Jenson Blames Coulthard for their collision..

[Zico]

I cant believe Jenson is throwing the blame in Davids direction...


"Button and Coulthard tangled, with the Honda driver blaming his close friend
"When I caught up with DC he was struggling," Button said.

"He moved across for his racing line but it was too late - I was already committing.

"Hitting him in the side was me trying to take avoiding action.

"That's not the first time he has done that. He left it too late and there was nowhere for me to go."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7333277.stm


The Coulthard/Massa incident was debatable.. but this one?
IMO I think Jenson needs to watch the footage again before pointing any fingers.

[ioan]

This was about the same as with Felipe!
They should tell DC not to sleep while others are racing him, he is clearly way to slow when taking decisions.

JB is right, it was DC's fault as it was in Oz.

[Zico]

This was about the same as with Felipe!
They should tell DC not to sleep while others are racing him, he is clearly way to slow when taking decisions.

JB is right, it was DC's fault as it was in Oz.

Dont you believe that Button should have been level or at least have had his front wheel along side David in the braking zone? That is the general unwritten rule on aportioning blame..

[wedge]

Racing incident, though I think blame goes slightly towards JB.

JB made the move just as DC decided to close the door, and JB lost control of the car under braking and took out DC.

Personally I don't have a problem with moving across the braking zone - that's racing, IMHO.

[ArrowsFA1]

JB explained he was committed to the move well before the corner, and DC changed his line slightly when the Honda was already committed. You could tell JB was trying to take avoiding action but to no avail.

[Garry Walker]

DC was the idiot here, he should be given a suspended ban for this idiocy. He changed his line when Button had already taken a line, so there was nothing he could do anymore. Stupid.

[ioan]

It was the same scenario as in Oz, DC is being passed, the other car comes along the RedBull (what a fitting name for a car that constantly runs into others! :p : ), than DC decides that others have no right for a piece of tarmac and runs into them.
Send the bull home! ;)

[I am evil Homer]

DC should be pensioned off I think...always with the brain fade must be getting senile.

[Zico]

JB explained he was committed to the move well before the corner, and DC changed his line slightly when the Honda was already committed. You could tell JB was trying to take avoiding action but to no avail.

I agree, but I dont think this necesarily makes David guilty.. he is entitled to defend his position after all... Im with wedge on this one.

Ioan- Your idol MS suggested Massas move on Coulthard was optimistic when they collided..... this move was even more optimistic in Jensons case.

[DazzlaF1]

TBH i dont see how either Button or DC could blame each other for the incident, i just see it as a racing accident, Button looke dlike he tried to brake late, lost control of the rear slightly and DC didnt know he was coming in that hot.

[ioan]

Ioan- Your idol MS suggested Massas move on Coulthard was optimistic when they collided..... this move was even more optimistic in Jensons case.

Unlike others I do have my own opinion.
And unlike others I believe that it can't be always some others fault when DC has a blackout!

[ioan]

... and DC didnt know he was coming in that hot.

That's the problem every time, he never knows.
They should tell him that the mirrors are not only aerodynamic devices! ;)

[nigelred5]

When I looked at the replay, I see DC moving left slightly prior to the corner, opening the door. JB committed and was coming along side when DC closed the door pretty hard. JB did try to avoid but was already pinched with no where to go. I wouldn't place blame entirely on DC, however he just as easily could have made the turn and maintained his place with a wider line that would have minimised if not avoided the contact altogether. Racing incident IMO. DC needs to admit to himself that he's the old guy in the series and he doesn't have the car to hide that.

[Faisal]

That was clearly JB's fault. DC was on the right line, Jenson partially cut the track and tried getting past him and hit him !

[markabilly]

Racing incident, though I think blame goes slightly towards JB.

JB made the move just as DC decided to close the door, and JB lost control of the car under braking and took out DC.

Personally I don't have a problem with moving across the braking zone - that's racing, IMHO.


This attitude is part of the reason there is no passing inF1. Perfectly acceptable to slam the door as someone tries to come up along side of him.

This is just a repeat of the other "racing incidents" involving DC.


