What was attendance at Homestead?

[timshag]

Any one know?

[Hoop-98]

ESPN is reporting 40K, I am sure there will be differing opinions.

rh

[Chris R]

How many does the place hold? It looked less than ideal as far as attendance is concerned. I am thinking all the blackness around the track added to the general funk of the broadcast.....

[trumperZ06]

;) The race looked good in HDTV on a 65 inch screen.

From the TV camera angles... the seats looked pretty full...

but you don't always get a good view of the stands.

[FormerFF]

From http://www.homesteadmiamispeedway.com/track%5Finfo/

Seating capacity is 65,000.

To me, it looked like about 20% of the grandstands were open, and that 20% looked to be about half full. It's hard to judge from the TV shots, especially at night, and especially when they don't want to show you any crowd shots.

It could have been worse, I suppose. Did anyone see any of the Grand Am race? I'd guess there were maybe 2000 or so in attendance.

[jeffconn]

As a general rule, GrandAm/ALMS fans don't use the stands much, and will wander the track and pits. Endurance racing doesn't lend itself well to sitting on metal grandstands for long periods of time.

[FormerFF]

As a general rule, GrandAm/ALMS fans don't use the stands much, and will wander the track and pits. Endurance racing doesn't lend itself well to sitting on metal grandstands for long periods of time.

I understand that - I'm a big time IMSA/ALMS fan and have been to the 24 Hours of Daytona more times than I can remember. There still wasn't anyone at the Grand Am race. Homestead has placed a number of small bleachers near some of the infield turns. The camera was pointed at one of them for a few seconds, and I counted eight people sitting on it.

There's not a lot of infield spectator space at a 1.5 mile roval anyway.

[Wilf]

From http://www.homesteadmiamispeedway.com/track%5Finfo/

Seating capacity is 65,000.

To me, it looked like about 20% of the grandstands were open, and that 20% looked to be about half full. It's hard to judge from the TV shots, especially at night, and especially when they don't want to show you any crowd shots.

It could have been worse, I suppose. Did anyone see any of the Grand Am race? I'd guess there were maybe 2000 or so in attendance.

So you estimate 6500????

[-Helix-]

Of the stands that were obviously open it looked packed. Which was about half I'd say. Then I even saw some groups of people spread out in the stands that weren't open. So I'd say about 60% of the total capacity. Well over the capacity that was open for the race though.

[BenRoethig]

ESPN is reporting 40K, I am sure there will be differing opinions.

rh

If true, that's about 60-65% capacity.

[!!WALDO!!]

Since Homestead is an ISC track and ISC tracks sell packages to those who want tickets to the NASCAR Grand Finale, then like most of these tracks over 50,000 season packages were sold. So The G-A, IRL sold 50,000 tickets with that money in place since Feburary 1st. So $3,000,000 in revenue with no walk ups and $1,000,000 in purses to cover that aren't covered and $1,000,000 in expenses.

This is why the IRL stays at ISC/SMI tracks as those shows are profitable. In the other world where tracks magically appear at no cost and you must sell advanced and race day tickets. Then when 175,000 people show up for the weekend, the show loses $3,000,000.
In this world, 30,000 show up and the track makes $1,000,000. Do we want to discuss the fact that a NCTS/NNS/Sprint Cup weekend at Homestead pays out nearly $8,500,000 in purses with a net lay out of ZERO and receives another $9,000,000 in profit sharing from TV and has been sitting on over $9,000,000 in ticket sales for those races since 2/1?

That is what makes a racetrack profitable and a street race questionable.

[evo5_mat]

for qualifying looking only a few hundred, must admit the main stand looked more full on race day although noticed stands with zero spectators in them.

Surely more spectators would have come to a combined event (IRL,CHAMPCAR), even portland had more spectators and that was one of the lowest attended events on the champcar calander i personally witnessed over the mainy years going to events.
Lets hope things change, or we end up with same situation within 2 years of sponsorship non existant which i noticed a number of cars had very little sponsorship on the cars and fans staying away as not interested in oval racing which seems to have been proven in recent years for open wheeled cars

[Rogelio]

The stands from what I could see, seemed empty. This is sad becase this is the first race of the year. Hopefully, this serves as a wake-up call to TG that something needs to be done. The elmination of Champ Car will not solve the lack of fan interest. Whether the solution is lower ticket prices or more promotion, something needs to change. The first race of the year should be big and raucus.

[FormerFF]

So you estimate 6500????

Like I said, it's hard to estimate, especially when the TV crew doesn't provide any crowd shots. If the camera is panning, or if it is at an oblique angle to the grandstand, the grandstand will appear much more crowded than it is. In any case, it appeared to me that those grandstands that were occupied were about half full, but that most of them were closed.

