Bernie's Big Mouth

[Tazio]

Why would Bernie tell Marca that McLaren screwed up by taking a neutal posture in last seasons wdc? I don't want to get into all the partculars of the last three races, but Fred was fighting for his 3rd wdc. That part is over!
Now Bernie has got to start spewing on McLaren.
What a D!(k:

Bernie blames team for Lewis' lost chance

February 1, 2008

(AP Photo CHX108)
Bernie Ecclestone believes McLaren cost its driver Lewis Hamilton the 2007 Formula 1 championship.

The F1 chief executive said in a Spanish newspaper, Marca, that the British team's neutrality toward its drivers kept Lewis from becoming the first rookie champion
'The team let him down' - Ecclestone
.

"Lewis could have won - the team let him down," 80-year-old Ecclestone said.

He added that it was better that Fernando Alonso returned to Renault after a disappointing year with McLaren "because the truth is that he wasn't happy where he was".

Ferrari driver Kimi Raikkonen won the 2007 Drivers' championship by one point from Hamilton and Alonso. - Sapa-AP

[Ranger]

I think he's trying to arouse more interest in the Spanish GP by making those rather inflammatory remarks to a Spanish news outlet.

After all, wouldn't that equate to more money for him?

[Tazio]

I think there is going to be plenty of interest in the 2008 Spanish GP!

I'd like to here from the McLaren Fans
Is he appealing to your affection for Lewis, a sense of fair play, and propriety,
or is this another pot shot at McLaren?
I swear to god that guy could turn me into a Maca' fan

[janneppi]

Honestly, what should have Bernard say to Marca? That McLaren should have favoured Alonso through the whole season?
*What was the question posed to him?
* If Ecclestone was even asked anything about the subject
* if there even was this interview at all

The editor of the story seems to be of the opinion that Ecclestone seems to be of the opinion that the last two races weren't completely Hamilton's own doing, something which I tend to agree. Had the team done better, Hamilton could have won the wdc as Bernie suggested.

[Tazio]

Honestly, what should have Bernard say to Marca? That McLaren should have favoured Alonso through the whole season?
*What was the question posed to him?
* If Ecclestone was even asked anything about the subject
* if there even was this interview at all

The editor of the story seems to be of the opinion that Ecclestone seems to be of the opinion that the last two races weren't completely Hamilton's own doing, something which I tend to agree. Had the team done better, Hamilton could have won the wdc as Bernie suggested.
"Lewis could have won - the team let him down," 80-year-old Ecclestone said

That's the answer! How important is the way the question was framed, or even it's context.

Are you saying the error was McLarens?
I mean there was the matter of the FIA intervention.
Hamilton was the one that got himself beached in Shanghai.
He was the one who was feeling the handling of the car.
A more seasoned driver would have been proactive, and said "This things a sled, I'm comming in boys!
I think it's a bit of a reach to blame McLaren for that.
I've never heard a satisfactory explanation for his transmission glitch
at Brazil.

[janneppi]

That's the answer! How important is the way the question was framed, or even it's context.
It sort of is, If Marca asks do you think Lewis could have won the wdc and Bernies says what he says, there is nothing wrong in his answer. :)


Are you saying the error was McLarens?
IMO McLaren had some fault in the way the last two races went down



Hamilton was the one that got himself beached in Shanghai.
He was the one who was feeling the handling of the car.
A more seasoned driver would have been proactive, and said "This things a sled, I'm comming in boys!
I think it's a bit of a reach to blame McLaren for that.
Is it really? A more adept team would have played it safe and taken Hamilton, a rather inexperienced driver to the pits, who if my memory serves me right, warned the team of the cars handling


I've never heard a satisfactory explanation for his transmission glitch
at Brazil.
And you won't hear any, unless someone comes out and says something you already believe was the case. ;)

[Tazio]

"And you won't hear any, unless someone comes out and says something you already believe was the case."

I'll go along with your explanation of the shanghai incident. If that is true, It is a compelling arguement that McLaren "shares" the blame.

Which explanation do you accept about the extended period of time hamilton spent in nuetral. I honestly didn't know there was an accepted one. Is there!

