody at wrc,and he is not so stupid.Maybe he didn t won the championship,but he definetely earn the most from anyone.

[darkstar]

yes, that´s what i´m talking about! i said that m-sport will continue also WITHOUT ford.

[dimviii]

yes, that´s what i´m talking about! i said that m-sport will continue also WITHOUT ford.

i find you very polemic :p

sorry i misread your post. :dozey:

[focus206]

I'm sure we should see some sort of semi-official M-Sport team at least?.. Like when Skoda pulled and the following year we had Red Bull Fabia WRCs (except hopefully better!)

It would seem like a great waste to can the Fiesta programme after only one year, it seemed to have reasonable potential even if the drivers couldn't bring home the silverwear this year. I'm sure Ogier-Latvala could have achieved better results.

The risk is if it is no longer a full works programme that they will fall even further behind on development.

I agree, the Fiesta showed potential, it would be a shame if Ford pulls out.
If M-Sport will continue without Ford support in 2012, I see no chances for Latvala (or eventually Ogier) to aim for the championship...

[Nornbugger]

Lol, wrong again....

To set competitive stage times(on gravel) the drivers set their cars up for corners that they havent even seen yet....How much confidence would a driver have to do this with no co-driver? Not a lot.
On tarmac, they need to know distances(amongst others) etc to find optimal braking points, turning in points, how long the corner is so they know when they can exit at full speed...Once again, how much would a driver commit to a corner that he cant see without a co-driver reading notes?
Circuit racing drivers dont need this, they practice the track so many times they know where all of the correct braking points are, exit speeds etc etc. Unfortunately, in rallying you do not get that privilage.

ah so thats what they do, I thought they were just ballast and for conversation on road sections?

[N.O.T]

ah so thats what they do, I thought they were just ballast and for conversation on road sections?

sometimes their role is also the one you thought about...

Markko Martin & Beef Park - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0eG_HCrPGOY)

it is sad such a personality left us so early :( :(

[RS]

If the Ford rumours turn out to be true then Mikko is a very lucky boy that Citroen decided they didn't want Ogier anymore...

[N.O.T]

and Mr Ogier and his manager quite the opposite....

[MJW]

IF the Ford withdrawal as a manufacturer is true, and Mini only do a part programme where does this leave Citroen and the FIA's stance on a maufacturer championship? Maybe WRC would be better served as a Teams Cup and drivers championship.

[Doon]

I always thought Fords contribution was pretty low anyway, i.e. 5M euros. Correct me if i'm wrong, or have any accurate information on the money Ford were putting in. As said before, the Ford/Msport entry was never really a full manufacturer outfit anyway (compared to Citroen Sport), so they will continue in my eyes as they still have plenty of work and private orders.

I hope they do well whatever the backing the receive.

[RS]

and Mr Ogier and his manager quite the opposite....

I'm sure he will be fine. He is young enough to take a year off the main series testing with VW.

[noel157]

Latvala will provide plenty of interest for us next season.

[SubaruNorway]

very very interesting an amazing source for last years news.... he forgot to mention the sink of titanic though.

This forum is the best source of info....the power all the members in here have cannot be matched by any gimmick individual....so nice try....but no soup for you.

Good if you don't have time to sit on this forum all day. And to have someone filter out all the unnecessary banter.

[bopApocalypse]

Maybe WRC would be better served as a Teams Cup

Isn't that really what the current "manufacturers" championship is anyways?

[Bobcat]

I always thought Fords contribution was pretty low anyway, i.e. 5M euros. Correct me if i'm wrong... Yes, you are wrong.

[pettersolberg29]

Petter and Henning gear up for this weekends Solberg-show, with the Norwegian defence as a sponsor (forsvaret.no) .....


http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/375610_10150479386961013_565386012_10915933_133404 5139_n.jpg
http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/382198_10150479385991013_565386012_10915929_933122 604_n.jpg

I wonder if this has any relevance to a potential Norwegian Army deal for Petter and Henning in 2012??

Either way, nice looking cars.

[noel157]

Yes, you are wrong.

Well Bob, what kind of coin are we looking at?

[tfp]

ah so thats what they do, I thought they were just ballast and for conversation on road sections?

Maybe daniel elena :D
But then again, I thought they only did that in he BTCC?

:)

[Doon]

Yes, you are wrong.

How much is it then? You can't just say i'm wrong without saying what the actual figure is.

[spiderem]

I have heard that you might see a semi work fiesta with a TAG Heuer livery for Ogier next season...

[fastboy]

Ford give 30% of the yearly budget.Malcolm and M-Sport take a lot of stick from people,but in MY opinion do a great job to get as near as they do to Citroen.

