Melbourne keeps GP *merged*

[Valve Bounce]

........until 2005: http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23865230-661,00.html

A deal hs been struck to keep the race at Albert Park. "The deal is expected to include a move to later race start times -- probably about 5pm -- to attract a wider European television audience.

But it will not be a night race. "

[Tazio]

........until 2005: http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23865230-661,00.html

A deal hs been struck to keep the race at Albert Park. "The deal is expected to include a move to later race start times -- probably about 5pm -- to attract a wider European television audience.

But it will not be a night race. "........until 2005:
Let's go back to the future :p :

[maxu05]

I just read this on crash.net. Great news.

[ShiftingGears]

Excellent :up:

[Valve Bounce]

Sorry!! Just heard on the telly that this has not been agreed by Bernie who still wants a night race.

[gloomyDAY]

Verbal agreement?

Pssshhhh! I'm going back to bed.

[aryan]

Nothing's done guys.

Just some rumours...

[ArrowsFA1]

........until 2005: http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23865230-661,00.html

A deal hs been struck to keep the race at Albert Park. "The deal is expected to include a move to later race start times -- probably about 5pm -- to attract a wider European television audience.

But it will not be a night race. "
Good to hear that Albert Park looks likely to keep the GP :up: but this rubbish about a later start... :mad: This is a World championship, not a European one.

Next thing you know there will be a stipulation that each race on the calendar must start at the same central European time, and the races will all end up taking place at Tilkedromes that all look much the same. It'll be like going into a MacDonalds...it doesn't matter where you are in the world, they look the same and serve the same food :down:

[millencolin]

Good to hear that Albert Park looks likely to keep the GP :up: but this rubbish about a later start... :mad: This is a World championship, not a European one.


Amen to that!!!

[leopard]

Why should Australia and NZ have that weird time zone? :)

[SGWilko]

Why should Australia and NZ have that weird time zone? :)

I know, crazy innit. You'd have thought, with all his gazillions, Bernie would heve had the countries moved round the globe a bit.... ;)

[F1boat]

Good to hear that Albert Park looks likely to keep the GP :up: but this rubbish about a later start... :mad: This is a World championship, not a European one.

Next thing you know there will be a stipulation that each race on the calendar must start at the same central European time, and the races will all end up taking place at Tilkedromes that all look much the same. It'll be like going into a MacDonalds...it doesn't matter where you are in the world, they look the same and serve the same food :down:

I agree too. :(

[jens]

I like Albert Park circuit. Perfect place for the start of the season, often creating some drama and chaos. So I feel positive about the news.

And about the time, when the race should take place... Well, personally I like, when races take place in the morning [Oz race could be a couple of hours later (starting 5:00 in our time zone), but for example Malaysian GP is in perfect time for me :p : ]. It's good to wake up and start watching a race immediately without waiting for it until mid-day. IMO the mid-day option isn't very good as it halves the day and it's hard to have some greater plans for that day. If the race takes place in the morning, then fine - after having seen the race the rest of the day is 'free'. :p :

[gravity]

I know, crazy innit. You'd have thought, with all his gazillions, Bernie would heve had the countries moved round the globe a bit.... ;)

HAHAHA... Techtonic plate movement is scheduled for the end of 2010... Aus and NZ will be shifted to the Atlantic to accomodate Europe AND America. No more 'weird time zones'. A bit late, I know, but Bernie's getting slow in his old age.

[aryan]

HAHAHA... Techtonic plate movement is scheduled for the end of 2010... Aus and NZ will be shifted to the Atlantic to accomodate Europe AND America.

oh, that would be AWESOME. Seriously, do you know how much that would save me in travel costs?

I say it time and time again, Australia is the perfect land to live in... only if was a bit closer to Europe ;)

[Valve Bounce]

oh, that would be AWESOME. Seriously, do you know how much that would save me in travel costs?

I say it time and time again, Australia is the perfect land to live in... only if was a bit closer to Europe ;)

Why don't you ski at Niseko instead? No queues and better powder. :up:

[leopard]

I know, crazy innit. You'd have thought, with all his gazillions, Bernie would heve had the countries moved round the globe a bit.... ;)

Human can't do that! ;)

[truefan72]

this was never really in doubt just Bernie trying to weasel out more millions

[Valve Bounce]

It was on the new that negotiations have hit an impasse and that Bernie is insisting on a night GP which the Government here is refusing point blank. So, far from the other thread which I reported we will have a GP here until 2005, that appears now to be quite dead.