By comparison, think about how full Texas Motor Speedway appears. By most estimates, attendance there is around 50 - 60 % of its approximately 160,000 seats.

If you want to see what a genuinely full grandstand looks like, you can tune into a NASCAR race, or for that matter, wait for Kansas or Indy. You'll see that a full grandstand looks absolutely stuffed full of people.

I'd say that Homestead is a good candidate to be left off of next year's schedule. Like others have mentioned, it's a tough sell even for NASCAR.

[!!WALDO!!]

The stands from what I could see, seemed empty. This is sad becase this is the first race of the year. Hopefully, this serves as a wake-up call to TG that something needs to be done. The elmination of Champ Car will not solve the lack of fan interest. Whether the solution is lower ticket prices or more promotion, something needs to change. The first race of the year should be big and raucus.


So Kanaan said "it was the biggest crowd he ever saw at Homestead."--- Wind Tunnel 9:44PM 3/30/2008.

[NickFalzone]

The crowds looked a bit better than last year's, though that's not saying much. It's a great location but as others have said it never gets great crowds even for NASCAR. The bigger question is how it did as far as ratings on ESPN.

[Lousada]

Since Homestead is an ISC track and ISC tracks sell packages to those who want tickets to the NASCAR Grand Finale, then like most of these tracks over 50,000 season packages were sold. So The G-A, IRL sold 50,000 tickets with that money in place since Feburary 1st. So $3,000,000 in revenue with no walk ups and $1,000,000 in purses to cover that aren't covered and $1,000,000 in expenses.

I believe you are wrong on this one. Only Kansas and Chicagoland sell ticketpackages with Nascar sprint cup weekends. Homestead also does not do a lot of promotion by themselves, so getting +-30k is pretty good.
Nascar has a hard time getting a full house of 80k here so really it's not bad.
Another thing is the cliche, but it has merit, 30k in a stadium that holds 80k looks worse than 30k in a stadium that holds 35k. Yet they collect the same money. I suppose Homestead attendance is seasonwise at the bottomhalf, but it's certainly not the worst, and not the second or third worst either. No idea about profitability.

[!!WALDO!!]

I believe you are wrong on this one. Only Kansas and Chicagoland sell ticketpackages with Nascar sprint cup weekends. Homestead also does not do a lot of promotion by themselves, so getting +-30k is pretty good.
Nascar has a hard time getting a full house of 80k here so really it's not bad.
Another thing is the cliche, but it has merit, 30k in a stadium that holds 80k looks worse than 30k in a stadium that holds 35k. Yet they collect the same money. I suppose Homestead attendance is seasonwise at the bottomhalf, but it's certainly not the worst, and not the second or third worst either. No idea about profitability.

Sorry but I am on the Homestead mailing program. Got it in January for tickets. If I knew I had to defend myself I would of kept for scanning purposes.
I hate to break it to you, all tracks are doing that. This is what drives the CART/CCWS fans absolutely nuts. Tickets sold verus what shows up.
The NASCAR Weekend for Homestead is a THREE DAY sell out. As of 2/1/2008 but 30 days prior to the race, tickets will become available.
How do they do that?

[Lousada]

Sorry but I am on the Homestead mailing program. Got it in January for tickets. If I knew I had to defend myself I would of kept for scanning purposes.
I hate to break it to you, all tracks are doing that. This is what drives the CART/CCWS fans absolutely nuts. Tickets sold verus what shows up.
The NASCAR Weekend for Homestead is a THREE DAY sell out. As of 2/1/2008 but 30 days prior to the race, tickets will become available.
How do they do that?

Okay, then why does the official ticketsupplier say tickets start selling on 19/4?
http://www.racetickets.com/nascar-sprint-cup-series-tickets/2008/ford-400/

Of course after the race it's hard to find sources but this flyer from the homestead website clearly shows you can buy seperate indy tickets.
http://www.homesteadmiamispeedway.com/images/hms_08GainscoFlyer.jpg

At Kansas and Chicago you can only only buy ticketpackages. There is no possibility to buy for one race only.

[anthonyvop]

The Miami herald reported 30,000.

I say 25-27,000.
Of those 15-20% were wearing brand new red Penske Racing Hats which indicate that they were freebies from Marlboro.

[the bro]

Since Homestead is an ISC track and ISC tracks sell packages to those who want tickets to the NASCAR Grand Finale, then like most of these tracks over 50,000 season packages were sold. So The G-A, IRL sold 50,000 tickets with that money in place since Feburary 1st. So $3,000,000 in revenue with no walk ups and $1,000,000 in purses to cover that aren't covered and $1,000,000 in expenses.