[Francis44]

Ford give 30% of the yearly budget.Malcolm and M-Sport take a lot of stick from people,but in MY opinion do a great job to get as near as they do to Citroen.

I have to agree with this. M-Sport gets all the hate but really Ford is the one to blame, they want maximum exposure pouring just 5 million?! That's nearly what some privateers pay for programmes with costumer cars.

[Zeakiwi]

Hayden Paddon -interview with a NZ motorcycle journalist on plans for 2012.
Appears Subaru is possible but Ford,Mini or Skoda if money can be found.

Motorsport: Quickchat with Eric Thompson - Motoring - NZ Herald Videos (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/motoring/news/video.cfm?c_id=1503084&gal_cid=1503084&gallery_id=122786)

[Dug83]

Ogier signs with VW!!!!!!!!

Ogier becomes first factory driver at Volkswagen - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeicxXyqwvw&feature=feedu)

[spiderem]

Ogier signs with VW!!!!!!!!

Ogier becomes first factory driver at Volkswagen - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeicxXyqwvw&feature=feedu)

Bim! that is news everybody was waiting for... question, what he is gonna do next year??? play with fabia S2000 to kill the time? Or will VW enter earlier than scheduled?

[spiderem]

i Hope as well that loeb will compete in 2013. As next season will be the easiest season he will have to face (by the looks of it).
But if we have loeb in a ds3 and ogier in a polo (reliable and fast?) in 2013 this could be an amazing season!!!

[6789]

Now just need Ford to continue somehow!

Go Ogier in 2012!!

[J.Lindstroem]

Ogier: "Volkswagen is the best manufactor in the world" haha!!

[Tanelv]

I wonder if this has any relevance to a potential Norwegian Army deal for Petter and Henning in 2012??

Yes, and they are driving with Leopard 2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leopard_2)-s. Would be quite good in rough rallies :D

[MJW]

i Hope as well that loeb will compete in 2013. As next season will be the easiest season he will have to face (by the looks of it).
But if we have loeb in a ds3 and ogier in a polo (reliable and fast?) in 2013 this could be an amazing season!!!
I hope Loeb becomes champion in 2012 so that gives him 9 titles, then he should give him the motivation to stay for 2013 to face Ogier's challenge. I fear Loeb (and Citroen) will run away and hide before facing VW/Ogier.

[noel157]

Why the doubt about Loeb in 2013? His new contract is for 2 years.

[MJW]

Why the doubt about Loeb in 2013? His new contract is for 2 years.
Option after one year.

[N.O.T]

I fear Loeb (and Citroen) will run away and hide before facing VW/Ogier.

Citroen must stay until 2013 or they have to pay a fine to the FIA since they have a contract, so i guess we are going to see the clash for 1 year.

[noel157]

Option after one year.

Thanks, forgot about that.

[N.O.T]

Ogier: "Volkswagen is the best manufactor in the world" haha!!

i guess he was blinded by the zeros in his check and his mind went blurry.... :)

[spiderem]

Citroen must stay until 2013 or they have to pay a fine to the FIA since they have a contract, so i guess we are going to see the clash for 1 year.

Is that true? Or Ogier has still a chance to be a test driver for hundai accent?
Anyway it means citroen has to stay, but not necessarily Loeb...

[dimviii]

i guess he was blinded by the zeros in his check and his mind went blurry.... :)

don t forget that Citroen broke his contract for 2012 so double money for him for next year.

[dimviii]

I fear Loeb (and Citroen) will run away and hide before facing VW/Ogier.
VW and Ogier have a lot of work to do before they managed to scare Citroen.First Ogier have to study how to finish rallies.

[I am evil Homer]

Loed has earned the right ot whatever he wants....he's never hidden before. If he wants to go at the end of next year that's his call. To suggest he'd be 'hiding' from a challenge - ha!

[Barreis]

All this drivers can wipe Loeb's a**.

[Motorsportfun]

What a programme for Al Attiyah!!! DS3 RRC for him in MERC, DS3 WRCar in the WRC and an ongoing programme for a Citroen Dakar car! :O

Looks also Quesnel will leave the Citroen team, replaced by former Mitsubishi Dakar team principal Dominique Serieys!

Rally Emotion - WRC / Esclusivo: Al Attiyah a tutto campo, dal WRC alla Dakar! (http://www.rallyemotion.it/news/1165-wrc-esclusivo-al-attiyah-a-tutto-campo-dal-wrc-alla-dakar)

[mousti]

That would be then the debut of the DS3 S1.6t wonder how it looks like..

[EuroTroll]

All this drivers can wipe Loeb's a**.

Ash? Is he a smoker?

[BDunnell]

All this drivers can wipe Loeb's a**.

Arm? Is he an amateur farm animal proctologist?