[Valve Bounce]

this was never really in doubt just Bernie trying to weasel out more millions

Maybe not!! I think we're buggered by Bernie!! :(

[Powered by Cosworth]

I don't understand why the government wants a day race.

Maybe their opinion will change after Singapore.

[MAX_THRUST]

Is it because of the cost of lighting the circuit?

Shame I think it would look good on TV. However I like getting up early in March to watch the first race of the season, and then early at the end of the season for Japan.

What's wrong with Bernie, he goes to these far flung countries and then moans about the european tv coverage and time zone differences. The man is mad........if it is so bad keep the races in Europe or leave F1 and run a european series.

[Ranger]

I don't understand why the government wants a day race.

Maybe their opinion will change after Singapore.

1. $$$

2. Literally across the road from the circuit are light residential areas, nursing homes, nature reserves, etc.

3. $$$

4. $$$ (Have I said that the event is now running at a loss of up to $150 million?)

[ioan]

Australians, let it go, losing $150 million tax money for holding a F1 GP is insane. Be smart use the money for something better than filling someone else' pockets.

[ShiftingGears]

Maybe their opinion will change after Singapore.

Tell the residents next door to Albert Park. Having a night race is guaranteed to slaughter the gov's approval rating.

[Valve Bounce]

PLus a huge hospital well within hearing range. I guess we are back to square one on this - I have serious doubts that Bernie has changed his mind in the last 3 months - he wants a night race or else there will be no race.

[I am evil Homer]

Australians, let it go, losing $150 million tax money for holding a F1 GP is insane. Be smart use the money for something better than filling someone else' pockets.

Agreed....Bernie lost the plot long ago. I actually like the excitement at getting up early to catch a GP rather than them all being on between 2 and 5pm here.

[ioan]

Agreed....Bernie lost the plot long ago. I actually like the excitement at getting up early to catch a GP rather than them all being on between 2 and 5pm here.

Honestly, me too, I would like to have them all very early or very late. We all do have a life, friends, a family who don't watch F1 and we want to go out with them on week ends instead of staying in front of the TV because Bernie thinks that's best for his pocket.

[ioan]

PLus a huge hospital well within hearing range. I guess we are back to square one on this - I have serious doubts that Bernie has changed his mind in the last 3 months - he wants a night race or else there will be no race.

In fact I believe that Bernie doesn't want a race in Oz and the night race requirement is the reason not to lengthen the contract because he knows very well they won't agree with the conditions.

It's like wanting the French GP in downtown Paris, it won't happen, so he will take his toys to Iran or Turkmenistan without being the one that actually refused the deal.

He's killing F1, slowly but surely.

PS: In a way I was glad when Tony George didn't accept his terms, that was a blow for Bernie, he lost the only US venue where it was possible to host the F1 race. I hope he loses Oz too.

[ArrowsFA1]

...because Bernie thinks that's best for his pocket.
Just a reminder that CVC Capital Partners (http://www.cvc.com) control F1. They apparently paid $1.7b for that priviledge in 2006. They also own GP2 and were rumoured to be interested in NASCAR a while ago.


He's killing F1, slowly but surely.

PS: In a way I was glad when Tony George didn't accept his terms, that was a blow for Bernie, he lost the only US venue where it was possible to host the F1 race. I hope he loses Oz too.
Killing F1? Really? Where's the evidence for that? I may not like the fact that Bernie wants races to take place at a time convenient for Europeans, and the fact that F1 is moving away from traditional venues, but the fact is their are many more countries waiting to host a GP.

[F1boat]

Yes, Arrows, but the spirit of F1 is gone with this new venues, Spa is constalntly missing, we lost Imola, Indy, A1 ring, now Melbourne. I believe that Bernie and not Max is the one who should leave office.

[Roamy]

good lets have it in Perth

[e2mtt]

It seems like most of his decisions lately are purely done to line his own pockets at the expense of the longtime fans and overall strength of the sport. He then tries to sell it as attracting new fans in developing countries.

Every time he dumps an established and historic venue, with longtime local & TV fans, for a new track in an unfamiliar location that will give him a bigger check, he is killing a little bit of F1.

[gloomyDAY]

I'll be sad to see Melbourne get dropped.

How about Surfer's Paradise?

[ArrowsFA1]

Yes, Arrows, but the spirit of F1 is gone with this new venues.
I don't disagree with that, but everything changes over time. Bernie will leave F1, but don't expect F1 to rediscover the "spirit of F1" as a result.

