Milwaukee Race

[Mad_Hatter]

Starting Order:

1. (26) Marco Andretti, Dallara-Honda, 168.079
2. (06) Graham Rahal, Dallara-Honda, 167.654
3. (9) Scott Dixon, Dallara-Honda, 167.637
4. (8) Will Power, Dallara-Honda, 167.265
5. (3) Helio Castroneves, Dallara-Honda, 166.667
6. (11) Tony Kanaan, Dallara-Honda, 166.473
7. (10) Dan Wheldon, Dallara-Honda, 166.195
8. (36) Enrique Bernoldi, Dallara-Honda, 165.216
9. (5) Oriol Servia, Dallara-Honda, 165.190
10. (33) EJ Viso, Dallara-Honda, 164.843
11. (6) Ryan Briscoe, Dallara-Honda, 164.106
12. (17) Ryan Hunter-Reay, Dallara-Honda, 164.066
13. (7) Danica Patrick, Dallara-Honda, 163.702
14. (27) Hideki Mutoh, Dallara-Honda, 163.368
15. (18) Bruno Junqueira, Dallara-Honda, 163.123
16. (24) John Andretti, Dallara-Honda, 162.449
17. (20) Ed Carpenter, Dallara-Honda, 162.139
18. (2) A.J. Foyt IV, Dallara-Honda, 162.049
19. (15) Buddy Rice, Dallara-Honda, 161.903
20. (14) Darren Manning, Dallara-Honda, 160.787
21. (23) Townsend Bell, Dallara-Honda, 160.311
22. (02) Justin Wilson, Dallara-Honda, 159.927
23. (19) Mario Moraes, Dallara-Honda, 155.511
24. (34) Jaime Camara, Dallara-Honda, 154.613
25. (96) Mario Dominguez, Dallara-Honda, 150.071
26. (4) Vitor Meira, Dallara-Honda, no speed


Here's to a safe and exciting race.

[Mad_Hatter]

Video Stream shows a pretty decent crowd.

Timing:
http://scoring.indycar.com/2008/
Video:
http://www.indy500.com/?autoPlay=true

[BobGarage]

i take it Marty Roth isn't starting again? he;s not currently listed on t&s.

wish he'd give it up and let Jay Howard race his car.

[cos]

Roth trashed his car yesterday. Race is set to get underway, looking forward to it.

[Mad_Hatter]

Yep they withdrew after a crash during practice yesterday.

[Mad_Hatter]

First caution, oriol's wing damaged.

Marco stretched a gap early.

[BobGarage]

servias doing a great job staying aherad of the leaders and on the lead lap. he's going through the traffic better than them at times.

[Mad_Hatter]

Yep, looks like it has paid off too. Caution for debris.

[ChicagocrewIRL]

What a great crowd ! Only looks like the end grandstands have bare aluminum. The main part of the seating area is packed and what a beautiful day !

The cars look amazing in the sun, especially with so many of them on track.

Milwaukee is BACK !!!!

[ChicagocrewIRL]

Oriol up to 10th !!! what a great run ! GO ORIOL !!! KEEP PUSHING !!!

[BobGarage]

Wilson doing well as well, started 20th, up to 9th!

[Mad_Hatter]

EJ Viso has some stones. Great pass.

[booger]

It's a pretty good race from Dixon back. But am I being picky or is this the most god-awful broadcast job we've ever seen? They are really doing a crap job, missing the racing action, focusing on drivers that aren't in contention and throwing all these general interest sidebars in while some good racing is going on...give me a break!

[gm99]

Congrats to Briscoe on his first IndyCar victory (although the yellow at the end probably saved him, as Dixon was looking very menacing).

[Mad_Hatter]

Double post

[Mad_Hatter]

It's a pretty good race from Dixon back. But am I being picky or is this the most god-awful broadcast job we've ever seen? They are really doing a crap job, missing the racing action, focusing on drivers that aren't in contention and throwing all these general interest sidebars in while some good racing is going on...give me a break!

It isn't just you.