[EuroTroll]

All this drivers can wipe Loeb's a**.

Art? Is he a negligent collector? :D

[darkstar]

Ogier: "Volkswagen is the best manufactor in the world" haha!!

depends on what you call "best". at least they are one of the biggest and they are growing...

[GigiGalliNo1]

Link to Nasser story in English?

[Motorsportfun]

Link to Nasser story in English?

At the moment it's written just in Italian, but it says that Nasser will embarque to a full campaign with Citroen (which will replace Red Bull sponsorships with "Visit Qatar") and he will compete also in the Middle-East Rally Champ with a RRC-spec DS3. They're looking also for a committment to the Dakar rally in the future!

[Mintexmemory]

Asp? is he a reptile vetinarian?

[Rallyper]

I think Ogiers´move to VW opens up for Petter Solberg to move to Ford along JML. Petter will for sure not earn much money, except for the money his own sponsors bring, but will drive for MW without paying. That should be a very good deal for MW as well!
And the rally fans get a very much competitive team!!

[tfp]

All this drivers can wipe Loeb's a**.

Does Loeb drink real ale? Maybe a pint of "old leg over"?

[tfp]

I think Ogiers´move to VW opens up for Petter Solberg to move to Ford along JML. Petter will for sure not earn much money, except for the money his own sponsors bring, but will drive for MW without paying. That should be a very good deal for MW as well!
And the rally fans get a very much competitive team!!

Thats what I think will happen, I can imagine if there is a team solberg with the two brothers, and tanak gets the nr 2 manu seat, what will happen when Petter outpaces Tanak?! Ford need the manufacturer points!

It would be kind of like subaru in the old days, when Tommy Mak tutored Petter, now Petter returns the favour!

[BDunnell]

All this drivers can wipe Loeb's a**.

App? Does he not know how to delete something unwanted from his iPhone?

[GigiGalliNo1]

Haha

Anyways, Ford won't be back in 2012... Just M-Sport ;)

[Rallyper]

Haha

Anyways, Ford won't be back in 2012... Just M-Sport ;)

Jepp, I mean Ford=M-sport (if you didnt catch that) :s mokin:

[darkstar]

Haftbefehl gegen WM-Promoter*:: rallye-magazin.de (http://www.rallye-magazin.de/rallyes/wm/nachrichten/news-detail/d/2011/11/23/haftbefehl-gegen-wrc-promoter/index.html)

Google Übersetzer (http://translate.google.de/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rallye-magazin.de%2Frallyes%2Fwm%2Fnachrichten%2Fnews-detail%2Fd%2F2011%2F11%2F23%2Fhaftbefehl-gegen-wrc-promoter%2Findex.html&sl=de&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8)

[dimviii]

Arrest warrant for World Rally Championship commercial chief Vladimir Antonov - WRC news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/96413) lol

[Juha_Koo]

Interesting.

There's a Europe-wide arrest warrant out for Vladimir Antonov.

BBC News - Arrest warrant for Portsmouth FC owner Vladimir Antonov (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-15859800)

EDIT. Haaaa, dimvii was little faster... I should have posted this right away and not digging up stuff on other tab and trying to find out more. :D

[darkstar]

can please someone else post another link :p

[Juha_Koo]

can please someone else post another link :p

Not bad, three different links on the same matter in five minutes. We are good. :D

[darkstar]

hehe, defenetly ;)

[Mirek]

PG will again start in Prague Rallysprint. This time with Fabia WRC.

[MartijnS]

Kevin Abbring is testing the DS3 of Ogier in Wales today on gravel.

[rage82]

Kevin Abbring is testing the DS3 of Ogier in Wales today on gravel.

The source is his twitter: " Dear fans! @ Citroen Racing tonight. Tomorrow one day test with Sebastien Ogier's GB WRC car on gravel!! Thanks for the opportunaty!"

Sounds very good to me! It's really nice that he's showing some speed and then he gets opurtunities to drive first for VW and now testing DS3 WRC

[Mintexmemory]

All this drivers can wipe Loeb's a**.

ark? I didn't think Indiana Jones left the precious artefact with Citroen for cleaning!

[bluuford]

ark? I didn't think Indiana Jones left the precious artefact with Citroen for cleaning!

I thought that Loeb was the one who has been cleaning.....
.. the road for last couple of years ;-)

[Francis44]

The owner and boss of North One Sport, Vladimir Antonov, has a international capture mandate, apparently he is accused of fraud and deviation of bank money.

[mm1]

See previous page. Actualy I spoke about this allready on Tuesday.

[cali]

In current situation one thing bothers me the most - the lack of seats vs number of talented drivers (Hänninen, Mikkelsen, Tänak, Neuville, Breen etc ). Such a shame!