[ArrowsFA1]

It seems like most of his decisions lately are purely done to line his own pockets at the expense of the longtime fans and overall strength of the sport.
I'll ask the same question I asked ioan - Really? Where's the evidence for that? I'm a longtime F1 fan - how is Bernie lining his own pockets at my expense?

[ioan]

Just a reminder that CVC Capital Partners (http://www.cvc.com) control F1. They apparently paid $1.7b for that priviledge in 2006. They also own GP2 and were rumoured to be interested in NASCAR a while ago.

And who is in charge of F1 for the CVC?! You guessed it it's Bernie Ecclestone! :s



Killing F1? Really? Where's the evidence for that? I may not like the fact that Bernie wants races to take place at a time convenient for Europeans, and the fact that F1 is moving away from traditional venues, but the fact is their are many more countries waiting to host a GP.

Who do you think will continue advertising and thus paying the bills in F1 when the US and the Europeans will not care about it anymore?!
Don't you see that European televisions are showing less F1 every year, I consider myself happy to get the races in France, no way they will show a practice session or qualifying.
In Oz, Canada and the US, often is just a delayed cast.
How many people show up on race day compared to 10-15 years ago? And why do you think this is happening, does a 100€ ticket price sound familiar?!

Why is that most European venues are threatened to lose their place if they won't pay even more millions?!

You might get a better coverage in the rest of the world, but sponsor could care less if Chinese, Pakistani or Indians will see their banners as long as they can't pay for the products. :rolleyes:

And all this is directed by Bernie, cause he's in charge for the CVC and he's calling the decisions.

[BDunnell]

In fact I believe that Bernie doesn't want a race in Oz and the night race requirement is the reason not to lengthen the contract because he knows very well they won't agree with the conditions.

It's like wanting the French GP in downtown Paris, it won't happen, so he will take his toys to Iran or Turkmenistan without being the one that actually refused the deal.

He's killing F1, slowly but surely.

PS: In a way I was glad when Tony George didn't accept his terms, that was a blow for Bernie, he lost the only US venue where it was possible to host the F1 race. I hope he loses Oz too.

ioan, as before when this came up, I agree absolutely with you. The night race thing is meaningless, and there are far better things to spend public money on than F1 — hosting V8 Supercars, for instance!

[Hawkmoon]

Just a reminder that CVC Capital Partners (http://www.cvc.com) control F1. They apparently paid $1.7b for that priviledge in 2006. They also own GP2 and were rumoured to be interested in NASCAR a while ago.


Killing F1? Really? Where's the evidence for that? I may not like the fact that Bernie wants races to take place at a time convenient for Europeans, and the fact that F1 is moving away from traditional venues, but the fact is their are many more countries waiting to host a GP.

Arrows you have to admit that moving the GP away from Australia can in no way be to the benefit of the teams, who all continually profess their enjoyment of racing in Australia, or the fans, particularly those in Australia, New Zealand and other nearby areas where they get to see 1 race a year "live".

The Indians will pay huge dollars for a GP, so Bernie moves the race there. Good business decision, crappy sporting decision. Bernie has lost sight of the sporting aspects of F1. His continual threats to Silverstone, his moving the GP away from Suzuka, the on-again-off-again Spa race, loss of Imola and Austria, night races in Asia for the benefit of European TV. None of these things have benefitted the sport of F1. The business of F1? Sure. But there's got to be more to it than that.

So Bernie sold out to CVC? Who benefitted from that? Mr E. once again. Bernie does what he does because it benefits Bernie. No one else. That's OK for you and I. My family and I come first as far as I'm concerned. But when you're in a postion like Bernie's I believe you have an obligation to more than just yourself and your family, particularly when your family has more money than the next several generations can spend.

[Cozzie]

A STREET RACE AROUND TASMANIA!

What there would be more F1 fans here than there are in Turkmenistan!

[CNR]

why done they just run it at about 8 am

it looks like eastern creek raceway could be the only place if it has to be a night race.

[ShiftingGears]

why done they just run it at about 8 am
People have work.


it looks like eastern creek raceway could be the only place if it has to be a night race.

I hope not. Eastern Creek is kinda boring and rarely makes for interesting racing in V8 supercars. Its only saving point is Turn 1.

I'd like to see a road course race on closed public roads. City grids are relatively boring to stick races at, and seeing the cars go through the fast, flowing corners of many natural terrain courses would be a brilliant spectacle, even if there wasn't passing. I know Sydney has some brilliant roads.

[Valve Bounce]

People have work.



I hope not. Eastern Creek is kinda boring and rarely makes for interesting racing in V8 supercars. Its only saving point is Turn 1.