[harvick#1]

holy cow Vitor,

that was very scary on board of Meira jumping over Marco.


awesome win for Ryan and the 300th win for Penske :D

[harvick#1]

Congrats to Briscoe on his first IndyCar victory (although the yellow at the end probably saved him, as Dixon was looking very menacing).

the 2 cars were evenly matched at the end, it would've taken a lapped car to have had Scott pass Ryan. Scott was better in 1 and 2, but Ryan was way better in 3 and 4

[xtlm]

marco marco marco, when will it stop....

anyway, very nice to see brisco finally not have a dumb mistake or bad luck!

awesome race (and to the comment on the broadcasting.....yeah, it wont ever change.....)

[xtlm]

oh and for the second race in row they did not show the series standings!

why??????????!!!!!!!! (or did i just miss it...)

you would think that they would want to mention that their lovebird is now in 5th...

[NickFalzone]

The whole broadcast suffers from an extreme case of ADD. From Marty's endless off-topic rants, Jack Arute's "behind the scenes" stories that lose me way before the punchline, the constant commercial breaks, the endless packages/repeats from Indy, the technical glitches (anyone else have out of sync audio and video?), bad camerawork... it almost makes me happy to hear Goodyear's monotone remarks on the racing action. Not to give NASCAR any credit here, but FOX had the Dover race this afternoon that went twice as long, and they managed to focus on racing for the better part of it. I'd say there was 45 minutes of actual full-screen IndyCar racing with track commentary today, and that's being generous.

Edit: Just watched some of the videos from the race on IndyCar.com - wow, Mike King and team at IMS radio are such an improvement, I might have to listen to that from now on.

[beachbum]

oh and for the second race in row they did not show the series standings!

why??????????!!!!!!!! (or did i just miss it...)

you would think that they would want to mention that their lovebird is now in 5th...They did, at least the top 10. You missed it.

I watched only the last bit on TV when the online radio somehow was 4 laps behind the TV coverage. The radio (internet) coverage was pretty good, as they talked a lot about the mid pack battles and why some drivers were moving up and some moving backwards. I watched the TV with sound off, and listened to the radio. A nice way to get the whole story.

[Canada Cornrow]

Having just returned from Milwaukee I can see I won't miss anything when I watch the Tivo'd version Tuesday night. All I can say was Servia was racing hard all day. He had an awsome battle with Carpenter that seemed to go on forever near the end. Ryan Hunter Rheay had a couple tank slappers in turn four too. This was one of the best races I've seen at Milwaukee in quite some time. Our section of seating was quite empty though.

[e2mtt]

I agree... the TV is terrible. ESPN used to be the gold standard for racing coverage, lately it's been terrible. Too much focus on certain famous drivers at the expense of others, a terrible tendency to miss action while doing meaningless interviews, way too much contrived controversy (like hopeing Danica would ram Brisco or something in retaliation for Indy), too much zooming in and close-up tracking with the camera (which I think doesn't show the actual racing near as well & gets tiring to watch in a hurry), very poor understanding or clumsy interpretation of racing tactics & strategy, too much wasted screen space in the side-by-side segments, etc. etc. etc.

Good race however.

[BobGarage]

Edit: Just watched some of the videos from the race on IndyCar.com - wow, Mike King and team at IMS radio are such an improvement, I might have to listen to that from now on.

The IMS radio team have had their off days this season (both Long Beach and St Pete they were useless), but yesterday they were great! A lot of passion about what was going on on the track and didn't miss a thing.

As the UK's coverage started after the race finished I then watched the international feed after watching the online stream. The international commentators were aweful, missed a lot of the action at the start and throughout the race.

[millencolin]

Holy Crap! What a race... the last 50 laps were the most intense laps ive witnessed in a long time. Good to see Ryan shut up his critics with a beautiful drive, it was magnificent!!! I was never so happy to see a yellow come out

The coverage was down right horrible... but when the result goes your way you dont care about the coverage!!!

Ryan may be a dirty cockroach southener, but any Aussie winning is a fantastic thing, and something i want to see more of!

[Komahawk]

A fine drive by Ryan. On the other hand he really needed this result. Another DNF would've been dreadful.
So far five different winners in six races, not counting Long Beach. And Castroneves and Kanaan are certain to win races, too. It's gonna be a monster season finale!


