What happens to Bourdais?

[Ranger]

...considering STR is going bust, and Vettel's pretty much been given a blank cheque by the Red Bull A-team for the 2009 seat.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/66666

Vettel tipped for RBR switch in 2009

By Steven English and Steve Cooper Wednesday, April 16th 2008, 10:03 GMT


Red Bull protege Sebastian Vettel is likely to switch to the firm's A-team for next year after impressing the team's bosses in the first three races of this season.

The 20-year-old has yet to finish a race this year, but his pace so far has contributed to an increasing wave of approval from Red Bull's senior racing management.

I also like this gem from Berger:

"We're equal for both drivers but Sebastian has been in the team a bit longer and the guys all like him."

[markabilly]

...considering STR is going bust, and Vettel's pretty much been given a blank cheque by the Red Bull A-team for the 2009 seat.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/66666
Go go kart racing as Scot Speed's new team mate..... :D

[jens]

It's quite possible to see Le Seb continuing in the current team and even if it gets a new ownership, then they may be sensible enough to keep one driver (if keeping another is out of question) to have some continuity in case Bourdais performs well.

If for some reason SB doesn't continue in STR or it's successor, then... it's hard to suggest a clear destination to him (once there were rumours that he might go to NASCAR), but I guess it's a bit too early to speculate about that. First let's see, how will the rest of the driver market unfold (especially FA and FM).

[ShiftingGears]

Fingers crossed that he stays, especially if he continues beating Vettel like he did in Bahrain.

[veeten]

One has to take a good look at the individuals that spoke in the article and think about it...

a massive PR job, considering that their boy hasn't done quite well the past few races, and 'the new guy' has brought the car home on occasion and scored points. National pride will take a big hit if this trend continues, so 'talking up' a driver, instead of relying on recent performances, is the tactic that Berger, Markko, and Tost are left with.

The real stinger in this is if, by the end of the season, Bourdais continues to be consistent with the car, places high in the standings, and just kicks the crap out of Vettel on the track, the Red Bull 'Brain Trust' will look more like the Three Stooges in overrating a 'pay driver', disguised as a fellow countryman.

watch this space...

[ioan]

One has to take a good look at the individuals that spoke in the article and think about it...

a massive PR job, considering that their boy hasn't done quite well the past few races, and 'the new guy' has brought the car home on occasion and scored points. National pride will take a big hit if this trend continues, so 'talking up' a driver, instead of relying on recent performances, is the tactic that Berger, Markko, and Tost are left with.

The real stinger in this is if, by the end of the season, Bourdais continues to be consistent with the car, places high in the standings, and just kicks the crap out of Vettel on the track, the Red Bull 'Brain Trust' will look more like the Three Stooges in overrating a 'pay driver', disguised as a fellow countryman.

watch this space...

What's all this "fellow countryman" talk about?!

[woody2goody]

Does anyone think that Bourdais may join Vettel at Red Bull Racing and DC and Webber will both be on their way?

I think they should seriously consider running STR (or whatever it will be called) as a proper junior team again, so why not put Sebastien Buemi and Neel Jani in the car for next year?

[gloomyDAY]

Does anyone think that Bourdais may join Vettel at Red Bull Racing and DC and Webber will both be on their way?

I think they should seriously consider running STR (or whatever it will be called) as a proper junior team again, so why not put Sebastien Buemi and Neel Jani in the car for next year?I've been saying this for months.


I read what Vettel said and I'm sure he's confident.

All I can do is sit on my hands and wait for the first race. Really want the 'Sebs' to do well this season, but I don't want to jinx it. Since I believe the 'Sebs' are the future of Red Bull they need to perform well in order to make the A team next season.Sack Mark and DC, then let the Seb's take their place.

[truefan72]

One has to take a good look at the individuals that spoke in the article and think about it...

a massive PR job, considering that their boy hasn't done quite well the past few races, and 'the new guy' has brought the car home on occasion and scored points. National pride will take a big hit if this trend continues, so 'talking up' a driver, instead of relying on recent performances, is the tactic that Berger, Markko, and Tost are left with.