I'd like to see a road course race on closed public roads. City grids are relatively boring to stick races at, and seeing the cars go through the fast, flowing corners of many natural terrain courses would be a brilliant spectacle, even if there wasn't passing. I know Sydney has some brilliant roads.

Yeah!! up at Mt Panorama. :eek:

[ArrowsFA1]

And who is in charge of F1 for the CVC?! You guessed it it's Bernie Ecclestone! :s

Who do you think will continue advertising and thus paying the bills in F1 when the US and the Europeans will not care about it anymore?!
Don't you see that European televisions are showing less F1 every year, I consider myself happy to get the races in France, no way they will show a practice session or qualifying.
In Oz, Canada and the US, often is just a delayed cast.
How many people show up on race day compared to 10-15 years ago? And why do you think this is happening, does a 100€ ticket price sound familiar?!

Why is that most European venues are threatened to lose their place if they won't pay even more millions?!

You might get a better coverage in the rest of the world, but sponsor could care less if Chinese, Pakistani or Indians will see their banners as long as they can't pay for the products. :rolleyes:

And all this is directed by Bernie, cause he's in charge for the CVC and he's calling the decisions.
ioan, I agree with a lot of what you say. I'm an old fart traditionalist where F1 is concerned, and I complain about a lot of the changes. Tilkedromes are soulless places located where there is no history of motorsport and little ground level interest. F1 was a largely European series when it began and the loss of the likes of Brands Hatch and other European circuits is a great loss IMHO. I'd love to see the return of cars like the Lotus 49 and see how current drivers would cope with them. But, things change and I can't stick my head in the sand and wish for things as they were.

The reality is that organisations like CVC are involved to make money. Money is to be made in places such as China and India and they want to host F1 races. It's a commercial, not sentimental, business.

TV now rules. Spectators attending GP's provide a tiny amount of income (despite the ticket prices) in comparison with TV rights, and TV doesn't care where the races are held because 'the show' can be beamed around the world. That wasn't the case in the past. When I first started to be interested in F1 I don't recall seeing races on TV. I listened to James Hunt winning his WDC on the radio in the middle of the night! It was only in 1978 (I think) that the BBC first had a 1/2 hour highlights show.

Where I disagree with you is that I do not see Bernie as being solely responsible for all that is bad in F1. It is largely due to him that the sport is as successful as it has become. If you look at the sport in the late 1970's (when FOCA led by Bernie began to have influence) and compare it with today there is simply no comparison. Yes, Bernie saw the chance to make money but he's not been the only one to benefit. Not too many teams complain about how things have progressed in those 30yrs.

What Bernie did was to recognise that commercial considerations and TV could make the sport bigger and better. He was the first to act on that and, as is the way in our world, being the first he has benefitted the most.

Bernie does what he does because it benefits Bernie. No one else.
Sure it benefits Bernie, but what he's put in place also benefits a lot of other people as well. The deals he does gives a lot of people a very comfortable lifestyle! I believe he has propped up more than one team or two in his time as well with financial support.

The sport is attractive to sponsors largely because of Bernie, and without sponsors the sport could not sustain itself in the manner to which it has become accustomed!!

Rather than making Bernie the bogeyman (which ioan does tend to do to deflect the heat from Max :D ) think how different the sport would be without him. I'd suggest it would change very little.

[Valve Bounce]

Just announced on the news : an agreement has been reached with Bernie to run a twilight race starting at 5 pm. So it looks like Melbourne might keep its GP after all.

[leopard]

I don't understand why the government wants a day race.

Maybe their opinion will change after Singapore.
I don't underestimate Oz, the night race refusal is understandable, it requires high investment. :D

[ShiftingGears]

Yeah!! up at Mt Panorama. :eek:

If you saw the V8's flying through some closed-off roads here you might be surprised ;)

[Azumanga Davo]

Valvy, how long is this bipolar thread going to go on for? :p :

[maxu05]

I think OZ should tell Bernie to Pi*s off, and don't hit your ass on the door on the way out. Save the money you would lose, and invest it in the Motogp and Superbike at Phillip Island.

[SGWilko]

My apologies for this being a little off topic, but it is at least relevant. :)

The sport of F1 stopped being a sport all the time (just on Sunday afternoons) when the sponsors started putting their colours on the cars and paying for the privilage. This may have started with the JPS lotus team, but I am no doubt wrong.

Now, in order to keep the sponsors happy - and I have no doubt that they hold a fair amount of clout in F1 - ever new and further afield venues are being sought to maximise their investment and justify their costs.