BTW, how about Meira at the end? Is it just me or should he have rather moved to the inside to dodge Marco, who was drifting towards the outside? IMO Vitor could've avoided contact that way.

[usgrandprix]

I agree... the TV is terrible. ESPN used to be the gold standard for racing coverage, lately it's been terrible. Too much focus on certain famous drivers at the expense of others, a terrible tendency to miss action while doing meaningless interviews, way too much contrived controversy (like hopeing Danica would ram Brisco or something in retaliation for Indy), too much zooming in and close-up tracking with the camera (which I think doesn't show the actual racing near as well & gets tiring to watch in a hurry), very poor understanding or clumsy interpretation of racing tactics & strategy, too much wasted screen space in the side-by-side segments, etc. etc. etc.

Pretty much exactly how I felt. Horrible coverage. I try to be patient, but it was very frustrating watching their coverage of that race. They need to pick it up. Sure, put in the ocassional magazine piece when they are spread out and the race is slow, but not when Hunter-Reay and Power are going at it for 5 intense laps.

It was such an exciting race in the top 5 or 6, even if not always right at front and I feel like I missed a lot of it. Pretty bad when Brianne Pedigo's reporting is the best part of your coverage.

I'm trying to be positive and patient, but this is getting frustrating.

Oh, and great drive Ryan.

[dataman1]

Ditto on the TV coverage.

I agree with G. Rahal on need for more agressive officiating to require lap down cars to move/give way to leader's.

Great drive by Briscoe!

Viso is fearless. They could have followed him with a camera.

Great comeback by Servia and team.

Anyone hear why Marco fell backwards??

[e2mtt]

...

I agree with G. Rahal on need for more agressive officiating to require lap down cars to move/give way to leader's.

...

I think G. Rahal is great, but he just got too aggressive, trying to drive around the outside of 2 lapped machines. They had their own scrap going on, and Rahal should have waited a bit for them to get in line, and gone under them. I think it is good to let the lapped cars be part of the show and make the leaders actually race with them, rather then always blue-flagging them off of the racing line.

[dataman1]

I think G. Rahal is great, but he just got too aggressive, trying to drive around the outside of 2 lapped machines. They had their own scrap going on, and Rahal should have waited a bit for them to get in line, and gone under them. I think it is good to let the lapped cars be part of the show and make the leaders actually race with them, rather then always blue-flagging them off of the racing line.

Granted young Rahal got fed up with following 2 lapped cars and made a bad decision at that time. Re-watch the race and you will see that he follows those 2 for several laps and at one time had to brake so hard after a block move that Castroneves almost passes him.

I don't suggest the officials call every lap down car and tell them to move over however the officials can watch and see that multiple attempts to pass are not successful due to blocking and or disregard for faster cars and make the call then.

Put youself in Rahal's position. You know you are faster that the guys ahead. You've got a good car on your butt trying to pass you. How long do you wait? How many times do you get blocked before you get frustrated and take a risk?

I am not a Rahal fan, so you can put any driver's name in place of his.

[downtowndeco]

I seem to recall a wave of crashes when the first wave of CART teams (Rahal, Andretti, Penske) came over to the IRL. IMO it was due to the "street circuit" mindset that that the drivers had. Street circuits, being hard to pass on, make it almost impossible to have patience. You need to dive bomb & go for a pass whenever you may see a glimmer of an opening. Oval racing is much more about having patience & setting up a pass. Scoping the driver in front of you out until you see that one spot where you can safely get by him.

[bblocker68]

Wow, awesome race. I really miss seeing that large of a field at The Mile.

You guys are right about the broadcast. It was poor to say the least. I liked the Indy Lights team of Jenkins, Buhl and King sooo much more when I watched the Indy race.

I think they should swap broadcast teams and put Jack-A-Root out to pasture.

[RJL25]

i think rahal is suffering the same sort of problem as Ryan Briscoe suffered when he first came on the scene, all the talent in the world but just no patience. In Ryan's case it came out of years being a test driver for toyota and not doing all that much actual racing, and for rahal i think, as strange as it may sound, he got his first win a bit too early and now expects it to happen rather then working hard with patience to make it happen.