It was the same scenario as in Oz, DC is being passed, the other car comes along the RedBull (what a fitting name for a car that constantly runs into others! :p : ), than DC decides that others have no right for a piece of tarmac and runs into them.
Send the bull home! ;)

He can not help it.
As he said before, his eyes point forward, not backward.

Whenever DC hits anyone, it is only because they are in the way of his "racing line" and doing something stupid, the little####s. All of them need the ####% kicked out of them!!!

[markabilly]

Ioan- Your idol MS suggested Massas move on Coulthard was optimistic when they collided..... this move was even more optimistic in Jensons case.
MS said the same thing about JV at a certain race in Jerez......"optimistic" means if they can run into you while slamming the door, the other driver is optimstic.

If DC can just keep this up, he will never lose any position nor be passed.......

[Phoenix]

As in Oz, I see this as the fault of the driver trying to pass.

Much as I like Bunsen, he was not ahead and was in the same position as Massa.

[Phoenix]

Unlike others I do have my own opinion.

I thought I made it clear - when I want your opinion, I'll give it to you! :p :

[markabilly]

let me guess, "phonenix" is a newbie, rising from the ashes, perhaps banned in another life???

A lttle obvious? Who is you really? who?

[tinchote]

It was the same scenario as in Oz, DC is being passed, the other car comes along the RedBull (what a fitting name for a car that constantly runs into others! :p : ), than DC decides that others have no right for a piece of tarmac and runs into them.
Send the bull home! ;)

The detail here is that JB was never "along". He locked his wheels when his car was still completely behind DC's. How could he think that he would ever make the turn I cannot understand. Even after losing control of the car and using DC's car to stop, he couldn't make the turn.

[Phoenix]

let me guess, "phonenix" is a newbie, rising from the ashes, perhaps banned in another life???

A lttle obvious? Who is you really? who?

I don't know what you mean?

[markabilly]

I don't know what you mean?
who were you before? flat tyres? valve


confess now or else :arrows:

[Phoenix]

who were you before? flat tyres? valve


confess now or else :arrows:
There's an engineering theme to the above names I see, perhaps I was Dodgy Solenoid, or maybe Blown Head Gasket....

Actually, I am really just a humble bird of ficticious origin, belonging first to R Harris, but now M Gambon (who had to give up homosexuality because it made his eyes water)

So what happened to flat tyres and valve then? Did they shout Jehova or something?

[markabilly]

There's an engineering theme to the above names I see, perhaps I was Dodgy Solenoid, or maybe Blown Head Gasket....

Actually, I am really just a humble bird of ficticious origin, belonging first to R Harris, but now M Gambon (who had to give up homosexuality because it made his eyes water)

So what happened to flat tyres and valve then? Did they shout Jehova or something?
i see, you can not tell us or you might get banned again.....

[Phoenix]

i see, you can not tell us or you might get banned again.....

I refer my learned friend to the answer I gave earlier..http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=456428&postcount=21

[BDunnell]

The detail here is that JB was never "along". He locked his wheels when his car was still completely behind DC's. How could he think that he would ever make the turn I cannot understand. Even after losing control of the car and using DC's car to stop, he couldn't make the turn.

Exactly my reading of the incident. Not Coulthard's fault.

(Incidentally, I fully expect someone or other to make an 'amusing' comment along the lines of 'You're not Scottish, are you?' as a result of this post.)

[ioan]

The detail here is that JB was never "along". He locked his wheels when his car was still completely behind DC's. How could he think that he would ever make the turn I cannot understand. Even after losing control of the car and using DC's car to stop, he couldn't make the turn.

You might be right.
I'll have to hunt down a replay on the net, cause each time I've seen it (2 or 3) JB was up enough on the inside to have he's front wing touch DC's right front wheel.

[BDunnell]

You might be right.
I'll have to hunt down a replay on the net, cause each time I've seen it (2 or 3) JB was up enough on the inside to have he's front wing touch DC's right front wheel.

He was indeed that far alongside Coulthard, but not entirely under control on the brakes.