This is why the IRL stays at ISC/SMI tracks as those shows are profitable. In the other world where tracks magically appear at no cost and you must sell advanced and race day tickets. Then when 175,000 people show up for the weekend, the show loses $3,000,000.
In this world, 30,000 show up and the track makes $1,000,000. Do we want to discuss the fact that a NCTS/NNS/Sprint Cup weekend at Homestead pays out nearly $8,500,000 in purses with a net lay out of ZERO and receives another $9,000,000 in profit sharing from TV and has been sitting on over $9,000,000 in ticket sales for those races since 2/1?

That is what makes a racetrack profitable and a street race questionable.


Sure you are making money off the NASCAR race, but what does this do for your product in the long term. If 25,000 people buy the tickets as part of a package and can't be bothered showing up for the Indy race, that doesn't say much for your product. In the short term you are making money, but in the long term doesn't this devalue your product, and make it a second rate product? ICS in my opinion would be better to try and seek out their own markets seperate from NASCAR. In the late 80's early 90's most of the ovals CART ran were open wheel ovals only.

[DavePI2]

I have the last 3 years on tape as well as this years. I don't know what percentage was filled this year, I won't hazzard a guess but it is clear that there were far more fans this year then at least last years race. Last years attendace was terrible.
Also did anyone notice the crowd at the cup race on Sunday. I know the cup fans will have their excuses as they always due for the falling popularity of nascar but there were a lot of empty seats there also.


David

[!!WALDO!!]

Sure you are making money off the NASCAR race, but what does this do for your product in the long term. If 25,000 people buy the tickets as part of a package and can't be bothered showing up for the Indy race, that doesn't say much for your product.

It is 50,000 and does it bother you that 25,000 show up and the show gets paid for 50,000? I have read for years how this is EVIL and should not be allowed. No different than any other professional sport, TICKET SOLD over ACTUAL ATTENDENCE. That is why CART/CCWS was not a real sport, like a movie you need butts in the seats after they paid for a ticket.



In the short term you are making money, but in the long term doesn't this devalue your product, and make it a second rate product?

You mean like having a race one year and not the next year. This is wholly about making money for the track. Anything else is 500 miles behind.


ICS in my opinion would be better to try and seek out their own markets seperate from NASCAR. In the late 80's early 90's most of the ovals CART ran were open wheel ovals only.

Huh? Who owns ISC? 51% by the FRANCE FAMILY. Do you know what else they own?
Milwaukee and Nazareth but both ended up with Busch races
Michigan had two NASCAR dates since 1969. Phoenix since 1987, NHIS Cup dates since it opened.
So what ovals had was just CART?

[!!WALDO!!]

I have the last 3 years on tape as well as this years. I don't know what percentage was filled this year, I won't hazzard a guess but it is clear that there were far more fans this year then at least last years race. Last years attendace was terrible.
Also did anyone notice the crowd at the cup race on Sunday. I know the cup fans will have their excuses as they always due for the falling popularity of nascar but there were a lot of empty seats there also.


David


Free TV hurts shows. Look if it is 30 degrees and you bought tickets to Ohio State and Northwestern and it could rain/freezing rain/snow and the game is on TV?
You will stay home. Put $4.00 gas in equation that is the economics of the situation. Again those were no shows as the tickets were sold.

[DavePI2]

ohio state and northwestern would sell out in columbus no matter what the weather

[PA Rick]

As a general rule, GrandAm/ALMS fans don't use the stands much, and will wander the track ......

They must be careful step aside as the cars pass.

[Lee Roy]

Huh? Who owns ISC? 51% by the FRANCE FAMILY. Do you know what else they own?
Milwaukee and Nazareth . . . . . . .

ISC does not own Milwaukee.

[!!WALDO!!]

ohio state and northwestern would sell out in columbus no matter what the weather

Sold out does not mean every seat is taken. THAT WAS MY POINT!


Look if it is 30 degrees and you bought tickets to Ohio State and Northwestern and it could rain/freezing rain/snow and the game is on TV?

[!!WALDO!!]

ISC does not own Milwaukee.

Didn't say that.


ICS in my opinion would be better to try and seek out their own markets seperate from NASCAR.

This is my response:
Huh? Who owns ISC? 51% by the FRANCE FAMILY. Do you know what else they own?



In the late 80's early 90's most of the ovals CART ran were open wheel ovals only.

My response:
Milwaukee and Nazareth but both ended up with Busch races
Michigan had two NASCAR dates since 1969. Phoenix since 1987, NHIS Cup dates since it opened.
So what ovals had was just CART?

Some how I think you knew that!

[Lee Roy]

Some how I think you knew that!

Whatever.

Hey, it isn't my fault that you need a remedial writing class.

[!!WALDO!!]

Whatever.

Hey, it isn't my fault that you need a remedial writing class.

This person appears not to know who owns ISC and is dreaming of CART ovals that didn't run NASCAR.

My writing is fine, it was your misreading that caused you angst.