But many great drivers tore up lots of cars early in their careers, its part of learning. As Briscoe proved today you can turn it around and prove the critics wrong. Now the ducks off broscoe's back i think he can go on with it, i don't think even his critics doubt the talent ryan has, all he has to do is start putting it together and drive smart races like he did at milwaukee and he'll win alot of races in his career!

[e2mtt]

If a lapped driver is actively racing & blocking a driver on the lead lap, I agree, the blue flag should be used.

If 2 lapped drivers are racing each other, and in the process obstucting an unlapped car, race control should allow them sort it out on track for the most part.

Drivers should definatly be allowed to fight to stay on the lead lap.

NASCAR tends to handle this pretty well, everybody fights hard to stay on the lead lap, then mostly pull aside to led others through once they are lapped. This helps tighten the race as the leader negotiates traffic, and when the occasional scrap holds up a leader in traffic, its all part of the show.

Formula 1 gets it absolutly wrong, IMO. Drivers can block much faster cars for lap after lap, yet should the leader get within a straightaway behind, the blue flags come out, and they have to give up the lead lap.

[coogmaster]

I agree with everything on this post. Great racing, awesome individual battles, great two car race at the end. I think Briscoe would have been able to hold Dixon off at the end had the crash not occured, although it would have been interesting to see what would have happened.

Briscoe did a great job of avoiding that wreck BTW.

Andretti needs to get a brain check before the next race. Ruined a good day for both himself and Carpenter.

Servia probably would have given Dixon and Briscoe a run at the end had he not had his troubles early on. He really impressed me with his performance.

Unfortunatley, its the same ol' story with the top 5 (red, white and green). It just seems like week in and week out, those 5 drivers are just on another level than the rest of the competition. Hopefully Vision can catch up on the bigger tracks and the transition guys will show their muscle at the road/street courses. But these top 5 always seem like they will be in contention no matter what.

Overall, a great race. Love the traffic, makes me excited for Iowa and Richmond.

As far as the broadcast goes, you guys should try my method: Turn down the volume, and pretend that Paul Page and Bobby Unser are calling the race in the booth, with a younger Jack-the-fruit as well as Gary Gerould and Jerry Punch in the pits. You would be suprised on how much better the broadcast is when you use your imagination.

[dj420]

You would be suprised on how much better the broadcast is when you use your imagination.
I haven't had that much imagination since my borderline drug culture days. ;)

[coogmaster]

I haven't had that much imagination since my borderline drug culture days. ;)

Well, I'm 22, so those days aren't quite behind me yet...

[tbyars]

I agree... the TV is terrible. ESPN used to be the gold standard for racing coverage, lately it's been terrible.

As has been pointed out elsewhere, everyone is really quick to jump on ESPN/ABC for these problems.

Don't forget that ALL that ABC or ESPN does is show the race. It does not produce the broadcast!

The broadcast production, from the camera angles to the announcers, is the purview of Indianapolis Motor Speedway Productions. You can gripe to and about ABC/ESPN all you want, but they aren't the source of the problem!

[e2mtt]

As has been pointed out elsewhere, everyone is really quick to jump on ESPN/ABC for these problems.

Don't forget that ALL that ABC or ESPN does is show the race. It does not produce the broadcast!

The broadcast production, from the camera angles to the announcers, is the purview of Indianapolis Motor Speedway Productions. You can gripe to and about ABC/ESPN all you want, but they aren't the source of the problem!

Are you sure about that? I am pretty sure that the announcers are ABC anchors, not Indy employees. I have watched some Nascar Nationwide races on ESPN this year, and the broadcast was much more like the Indycar broadcasts (not in a good way) then the other Nascar networks. More "emotion" emphasis, a poorer understanding of race strategy, and some of the same anchors & pit reporters.

[!!WALDO!!]

If a lapped driver is actively racing & blocking a driver on the lead lap, I agree, the blue flag should be used.

Of all the flags the starter has, which one is discretionary and not mandatory?

Situations arise like a famous picture taken in 1963 of Johnny White in a dirt car going into three being lapped by Len Sutton in a Roadster and Sutton is being lapped by Clark in a Lotus-Ford.