[janneppi]

I'm fine with both, either Hamilton dropped the ball or that there was glitch in the car, heck, it could even be both. ;)

[wmcot]

I think Bernie's just ticked off because he would have made a lot more money if Lewis had been WDC! He doesn't dare blame Lewis, so who's next in line? Team McLaren!

[SGWilko]

Why would Bernie tell Marca that McLaren screwed up by taking a neutal posture in last seasons wdc? I don't want to get into all the partculars of the last three races, but Fred was fighting for his 3rd wdc. That part is over!
Now Bernie has got to start spewing on McLaren.
What a D!(k:

Bernie blames team for Lewis' lost chance

February 1, 2008

(AP Photo CHX108)
Bernie Ecclestone believes McLaren cost its driver Lewis Hamilton the 2007 Formula 1 championship.

The F1 chief executive said in a Spanish newspaper, Marca, that the British team's neutrality toward its drivers kept Lewis from becoming the first rookie champion
'The team let him down' - Ecclestone
.

"Lewis could have won - the team let him down," 80-year-old Ecclestone said.

He added that it was better that Fernando Alonso returned to Renault after a disappointing year with McLaren "because the truth is that he wasn't happy where he was".

Ferrari driver Kimi Raikkonen won the 2007 Drivers' championship by one point from Hamilton and Alonso. - Sapa-AP

Personally, I think Bernie is trying to suggest (correctly, IMHO) that there was no favouritism for either driver, thus trying to placate Alonso's fans.

And I also think that both Lewis and his team are equally to blame for losing the WDC. Lewis made a big rookie mistake (and fair play, he didn't make too many, did he?) in Shanghai, and who knows what happened in Brazil? It's one of those Mansell in the Williams at Canada conundrums.

[DonJippo]

I think Bernie's just ticked off because he would have made a lot more money if Lewis had been WDC!

How come? Do he get a commission of Hamilton's income or what way Bernie would make more money If Lewis won the title?

[BDunnell]

How come? Do he get a commission of Hamilton's income or what way Bernie would make more money If Lewis won the title?

Because he probably sees Hamilton as the most marketable commodity in human terms in F1, and I think he's right about that.

As far as I'm concerned, though, Hamilton never lost his chance to win the WDC. He had the chance and he cocked it up. The chance was always there.

[wedge]

Why would Bernie tell Marca that McLaren screwed up by taking a neutal posture in last seasons wdc? I don't want to get into all the partculars of the last three races, but Fred was fighting for his 3rd wdc. That part is over!
Now Bernie has got to start spewing on McLaren.
What a D!(k:

Bernie blames team for Lewis' lost chance

February 1, 2008

(AP Photo CHX108)
Bernie Ecclestone believes McLaren cost its driver Lewis Hamilton the 2007 Formula 1 championship.

The F1 chief executive said in a Spanish newspaper, Marca, that the British team's neutrality toward its drivers kept Lewis from becoming the first rookie champion
'The team let him down' - Ecclestone
.

"Lewis could have won - the team let him down," 80-year-old Ecclestone said.

He added that it was better that Fernando Alonso returned to Renault after a disappointing year with McLaren "because the truth is that he wasn't happy where he was".

Ferrari driver Kimi Raikkonen won the 2007 Drivers' championship by one point from Hamilton and Alonso. - Sapa-AP

The Spanish media aren't exactly known for their unbiased reporting skills in the F1 community.

I suspect someone has twisted Bernie's words.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I've always had the impression that when Bernie said McLaren let Lewis down it was down to poor decision-making skills on race day, not because over which driver should have more backing?

[BDunnell]

The Spanish media aren't exactly known for their unbiased reporting skills in the F1 community.

This is another possibility, of course.

[ArrowsFA1]

"Lewis could have won - the team let him down," 80-year-old Ecclestone said.
I don't think Bernie is saying anything that many others haven't already said. Of course Hamilton could have won the WDC but hindsight doesn't change things.

I don't think Bernie is saying anything that many others haven't already said. Of course Hamilton could have won the WDC but hindsight doesn't change things.

Not only is Bernie not saying anything that others haven't already said, he already said it himself.

It was reported in Autosport in early January.

[Tazio]

Little Big Man!