The real stinger in this is if, by the end of the season, Bourdais continues to be consistent with the car, places high in the standings, and just kicks the crap out of Vettel on the track, the Red Bull 'Brain Trust' will look more like the Three Stooges in overrating a 'pay driver', disguised as a fellow countryman.

watch this space...


Vettel is German
Red Bull/Torro Rosso is Austrian

[woody2goody]

I think he means that Vettel is STR's wonderkid and maybe they aren't too happy that Bourdais has outscored him so far?

Webber's career isn't going anywhere and DC probably has one year left at Red Bull in him, but I wouldn't put him infront of a multiple champ like Bourdais. Either DC goes to STR or he becomes the test driver.

[veeten]

Pardon my mistake, on the subject of nationality and Berger, Marko, and Tost... :o

but the main gist of my original post stands, that the PR job these three are doing for Vettel is an exercise in trying to drum up reasons for moving him to the senior team (RBR). The more his teammate, whom is better experienced, produces better results, the more they look foolish. :dork: :bonce:

There is no longer a Minardi-type team that others can see as a proving ground for drivers that show the capabilities of being in a top team, so we are reduced to this; accomplishment via Press Release, and advancement via contractural agreement. :rolleyes:

[woody2goody]

That's a decent point. I think both Sebs are very good and they should both be given an equal chance at getting into the RBR team. I wonder if Bourdais outscores Vettel about 20 points to 5 this year (probably not going to happen), whether he will get promoted over Vettel? :)

but the main gist of my original post stands, that the PR job these three are doing for Vettel is an exercise in trying to drum up reasons for moving him to the senior team (RBR). The more his teammate, whom is better experienced, produces better results, the more they look foolish. :dork: :bonce:

Except that Bourdais hasn't beaten Vettel in a straight fight yet. Vettel has had three retirements to Bourdais one. Vettel has retired because of engine failure in one race and damage caused by others in two races.

He has out-qualified Bourdais 2-1.

Since qualifying is the only place where there has been a straight fight and were a straight comparison can be made, Vettel is producing better results.

He is quicker, with no 'fuel adjustment'.

[jens]

This is true that we can't make a proper comparison between the two Sebs yet. There hasn't been a single race, where one of them hasn't been out in the first few laps. So we have to keep patience and see several more GP weekends before making a judgement.

[woody2goody]

I think Bourdais is doing very well considering his transition from Champ Car. He has coped well so far with a car that is much different to drive.

Vettel has the edge IMO but both guys are elevating that team. Now if they can run their new car in Spain they may be able to show DC and Webber a thing or two.

[ioan]

Bourdais is certainly not making himself favors with the team at the moment:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/66675


Toro Rosso team principal Franz Tost ruled out mechanical failure as the cause of the accident, saying: "He simply went too fast."

The damage to the STR3 means that Sebastian Vettel will not be able to sample the new car tomorrow as planned.

[keysersoze]

So some think that Webber needs to go to make way for Bourdais? What has Mark done to warrant his nonrenewal? How much of his equipment failure is his fault?

Where would he go if he's not renewed at RBR?

[maximilian]

Bourdais can always go back to Indycar if he doesn't get a seat in F1. With the merger, hopefully we'll see more ex-F1 drivers going to Indycar as a viable open-wheel alternative, but we shall see...

[ioan]

So some think that Webber needs to go to make way for Bourdais? What has Mark done to warrant his nonrenewal? How much of his equipment failure is his fault?

Where would he go if he's not renewed at RBR?

DTM seems to be the place they are all wanted.

[Stuartf12007]

Bourdais could take barichello's seat at honda, but only if he has a magnificent season.

[woody2goody]

So some think that Webber needs to go to make way for Bourdais? What has Mark done to warrant his nonrenewal? How much of his equipment failure is his fault?

Where would he go if he's not renewed at RBR?

I don't think Webber is as good as Bourdais myself. I think with a season under his belt Seb will be really good, and he's got championship pedigree against really good drivers in the USA.

Maybe Webber could go into the STR team? I think he's getting to the point where his career won't go any further up the grid.