[jjanicke]

F1 should institute a common sense no-blocking rule. You can change your racing line, but not in reaction to your mirrors.

Although Button was optimistic, had DC given him the room and not reacted to Button's line they would have avoided the collision. DC clearly reacts, and cuts back to the inside, after starting to set himself up for the turn.

I fully blame DC for this incident.

[janneppi]

Button was being a bit thick with his approach, he seems to loose his rear when he's behing DC and can't stop his car.
DC couldn't really do anything at that point as Button was out of control going a straight line.

[Phoenix]

Button was being a bit thick with his approach, he seems to loose his rear when he's behing DC and can't stop his car.
DC couldn't really do anything at that point as Button was out of control going a straight line.

I also think the difference between this and the DC/FM accident is that DC - clearly mindful of the Oz incident - did not turn in on JB, but JB slid into, and almost over DC.

I have seen an amusing referral to DC on here somewhere as Spongebob! Priceless. :)

[CNR]

after the crash when he was in the pits talking to louise goodman he said that dc seen him and tried to turn away but it was to late.

[tinchote]

after the crash when he was in the pits talking to louise goodman he said that dc seen him and tried to turn away but it was to late.

That was classical "it's never my fault" Jenson ;) :D

[wedge]

It was the same scenario as in Oz, DC is being passed, the other car comes along the RedBull (what a fitting name for a car that constantly runs into others! :p : ), than DC decides that others have no right for a piece of tarmac and runs into them.
Send the bull home! ;)

The difference between Melbourne incident was that Massa was alongside DC and made the move stick whereas in Bahrain JB's manoeuvre was somewhat optimistic and lost the car underbraking.


This attitude is part of the reason there is no passing inF1. Perfectly acceptable to slam the door as someone tries to come up along side of him.

I personally don't have much of a problem with blocking but there is a grey area which blurs the moral code eg moving across the braking zone, squeezing your opponent onto the edge of the track.

The guy infront has as much right to defend his position just as much as the guy behind should be able to overtake - as long as he makes the move stick.

There has been good example over the years of good and fair blocking in F1:

Senna vs. Mansell - Monaco 1992

Schumi vs. Hill - Spa 1994

Alonso vs. Schumi - Imola 2005

Schumi vs Alonso - Imola 2006

That's all part of racing. Last year Bourdais complained about Doornbos' driving in a CCWS race in Canada and quite rightly Sea-bass was booed by the patriotic crowd.

[Rollo]

I don't think that this is even a case of blocking per se. You'd normally expect drivers to move to the inside of a corner on the racing line. I doubt whether DC even deviated more than about 3 feet from that. Button stuck his nose in where it didn't belong and looked stupid as a result.

Jehova Jehova Jehova... hmm. Semprini :D

[jso1985]

Both have some fault IMO thus it makes it just another racing incident.

Coulthard closed the door too late(and after from what it seemed like he was opening the door), while Button was way too optimistic and even locked the wheels... block or no blocking from Coulthard, he wasn't going to make it through that corner...

[jjanicke]

Button lost control of his car (i.e. back end stepping out and wheels locking) because DC gave him an opportunity and then, after noticing that Button could make it, took it away.

Optimistic move by Button and an idiotic block by DC.

[markabilly]

The ...



I personally don't have much of a problem with blocking but there is a grey area which blurs the moral code eg moving across the braking zone, squeezing your opponent onto the edge of the track.

crowd.

Time to take away the "grey area" as it permits bumper car excuses.


Button lost control of his car (i.e. back end stepping out and wheels locking) because DC gave him an opportunity and then, after noticing that Button could make it, took it away.

Optimistic move by Button and an idiotic block by DC.

Yep and as long as the "gray area", slam the door is okay, is permitted to continue, then there is one the biggst problems with F1 and passing. Car to the inside of a corner should have the right of way. Car to the outside must make room.

Failure to do so should have some amajor penalty involved beyond the result of the accident (last place on the grid and 10 points removed from the guy for next race)

[woody2goody]

I think that Jenson is pretty much blameless in this situation. The normal line for that corner is slightly wider than the one DC was taking, leading me to believe that he saw Button originally, panicked when he saw Jenson going for it, then moved across in a desperate attempt to block.