So who was the "move over flag" for then?

Yes different time and in 1963, one less car starting the race.

[NickFalzone]

Are you sure about that? I am pretty sure that the announcers are ABC anchors, not Indy employees. I have watched some Nascar Nationwide races on ESPN this year, and the broadcast was much more like the Indycar broadcasts (not in a good way) then the other Nascar networks. More "emotion" emphasis, a poorer understanding of race strategy, and some of the same anchors & pit reporters.

You are exactly right. I'm not going to get into this any more because it's a pointless discussion. But yes, FOX does a stellar job on NASCAR and it's depressing when they switch over to ABC for the rest of the season. Same nonsense we get in the IRL broadcasts. ABC/ESPN just doesn't get racing. They generally manage to pull together a decent Indy broadcast, but the rest of the season, forget about it. If they want to stick with Goodyear and Reid, fine. I can live with that. Even Arute and Pedigo are OK, and Arute knows his stuff, he's just stuck doing stupid emotional behind the scenes crap these days. The problem is the endless commercial, the side by side, and the ADD of the whole production. Just STFU for a few minutes and broadcast some racing. Stop trying to "create stories" and morsels of action every time you get back from a commercial. Good hard racing is entertainment enough.

[tbyars]

Are you sure about that? I am pretty sure that the announcers are ABC anchors, not Indy employees. I have watched some Nascar Nationwide races on ESPN this year, and the broadcast was much more like the Indycar broadcasts (not in a good way) then the other Nascar networks. More "emotion" emphasis, a poorer understanding of race strategy, and some of the same anchors & pit reporters.

Absolutely.

All ABC/ESPN does is broadcast the race. The production of the race is done by IMSP. 100%.

Next time you go to a race, see how many ABC or ESPN trucks you see. All you will see is the IMSP trucks.

[tbyars]

You are exactly right. I'm not going to get into this any more because it's a pointless discussion. But yes, FOX does a stellar job on NASCAR and it's depressing when they switch over to ABC for the rest of the season. Same nonsense we get in the IRL broadcasts. ABC/ESPN just doesn't get racing. They generally manage to pull together a decent Indy broadcast, but the rest of the season, forget about it. If they want to stick with Goodyear and Reid, fine. I can live with that. Even Arute and Pedigo are OK, and Arute knows his stuff, he's just stuck doing stupid emotional behind the scenes crap these days. The problem is the endless commercial, the side by side, and the ADD of the whole production. Just STFU for a few minutes and broadcast some racing. Stop trying to "create stories" and morsels of action every time you get back from a commercial. Good hard racing is entertainment enough.

Nick, what you say may be right, but ABC/ESPN DOES NOT PRODUCE THE RACES. They are not responsible for any of that. IMSP is.

[45 Below]

Holy Crap! What a race... the last 50 laps were the most intense laps ive witnessed in a long time. Good to see Ryan shut up his critics with a beautiful drive, it was magnificent!!! I was never so happy to see a yellow come out

The coverage was down right horrible... but when the result goes your way you dont care about the coverage!!!

Ryan may be a dirty cockroach southener, but any Aussie winning is a fantastic thing, and something i want to see more of!

Great to see the guy get that monkey off his back - even if it meant beating Dixon in the process.

Now if we can just find some Kiwi heritage ...

[NickFalzone]

On tv it looked like mostly full stands, anyone at the race notice an improvement over last year? This is good news, because while this is a classic track it hasn't had great attendance. Curt Cavin says it seemed like double the crowd on his blog:

Question: I only had a chance to watch the last 40 laps of Milwaukee but what a great finish with Penske once again making a great strategic move to seal the win. Question for you is how was the post-blendification crowd compared to last year? (Steve, Memphis, Tenn.)
Answer: I don't think there's any question everyone had to be pleased with the crowd at Milwaukee, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was double last year's.

[CARTDM15]

A very good race and nice crowd but the TV numbers most improve.A .8 on ABC is awful.Those are WNBA numbers.
I don't care who is doing the production.The announcers are still very bad.Good announcers can cover up bad production.I wish ABC would get rid of everybody but Vince Welch.