[V12]

Hamilton could have won if the team had done things differently, but so could Alonso. But they didn't, and Kimi won, but then if Massa's car hadn't kept breaking he'd have probably beat the lot of them...if if if

[Tazio]

As far as I'm concerned, though, Hamilton never lost his chance to win the WDC. He had the chance and he cocked it up. The chance was always there. You might even say he "queered" the deal!

[wmcot]

How come? Do he get a commission of Hamilton's income or what way Bernie would make more money If Lewis won the title?

Publicity and name recognition translates directly into money in F1. Anything that has the F1 logo on it when it sells puts money in Bernie's pockets!

[Mark]

If mclaren had favoured one driver then that driver would have been world champ. Of that there is no question.

[Tazio]

If mclaren had favoured one driver then that driver would have been world champ. Of that there is no question.

Would it be fair to say that McLaren let Fred down as well?

[wedge]

Would it be fair to say that McLaren let Fred down as well?

Yes that's true, but both McLaren drivers and Ferrari too - though generally regarded as underdogs were fighting for WDC.

You'll never get 100% equality in F1 but there are ways and means.

I applaud Ron for not giving into the demands of Alonso but for sure in Hungary, I thought, there were better procedures such as allowing the fastest driver in Q2 should 'lead the pack' in Q3, not taking turns on a race-by-race basis.

And of course, there are times when team orders are 'acceptable' - such as in the dangerously tight confinements of Monaco opposed to Tilke-dromes; and the last few races where one driver has a better chance of winning the WDC.

[fandango]

If mclaren had favoured one driver then that driver would have been world champ. Of that there is no question.

I disagree! McLaren favoured the wrong drivers at the wrong time and cocked up the whole house of cards that they built.

They should have yanked Alonso's leash at the first mutterings of discontent in the early part of the season, and then later they should have redressed the balance that Hamilton broke when he disobeyed the team in Hungary. I've never like the McLaren "we're all happy and fair in a big happy family" image. I just don't believe it, and never did. It doesn't make competition or business sense.

Hamilton didn't win the WDC because he had less points than Kimi at the end. Mistakes happen, sometimes at the start of the season, sometimes at the end.

[wedge]

I've never like the McLaren "we're all happy and fair in a big happy family" image. I just don't believe it, and never did. It doesn't make competition or business sense.

There some areas where McLaren/Ron Dennis fully deserves the criticism - notably PR and 'Ron-speak' but I would never dare question their business acumen.

The likes of TAG, Tag-Huer and Hugo Boss have supported McLaren for a number of years. Ron started off as mechanic at McLaren and look where he is now and the company has achieved as a whole.

[Mark]

Would it be fair to say that McLaren let Fred down as well?

They ended up letting both of their drivers down. After all if they had concentrated on one driver, doesn't matter which, then that driver would be WDC today. I have no doubts about that.

[ShiftingGears]

I think he's trying to arouse more interest in the Spanish GP by making those rather inflammatory remarks to a Spanish news outlet.

After all, wouldn't that equate to more money for him?

Bingo.

[jso1985]

If mclaren had favoured one driver then that driver would have been world champ. Of that there is no question.

But the problem was who was the one who needed to be favoured? for Ferrari it was easier as Massa had few chances, but for McLaren, was it really right to let one of their drivers with WDC chances down?

[fandango]

There some areas where McLaren/Ron Dennis fully deserves the criticism - notably PR and 'Ron-speak' but I would never dare question their business acumen.

The likes of TAG, Tag-Huer and Hugo Boss have supported McLaren for a number of years. Ron started off as mechanic at McLaren and look where he is now and the company has achieved as a whole.

Yes, that's a good point, and he certainly makes quite a bit more than I do :) BUT, what could McLaren have won with a different policy? Every team has their ups and downs, but Ron Dennis seems to take a few seasons building up the pieces to have a supremely dominant team, only to have the whole thing fall apart once everything is in place. And mostly due to this "equal treatment" policy, which I've always found hard to believe when it's clear who his favourites have been (Hamilton, Hakkinen, Senna, Lauda). I've always preferred the Williams approach, which isn't tied down to one policy to the detriment of the team.