Jenson was braking as if to overtake, so he could do nothing when the Red Bull came across him. He had no chance to go wide to avoid him, so tried to cut the corner and it turned into a crash.

Jenson said on the TV that he did a fastest lap/sector time just before he caught Coulthard, so maybe he came up on DC so quickly that DC didn't know he was there?

[Valve Bounce]

who were you before? flat tyres? valve


confess now or else :arrows:

Why am I being dragged into this?

I don't appreciate this nonsense!

[markabilly]

Why am I being dragged into this?

I don't appreciate this nonsense!
Sorry my mistake unless it was not a mistake as maybe Pino followed through and banned you for the weekend as you have been very silent lately....so I figured "Phonenix"

[Valve Bounce]

Sorry my mistake unless it was not a mistake as maybe Pino followed through and banned you for the weekend as you have been very silent lately....so I figured "Phonenix"

First of all, I have been quiet this weekend because I was away from Melbourne; and
Secondly, if I had been banned by pino, (and I have never been banned in any forum), it would be something between pino and myself, and nobody else.
I know you were trying to be somewhat humorous, so I take it all in good fun. Let's leave it at that.

[wmcot]

Nobody else has brought this up so far - the most amazing point of the collision is that the Red Bull didn't self-destruct into a thousand pieces this time! Looks like they've been working on the strength problem or Honda is even softer! ;)

[Daniel]

Button was being a bit thick with his approach, he seems to loose his rear when he's behing DC and can't stop his car.
DC couldn't really do anything at that point as Button was out of control going a straight line.

Well did Jenson lose the rear because he was trying to slow down because of the door being closed or had he just lost the car? Who knows. I certainly thought it was JB's fault initially but the replay and Jenson's words made me think DC had a fair bit of blame too.

[Hawkmoon]

DC should ask himself two things. Firstly, why is someone always trying to pass me and not the other way 'round and secondly, why is it always the other guys fault that my car hit his car?

[ioan]

Nobody else has brought this up so far - the most amazing point of the collision is that the Red Bull didn't self-destruct into a thousand pieces this time! Looks like they've been working on the strength problem or Honda is even softer! ;)

Yep, you're right, they managed to make their suspensions stronger than Honda's front wing, that's quite an improvement! :D

[Daniel]

Yep, you're right, they managed to make their suspensions stronger than Honda's front wing, that's quite an improvement! :D

I think you will need a bullbar in the future to overtake DC without having your car destroyed :)

[ten-tenths]

im not a DC supporter but this time it seems jenson was way too optimistic. bunson should recieve about 65% of the blame to DC's 35%.

[Valve Bounce]

im not a DC supporter but this time it seems jenson was way too optimistic. bunson should recieve about 65% of the blame to DC's 35%.

The way I saw it, and also on the replay from bunsen's car, the pass was nevre on, and I felt bunsen sorta lost control of his direction before he hit DC. I felt that bunsen was far too optimistic, and he ran into DC's car. From my perspective, bunsen should have braked and kept station behind DC.

[Garry Walker]

Button was being a bit thick with his approach, he seems to loose his rear when he's behing DC and can't stop his car.
DC couldn't really do anything at that point as Button was out of control going a straight line.

Except you are forgetting that the reason JB lost the car was due to DC suddenly changing his direction.

[OutRun]

Racing incident. Button's race was ruined because of the puncture. He would've been better off racing clean and collecting some test data.

[markabilly]

First of all, I have been quiet this weekend because I was away from Melbourne; and
Secondly, if I had been banned by pino, (and I have never been banned in any forum), it would be something between pino and myself, and nobody else.
I know you were trying to be somewhat humorous, so I take it all in good fun. Let's leave it at that.


Whatever, but you did violate a certain prohibition resulting in one of your posts being deleted........and perhaps so incurred the announced penalty.
But denial of the obvious, "even when caught on videotape", "private" and all that, seems to be a common british trait :arrows: :rotflmao:

[ShiftingGears]

Racing incident. Also, interesting that before the race, Allen mentioned that Coulthard was unhappy about the mirror placement in pre-season testing.