Inevitably, some existing facilities lose out.

I don't doubt for one moment however, that the night race in Oz thing that Bernie wants is just an excuse for him to take another staple track away, in order to make room for higher paying countries.

[Valve Bounce]

Stop Press!! Melbourne is keeping the GP by having a twilight race starting at 5 pm. This thread is, for the moment, in limbo. It is hoped that the agreement will be signed soon if it hasn't been yet!

[Valve Bounce]

Valvy, how long is this bipolar thread going to go on for? :p :

Ask Bernie. :( I only report what I hear in the news.

[maxu05]

Check out the story at ninemsn.com. Melbourne City Council does not want the GP.
http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=582152

[Azumanga Davo]

Fair enough. I'll see you tomorrow in the Kaput thread then. ;)

[Mark]

What's wrong with running at 5? It benefits European audiences and those in Aus still see it at a decent time, so what's the problem?

[Azumanga Davo]

What's wrong with running at 5? It benefits European audiences and those in Aus still see it at a decent time, so what's the problem?

Well, two main problems I can forsee (one of which mentioned many times):

1. The whingeing morons who like to complain about noise even though the majority of them moved there knowing full well a GP happens there.

2. Channel 10 is a notoriously useless network for showing anything live that isn't footy or Rove the supposedly funny moron and probably didn't fancy putting F1 on proper prime time when there is a perfectly good list of Ernest movies still to go through.

[ioan]

What's wrong with running at 5? It benefits European audiences and those in Aus still see it at a decent time, so what's the problem?

As posted in the other thread:

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/article.aspx?id=582152

More than enough reasons to say NO and no reason to say YES.

[V12]

Well I missed the Australian GP this year from falling asleep, and I would say I DEFINITELY will next year given it is starting even later. If they cared about European TV audiences they'd move the start time back to where it was, so that it is easier to stay up for.

No, a ploy to the Asian market methinks.

[Valve Bounce]

What's wrong with running at 5? It benefits European audiences and those in Aus still see it at a decent time, so what's the problem?

As I mentioned before, and you may have missed it, the start time at 5 pm means the cars will be starting directly into the setting sun. Turns 1 to 3 might be a lot more exciting as a result.

[Valve Bounce]

I seem to be hosting two diametrically opposed threads, don't I. What can I say? The City of Port Phillip (in which Albert park lies) have opposed the Grand Prix for many years as their residents have complained vociferously each year. This is nothing new.

The City of Melbourne is all for the Grand Prix.

[Ari]

Well I missed the Australian GP this year from falling asleep, and I would say I DEFINITELY will next year given it is starting even later. If they cared about European TV audiences they'd move the start time back to where it was, so that it is easier to stay up for.

No, a ploy to the Asian market methinks.

I think the idea is you guys will get a nights sleep BEFORE the GP not after it.

[Ari]

Valve.... you're giving me a headache mate! :p

One thread starts with 'THE GP IS STAYING' and ends with 'THE GP IS DEAD' and the other starts with 'THE GP IS DEAD' and ends with 'THE GP IS STAYING'.

Even one thread would be confusing but two! ;)

[Valve Bounce]

You try barracking for Essendon and you'll end up as crazy as me also. :p :

[aryan]

The City of Melbourne is all for the Grand Prix.

As a resident of the City of Melbourne, let me say "hear, hear".

Note: To those new to this debate, you can search the forum to find some of my old posts on both the direct and intangible benefits of holding the GP for the Victorian economy. I don't see the need to repeat myself every few months.

[Dave B]

It's official now: Australia has a deal until 2015 and a 5pm start.


Australian Grand Prix officials have secured a new deal to keep the race in Melbourne until 2015, ending months of speculation about the future of the event.

Doubts had been cast about whether Melbourne would remain on the F1 calendar, with Formula One supremo Bernie Ecclestone making it clear that he wanted a night race if Australia was to keep hold of a slot.

However, a compromise settlement was reached with the race now due to start at 5pm local time - and that was enough for Ecclestone to commit to an extended contract.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/68811

:)

[gravity]

Well I missed the Australian GP this year from falling asleep, and I would say I DEFINITELY will next year given it is starting even later.

This year, the Aus GP was broadcast live starting at 7am in South Africa. Assuming u live in Leeds (yr location in yr profile), time zones and daylight saving calculated, means that it started 5am your side? By moving the race from a 2pm start to 5pm start means that the race will start at 8am your side.

[aryan]

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.

My windows will vibrate by the sound of F1 engines for a couple of years more than I expected.

I am a happy man today! :p