[Tazio]

They ended up letting both of their drivers down. After all if they had concentrated on one driver, doesn't matter which, then that driver would be WDC today. I have no doubts about that.
Ok, I respect your opinion.
Hopefully this season the outcome of the wdc,
and the wcc will be just as closely contended.
Only without sanctions, inteam fueding, cheating,
and poor sportsmanship. LOL

[CNR]

i think the teams would have got together and made sure that the drivers title was striped from ever maclaren driver.

what a joke it would have made of f1

[wmcot]

They ended up letting both of their drivers down. After all if they had concentrated on one driver, doesn't matter which, then that driver would be WDC today. I have no doubts about that.

But the other would NOT have been happy!

[wedge]

Yes, that's a good point, and he certainly makes quite a bit more than I do :) BUT, what could McLaren have won with a different policy? Every team has their ups and downs, but Ron Dennis seems to take a few seasons building up the pieces to have a supremely dominant team, only to have the whole thing fall apart once everything is in place. And mostly due to this "equal treatment" policy, which I've always found hard to believe when it's clear who his favourites have been (Hamilton, Hakkinen, Senna, Lauda). I've always preferred the Williams approach, which isn't tied down to one policy to the detriment of the team.

When I followed F1 McLaren hit a slump because Honda left in 1993 and rival teams were producing consistantly better and reliable machinery since 2000.

Frank Williams preferred to utilize 'equal treatment' and yet he re-signed Mansell after Mansell place huge demands!

[Tazio]

I'm not making a big deal out of this, but I had assumed that being relegated to last place in the WCC
meant having to deal with "ALL" the consequences!

http://www.feedmef1.com/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=9332

However, despite having all its points taken away last season amid the espionage scandal,
it seems that McLaren will call the fifth garages home in 2008.

The Finnish daily newspaper Turun Sanomat reports that Bernie Ecclestone has ordered the re-shuffle
so that one of F1's 'Big Two' teams can still have access to first class circuit facilities this year.

It is reported that Ecclestone, F1's chief executive,
actually wanted Mercedes-powered McLaren to have the third pit area,
but Renault - officially third in the championship last year - objected.

At most F1 circuits, the first three pit garages are wider and include better amenities for its personnel and guests.


At least Renault held their ground! and said "**** ***"!!!

[Ranger]

I'm not making a big deal out of this, but I had assumed that being relegated to last place in the WCC
meant having to deal with "ALL" the consequences!

http://www.feedmef1.com/html/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=9332

However, despite having all its points taken away last season amid the espionage scandal,
it seems that McLaren will call the fifth garages home in 2008.

The Finnish daily newspaper Turun Sanomat reports that Bernie Ecclestone has ordered the re-shuffle
so that one of F1's 'Big Two' teams can still have access to first class circuit facilities this year.

It is reported that Ecclestone, F1's chief executive,
actually wanted Mercedes-powered McLaren to have the third pit area,
but Renault - officially third in the championship last year - objected.

At most F1 circuits, the first three pit garages are wider and include better amenities for its personnel and guests.


At least Renault held their ground! and said "**** ***"!!!

And Renault have every right to fight tooth and nail for it. They are rightfully the #3 team on the grid.

McLaren dwindled themselves out of those garages and so hence deserve this punishment.

Of course Bernie wouldn't be doing this unless it made some business/marketing sense to do so. As it goes, he will probably get his way.

...if indeed the report is true.

[Tazio]

And Renault have every right to fight tooth and nail for it. They are rightfully the #3 team on the grid.

McLaren dwindled themselves out of those garages and so hence deserve this punishment.

Of course Bernie wouldn't be doing this unless it made some business/marketing sense to do so. As it goes, he will probably get his way.

...if indeed the report is true.
I have no doubt that a guaranteed cash retainer facilitated the movement. I see absolutely nothing wrong with Mclaren dipping into their corporate slush fund to procure the accommodations. I think it's fine if Bernie oversees it. What rubs me the wrong way is (and I don't know how accurate this report is) Bernie being the facilitator. I repeat this report may be slanted, and / or a misrepresentation of the alleged transaction!

[fandango]

Where are they in Jerez? Because in Barcelona they were way down the end, and I assumed that this was to get themselves used to the garages they'd use come race day (let's not have the obvious joke, here).

[speeddurango]

I would say both team and Lewis himself screwed up quite a bit, should either of both make less mistakes in the last 2 races, Lewis had a chance to win.