Coulthard won't be in F1 in 2009.

[wedge]

Racing incident. Also, interesting that before the race, Allen mentioned that Coulthard was unhappy about the mirror placement in pre-season testing.

Coulthard won't be in F1 in 2009.

The mirrors were originally placed on the sidepods for better aero but they were completely useless whereas placing them in the cockpit area the mirrors function (slightly) better.

After the Massa incident, the mirrors are now mounted near the cockpit.

[Robinho]

i'd call it 50:50, as in the Massa incident, although for different reasons.

in this case i think it was a very optimistic move from Button, but he carried so much more speed through the previous chicane it seeemed a valid move, DC left the door open long enough to invite a move, and once he reliased Button was trying something he tried to blcok him off. for teh optimism and the block i'd apportion both a bit of blame.

what happened after was simply a product of DC's reaction, Button tried to avoid a crash by moving tighting and lost the back end, DC still turned in, into an out of control car, had he moved over Button would have probably slid through and missed the apex, DC could have cut back and retaken the place.

in hindsigt DC would have probably been best being a little less agressive and fighting on into another corner, lap etc, but the same could be said of Jenson, he was clearly faster at that point, but could have waited for a better opportunity

[janneppi]

Except you are forgetting that the reason JB lost the car was due to DC suddenly changing his direction.
That may be, but If my memory serves me right DC was clearly ahead and well within his rights to turn his car into the corner, Button was not even partly alonside DC at time.

Button may have been commited to the pass, but IMO he was mostly at fault here.

[Azumanga Davo]

Racing incident. Also, interesting that before the race, Allen mentioned that Coulthard was unhappy about the mirror placement in pre-season testing.

Coulthard won't be in F1 in 2009.

I found that a strange thing to mention specifically. But it all became clear when that incident happened. :D

[woody2goody]

Coulthard won't be in F1 in 2009.

Not if he keeps causing accidents he won't. But he always finds a way to pull results out just when you think he's done: Australia 2003, Monaco 2006, Spain 2007. It may be Webber and Vettel in the car next year. But judging by Red Bull's lack of patience with it's drivers, it'll probably be Bourdais and Jacques Villeneuve...

Vettel's wasted in the Toro Rosso really. He still has a lot to learn but at least he doesn't cause accident after accident like Sutil and Nakajima seem to do. And he's quicker than the pair of them.

DC's problem since 2003 has been qualifying since they scrapped the 60 minute session. He can't qualify as well as Webber so he's at a disadvantage from the start. It was the same with Raikkonen at McLaren; DC wasn't particularly slower than Kimi, it's just Kimi could qualify it better than him and it's all over already if your racing against Raikkonen. Even against Webber you can't expect him to beat Mark if Webber is driving the wheels off it in quali.

Glock, Nakajima and Sutil seem to have the same problem at the moment.

[jens]

We can't get around the fact that DC has been having too many similar collisions lately. I think we should find a video once again as our memories here serve different views. As far as I remember then Button was almost alongside DC before DC turned in. Button lost his front wing against DC'st front wheel.

[wmcot]

We can't get around the fact that DC has been having too many similar collisions lately.

Too many collisions in general for DC going back to his "optimistic" move on Wurz at OZ, 2007! Either he has a problem with his mirrors, or his car has become an "accident magnet!" ;)

Anyone know how many "racing incidents" DC has been involved in over the past few years?

[Tazio]

Well did Jenson lose the rear because he was trying to slow down because of the door being closed or had he just lost the car? Who knows. I certainly thought it was JB's fault initially but the replay and Jenson's words made me think DC had a fair bit of blame too.
THat is an excellent obsevation! Button obviously lost the car.( which is his fault, especially by the way he was setting it up! Way to optomistic( Check my sig). My concern about Sponge Bob is: He knows there is a race car in the neiborhood. And this is easy to say having seen the replay in slow motion.
That if DC had just peeked he would have seen that Bunsen was sliding into the turn and never would have taken or held the position. They mentioned several times on Speed TV about how DC just couldn't get a set-up he was happy with, that included new aero parts. David Hobbs said that he thought that DC was overanalyzing the situation, and should consider just saying they weren't working for him, and taking them off. Or use them and hope the feel and benefits fall into place Hobbs implication being that he was taking a part of the race weekend Friday into (Qualifying) that should have already been decided!