[CNR]

given that
Bourdais destroys NEW Toro Rosso car


he may be on his way out at the end of the year.
do not forget that he manage by jean todt son and even if toro rosso do not use the Ferrari engine he will be out.

as for mark webber NOW might be the time to move to toyota

[ShiftingGears]

Whats all this crap about Webber leaving Red Bull? The guy is solid, consistant and fast. One of the best drivers on the grid easily. Besides being in STR, neither of the Seb's have done anything that would warrant his removal.

[jens]

I don't expect Webber to leave Red Bull either, especially if RB establishes itself as a constant point scorer as they have done in the past two races. The only clearly better options for Webber would be Ferrari, BMW or McLaren, but I don't think he can be considered as a serious candidate into any of those teams.

There is a slight chance that RB might hire both Bourdais and Vettel for next season, but I guess a more sensible move would be keeping Webber and... hiring Vettel (had to make a choice here! :D ) alongside him, which could create an exciting team-mate battle.

Generally I'm expecting Webber to get a contract extension with RB for 1-2 extra seasons, but if for some strange reason MW and RB part ways, then Webber might find a new drive in a team like... Honda (Rubens will be retired).

[gloomyDAY]

He shunted a test run. So what?

Nothing was done intentionally and his thoughts of the car are positive.
Bourdais' position is secure within the team and looks like the climb up the ladder is going to be highly accessible to Le Seb.

I'm adamant that DC's race days are numbered with Red Bull. He's inconsistent and there is more potential with the either one of the Seb's. Mark is a question mark since he will probably look for another team once his contract is done.

[woody2goody]

given that
Bourdais destroys NEW Toro Rosso car


he may be on his way out at the end of the year.
do not forget that he manage by jean todt son and even if toro rosso do not use the Ferrari engine he will be out.

as for mark webber NOW might be the time to move to toyota

Toyota's drivers are better a far as I'm concerned. I know Webber fans are probably going to be insulted by this, but why not Force India for next season. He could team with Fisichella to form a solid veteran pairing, and given the way that team are improving could still score some points.

I don't mind Webber and think he should be in F1, but he's not good enough to be in the top 3 teams. Having said that RBR will probably keep him for next year. But i think Toyota have their best ever driver pairing now. Trulli is driving like an absolute legend!

[millencolin]

DTM seems to be the place they are all wanted.

He's Australian, so try v8supercars!

But Webber getting the boot? Why exactly? Quick qualifier, regularly the 'best of the rest', scored points in the last 2 races, kept hamilton at bay in Malaysia... I dont see any reason for him to get the boot (and im looking from a non-biased point of view).

Seabass is a driver i rate extremely highly (although i'm not a fan of his. i.e Surfers Paradise 2006), He is not going to get the Red Bull seat if one becomes available.

What about Honda? Barrichello is nearing the end of his career... Renault if Piquet continues to disappoint (no wait, i forgot he had a falling out with flavio a few years back)... or stays with the team under new ownership

[ioan]

He shunted a test run. So what?

That was the only test car they had and now they can't test it anymore, might have to postpone it's racing debut too.
Nothing to make the team happy, and it's a team with little finances too.

[ioan]

He's Australian, so try v8supercars!

You're right, that's the right one for him.



Seabass is a driver i rate extremely highly (although i'm not a fan of his. i.e Surfers Paradise 2006), He is not going to get the Red Bull seat if one becomes available.

What about Honda? Barrichello is nearing the end of his career... Renault if Piquet continues to disappoint (no wait, i forgot he had a falling out with flavio a few years back)... or stays with the team under new ownership

Berger will keep his 50% in the team, so it's not like a complete ownership change. Also it it is to become a Kuwait founded team, as it seems at the moment, I think that it will be Berger who will decide about the drivers they will use, so I think Bourdais will stay with STR unless he makes something very stupid.

[Ranger]

and it's a team with little finances too.

Is it? The team is based out of Minardi's old headquarters but with Red Bull backing (and cars!)its barely running on slim pickin's.

Although it's just one accident.

[markabilly]

given that
Bourdais destroys NEW Toro Rosso car


he may be on his way out at the end of the year.
do not forget that he manage by jean todt son and even if toro rosso do not use the Ferrari engine he will be out.

as for mark webber NOW might be the time to move to toyota


Well Scott Speedie may decide that he does NOT want him for a teamate after all....those go- karts can cost too much money to have careless drivers crunchin them