[jjanicke]

i'd call it 50:50, as in the Massa incident, although for different reasons.

in this case i think it was a very optimistic move from Button, but he carried so much more speed through the previous chicane it seeemed a valid move, DC left the door open long enough to invite a move, and once he reliased Button was trying something he tried to blcok him off. for teh optimism and the block i'd apportion both a bit of blame.

what happened after was simply a product of DC's reaction, Button tried to avoid a crash by moving tighting and lost the back end, DC still turned in, into an out of control car, had he moved over Button would have probably slid through and missed the apex, DC could have cut back and retaken the place.

in hindsigt DC would have probably been best being a little less agressive and fighting on into another corner, lap etc, but the same could be said of Jenson, he was clearly faster at that point, but could have waited for a better opportunity

Well said.

[Valve Bounce]

Racing incident. Also, interesting that before the race, Allen mentioned that Coulthard was unhappy about the mirror placement in pre-season testing.

Coulthard won't be in F1 in 2009.

In all honesty, I think DC would be a worthy successor to become President of the FIA next year.

[Bagwan]

OK , David , you need to stop being pig-headed in the corners , and remember some race craft .
You had Button suckered , and he was going to slide through , whether you were in front of him or not . The trouble is , you can't close a door with a car in it . You have to close the door BEFORE , way before that .
You had him suckered good , by leaving the door closed until the last moment , and he misjudged it perfectly for you .
You only had to set up outside , watch him slide through , and you were golden for the inside line .

After last race , I would have though you might have reviewed this technique .
Work on this , David . Those cars are expensive .


Now , Jensen , I just a talk with David , and I don't think he even knew he had you suckered there .
He had you done and dusted . Take it easy there , big fella . You seem a touch frustrated .
You're the guy that slid through , or would have if the blockhead hadn't turned in . Hopefully , David will figure this out , but in future , don't expect it to end differently when you try this on DC .
You might have noticed this happened in the last race , too , and Massa was much better placed than you were here , so get a clue .
You were beaten , unless you managed to block his way through the corner by slowing down in front of him , and the speed you were going made that pretty unlikely , so it was never going to work .

He put himself in harm's way , and you supplied the harm .

Like I told David , these cars are expensive .

[truefan72]

It was the same scenario as in Oz, DC is being passed, the other car comes along the RedBull (what a fitting name for a car that constantly runs into others! :p : ), than DC decides that others have no right for a piece of tarmac and runs into them.
Send the bull home! ;)

LOL

I agree

Who would have guessed my 1000's post would be me agreeing with Ioan.

But why is it that these incidents always happen to DC, when he is about to be passed. I still can't beleive Red Bull offered him a contract and got rid of both Klien and Liuzzi. Either one of them would be doing a betterjob than DC now. And throw in Scott Speed as well who certainly would have done a better job.

[Tazio]

LOL
I still can't beleive Red Bull offered him a contract and got rid of both Klien and Liuzzi. Either one of them would be doing a betterjob than DC now. I am going to propose this honestly, because it is the only reason I can think of.
Sponge Bob is the only one of the three that has a constituency of fans,
and a recognisable face that would surely help Red Bull with their bottom
line in regaurd to their "soda pop" sales

[Storm]

DC gets in far too many race incidents..but on this one it was pretty obviously Button's mistake to assume that DC would give him way . plus he lost the car under braking!

[truefan72]

Tazio,

i don't think they are keeping DC on the team becuase he might help the bottom line in terms of eneryg drink sales.
The company was a billion dollar outfit before it got to F1 and had enough cash to buy and operate 2 teams.

I think he's on the team 'cause he does just enough to retian his seat and talks up a storm about experience etc.

IMO as soon as they got Webber, I would have released DC and continued on my "Red Bull Young Driver Development Program" which to date has ousted, pushed away and demoted all theior young talent.

I still say if Klien were on the team this year, both he and Webber would be running in the top 10 consistently.

[ioan]

Tazio,

i don't think they are keeping DC on the team becuase he might help the bottom line in terms of eneryg drink sales.
The company was a billion dollar outfit before it got to F1 and had enough cash to buy and operate 2 teams.

I think he's on the team 'cause he does just enough to retian his seat and talks up a storm about experience etc.

IMO as soon as they got Webber, I would have released DC and continued on my "Red Bull Young Driver Development Program" which to date has ousted, pushed away and demoted all theior young talent.

I still say if Klien were on the team this year, both he and Webber would be running in the top 10 consistently.

My turn to agree with you, mostly.
I disagree that he did enough to deserve that seat, and if it wasn't for his long time friendship with Newey he would have been long gone.

[Tazio]

Tazio,

i don't think they are keeping DC on the team becuase he might help the bottom line in terms of eneryg drink sales.
The company was a billion dollar outfit before it got to F1 and had enough cash to buy and operate 2 teams.

I think he's on the team 'cause he does just enough to retian his seat and talks up a storm about experience etc.

IMO as soon as they got Webber, I would have released DC and continued on my "Red Bull Young Driver Development Program" which to date has ousted, pushed away and demoted all theior young talent.

I still say if Klien were on the team this year, both he and Webber would be running in the top 10 consistently.Well at least I proposed it honestly :p : I never underestimate the machinations of corporations. Once a Corporation stops expanding it begins to lose money.



IMO I would have released DC and continued on my "Red Bull Young Driver Development Program" which to date has ousted, pushed away and demoted all theior young talent.
I'm a cynical old ******* From the day I heard of that program I said "Marketing ploy"! I don't know all the particulars involving the program I was honestly amazed that they followed through with it as far as they did. There was probably a couple of the proponents that took the project very seriously and worked with passion to develope it. (only conjcture here) But eventually lost their drive as it became more and more obvious that RED BULL was Much More interested in selling soda to Americans than F1.
BTW I've never drank a Red Bull! I'm a coffee kinda guy

[markabilly]

What I think is revealing is that DC is not busy crashing into people while trying to pass them; rather he is busy crashing into people who are trying to pass him....................

[ten-tenths]

What I think is revealing is that DC is not busy crashing into people while trying to pass them; rather he is busy crashing into people who are trying to pass him....................

that is a fresh take! never thought of it in that way.

[jens]

http://img502.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dvjbfv0.jpg

This picture convinces me even more that this collision was (once again) DC's fault...

[jens]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FcW_aPOw7zs

Take a view about at 1:30. Seeing a replay of this I have to change my mind and say that this looks more of Button's fault. He was completely out of shape into that corner and clearly behind before braking.

[stevie_gerrard]

Is it just me or did i remember Button saying on ITV that he wasn't trying to overtake Coulthard and was just braking for the corner, but saw a gap open, went in it and because coulthard closed it back up he tried to avoid a collision but it was too late?

honestly think it was a racing incident, Martin said on the commentary, these two are good friends, its not like this will enrage into a bitter battle between the two. I think both will realise they were wrong in this collision.

[Tazio]

Is it just me or did i remember Button saying on ITV that he wasn't trying to overtake Coulthard and was just braking for the corner, but saw a gap open, went in it and because coulthard closed it back up he tried to avoid a collision but it was too late?

honestly think it was a racing incident, Martin said on the commentary, these two are good friends, its not like this will enrage into a bitter battle between the two. I think both will realise they were wrong in this collision.
It's possible! You can make anything happen in cartoons! :p :

[wedge]

One thing that wasn’t shown on the TV coverage was that a couple of laps before the incident Jenson had actually passed me in that corner – but he ran wide because he came down the inside carrying too much speed to make the apex, and I repassed him on the run down to the next corner.

http://www.itv-f1.com/Feature.aspx?Type=David_Coulthard